JustTricia
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,827 
Location: Indianapolis
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Post by JustTricia on Sept 24, 2018 18:29:25 GMT
My son is not a great student. There are classes he puts forth little effort and some classes he does.
He has two teachers this year that have fought over him to be their teaching assistant. He loves them both, and has a very joking relationship with them. I tell him sometimes he pushes it too far, but then he tells me they come right back at him.
I have only had one other teacher ever email me, and that was one time grade related in all thirteen years of schooling.
I received an email from a teacher today that discussed a low grade, but also said “I recently called him out on being lazy, because he certainly isn’t stupid.”
I will admit that had one of the above loved teachers sent that to me, I would have read it, responded, and moved on. But it was a teacher I don’t know, my son isn’t enjoying the class, and does not do well with the subject. He has failed the Grade 10 standardized state testing three times for this subject. He has to pass the test to graduate, and he’s a Senior.
(Side note, they have alternative things to do, which he has, but he had to take the standardized test three times first. This is the first year for this requirement, and apparently there are SEVERAL in my son’s grade who are in the same position. But, because he has completed the other pieces, he will graduate.)
I did email the teacher back and asked if she hadn’t thought he was lazy would her first thought have been he was stupid? I also stated I didn’t think the use of the word was professional nor was emailing a parent to reassure them their student wasn’t stupid.
I will fully admit I’m in the week before my period where everything sets me off. Would you be upset receiving an email about your child with that statement?
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sharlag
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Jun 26, 2014 12:57:48 GMT
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Post by sharlag on Sept 24, 2018 18:33:54 GMT
Yeah, I might have felt the same way. Although I sort of admire the teacher for being frank/humorous.
I feel like everyone has to be SO CAREFUL in so many aspects of their communication. It feels exhausting to me. But then, I appreciate people being careful on sensitive subjects when they speak TO ME, so I try to do the same.
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maryannscraps
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Aug 28, 2017 12:51:28 GMT
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Post by maryannscraps on Sept 24, 2018 18:37:15 GMT
I don't think that sending an email using the words "lazy" and "stupid" are in any way professional (even if she said he wasn't stupid.) She knows the position your son is in, and could have any number of other descriptors to get her point across.
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Kerri W
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Location: Kentucky
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Post by Kerri W on Sept 24, 2018 18:37:54 GMT
No it wasn't professional and I can't see myself saying the same thing had I been in the teacher's shoes. Being on the parent side, *I* would choose to give the benefit of the doubt and think the teacher is just not super professional. It would be my guess they meant it as a backhanded compliment gone way askew.
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Deleted
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May 17, 2024 2:52:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2018 18:46:21 GMT
My take would be that while her email wasn't professional, is her statement an accurate description of my son? If it is, then I'd focus less on how she worded it an what we can do to overcome the problem at hand.
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Post by Basket1lady on Sept 24, 2018 18:49:31 GMT
I'd call it poorly worded, not inappropriate, and move on. If your DS is a senior, he's probably heard this many times. Heck, my DS graduated with a 4.0+ and I occasionally would have a teacher emailing or calling about how DS isn't working up to his full potential. Same meaning, but using PC words instead.
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Post by chlerbie on Sept 24, 2018 18:53:03 GMT
To me, it sounds like she was saying that she knows he is smart, but not living up to his potential. She might have worded it better, but it's not an insulting message.
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Post by mom on Sept 24, 2018 18:55:26 GMT
I think it could have been worded better, but if There is some truth to what she is saying, I would address that with your son.
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Post by nurseypants on Sept 24, 2018 18:59:01 GMT
Focusing on the teacher’s choice of words seems counterproductive. While I can understand a bit of defensiveness on your part, you know the teacher is correct as you have basically said so in your OP.
I have the impression that American public school teachers are handicapped enough by regulations, testing, and parents. You might consider recognizing this for what it is, a poor choice of words, and moving forward to figure out what your son needs,
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Post by Merge on Sept 24, 2018 19:22:59 GMT
Probably. And double standards when it comes to some parents, too. I’m trying to just grant everybody a lot of grace these days. We’re all doing our best and most people don’t have bad intent.
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Post by cmpeter on Sept 24, 2018 19:23:50 GMT
That...and if a teacher said that about my son, I would know they were speaking the truth. Poorly worded or not, the sentiment would have been correct.
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Post by bunnyhug on Sept 24, 2018 19:30:22 GMT
I'm pretty sure I've described all three of my kids in exactly those terms at one point or another. I'm not a big fan of pussy footing around and would have actually appreciated an email like this--it feels like the teacher is probably more concerned about figuring out how to help the kid than trying to excuse or explain away their behaviour . . . unless there was a history of problems with the teacher being mean to the kid, I would look on this email as a great sign that they are invested enough in the kid to be frustrated with them, and obviously wanting to help them enough to send an email, anyway . . .
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Post by annabella on Sept 24, 2018 19:32:12 GMT
I read a lot of teacher emails on this board and often think the parent overreacted, but understand I have no emotional attachment to the email since it's not my child. I think your son's teacher wrote the email speaking as casually as she does to your son. I hope your email to her was polite and not bashing, but it is a good point you made that she shouldn't use those words in her professional capacity.
I have a co-worker who is old enough to be my mother who always starts every email to me with "I'm sorry to bother you" and every time I cringe that a woman would put that in a professional email. I finally worked up the nerve to say something to her. Not that I'm shy, but I want to be respectful to point out that she doesn't need to put that in emails.
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JustTricia
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,827
Location: Indianapolis
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Post by JustTricia on Sept 24, 2018 19:45:03 GMT
I appreciate everyone’s responses. Like I said, I was feeling a bit touchy today, and that was before I even received this email.
I’m not disagreeing with the gist of the email or her statement he isn’t working to his potential. I absolutely agree he isn’t, and that is something he and I have discussed all quarter. I just don’t find the use of the word stupid as professional in an educational setting, even when used to point out he is not stupid.
Again, I appreciate everyone taking the time to share their views and help me see it from all sides.
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Post by pierkiss on Sept 24, 2018 19:49:10 GMT
I think it was inappropriate for him to say that him that way, and I think it was inappropriate for her to write it to you.
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ellen
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Post by ellen on Sept 24, 2018 20:11:06 GMT
The teacher cared enough to email you. Because she's not a favorite, you decided to be a little extra critical of her use of a word most educators wouldn't use. But you understood the gist of her message and opted to get defensive. A lot of teachers might not have bothered to contact you at all and this teacher probably won't bother to in the future based on your response. How does this help your son?
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pilcas
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Post by pilcas on Sept 24, 2018 20:54:18 GMT
As a retired teacher I can tell you that I never used the word lazy to a parent or a student. But I did think it, and it described many of my students who were not doing well. Sometimes we sugar coat things too much and it doesn’t do the student any good. Perhaps that is what the teacher is seeing and you need to be aware of it. I can’t tell you how many times I have had parents ask about tutoring because child doesn’t understand and I’m thinking if he would just stop talking or texting on his phone and pay attention he might understand the topic better..
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JustTricia
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Posts: 2,827
Location: Indianapolis
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Post by JustTricia on Sept 24, 2018 20:57:33 GMT
I just talked to my son (I received the email while he was at his dad’s). The teacher didn’t call him stupid to his face, just the lazy comment twice. I wasn’t sure from the original email what was actually said to him.
I did receive an email back from the teacher apologizing for the word choice and agreed it wasn’t appropriate.
She did go into more detail as to why she made the lazy comment.
In both emails to her today I did tell her I appreciated her contacting me and agreed with the base of her statement.
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Post by auntkelly on Sept 24, 2018 21:00:59 GMT
Personally, I would not have said anything about the teacher's choice of words, although I agree she could have been more professional with the wording.
I think she genuinely cares about your son or she wouldn't have taken the time to write the e-mail.
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JustTricia
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Posts: 2,827
Location: Indianapolis
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Post by JustTricia on Sept 24, 2018 21:02:33 GMT
Also, as soon as I received the email I did address the situation with my son via text (he was at his dad’s) before I emailed the teacher back. I also have had a conversation in person with him today after school.
We also talk about his math grade on at the least a weekly basis.
In no way am I ignoring the context over a poor choice of words.
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kate
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Jun 26, 2014 3:30:05 GMT
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Post by kate on Sept 24, 2018 21:04:15 GMT
I think I would be in Big Trouble if I used that vocabulary to a parent. I think pilcas has a good point, though. Sugar-coating everything can do a disservice to the child. It can be a tough balance to be truthful without putting everyone on the defensive - you really have to know the family! But "stupid" and "lazy" in any professional context would definitely get me called on the carpet by admin. |
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Post by Zee on Sept 24, 2018 21:19:05 GMT
I've had that feedback umpteen times from teachers because...my son is lazy. No, I wouldn't be offended. It's the truth. He was always disappointing teachers by refusing to participate or complete homework or projects though he'd take tests all day long and ace them. He's very smart and supremely unmotivated.
No threats, rewards, punishment, or cajoling ever changed that and I washed my hands of it all when he was in 10th grade. He graduated but I'm unsure how.
He's...something. I like him, but I don't expect teachers to.
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JustTricia
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,827
Location: Indianapolis
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Post by JustTricia on Sept 24, 2018 21:24:27 GMT
I have no issue with the lazy part of the comment, or even that the teacher said it to my son. I agree with her for the reasons she listed.
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Post by threegirls on Sept 24, 2018 21:52:56 GMT
I think you handled her comment just fine. I personally hate the words lazy and stupid.
The use of the words lazy and unmotivated are personally touchy to me. When my middle daughter was in first grade her teacher told me she was "lazy" and wasn't working hard enough. I knew she was wrong. It wasn't until third grade when my daughter was tested that what I knew all along was correct, she is dyslexic.
Despite having an IEP, never missing a day of school, attending math camp in the summer and going to a tutor year round, her Title One math teacher told me that my daughter was "unmotivated". Bull Shit. She works her ass off and she wants to please people. Needless to say, my daughter is not at that school anymore. She is at a specialized school for kids with learning disabilities and is doing great!
I understand that your son isn't in the same boat as my daughter but I thought I'd explain why I really dislike the use of those words.
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Post by Legacy Girl on Sept 25, 2018 3:03:00 GMT
I think you handled her comment just fine. I personally hate the words lazy and stupid. The use of the words lazy and unmotivated are personally touchy to me. When my middle daughter was in first grade her teacher told me she was "lazy" and wasn't working hard enough. I knew she was wrong. It wasn't until third grade when my daughter was tested that what I knew all along was correct, she is dyslexic. Despite having an IEP, never missing a day of school, attending math camp in the summer and going to a tutor year round, her Title One math teacher told me that my daughter was "unmotivated". Bull Shit. She works her ass off and she wants to please people. Needless to say, my daughter is not at that school anymore. She is at a specialized school for kids with learning disabilities and is doing great! I understand that your son isn't in the same boat as my daughter but I thought I'd explain why I really dislike the use of those words. The classic story of the family of a dyslexic child. Our story is nearly identical! Good for you for standing up for your DD. And, OP, I'm with you on thinking that the words "stupid" and "lazy" were inappropriate. |
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Post by freecharlie on Sept 25, 2018 3:09:26 GMT
There definitely are favorite teachers and not so favorite.
Sometimes we send things before we think. Perhaps she worded it poorly. If I was that teacher, I would not be contacting you again. I assume you have access to his grades and I would leave it at that.
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artbabe
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by artbabe on Sept 25, 2018 11:28:41 GMT
Not the greatest word choice but I absolutely understand where she is coming from.
I told several students yesterday that I knew they were really smart but they weren't challenging themselves. I explained that true learning comes from trying to do things that are a little more difficult than they are comfortable with.
I use that explanation a lot. Sometimes they blow it off. Some kids are difficult to reach. A decent percentage of them get what I said and do try harder.
Talking to parents is always difficult. Parents usually love their children and only want to see the best in them. I absolutely understand that. My job is to grow them and sometimes that involves pointing out where they need to improve. The trick is to do it diplomatically. Some days I'm good at it. Some days I use a poor word choice or mess up. I'm human. I make mistakes. I really try to do things correctly, though.
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Post by peasapie on Sept 25, 2018 11:51:49 GMT
Frankly, this individual isn't qualified to know that your son is "lazy" or "stupid," so that's the first problem I have with the email. The second is the actual terms.
Kids with learning disabilities can sometimes look unmotivated to an unpracticed eye, when in fact they may have trouble organizing themselves to work (executive function disorders, ADHD, emotional issues, etc.)
I'd consider it a red flag and keep an eye on things with this person. It may not be the last issue you have with her. (I hope I'm wrong.)
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paigepea
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Post by paigepea on Sept 25, 2018 12:47:46 GMT
It sounds like you know this is an accurate description of your son. Sure the language could have been chosen better but maybe focus on the message. This teacher created a learning opportunity for your son - you must work hard in every class whether you like the teacher or not. It sounded liked you were making excuses for him not doing well in this class whereas the teacher is saying to you he has greater potential. Just feel lucky your son has greater potential, talk to him, and forget the teacher’s poor wording. In trying to get through to different students I believe teachers try a variety of methods. To me it sounds like your son’s wasted potential is frustrating this teacher and the teacher has finally decided to get your help.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2018 13:36:09 GMT
To me, it sounds like she was saying that she knows he is smart, but not living up to his potential. She might have worded it better, but it's not an insulting message. I agree. Writing it that way was rather unprofessional as the recipient can, as has happened in this case, take it the wrong way. I bet it would sound totally different if the teacher said it face to face to the OP. He's capable of doing the work ( he isn't stupid) but he prefers to not put the effort into doing so ( lazy) |
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