|
Post by Leone on Nov 14, 2018 13:53:15 GMT
I say let go...I suspect your dad wants the change. You have become too invested in this with moving your family’s etc. Your need to be a caregiver Is honorable but what fulfills that need when your dad passes. Step away and start rebuilding your life.
|
|
|
Post by LisaDV on Nov 14, 2018 15:01:34 GMT
Hugs. Sorry.
|
|
|
Post by mrssmith on Nov 14, 2018 16:06:49 GMT
I quit my full time job little over two years ago and moved to a part time position 2 days a week so that I could help my Dad take care of my mother who was suffering from dementia. (So a 60%pay cut). A few months later he asked if I would quit my job to help him full time. He said he would pay me (about 1/2 of what I was making part time). Which I did without hesitation, even though it would put a strain on us financially. Also during this time, DH and I decided to move our family across town so we would be closer to them. So for several months I was over there 7 days a week helping with mom, feeding, dressing, cooking etc. All while still running our household. He has a lady come in 2x per month to do the heavy cleaning, but I do everything else: all of the shopping, errands, cooking, etc. I take him to all of his doctors appointments and keep up with all of his medications and make sure he is taking them properly. In addition, I am trying to go through the house they have lived in for over 50 years and all of the things they accumulated. My mother loved stuff. I have been going through boxes and cabinets and taking photos of everything and posting it on our private family Facebook group so everyone can say if they would like something. It has been a long process because I haven't been able to so it every day and I am trying to find someone who could use the stuff rather than just hauling it all to the dump, which is what my brother wants to do. And while one child is away at college and one is away at a boarding high school, I am still running two households., although I am only cooking one evening meal and DH comes by after work for supper then we go home once I have the kitchen cleaned. This has been a stressful set up and DH and I talked and decided that if my Dad agreed, we would buy a house with enough room for us all to live together. We talked to Dad about it and he was like we will see. At the same time, my brother has been pushing for him to move to assisted living. They moved SIL's mom into one last spring and I think that's what is behind it. DH and I found a house that would be perfect, 2 ground floor masters and plenty of room for all of us. Only 2 miles from his current house, and in our price range. We took him and showed it to him and we discussed that we wanted him to live with us and we could make the move slowly, etc. DH wasn't going forward with any purchase until he had a commitment from Dad that he would be willing to live with us. They talked and on Wednesday night last, Dad said he wasn't going to make any decision until after the holidays. Ok. We could live with that. So imagine my surprise and utter shock when I called Dad on Saturday morning and he told me that brother and SIL were coming into town on Sunday (which they NEVER travel on the weekends). I asked him if they were trying to get him into assisted living and he said, "well, we will talk about that".Come to find out, while DH and I have been here, every freaking day taking care of Dad, my brother was using his daily phone calls to convince him that it was too much for me to take care of him and I was taking too long to clean out the house. Spent the rest of the day Saturday crying and upset. We went over to see Dad yesterday morning before my brother got there and listened to him tell me all of the terrible things that MIGHT happen and how I wouldn't be able to take care of him, etc etc etc. For probably the first time in my life I stood up and told my father exactly how I felt and how hurt I was that he and brother are making these decisions without me. He is not going on FACT that there is nothing wrong with him and there is nothing that assisted living could do for him that I couldn't do myself. He is not the type of person to join in all the activities and go out and make all kinds of new friends. He will sit in his room and watch Fox news and the weather channel for 12 hours a day. Over a dozen years ago, before mom got sick, I promised her that she and dad would not be put in a home unless as a last resort. I also promised her that I would look after my father if she went first. So now, not only will I not be able to keep my promise to my mom, I won't have a purpose. I am a caretaker by nature, so without him to take care of, what am I supposed to do? I guess I am supposed to go back to work and then stop and see him and watch him watch the walls. Some life.Of course, SIL is like "well I don't go see mom every day ". Well, that is fine and fucking dandy for you, but that is not ME, not who I am. Of course, somehow it is now turned around and I am the selfish one and am acting horribly because I am upset that they are making all of these plans and decisions without including me or what my opinion is. Once again, I am being left out of the "grownup decisions" because I am the youngest and they don't think I can handle it. Dad just called to see if I was going over there today and I said no, they should be able to fix his lunch and dinner since they are grown ass people. He wants to sit down and talk this all out.Not sure what there is to talk about, he has decided that he's better off in a home surrounded by strangers. I told him DH and I would go over this evening because I need him there to have my back. First, huge hugs. Second, take a deep breath. Third, let go of the promise you made to your mom. (And FTR, the only time I have seen my dad cry was when we talked about breaking his promise to my mom that he would never put her in a home. I know it isn't easy.) By your own words, the current set-up is stressful and not working. You have sacrificed a lot to keep your dad in his home. It sounds like you and your DH worked out a solution (buy a new home) without discussing it with either your father or brother. You need to go into a discussion with them and really listen to what dad wants. This isn't about you and your purpose, but about your dad's needs. My dad is 90, lives in a senior retirement home (not assisted living) that provides lunch, dinner and weekly housekeeping. He looks after all his other needs (breakfast, laundry, etc.). He really enjoys having his own space. More hugs. These are the things that stuck out to me as well. Honestly, I thought the post was going to end with you saying you need help. Sounds like you have sacrificed a lot to take care of your parents. Your dad said he wants to talk it out and it sounds like he doesn't want to be a burden to you. Perhaps he sees what a toll it is taking on you. Just because you feel an assisted living facility won't do anything you can't do, doesn't mean your dad shouldn't go. Maybe he wants to relieve you of your burden and your time together can be spent enjoying each others company, not having you take care of a 2nd household. Re: the stuff - my mom is similar in that she wants everything to go to someone who will use it. You could also post pics of entire rooms/boxes, etc. and give families 2 weeks to respond if they want anything. Donate anything that's left. It doesn't have to go to a dump. I hope you can come to a decision that everyone is comfortable with. Ultimately, it is your dad's choice where he wants to live if he is of sound mind.
|
|
|
Post by candleangie on Nov 14, 2018 16:27:39 GMT
Here’s the thing....if he’s telling you one thing, and your brother another thing....the way to solve that is for all of you to talk it out TOGETGER.
|
|
|
Post by tuva42 on Nov 14, 2018 16:34:46 GMT
Your dad may feel isolated in his home. Yes, he has you, but you are not his age. He may want the community that an assisted living facility can provide, people his own age, activities, etc. It can also give him a certain amount of independence. I know its important to YOU that you take care of him, but that may not be the most important thing to him. And he may not want you sacrificing all your time to take care of him. It's good of you to care so much and want to give him so much, but it may not be what he wants.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 10, 2024 2:22:58 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2018 17:10:08 GMT
My husband’s father would adore you.
|
|
|
Post by tentoes on Nov 14, 2018 17:54:13 GMT
We have an assisted living complex in the small town I live in. A friend of ours lived there until recently. He moved there with his wife because his wife needed the care, and at the time he was also in need of some help. The cost was 2700 a month. His wife died soon after they moved there, and he stayed until a month or so ago. He decided he really didn't need that much care. He is able to drive still, and although he uses a walker, he can get around ok with a cane unless it's a long walk. He did like the social life there. so now he's in a seniors complex. He LOVES it. He has a little kitchen, and his own stuff. He is learning how to cook his own meals. He has even had us over to enjoy one of his meals. I think he is 94 years old. He's just so cute out there making new friends, and socializing!! and the good part, it's only 790 a month (Plus he makes his own meals now, so whatever his groceries cost)
He needed a purpose. He's saving money so he can go on a cruise!! How is that for attitude??
good luck. I hope the talk with your family went well!
|
|
|
Post by lesserknownpea on Nov 14, 2018 20:43:58 GMT
I won’t speculate about what your Dad wants, that’s what the meeting to listen to him is for.
I CAN speak to two of your concerns. First, caregiving is an all encompassing, satisfying, frustrating, life changing bitch. I have spent a lot of my life doing it, and I know the power of it. It literally changes you. It requires so much self sacrifice your head switches to being fulfilled in a different way than it did before.
And the bond!! It is so strong. It reminds me of the bond you have with young children. Add in the fact that you nursed and then lost your mother, and that’s a lot of very strong emotions that get poured into the occupation of caregiving.
You have been through so much. I know personally the toll and the also the satisfaction that comes from helping a mother through illness to the death handled as she wished. It was one of the most significant periods in my life, and it was hard to return to regular life.
For you, add in the empty nest aspect, and the notion of having to rebuild a work life, and I totally understand just how strong your emotions are right now.
It’s time to take care of you!!!! I can’t emphasize this enough. Make a list of your interests, and pursue whichever appeals to you. It won’t be easy, I know. It’s very hard to just switch off caregiver mode. Be easy on yourself during this time. Perhaps go into counseling. I mean it. It is super helpful with dealing with grief and change.
Also, perhaps your DH has some wishes that have been put on hold during these times? Have some gentle, open talks about where your time and lives can be spent now.
The promise to your mother? I get that. I, too, made a promise to mine and considered it sacred. But the thing is, you DID fulfill your promise. You devoted your time to taking care of your dad. But if he chooses to live a different way, you have fulfilled your promise. Rest easy. For now. Who knows what the future holds? Things change. Use today to enjoy life, I know from experience you can never predict what can happen you never expect.
Caregivers are the angels on earth. Putting aside personal wishes to tenderly give of ourselves in trying, heartbreaking, emotion filled situations takes a lot out of us, and tends to leave us depleted and yet strangely craving more. It’s like we’ve discovered a well of strength and compassion that once revealed cries out to be utilized. If you go back to work, maybe you want to find a job that puts this to use?(of course I know nothing of your former profession).
Do please update us after the talk with your dad and brother. Also, buy a nice bottle of champagne and get a box of chocolates and whatever DH likes, and have a little indulgence time. You’ve earned it.
|
|
RedSquirrelUK
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,733
Location: The UK's beautiful West Country
Aug 2, 2014 13:03:45 GMT
|
Post by RedSquirrelUK on Nov 14, 2018 20:46:58 GMT
You've got some widely varying perspectives here, and some great advice. May I add my two pennyworth?
Here's how I understand this:
Your dad needs a change of accommodation, because his current setup is proving stressful. Both you and your eldest brother have been incredibly supportive of him in your own different ways and abilities.
Your brother goes home and talks it over with his wife and they come up with an idea that ticks all their boxes. They talk it over with your dad, and he says he'll think about it.
You go home and talk it over with your husband and come up with a different idea that ticks all your boxes. You talk it over with your dad, and he says he'll think about it.
It doesn't sound as if you and your brother have really talked over either of your ideas with each other, so you are hurt when you find out. Maybe your brother is also hurt.
But really, you and your brother need to get together and get on the same page. You have to hear each other out, and both understand the pros and cons of each other's suggestion, without getting stressed with each other. You each have to be ready to support your dad in whatever he decides, because this isn't only about you both. And here's why - your dad needs to make a big decision, and at the moment the decision is not only about where/how he is going to live, it is about which of his children he's going to have to upset if he choses the other one's plan. That's a horrible thing for an old man to have to do. The only way he can make that choice himself, is if he knows that whatever he decides, he won't cause a family rift. Please, for his sake, put aside 50 years of sibling rivalry and work together for your dad.
|
|
|
Post by hennybutton on Nov 14, 2018 22:14:26 GMT
What happens to your dad's house when he moves out? Who gets it, or the proceeds from it? Will it be more beneficial to your brother if your dad goes in AL? Not so much if he moves in with you? In most cases, it's all about the money. I think this needs to be addressed. Putting Dad in assisted living won't benefit anyone financially, especially if the house is paid off. Assisted living is expensive and not covered by insurance. If Dad is in good health, he could live another 10 years. The family has to plan to cover his living expenses for that amount of time. Right now, the only care expense is a housekeeping twice a week. Looking at it that way, I really doubt OP's brother has any ill intent. If he was looking to maximize the inheritance, he would be letting things continue as they are. OP, please consider what is best for your dad. You have gone above and beyond the call of duty, but try to look at everything like an outsider. Does your dad have friends, hobbies, activities? All of that is available at assisted living facilities. And, the transition will be easier for him now while he's wanting to do it. You said you talked to him and he told you he didn't want to do it. How did you approach it? Did you ask in a way that would make him think saying yes would make you unhappy? Did you ask him what he thinks he might like about a move? Please do some serious soul-searching about why it's so important to you that he stay in his home. Is it about him or about you?
|
|
|
Post by lesserknownpea on Nov 14, 2018 22:29:02 GMT
What happens to your dad's house when he moves out? Who gets it, or the proceeds from it? Will it be more beneficial to your brother if your dad goes in AL? Not so much if he moves in with you? In most cases, it's all about the money. Looking at it that way, I really doubt OP's brother has any ill intent. If he was looking to maximize the inheritance, he would be letting things continue as they are. ? In all the cases I’ve seen, when the parent(s) move into a larger home with the kid’s family, both houses are sold, and the money combined to buy the larger house. Then when the parent dies, the persons who spent their time caring for the parent is not begrudged any “ gain “ they may have got with the increase in real estate value. Is it possible the brother’s motive is to make sure OP does not benefit financially in any way by Dad moving in with her?
|
|
|
Post by Jen in NCal on Nov 15, 2018 19:52:51 GMT
I am so sorry you are going through this. I can only offer my story with my grandmother.
Grandma lived alone in a cute little townhouse for years. My mom wanted her to move to AL so she wouldn't have to take care of the house. Gram adamantly refused. Then, suddenly, one day after talking to her son (my uncle) Gram was all over the idea.
She, like your father, was a loner. Had lived in her house for 15 years and had never met her neighbors. Had no friends that lived locally.
When she moved into the facility, they took her picture. A year later, they took another one. The difference in the two was amazing. It looked like she was 10 years younger. Additionally, she had made friends with other women in the dining room and was becoming much more social than she had ever been before. None of us expected that.
My mom was a little bitter at first that she had been suggesting this for years and it wasn't until the "Golden Child" suggested it that my grandmother was open to the idea. My mom still went over a couple of times a week; that increased as my grandmother's health deteriorated.
We believe that my grandmother's quality of life increased greatly once she moved into the facility. She was 98 when she passed a year and a half ago.
I hope you can find some middle ground with this that brings you peace. I know I will be making these same decisions in the future with my own parents.
|
|
|
Post by craftedbys on Nov 16, 2018 5:25:06 GMT
Bump for update.
I forgot to address the situation with the house. It has been paid off for many years.
Thankfully, my dad was very careful and thoughtful with his money and investments so he can easily afford the nice facility we looked at for many years.
He and Mom bought their 4 bedroom/3bath Dutch colonial home for $29,000 in 1967. Similar homes in their neighborhood have recently sold for over 100k, so that would be a tidy sum to add to Dad's savings account.
Our biggest hurdle now is getting everything gone through and distributed among the family, sold, or donated. I am positive y'all will be seeing a vent thread over that in the near future, LOL.
Thank you again peas, for having my back!!
|
|
|
Post by cadoodlebug on Nov 16, 2018 5:45:27 GMT
Good update ~ I'm glad you're at peace with his decision. The place sounds wonderful!
|
|
RedSquirrelUK
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,733
Location: The UK's beautiful West Country
Aug 2, 2014 13:03:45 GMT
|
Post by RedSquirrelUK on Nov 16, 2018 6:39:12 GMT
I'm so thankful. Well done for going through that hard, hard time, and for learning a little more about yourself. And good luck with the clearing out - I'm glad you've had first crack at that!
|
|
|
Post by scrappintoee on Nov 16, 2018 10:22:31 GMT
Wow, your update is just WONDERFUL !!! (( hugs )) that things will keep going well!
|
|
wellway
Prolific Pea
Posts: 8,764
Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
|
Post by wellway on Nov 16, 2018 10:28:07 GMT
Good update and good on you for treating yourself to some me time. So, you never said, did DH like your new hairstyle once he was told to notice it??
|
|
|
Post by scrappinmom3 on Nov 16, 2018 12:32:02 GMT
Looking at it that way, I really doubt OP's brother has any ill intent. If he was looking to maximize the inheritance, he would be letting things continue as they are. ? In all the cases I’ve seen, when the parent(s) move into a larger home with the kid’s family, both houses are sold, and the money combined to buy the larger house. Then when the parent dies, the persons who spent their time caring for the parent is not begrudged any “ gain “ they may have got with the increase in real estate value. Is it possible the brother’s motive is to make sure OP does not benefit financially in any way by Dad moving in with her? That is the one of the things that I saw when I was reading this. I also was wondering if this is the brothers motivation to put dad into the assisted living. We are in almost a reverse situation with my mil. My shower is the middle of three boys. Oldest brother has “borrowed” tens of thousands of dollars from mil and has never made an attempt to pay back. Mil lives in a very expensive but very nice senior apt that has facilities from no care to full nursing care. When she moved there after fil died, she had to put down a large chunk of money, maintain a certain amount of assets and pay her monthly rent. As long as she maintained the assets that she initially said she had, along with using said amount reasonably, she would be cared for until she died even if her funds ran out. Asshat brother number one has borrowed so much that she now only has the funds to live there for 5 more years. She is 80 but in good health and both of her parents lived into their late 90’s. Youngest brother is closest to mil almost creepily so) and lives in a tiny house. She would only ever consider living with him, should she ever need to. We feel that it would be smartest for mil to move out now and maintain a less expensive senior apt. (She doesn’t need or even use the amenities that she has). To then take a chunk of the $ to put a nice addition onto 3rd bil’s house including a room and bathroom for mil. They would be able to have caretakers if needed. Of course, he would continue to have the benefit of the addition to the house but that would be well deserved as far as we are concerned. Asshat bil doesn’t agree, of course. And mil lives in denial and wants to stay where she is and I guess deal with it then. None of us have extra funds to keep her there, so it will be ugly in five years. Much luck to you with whatever decision is made.
|
|
peabrain
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,588
Jun 25, 2014 22:18:04 GMT
|
Post by peabrain on Nov 16, 2018 13:30:18 GMT
I am moved by your update. What a wonderful person you are. Your father has raised a caring daughter and he must be proud and is lucky to have you as his daughter.
|
|
|
Post by mikklynn on Nov 16, 2018 14:18:43 GMT
I'm really happy to see your update.
I think it's a great solution for you and your dad. You get to be the daughter, as so many other said.
|
|
moodyblue
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,175
Location: Western Illinois
Site Supporter
Jun 26, 2014 21:07:23 GMT
|
Post by moodyblue on Nov 16, 2018 14:28:51 GMT
Great update! Good for you for doing some listening and some Introspection - and for taking some time for yourself.
|
|
|
Post by Merge on Nov 16, 2018 14:32:55 GMT
Aww, love your update. My best wishes for a peaceful transition for all of you. And I bet your new hair looks great!
|
|
|
Post by revirdsuba99 on Nov 16, 2018 14:34:43 GMT
OP, well done!! Your update it good news all the way around.
|
|
|
Post by jenjie on Nov 16, 2018 14:36:13 GMT
Great update!
|
|
|
Post by revirdsuba99 on Nov 16, 2018 14:41:25 GMT
Mil lives in a very expensive but very nice senior apt that has facilities from no care to full nursing care. When she moved there after fil died, she had to put down a large chunk of money, maintain a certain amount of assets and pay her monthly rent. As long as she maintained the assets that she initially said she had, along with using said amount reasonably, she would be cared for until she died even if her funds ran out. To then take a chunk of the $ to put a nice addition onto 3rd bil’s house including a room and bathroom for mil. They would be able to have caretakers if needed. I suggest you read the fine print in the contract. Some of the 'full' service facilities HOLD that money for very long/excessive times. They hold the money until/even after the unit has been reoccupied, so they have no rush to fill it again. NJ has or is working on legislation to require timely refunds.
|
|
|
Post by FuzzyMutt on Nov 16, 2018 15:09:58 GMT
I am so sorry you are going through this. I can only offer my story with my grandmother. Grandma lived alone in a cute little townhouse for years. My mom wanted her to move to AL so she wouldn't have to take care of the house. Gram adamantly refused. Then, suddenly, one day after talking to her son (my uncle) Gram was all over the idea. She, like your father, was a loner. Had lived in her house for 15 years and had never met her neighbors. Had no friends that lived locally. When she moved into the facility, they took her picture. A year later, they took another one. The difference in the two was amazing. It looked like she was 10 years younger. Additionally, she had made friends with other women in the dining room and was becoming much more social than she had ever been before. None of us expected that. My mom was a little bitter at first that she had been suggesting this for years and it wasn't until the "Golden Child" suggested it that my grandmother was open to the idea. My mom still went over a couple of times a week; that increased as my grandmother's health deteriorated. We believe that my grandmother's quality of life increased greatly once she moved into the facility. She was 98 when she passed a year and a half ago. I hope you can find some middle ground with this that brings you peace. I know I will be making these same decisions in the future with my own parents. My Gram wasn't a loner, but she did love her alone time, and space. She lived in her own home for about 15 years after my Pap passed. Eventually taking care of the house was more than she wanted to do, and she moved into a senior apartment building. She LOVED it! She loved that she could entertain in common areas. She could just decide to go downstairs (elevator) and play rummy with whoever happened to be hanging around. Gram was a night owl, and she made many friends that way. She also loved that she could cook if she wanted to, or she could just put in her order for a meal in the evening. Rather than have to call my Uncle to change a lightbulb, she simply would push a button and it was done. She had two "children" living in town that were absolutely happy to do anything she needed, anything at all. But she felt a massive sense of independence that she wasn't asking, it was just "part of living there." She could be her own housekeeper, or there were greatly reduced rates for various levels of housekeeping. So instead of my mom and my uncle visiting with her and sorta doing chores or staring at the wall, they got to actually visit with her, hang out with her friends, and get to enjoy that part of her again. All us kids were sad when she announced she was selling her house (she'd lived in it nearly 70 years) because it impacted our holidays etc. Truthfully, it was great to see her so happy in her little community. Please don't think of assisted living as not fulfilling your promise to your mother. If that's what he wants, help him get there, and keep visiting. You may find you enjoy one another more than you'd ever imagine.
|
|
|
Post by mrssmith on Nov 16, 2018 15:57:57 GMT
Glad to see your update. I think you should definitely have the first opportunity to claim any special items! Glad to read that you took some time for yourself (even if DH didn't notice the haircut at first!)
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 10, 2024 2:22:58 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2018 16:17:42 GMT
I'm happy to hear you sounding so positive about things, such a good update
|
|
tincin
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,368
Jul 25, 2014 4:55:32 GMT
|
Post by tincin on Nov 16, 2018 17:16:47 GMT
I'm so glad that you were all able to sit down and discuss it with each other. I'm glad it is working out and that you were able to go in with an open mind. It will be difficult for you but at the same time, it's time you put the focus back on you and your DH and family. I'm sure you will enjoy having some free time for a change. Good luck.
|
|
|
Post by flanz on Nov 16, 2018 19:11:18 GMT
So happy to read your update! You've got this!
|
|