|
Post by Meri-Lyn on Aug 10, 2015 21:43:28 GMT
When my dad died he had no insurance and my mom had no money; my older brother hadn't worked in three years. I had to take out a loan on my 401K to pay for his funeral. This is probably going to be me with my mother when the time comes. All she has is SSI and a ton of credit card debt (that I am NOT paying for.) Nothing to show for it except a 14 year old car. When my aunt passed away back in '97, she had specifically said no funeral, burial, anything. Her words and this is a direct quote to me "Just leave me for the county." But my mother and uncle insisted she had to have "proper" burial, even though there was no money to pay for it. IIRC, they ended up going into thousands of dollars in debt, financed by the funeral home at a lovely 18% (or more) interest rate. I wouldn't be surprised if my uncle is still making payments so many years later. It's just...sad.
|
|
MerryMom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,562
Jul 24, 2014 19:51:57 GMT
|
Post by MerryMom on Aug 10, 2015 21:58:58 GMT
So if SS paid $255 to each qualifying spouse or if surviving dependent children for 770,000 deaths. I will use $1000 for a very basic funeral or cremation. $1000 x 770,000 deaths for one year = $770,000,000 so basically 3 quarters of a billion dollars a year!!!! to cover funeral expenses. Sorry, but I don't think the role of government is to pay for funeral expenses. Get life insurance, save the money, pay off the funeral in installments, or pass the hat at the funeral. And yes, I've had to pay for a funeral. What are you wanting SS to cover? Pension only? No more disability payments? What exactly do you mean by "rather than paying for what it should" ? Personally, I think they should do away with the $255. Social Security was a fully funded program but it is raid by Congress to pay for earmarks etc. So when you consider all those baby boomers that paid in for 40+ the money should be more than there, but it isn't because it has been raided as it has been replenished rather than banked as a pension plan to gain interest. That is actually a fallacy that is oft repeated. I'll include links www.ssa.gov/history/InternetMyths2.html
|
|
MerryMom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,562
Jul 24, 2014 19:51:57 GMT
|
Post by MerryMom on Aug 10, 2015 22:00:54 GMT
Social Security was a fully funded program but it is raid by Congress to pay for earmarks etc. So when you consider all those baby boomers that paid in for 40+ the money should be more than there, but it isn't because it has been raided as it has been replenished rather than banked as a pension plan to gain interest. That is actually a fallacy that is oft repeated. I'll include links www.ssa.gov/history/InternetMyths2.html www.ssa.gov/history/InternetMyths.html
|
|
|
Post by knit.pea on Aug 10, 2015 23:01:41 GMT
When my dad died he had no insurance and my mom had no money; my older brother hadn't worked in three years. I had to take out a loan on my 401K to pay for his funeral. This is probably going to be me with my mother when the time comes. All she has is SSI and a ton of credit card debt (that I am NOT paying for.) Nothing to show for it except a 14 year old car. When my aunt passed away back in '97, she had specifically said no funeral, burial, anything. Her words and this is a direct quote to me "Just leave me for the county." But my mother and uncle insisted she had to have "proper" burial, even though there was no money to pay for it. IIRC, they ended up going into thousands of dollars in debt, financed by the funeral home at a lovely 18% (or more) interest rate. I wouldn't be surprised if my uncle is still making payments so many years later. It's just...sad. As her executrix, I'm pretty sure I had to pay off whatever my Mom owed at that time, which was mostly medication bills upwards of $1,000 per month. From her insurance coverage reimbursement, it just kept rolling over to about $250 due per month. She didn't have the money to pay it, so my DH and I did. And afterwards, although some smaller balances from her hospitalization were written off, bills then kept coming from *all* the specialists (after insurance paid). Those we paid, too. There was no estate, no assets at that point (assisted living-ish) but she hadn't yet reached the threshold to qualify for Medicaid. Very close, but she was still officially self-pay. Difficult times
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 12:40:45 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2015 1:06:21 GMT
Many people donate their body to science to avoid funeral costs, but most major universities have a over abundance of donations and waiting lists are years long or closed because of it. This really surprises me. I'd have thought they'd have trouble finding bodies. At one time my parents looked into it and it was their understanding that after the medical use was completed, the remains (most likely cremains) were returned to the family to deal with. I don't know how factual that is because it was just brought up in discussion about why they decided to purchase a pre-arrangement package for cremation instead.
|
|
|
Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 11, 2015 1:22:06 GMT
Children have no.legal.obligation to pay funeral exoenses for a parent out if their own.pockets It varies state by state. I believe the last time I looked in my state, that funeral expenses would be assessed to the estate and the eldest child (not all the children) would bear responsibility for debts. Children are not obligated to pay the debts of the estate - nor or executors. Unless the children contract with a funeral home for the expenses, they are not obligated.
|
|
|
Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 11, 2015 1:23:34 GMT
This is probably going to be me with my mother when the time comes. All she has is SSI and a ton of credit card debt (that I am NOT paying for.) Nothing to show for it except a 14 year old car. When my aunt passed away back in '97, she had specifically said no funeral, burial, anything. Her words and this is a direct quote to me "Just leave me for the county." But my mother and uncle insisted she had to have "proper" burial, even though there was no money to pay for it. IIRC, they ended up going into thousands of dollars in debt, financed by the funeral home at a lovely 18% (or more) interest rate. I wouldn't be surprised if my uncle is still making payments so many years later. It's just...sad. As her executrix, I'm pretty sure I had to pay off whatever my Mom owed at that time, which was mostly medication bills upwards of $1,000 per month. From her insurance coverage reimbursement, it just kept rolling over to about $250 due per month. She didn't have the money to pay it, so my DH and I did. And afterwards, although some smaller balances from her hospitalization were written off, bills then kept coming from *all* the specialists (after insurance paid). Those we paid, too. There was no estate, no assets at that point (assisted living-ish) but she hadn't yet reached the threshold to qualify for Medicaid. Very close, but she was still officially self-pay. Difficult times You are not obligated as an executrix to pay the bills of the estate.
|
|
|
Post by myboysnme on Aug 11, 2015 1:53:24 GMT
My stepfather passed away this week and left about $8500 for funeral costs with a already paid for space, vault and engraved stone. His daughter came around looking for $1700 more. He did not have much - one large casket spray of flowers, a metal casket, embalming/viewing and transport to the cemetery. A nice basic funeral. But $10K? Who has that money just sitting around? I think that's why there are so many Go Fund Me requests.
|
|
|
Post by countrypeagirl on Aug 11, 2015 2:35:41 GMT
This really surprises me. I'd have thought they'd have trouble finding bodies. At one time my parents looked into it and it was their understanding that after the medical use was completed, the remains (most likely cremains) were returned to the family to deal with. I don't know how factual that is because it was just brought up in discussion about why they decided to purchase a pre-arrangement package for cremation instead.
Yes, the remains are returned back to the families after the bodies have been cremated.
|
|
|
Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 11, 2015 2:38:02 GMT
You are not obligated as an executrix to pay the bills of the estate. Does this mean A or B? A- deceased has home valued at 10k and $250 in their checking acct. They have utility bills and misc credit cards totalling 5k. Executrix can liquidate home and disperse roughly 10.25k to the beneficiaries of the will. B- same, but 5.25k is dispersed. B. The assets of the ESTATE are obligated to any outstanding debts. The executor of the estate is not personally obligated for any bills. The previous poster indicated she and her DH paid her mother's medical bills as she had no assets and was the executrix of the estate and was obligated.
|
|
|
Post by Meri-Lyn on Aug 11, 2015 12:09:13 GMT
B. The assets of the ESTATE are obligated to any outstanding debts. The executor of the estate is not personally obligated for any bills. The previous poster indicated she and her DH paid her mother's medical bills as she had no assets and was the executrix of the estate and was obligated. OK. Thanks. I was here going "what??!!". This is the way I understood it, at least in this state. She has Medicaid, so the medical expenses should be taken care of. This will sound mean and callous, but I worked my ass off trying to build up my retirement and have a nest egg for DH and I. Why should I have to pay for her (and ex-step-dad's) stupid financial mistakes? Sorry, went off on a tangent there....
|
|
mallie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,253
Jul 3, 2014 18:13:13 GMT
|
Post by mallie on Aug 11, 2015 12:26:25 GMT
In this area (multiple counties), funeral homes don't have to do anything until you can show them cash, although some do take credit cards. If I remember correctly from the recent past, the minimum amount for cremation alone was $1200. (Note that for some, cremation is not an option as, for example, the Catholic churches here will not do a funeral if the deceased is cremated and "traditional" preparation of the body, please casket, plus plot, plus internment, plus required headstone adds substantially to the cost.)
If the deceased did not have an estate to pay back the "heirs", you can apply to the county board of supervisors for a maximum gift of $500 for reimbursement of expenses -- which means you pay first, then apply for reimbursement.
You have a certain amount t of time to dispose of the remains, then the county will bury them in what used to be called a pauper's grave and you can not put a headstone up.
|
|
|
Post by compeateropeator on Aug 11, 2015 13:07:53 GMT
It is very disheartening that people need to deal with the such exorbitant funeral costs and how to pay them during an already sad, stressful, and a possibly traumatic time. Everyone who has to deal with with this has my sympathy and respect. And I am so sorry to anyone who has had to deal with the uncertainty of how to pay for a loved ones burial during a time of such sadness.
I did want to Add something about the Catholic/cremation issue. I don't think it is necessarily still taboo in all places so check in your area. We cremated my grandmother, who was a devout Catholic, had a mass/funeral and buried her in Catholic cemetery.
|
|
|
Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 11, 2015 13:23:23 GMT
It is very disheartening that people need to deal with the such exorbitant funeral costs and how to pay them during an already sad, stressful, and a possibly traumatic time. Everyone who has to deal with with this has my sympathy and respect. And I am so sorry to anyone who has had to deal with the uncertainty of how to pay for a loved ones burial during a time of such sadness. I did want to Add something about the Catholic/cremation issue. I don't think it is necessarily still taboo in all places so check in your area. We cremated my grandmother, who was a devout Catholic, had a mass/funeral and buried her in Catholic cemetery. The Catholic church lifted the ban on cremation in 1963. My family has used cremation in many Catholic cemeteries all over the country.
|
|
janeinbama
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,201
Location: Alabama
Jan 29, 2015 16:24:49 GMT
|
Post by janeinbama on Aug 11, 2015 13:36:13 GMT
At least in Alabama, you can prepay funerals prior to assets being used for nursing home care. Cremation for Catholics is okay, however, the ashes must be interred. No spreading of ashes at all.
|
|
mallie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,253
Jul 3, 2014 18:13:13 GMT
|
Post by mallie on Aug 11, 2015 13:45:28 GMT
It is very disheartening that people need to deal with the such exorbitant funeral costs and how to pay them during an already sad, stressful, and a possibly traumatic time. Everyone who has to deal with with this has my sympathy and respect. And I am so sorry to anyone who has had to deal with the uncertainty of how to pay for a loved ones burial during a time of such sadness. I did want to Add something about the Catholic/cremation issue. I don't think it is necessarily still taboo in all places so check in your area. We cremated my grandmother, who was a devout Catholic, had a mass/funeral and buried her in Catholic cemetery. The Catholic church lifted the ban on cremation in 1963. My family has used cremation in many Catholic cemeteries all over the country. It varies. In addition to this area, I know people in three different states in the last few years whose parish priest told them no body = no service and no Catholic burial.
|
|
|
Post by originalvanillabean on Aug 11, 2015 15:02:35 GMT
Very interesting thread. I've made some notes and see I have some research to do.
|
|
|
Post by jonda1974 on Aug 11, 2015 16:36:02 GMT
That's disgusting behavior. I know how cost effective a funeral can be, my DF's Funeral Home assisted in the burial of a lot of nuns (several convents nearby) and they don't spend any extra money on burials. I'm glad your community has you. I know people don't understand the ins and outs of the funeral industry and don't want to know until they need it and then they get this. Does the State AG not consider this price gouging? Heck, cremation in the closest city and viewing at the local church or other venue is better than $12-$14k. It happens all over the country.. As long as they provide a list of services (doesn't matter how much they cost) they are allowed to get away with it. That's why my company developed the Funeral Consumer Guardian Society. We protect our policy holders and their families from this happening. They should be able to be buried in their hometown and pay a decent and fair price and not have to use a funeral home in a large city just so they aren't paying outrageous prices. I work all over the states of Ohio and Indiana.. You would be sickened the things I hear every single day. It's sad.. That is so disheartening. I will be buried in Indiana. I already have a plot. My grandfather's funeral for everything open casket, burial, vault etc only cost us $10,000
|
|
|
Post by moosedogtoo on Aug 11, 2015 17:31:13 GMT
I laughed and laughed when I got that $255 check from SS after my first husband died. I'm pretty sure I ended up spending it at the liquor store for some fancy tequila and gin. LOL! I'm very thankful my DH had life insurance.
|
|
|
Post by knit.pea on Aug 11, 2015 17:39:54 GMT
Does this mean A or B? A- deceased has home valued at 10k and $250 in their checking acct. They have utility bills and misc credit cards totalling 5k. Executrix can liquidate home and disperse roughly 10.25k to the beneficiaries of the will. B- same, but 5.25k is dispersed. B. The assets of the ESTATE are obligated to any outstanding debts. The executor of the estate is not personally obligated for any bills. The previous poster indicated she and her DH paid her mother's medical bills as she had no assets and was the executrix of the estate and was obligated. In our case, there was no "estate" to pay anything. Yes, we could have gone into Probate for any outstanding bills. I felt obligated, as her daughter, to pay her medical debt. There may have been other legal avenues to do so, but I wasn't up to dragging it out any longer. I may have had a different opinion if it was credit card debt; my choice, of course, as her expenses were medically necessary to try and keep her alive. It *is* good to be aware that debt can be handled in another way, through Probate.
|
|
|
Post by knit.pea on Aug 11, 2015 21:01:55 GMT
None taken Everyone's circumstances are different. It was worth it to me to have them paid. After a month of doctor / hospital / surgery / heart attack / ventilator / sedation / second heart attack ... with 2 small boys at home ... I didn't have much patience left to deal with courts and Probate. The bills just kept coming, every couple days, with endless insurance adjustments. It was a constant reminder and, to me, very stressful. Quite the eye-opener about how little my parents had planned for retirement. I think they were from the generation who felt the Government programs and a pension would be enough. I don't think they ever did the math or took into account that medication in their older years would cost so much.
|
|
scrapaddie
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,090
Jul 8, 2014 20:17:31 GMT
|
Post by scrapaddie on Aug 11, 2015 21:17:00 GMT
Wow. I am really irritated by that. I've been paying just as much as any other one person of a couple into SS. More if only one of them has been employed. My survivor deserves that just as much as any one else's survivor. How unfair. Just one more thing to add to my lengthy list of things the government does that are screwed up as far as I am concerned. Better make sure she can get to cash quickly because we are on our own since I am unmarried. Really... How is this fair? It's incredibly unfair but the way the government works. They put that $255 in place during the 1930's.. And have never raised it according to the costs of final expenses. It makes me sad. The demographic of people I work with.. Some of them are living on $700 a month. And they know their families will be financially devastated by even a cremation. That's where I come in. I have to put together a plan that will fit comfortably in their budget so their family isn't left to "pass the hat around" when they pass. And then my company will make all of the arrangements at the funeral home for their families and price shop/negotiate the cost of the funeral down. People cry and hug me when I leave a home because they literally lay in bed at night worrying about what they will do. I have never thought that it was the governments responsibility to bury me.
|
|
|
Post by countrypeagirl on Aug 12, 2015 3:27:49 GMT
It's incredibly unfair but the way the government works. They put that $255 in place during the 1930's.. And have never raised it according to the costs of final expenses. It makes me sad. The demographic of people I work with.. Some of them are living on $700 a month. And they know their families will be financially devastated by even a cremation. That's where I come in. I have to put together a plan that will fit comfortably in their budget so their family isn't left to "pass the hat around" when they pass. And then my company will make all of the arrangements at the funeral home for their families and price shop/negotiate the cost of the funeral down. People cry and hug me when I leave a home because they literally lay in bed at night worrying about what they will do. I have never thought that it was the governments responsibility to bury me. Which is fine. The issue is more the fact that they only pay to certain people and not others.
|
|
scrapaddie
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,090
Jul 8, 2014 20:17:31 GMT
|
Post by scrapaddie on Aug 12, 2015 16:05:53 GMT
I have never thought that it was the governments responsibility to bury me. Which is fine. The issue is more the fact that they only pay to certain people and not others. Yes... There was nothing after my dad died and will be nothing when I die...
|
|
|
Post by AN on Aug 13, 2015 1:46:11 GMT
How much does a funeral policy run? If one can afford a policy, frankly, depending on age, most people are best off investing the premium and having that as savings, not buying a policy. Now, lots of people don't have the discipline to do that and it is just easier for them to buy the policy. But self-insuring for final expenses (when you have the money for a premium) is the best way to leave more money in your estate. Funeral policies are a business too, just like funeral homes. Fine if you want their service but calculate what it is costing you vs investing that same money. zanderinsurancetips.com/2011/07/q-should-i-buy-a-burial-policy/
|
|