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Post by aj2hall on Feb 11, 2022 4:31:02 GMT
Just wanted to echo that a lot of other strategies were tried before mandates. The Biden administration did everything possible to make getting the vaccine easy - free, time off work, transportation etc. Many places offered vaccine clinics - pharmacies, clinics, state run programs, even churches and restaurants. The Biden administration made it as easy and convenient as they could. Community outreach was also tried through pastors, ministers, community leaders, local health clinics, family care doctors etc. There was an ad campaign, late night tv show hosts and other entertainers encouraged people to get vaccinated. However, there was a stubborn group of mostly Republicans that flat out refused the vaccine. And the people most likely to reach the unvaccinated, Republican politicians and Fox/ other right wing media mostly refused to help and worse, got in the way. Regrettably, many Republican politicians instead of strongly encouraging people to get vaccinated, hedged, remained silent, refused to answer questions about their own vaccination status and fought covid mitigation measures every step of the way. Fox gave air time to conspiracy theorists and raged against the CDC, Dr Fauci, mitigation measures and vaccine mandates. Fox, other right wing media outlets, podcasters like Joe Rogan and Republican politicians eroded confidence in the CDC and safety of the vaccine. The people most likely to convince the unvaccinated instead just reinforced beliefs about their freedom, the safety of the vaccine and doubled down. In some cases, Republican governors sacrificed their supporters for political ambitions. The honorable, ethical thing for Republicans and right wing media would have involved efforts to get Republicans vaccinated when it became glaringly obvious last summer who was refusing the vaccine. And agree or disagree with mandates, they are effective at increasing vaccination rates. As far as employer mandates, when push comes to shove, a significant majority- 90-95% choose to get vaccinated. So the question - what was the point of all of the mask and vaccine mandates? Very simple - slow the transmission of covid and save lives. www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2022/01/22/do-vaccine-mandates-actually-workwww.npr.org/2021/10/07/1043332198/employer-vaccine-mandates-success-workers-get-shots-to-keep-jobswww.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/09/29/evidence-is-building-vaccine-mandates-work-well/thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/581613-amid-challenges-to-bidens-vaccine-mandate-study-shows-they-work |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:04:10 GMT
Surveillance video appears to show anti-vaccine protesters trying to set apartment building on fire That is so beyond crazy. That could have been mass murder. I’m glad it was put out but what about the next time. I can’t imagine being able to sleep until they were gone knowing that some of them were willing to do something so extreme. What does anti vax have to do with an apartment building full of innocent people. Where ARE all the peas who were so mad about the destruction of property at the George Floyd demonstrations? They're all probably still waiting for any of you to give a shit when the same damn thing was happening back in 2020 when riots broke out during protests that you agreed with. Burning buildings with people in them was dismissed back then and anyone that brought it up was demeaned and silenced. NOW you expect anyone to come and discuss this with you? Wow Liar. As usual. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:06:05 GMT
I agree. That's exactly what it is. Is that the best you can do??? Good God!!! That makes me laugh!!! I think it's great and I hope it works....and I hope it comes to DC. You all do realize that the mask/vax card mandates are going to be gone in probably a few short months, don't you?? I for one, can't wait to be done with the ridiculousness and hypocrisy that these politicians have caused.... And I'm glad that gofundme was called out and now they have to double down!! Assholes!! Jokes on you. Go fund me disallowed the fundraising and returned the funding to the original donors. But you keep showing us how selfish and un-American you are. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:06:48 GMT
Of course you do. You're like so many on the right - a hypocrite. Have fun when the next "lefty" issue is turned into siege warfare of your city.
Here's the difference between us, you hate it when the left breaks the law and love it when the right does.
I hate it when ANY PARTY breaks the law.
It's a protest, what law is being broken?  And a very peaceful one at that! Not at all like the ones in 2020 where peoples businesses and livelihoods were being destroyed by NOT PROTESTERS, but RIOTERS. There is a HUGE difference. Nope guess again. You’re deliberately being ignorant. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:07:26 GMT
GOOD!! That's the point of a protest, right??? Do you want to talk about BLM rioters trying to destroy a federal building and obliterating several small businesses during that time period??? Maybe Trudeau will quit being a dictator and listen to his countrymen... You are nuts. Trudeau a “dictator?” |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:09:26 GMT
Yup…being good humans and good members of society…definitely points that should be give the blah, blah, blah treatment and dismantled very soon. Sounds about right to many I am sure - and then we wonder why we have so many issues. 🤷♀️  I keep forgetting that the left is so good and the right is so bad!! And there are no BAD left and no GOOD right!!! At least you acknowledge how fucking awful, selfish, destructive and petty the right is. |
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Post by dizzycheermom on Feb 11, 2022 5:09:34 GMT
You do know that any immigrants crossing the border are vaccinated if they stay, right? Or do you just post pics that you see without researching? |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:11:19 GMT
Those same people wanted a crack down on the Occupy Seattle downtown demonstration in 2020, in the wake of the George Floyd killing. Crickets on the truckers doing the same thing. Typical hypocrisy from the right. It's OK for Republicans to protest for selfish "freedoms", but Democrats protesting for racial justice is unacceptable and needs a crackdown. A federal intervention for the mostly peaceful protest in Portland was justified, but no action needed for the truckers. The truckers are not rioting or destroying small businesses. You will have to tell me where the similarities are. And you are coo-coo if you think that the Portland or Seattle protests were peaceful. They still have safety warnings for those cities... Sure they are. Lots of businesses have closed, because of their presence, leaving workers without income. Their cargo isn’t being delivered, causing higher prices for the rest. It’s amazing to see such dumb comments coming from you—you’re a horrible person. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:12:30 GMT
There are people there carrying confederate flags, and some people tried to light a building on fire and lock people inside of it. Peaceful? Race card? Really? How do you know that they weren't from the opposing side trying to make the truckers look bad??? You don't know that. Like I said, there are always a few nutters causing problems. But I don't trust the MSM to report a true story anyway!! You’re brainwashed. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:13:37 GMT
Oh my god. It's been reported by multiple outlets. But I guess not on the "special" ones you watch. Funny how you trusted the MSM to report what happened in Minneapolis and Portland, but not now. You are the walking definition of confirmation bias. I never trusted the MSM...none of it...I get my news from several different sources. Not just CNN, MSNBS, Fox or others. I do my research. “I do my research” Bwaashahahaaaaa |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:17:21 GMT
but still 2.5%, a fringe minority. Keep in mind, this started as an anti-mandate convoy (which was supported by many but still a minority). It's weird because most of the mandates are at the provincial level but these people aren't rocket scientists. It turned into an occupation with thousands of citizens stuck in downtown Ottawa. Businesses closed. Gas tank storage on the streets. People not getting health care services because the workers can't get downtown. Now they have a MOU with demands to dissolve our elected gov't and putting these cement heads in charge. WTF don't you understand about this? Their aim is to stop democracy. Ottawa police stated a few minutes ago that 25% of the truckers downtown brought there kids with them. Cowards. Police also said they are working with enforcement in Ohio because people are trying to interfere with their response. Do you not believe in democracy? Or is democracy only fitting if your team wins? The Trump special. Nope, its to stop the ridiculous mandates. RIDICULOUS MANDATES!!!!! Look—-she’s frothing! 😂😂😂😂😂 |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:19:39 GMT
Aren’t you predictable? Someone addressing the specific behaviors, of what have been stated over and over again on this thread as a minority of truckers behaving reprehensibly, is extrapolated to mean every single trucker, including those who are vaccinated and want nothing to do with this. Just so you can take an imaginary moral high ground where there is none. Typical right.
FFS. It’s a peaceful protest, noisy but peaceful. Personally I think it’s members of the left or progressives who are infiltrating the protest and doing all the crazy confederate/nazi flag waving bullshit there. Your tin foil hat is tight. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:21:24 GMT
I see the village idiot has checked in. Funny how you’re ignoring the harassment of people of color, people wearing masks, lighting off fireworks between buildings in a city - some hitting buildings, the attempted arson and locking in of residents in an apartment building, and many other incidents. So, no. Not peaceful, you fucking dolt. It’s an insurrection and an occupation. Good grief. It’s so hard to believe that such a horrible person like you exists. 🖕🏻 What did I say that offended you? Oh , that’s right, I have a different view than you. You must be a real joy to live with. 😍😍😍 I hope you don’t have a husband or children, if you do, I pity them!! You’re such a bitch. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:29:51 GMT
It may have been five years ago but your opinions have not changed, so we are to believe that you would no longer move them out of the way if they were stopping you from getting to where you needed to go? Doesn’t seem likely… In my opinion. I have never cheered for anyone to die. I have relatives and coworkers who are not vaccinated and that are people still in my life, why in heck would I wish death on them? Do I agree with them or even understand why...unfortunately no. Do I think the are selfish…absolutely. Do I think they are patriots just fighting for freedoms being lost…not a chance in hell. 🤷♀️ I have tried to not be rude to anyone here when giving my opinion…so “all of you” is not cutting it in my book. Lucky for me I don't care about your opinion!! Sure you do. You come here to get your sorry ass and lies validated. You seek validation with every post you make. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Feb 11, 2022 5:32:51 GMT
OF COURSE the village idiot thinks it’s funny that Canadian and American workers can’t work. Actually, what I think is funny is your responses to my posts. We are all getting a big kick out of that over here. 🤣 So are “we”. We get to watch a pathetic human crash and burn on her lies, brainwashed narrative. |
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Post by pixiechick on Feb 11, 2022 6:37:12 GMT
You’re just flat out making things up and lying now. No one is being denied access to medical care or stores. In fact, by their actions, the unvaccinated are over whelming health care and preventing others from accessing healthcare There are gyms, restaurants, entertainment venues and colleges that require proof of vaccine. Not to mention transplant recipients are being denied their place on the list, if not vaccinated. I know they have their medical reasons, but it is happening. Despite you saying it isn't. So no, she's not "just flat out making things up and lying now." There's even a thread here on the transplant recipient. |
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Post by sideways on Feb 11, 2022 6:52:39 GMT
You’re just flat out making things up and lying now. No one is being denied access to medical care or stores. In fact, by their actions, the unvaccinated are over whelming health care and preventing others from accessing healthcare There are gyms, restaurants, entertainment venues and colleges that require proof of vaccine. Not to mention transplant recipients are being denied their place on the list, if not vaccinated. I know they have their medical reasons, but it is happening. Despite you saying it isn't. So no, she's not "just flat out making things up and lying now." There's even a thread here on the transplant recipient. When you own your own business, you can decide to not require vaccination of your patrons. Also, as has been mentioned ad nauseam, there are MANY requirements that transplant recipients must meet to ensure the best possible outcome. They’re not being denied their “place” on a transplant list; they don’t meet the requirements to even get on the list if they refuse to get vaccinated…or to do many other things that are required. If they’re not willing to get the covid vaccine, or any other vaccine required for transplant, they are at greater risk of contracting said illness and dying from it. Since organs for transplant are few and far between, they should go to those who have the best chance of survival. If someone chooses not to get the vaccine, then they’re not it. Kind of like how someone still drinking isn’t eligible for a liver transplant. |
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PLurker
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,840
Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Feb 11, 2022 7:02:19 GMT
You’re just flat out making things up and lying now. No one is being denied access to medical care or stores. In fact, by their actions, the unvaccinated are over whelming health care and preventing others from accessing healthcare There are gyms, restaurants, entertainment venues and colleges that require proof of vaccine. Not to mention transplant recipients are being denied their place on the list, if not vaccinated. I know they have their medical reasons, but it is happening. Despite you saying it isn't. So no, she's not "just flat out making things up and lying now." There's even a thread here on the transplant recipient. As a transplant recipient this is gross and insulting. There were a LOT of hoops to jump through, agreements and will and will not promises to be made to allow the GIFT of an organ from someone's loved one. It is to protect you and the organ of that person, to give the best chance at extending life of both . If you are lucky enough to find a match, you damn well should feel obligated to do what's best for the gift which in turn is best for you. If you trust the medical team to plan and carry out the untold amount of planning, tests and double checks leading to the procedure they bless you with, (not to mention the lifelong aftercare) that will save your ass, you should trust that they know a hell of a lot more than you what's best. Because they do. Insulting to not honor that. Furthermore, that guy, before getting a transplant and remaining unvaxd would be his own future self's worst enemy after recievung the gift of life. You, as a transplant recipient pretty much have to stay the hell away from anti-vaxers and the unvaxed because you are now permanently immunocompromised. That guy either has had his head full of misinformation and bought it all, is not thinking clearly, is an idiot or is a combination of. I'm sure there's other options, but you get the picture. Sorry, a potential organ recipient can lose their turn for a multitude of reasons all endangering the success of the Gift of a transplant. Being unvaccinated is just one of many of reasons. To cry foul is ridiculous. Obscene to not honor the gift you're willing to take. That's what it is, dishonoring the donor by not giving it the best shot. He was not. Period. |
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Post by pixiechick on Feb 11, 2022 7:48:25 GMT
There are gyms, restaurants, entertainment venues and colleges that require proof of vaccine. Not to mention transplant recipients are being denied their place on the list, if not vaccinated. I know they have their medical reasons, but it is happening. Despite you saying it isn't. So no, she's not "just flat out making things up and lying now." There's even a thread here on the transplant recipient. As a transplant recipient this is gross and insulting. There were a LOT of hoops to jump through, agreements and will and will not promises to be made to allow the GIFT of an organ from someone's loved one. It is to protect you and the organ of that person, to give the best chance at extending life of both . If you are lucky enough to find a match, you damn well should feel obligated to do what's best for the gift which in turn is best for you. If you trust the medical team to plan and carry out the untold amount of planning, tests and double checks leading to the procedure they bless you with, (not to mention the lifelong aftercare) that will save your ass, you should trust that they know a hell of a lot more than you what's best. Because they do. Insulting to not honor that. Furthermore, that guy, before getting a transplant and remaining unvaxd would be his own future self's worst enemy after recievung the gift of life. You, as a transplant recipient pretty much have to stay the hell away from anti-vaxers and the unvaxed because you are now permanently immunocompromised. That guy either has had his head full of misinformation and bought it all, is not thinking clearly, is an idiot or is a combination of. I'm sure there's other options, but you get the picture. Sorry, a potential organ recipient can lose their turn for a multitude of reasons all endangering the success of the Gift of a transplant. Being unvaccinated is just one of many of reasons. To cry foul is ridiculous. Obscene to not honor the gift you're willing to take. That's what it is, dishonoring the donor by not giving it the best shot. He was not. Period. I don't disagree with you and I'm not crying foul... He made his choice, the hospital has requirements for a reason. I agree with them and you. I simply said that it happened. It existed. It wasn't made up as was claimed. |
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Feb 11, 2022 8:33:56 GMT
GOOD!! That's the point of a protest, right??? Do you want to talk about BLM rioters trying to destroy a federal building and obliterating several small businesses during that time period??? Maybe Trudeau will quit being a dictator and listen to his countrymen... Because I missed this little gem the first time… Again, you seem to lack a basic understanding of the Canadian political system that would be required in order to make a meaningful contribution to this discussion. Other than measures under the purview of the federal government (border control, air and train travel, federal employees), all of the restrictive measures that the Flu Trux Klan are supposedly protesting are put in place by the provincial/territorial governments, the majority of which are conservative.. So, again, why are they protesting in Ottawa? (In case you were ignorant of this as well - Ottawa isn’t the seat of or provincial/territorial governments.) |
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Post by pixiechick on Feb 11, 2022 9:07:18 GMT
A business can. A government should not. And, with the exception of federal employees, the Canadian government hasn't. I may be required to have a vaccination to go to the local pub but, unless the pub requires it, the employees there aren't subject to the same mandate. US government tried. They were told no. |
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Post by pixiechick on Feb 11, 2022 9:11:04 GMT
Not wearing something political, getting fingerprinted, having a background check, or getting a physical, are nowhere near equal to having a drug injected into your body. That is your opinion, and many disagree with you. To most people, it’s no big deal. Yes, most people would have the "opinion" that something you wear is nowhere near equivalent to something you inject. |
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Post by pixiechick on Feb 11, 2022 9:17:41 GMT
If they were, "allowed across" they weren't illegaly entering. That isn't the least bit true. Does a minimum wage employee not confronting the guy walking out of Trader Joe's with a tower of meat in his arms mean the guy isn't shoplifting? |
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Post by pixiechick on Feb 11, 2022 9:19:59 GMT
I just hope those who are against vaccine mandates understand that your children and their children will start getting some of the awful diseases that my generation suffered with and too many died from. Think long and hard about what you are supporting. You and your cohorts are encouraging all mandates be gone. Ask some of your elders what polio did to their families and friends. Ask Mitch McConnell who has worn a mask through this whole mess. I had polio and still has issues. Small pox is deadly. Measles damages hearing, and kills. Diphtheria kills. Whooping cough has most recently been killing babies who can't cough the stuff out. Chicken pox leaves its after virus for Shingles... That's enough for now..... Again, think long and hard for the futures you are giving the next generations.. ETA: Forgot to mention most the House members and Senate members are vaccinated, FOX, requires vaccines for personnel as do most other networks... They just lie to the public/their viewers about it all. I bet they got in line and got theirs vaccines before I did. Wow. Talk about a strawman argument. |
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Deleted
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Nov 23, 2024 23:47:56 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2022 9:34:56 GMT
Just to clarify in case there has been any misunderstanding -
we are vaccinated
we are still clinically vulnerable
we have discussed things with my husband’s cardiologist
we have been advised to still continue shielding in our own capacity even though we are fully vaccinated with boosters.
In addition , we received a letter from the government that said that it would be wise to still continue with the same precautions when the official shielding protections ended nationally.
There is not more I can add to my reasoning for my support of voluntary rather than mandatory vaccine covered in my second post except to say that for people who have vaccine hesitancy due to medical risks , our personal experience of this dilemma has made us have compassion for those who have found themselves in the same boat. Sometimes making a decision where clinical risk is involved takes courage .
It has been 3 years since I was told my husband had a 20% chance of surviving emergency heart surgery. You just want to keep loved ones safe and it is so hard face risks on both sides whatever decision you make.
When the vaccine that offers protection against Covid can at the same time be potentially fatal and is associated with blood clots or thinning it easy to feel conflicted when those risks could have an impact on managing my husband’s condition .
I hope that people will wear masks and take other precautions whether they are vaccinated or not to protect themselves and others ,I feel that mask mandates would be beneficial but unfortunately this seems to be changing in many different areas.
Anyway ,I am now going to take a break from this thread.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Feb 11, 2022 9:43:20 GMT
And, with the exception of federal employees, the Canadian government hasn't. I may be required to have a vaccination to go to the local pub but, unless the pub requires it, the employees there aren't subject to the same mandate. US government tried. They were told no. Cool - what does that have to do with this protest? |
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Post by pixiechick on Feb 11, 2022 10:12:03 GMT
Just to clarify in case there has been any misunderstanding - we are vaccinated we are still clinically vulnerable we have discussed things with my husband’s cardiologist we have been advised to still continue shielding in our own capacity even though we are fully vaccinated with boosters. In addition , we received a letter from the government that said that it would be wise to still continue with the same precautions when the official shielding protections ended nationally. There is not more I can add to my reasoning for my support of voluntary rather than mandatory vaccine covered in my second post except to say that for people who have vaccine hesitancy due to medical risks , our personal experience of this dilemma has made us have compassion for those who have found themselves in the same boat. Sometimes making a decision where clinical risk is involved takes courage . It has been 3 years since I was told my husband had a 20% chance of surviving emergency heart surgery. You just want to keep loved ones safe and it is so hard face risks on both sides whatever decision you make. When the vaccine that offers protection against Covid can at the same time be potentially fatal and is associated with blood clots or thinning it easy to feel conflicted when those risks could have an impact on managing my husband’s condition . I hope that people will wear masks and take other precautions whether they are vaccinated or not to protect themselves and others ,I feel that mask mandates would be beneficial but unfortunately this seems to be changing in many different areas. Anyway ,I am now going to take a break from this thread. My heart goes out to you for the choices you are faced with as well as what all you are dealing with. Hugs to you. |
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Post by pixiechick on Feb 11, 2022 10:13:36 GMT
US government tried. They were told no. Cool - what does that have to do with this protest? It's a pandemic. There is going to be crossover in the discussions. |
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Post by aj2hall on Feb 11, 2022 12:18:08 GMT
As a transplant recipient this is gross and insulting. There were a LOT of hoops to jump through, agreements and will and will not promises to be made to allow the GIFT of an organ from someone's loved one. It is to protect you and the organ of that person, to give the best chance at extending life of both . If you are lucky enough to find a match, you damn well should feel obligated to do what's best for the gift which in turn is best for you. If you trust the medical team to plan and carry out the untold amount of planning, tests and double checks leading to the procedure they bless you with, (not to mention the lifelong aftercare) that will save your ass, you should trust that they know a hell of a lot more than you what's best. Because they do. Insulting to not honor that. Furthermore, that guy, before getting a transplant and remaining unvaxd would be his own future self's worst enemy after recievung the gift of life. You, as a transplant recipient pretty much have to stay the hell away from anti-vaxers and the unvaxed because you are now permanently immunocompromised. That guy either has had his head full of misinformation and bought it all, is not thinking clearly, is an idiot or is a combination of. I'm sure there's other options, but you get the picture. Sorry, a potential organ recipient can lose their turn for a multitude of reasons all endangering the success of the Gift of a transplant. Being unvaccinated is just one of many of reasons. To cry foul is ridiculous. Obscene to not honor the gift you're willing to take. That's what it is, dishonoring the donor by not giving it the best shot. He was not. Period. I don't disagree with you and I'm not crying foul... He made his choice, the hospital has requirements for a reason. I agree with them and you. I simply said that it happened. It existed. It wasn't made up as was claimed. You’re missing the point. He wasn’t denied health care, he just isn’t eligible for a specific procedure, a transplant. He remained in the hospital, receiving care and he had another procedure. Cindosha claimed people are being denied health care because of their vaccination status which simply isn’t true. One person who is not eligible for a specific procedure does not make her statement true. |
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Feb 11, 2022 12:39:27 GMT
Cool - what does that have to do with this protest? It's a pandemic. There is going to be crossover in the discussions. There is crossover and then there is takeover. You seem to have lost the script entirely. To be fair, it’s not just you but not every conversation has to be made about US politics. It’s tiresome. In all fairness to you, though, at least you aren’t trying to US-splain the protest to us like cindosha is. |
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And a very peaceful one at that! Not at all like the ones in 2020 where peoples businesses and livelihoods were being destroyed by NOT PROTESTERS, but RIOTERS. There is a HUGE difference. 
