zella
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Post by zella on Aug 30, 2015 3:51:55 GMT
I'm probably going to be starting several threads over the next little while, as I need someone to talk to, I need to vent, and I need perspective, and I can't get much of that IRL for various reasons. Here's my first question for you.
My sister was just diagnosed with a brain tumor. Some of her friends came into her hospital room and just sobbed. I didn't like that. I don't think it's right. I think you should hold it together when you
are the visitor, especially when you are a friend, not family. It's different when you are close family, and you are crying together; and I wouldn't expect children to control their emotions. But I felt that it was inappropriate for other people to go in her room and cry. I'm not talking a few tears and sniffing; I'm talking bawling.
So, what think the peas? Especially those of you who have been the patient in such a situation. I think one of the issues for me is that I don't think my sister should feel as though she has to make them feel better, kwim?
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MaryMary
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Post by MaryMary on Aug 30, 2015 3:59:27 GMT
I was terrified to see my sister-in-law after her brain tumor was diagnosed because I was worried I would respond the same way. But, you can't always control your emotions and I can't really fault them for loving her so much that they are heartbroken by this news. I don't know... It's a crappy situation. I'm sorry you are having to go through it.
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Post by AN on Aug 30, 2015 4:02:34 GMT
I think everyone reacts differently, and there isn't anything inherently wrong with crying in front of the person dealing with the tragedy. I do personally tend to agree with you, I'd personally try to keep it together; but I know a lot of people might feel like showing their emotion is showing her how much they care, etc. People react differently.
AND, that said -- I think it is fully within her rights to ask for whatever she needs at this point in time. If she needs to only be surrounded by people who can hold it together, or positivity, or if she only wants people to visit her while wearing the color blue, or WHATEVER -- that's totally fine. She needs to ask for exactly what would be most supportive for her, and then you as family or another close friend can act as the "enforcer."
I've shared sad personal news with people before and said, "I need you not to use your sad, sympathetic voice after I tell you this." Everyone wants a different kind of support, so I think asking for what you need and drawing some boundaries is totally appropriate in a situation like this.
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Post by myshelly on Aug 30, 2015 4:15:21 GMT
I'm sorry for what your family is facing.
I think not everyone has such a black and white separation of friends and family the way you do.
I think the next few weeks/months will be even harder for you if you focus unnecessary emotions on believing you have more of a right to emotions/feelings because you are family.
If I was faced with that diagnosis I know my BFF would be in the room crying and sobbing with me and we would just hold each other because that's just how we would feel.
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scrappinwithoutpeas
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Post by scrappinwithoutpeas on Aug 30, 2015 4:17:19 GMT
I'm sorry you're going through this. Prayers for your sister and you and the rest of your family.
I absolutely agree with you on this; you don't want your sister to be put into the position where she feels she has to comfort them , especially since they ostensibly came to the hospital to be supportive of her. I would politely ask them to step out of the room when/if they become overly emotional. But, I would also ask your sister first (when the friends are not present) how she feels about it and how she would like you to handle it - she may have a different opinion than you and may not mind.
I had a family member not respect my wishes (as relayed quite specifically by my DH) when I came home from the hospital after a big medical issue. She called and just sobbed on the phone to me (at me?) and I was not equipped to deal with it (which is why we asked for a few days of privacy in the first place, duh). I don't think I even spoke to her on the phone; I just silently handed the phone to DH and mimed something like "make her stop" or "make her go away" or something equally cold-sounding. I was just empty and emotionally fragile. So, I totally get where you're coming from. Hugs!
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Country Ham
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Post by Country Ham on Aug 30, 2015 4:26:22 GMT
You said it bothered you, but what did your sister say? When my husband had his cancer it was touching and comforting when his male friends cried in the room. It was such a display of real love and affection. It didn't make anyone feel less supported or uncomfortable at all.
A wonderful man from our church died recently. He was amazing. His cancer hit fast and it hit hard. A few days before he died about 30 of us from church squeezed into hospital room and we sang hymns. His voice was barely a whisper and he sang with us, not a dry eye in the room. Then while we all had tears streaming down our cheeks (not sobbing but just that silent crying) he actually prayed for us. 2 days later he was gone.
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Post by nlwilkins on Aug 30, 2015 4:36:42 GMT
You are saying they were sobbing not just having a few tears together? To me that is the difference. Sobbing is all about the person doing the sobbing, sharing some tears together is about support and sharing of emotions. It is just when you are sobbing and are uncontrollable crying you are unable to reach out but need someone to reach out to you. Visiting someone in the hospital is supposed to be for support of the patient. It seems like you should be able to step out of the room if you feel you are not able to hold it together and perhaps there might be other friends out there who can give you a bit of support to help you hold it together through the visit.
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theshyone
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Post by theshyone on Aug 30, 2015 4:39:38 GMT
I'm probably going to be starting several threads over the next little while, as I need someone to talk to, I need to vent, and I need perspective, and I can't get much of that IRL for various reasons. Here's my first question for you. My sister was just diagnosed with a brain tumor. Some of her friends came into her hospital room and just sobbed. I didn't like that. I don't think it's right. I think you should hold it together when you are the visitor, especially when you are a friend, not family. It's different when you are close family, and you are crying together; and I wouldn't expect children to control their emotions. But I felt that it was inappropriate for other people to go in her room and cry. I'm not talking a few tears and sniffing; I'm talking bawling. So, what think the peas? Especially those of you who have been the patient in such a situation. I think one of the issues for me is that I don't think my sister should feel as though she has to make them feel better, kwim? As a patient it never bothered me when friends cried. I never felt I needed to " make them feel better". It showed how much they loved me. I would have been pissed if family made my friends feel bad. |
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Post by RiverIsis on Aug 30, 2015 4:39:39 GMT
So sorry. I may be considered a clinical, cold hearted bitch, but I don't think there should be tears and histrionics until the histology is known and maybe not even then. A tumor is a growth it doesn't mean it is malignant. I just went through this with a friend, she collapsed and had emergency brain surgery and didn't get her histology results for a couple of weeks (benign) all clear, just some issues from surgery for the next year but full recovery anticipated. So honestly, I think you are right to be a bit ticked off. For me it would be like they are already throwing dirt on her grave. Thoughts and prayer for a full recovery for your sister.
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TXMary
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Post by TXMary on Aug 30, 2015 4:42:03 GMT
I didn't mind friends crying with me when I was diagnosed but bawling would have made me uncomfortable and I would have felt like I needed to console them.
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Mary Kay Lady
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Post by Mary Kay Lady on Aug 30, 2015 4:42:12 GMT
I think in a situation like what you've described, it's best to keep your emotions to yourself. They don't need to be shared with the person affected by the illness. Yes, I realize that it's hard. But in the situation that you've described it's best to put aside your own thoughts and feelings and be more concerned about the needs of the sick friend. My Dad had his second heart attack just before his 80th birthday. Because of his over-all health he wasn't a candidate for open heart surgery. His heart was functioning at 20% of it's normal capacity. I had a conference with his doctor about his condition and asked what the prognosis was. I was told that he would live 4-6 months. Sadly, the doctors didn't share this information with my Dad. Instead I was the one who told him. Was it hard? Absolutely. Would I do it again? Of course. Did I cry when I told him? No. I realize that everyone processes information differently. But in a situation like what you've described, zella, I think visitors should stay away if they are unable to control their emotions. |
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zella
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Post by zella on Aug 30, 2015 4:46:34 GMT
Interesting variety of opinions here; thank you for that. I still don't know how to tag people, but myshelly, not her BFF, not at all. The worst one was a coworker, actually. I didn't say anything to anyone. It's just
my opinion. And as a couple of people above said, shedding tears and sobbing are two different things.
RiverIsis: sadly we do have the results, or at least most of them. She has advanced brain cancer. We're waiting to find out if it's grade 3 or 4. We should find that out on Tuesday. This all came out of the blue. Really no warning signs.
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Post by rst on Aug 30, 2015 4:52:51 GMT
The great rule to remember is "Comfort in / Vent out". Envision a model in which the person will illness or crisis themselves is in the center. The next layer out is the immediate family and people most directly affected by the crisis (spouse, children, people living in the same house, then extended family, and outside that are various layers of friends and neighbors and co-workers. Obviously in each situation there can be different configurations, and over time it might fluctuate, but the idea is that the people closest to the situation have the fewest other alternatives for support or respite, whereas those farther out, while still feeling the situation keenly, are not so completely absorbed by it in every aspect of their lives-- they do get to leave and go on with normal life.
Comfort flows inward. Venting and emotional outbursts flow outward.
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Post by RiverIsis on Aug 30, 2015 4:55:56 GMT
Interesting variety of opinions here; thank you for that. I still don't know how to tag people, but myshelly, not her BFF, not at all. The worst one was a coworker, actually. I didn't say anything to anyone. It's just my opinion. And as a couple of people above said, shedding tears and sobbing are two different things. RiverIsis: sadly we do have the results, or at least most of them. She has advanced brain cancer. We're waiting to find out if it's grade 3 or 4. We should find that out on Tuesday. This all came out of the blue. Really no warning signs. I'm so sorry. But people need to keep their shit together, this isn't about them. I've lost an uncle 27 and a cousin's child 23 months to brain cancer. It's cruel. My thoughts are with you and your family. Maybe the benefit of the doubt to the sobbers that it brought back a memory, but honestly they were out of order sobbing IMHO. They can do that on their own time. |
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Post by smokeynspike on Aug 30, 2015 5:00:53 GMT
I think it matters what your sister thinks and the boundaries that she sets up with her friends (and family).
My BFF is way closer to me than my only sibling (we don't really get along and never have) and I would be so offended if he thought just because he was my "family" that he could have an opinion over what my friends were doing while they came to comfort me. Your friends are the people you CHOOSE to invite into your life. I'd much rather have her hanging around me, than him.
But that is just my perspective from my own life.
Edited to add: And I'm very sorry that your sister is sick. That has to be horrendous for all involved!
Melissa
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Post by penny on Aug 30, 2015 6:58:51 GMT
I can't find the diagram that explains how I handle situations like this, so hopefully I can sort of explain...
Imagine a target - circles around a center spot like in archery... The center spot is the patient... The ring surrounding them (innermost ring), is their immediate family... The next ring out is close friends and family... Next ring out is distant friends/family and acquaintances... Next ring out is distant coworkers and people you know by name...
The idea is that compassion and strength flow from the outermost circles towards the patient, and complaints and breakdowns flow from the patient towards the outermost circles...
So acquaintances show strength towards close friends/family, immediate family, and the patient... Close friends/family show strength towards immediate family and he patient, and can breakdown or vent to acquaintances... Immediate family shows strength to the patient and can breakdown and vent to everyone else... The patient can do whatever they want...
There are no rules about who is immediate family - maybe you're close to your best friend like a sister and haven't spoken to your brother in decades... And it's not strict - everyone has moments... The idea is that generally and more often than not, you let it out or compose yourself depending on where you are in relation to the patient...
Compassion and strength goes into the target, complaints and sadness goes out...
The diagram is so much quicker to understand...
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Post by dewryce on Aug 30, 2015 7:34:09 GMT
I am very sorry about your sister and can't imagine how difficult this is for you. The diagram rst and penny are talking about is great and it really made a lot of sense. For my personal experience, when our son was born too soon, it did happen once that I ended up comforting someone when I just wasn't ready. But that was my mom, so not much to do about that. She needed me so I held her, but it did make things more difficult for me. I think it is great that you want to look out for your sister. I agree with the other peas, ask her how you can help and how she would like things handled. I hope the remaining results are as positive as they can be and that there are good treatment options available for her. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Aug 30, 2015 9:47:23 GMT
I don't think you can dictate how another feels and expresses themselves, and you may not realize that her friends just might consider her "family" and love her!
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anniebygaslight
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Post by anniebygaslight on Aug 30, 2015 10:40:31 GMT
So sorry to hear about your sister.
The patient and their relatives should not be the ones who are having to comfort the people on the periphery of the situation. It should be the other way round. In my job, occasionally things do not go well and a baby may die, and rarely, a mother. I have observed first hand on several occasions a bereaved mother being expected to comfort a relative who made the situation all about them. It never is.
In my view, those on the outside, looking in should be channeling their emotions into offering help with child care, laundry, shopping, cooking, cleaning, etc.
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Post by emelle64 on Aug 30, 2015 10:54:39 GMT
I'm terribly sorry about your sister's diagnosis. It must be so difficult for all the people around her. But, ultimately I agree with those who talked about the diagram with the "support in and the vent out". I think those who are on the periphery of her life should be supporting those closest to her.
I was recently diagnosed with cancer and I found it very difficult when friends couldn't keep it together around me. I felt like I had to support them and frankly, I had very little left to give as any emotional energy I had went to supporting my children and my husband.
You and your sister will be in my prayers in the days going forward.
Emelle
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Post by anonrefugee on Aug 30, 2015 10:57:34 GMT
The great rule to remember is "Comfort in / Vent out". Envision a model in which the person will illness or crisis themselves is in the center. The next layer out is the immediate family and people most directly affected by the crisis (spouse, children, people living in the same house, then extended family, and outside that are various layers of friends and neighbors and co-workers. Obviously in each situation there can be different configurations, and over time it might fluctuate, but the idea is that the people closest to the situation have the fewest other alternatives for support or respite, whereas those farther out, while still feeling the situation keenly, are not so completely absorbed by it in every aspect of their lives-- they do get to leave and go on with normal life. Comfort flows inward. Venting and emotional outbursts flow outward. Thanks for this image and explanation rst . I had other, more personal comments to make about those farther out showing dramatic emotions. I like your positive Reno dee to flow comfort better! Thanks! Vent away isn't a directive, it is a direction! |
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Post by hop2 on Aug 30, 2015 11:28:32 GMT
You can't always control your emotions. I know I cant always. And it's not always crying that's a problem. Sometimes it's over perky positiveness that can be a drag. However I think it's imperative though to be aware of your emotions and redirect your self ( or leave ) if you the visitor are becoming a burden to the person who is ill.
The point of visiting is to be a means of support not a burden. It's not even specifically the crying but over all behavior and or expectations. If the person needs someone to have a good cry with then have at it but if the ill person has to comfort the visitor it's gone too far. Don't bring a gift, magazine, book etc and then require it's immediate use. You can't place expectations on a person battling an illness. If something gets put to the side, it's not what they needed right then, move on.
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Post by Spongemom Scrappants on Aug 30, 2015 12:35:41 GMT
While I agree that visitors - whether family or friends - are there to support the patient, I don't think everyone can always control that rush of emotions that happen sometimes in that kind of situation. I think it's a kind of support in a way to see that people are that affected by it.
It's really up to the patient (or person at the center of whatever tragedy or loss), to somehow communicate any boundaries they might need. You cannot assume your sister wants it handled the same way you do. You might end up being the one not supporting her by usurping her right to set those boundaries for herself. An honest conversation at a quiet time is definitely in order.
For me, the issue would not center around how people would act (crying, sobbing, etc), but what they would say. I abhor those platitudes people utter at times like that. Especially the ones attempting to give a "reason" for it. Things like, "It's part of God's plan..." "You're never given more in life than you can handle." And other stupid shit like that.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 30, 2015 12:44:37 GMT
I might be overly sensitive on this issue as I recently dealt with a very serious sudden injury to a young family member. I understand that young people in particular have difficult controlling their emotions - but at times I just wanted to bang some teenagers heads together and tell them to either get their shit together or leave. It's incredibly difficult for not only the patient, but the family to deal with hysterical visitors. I understand shedding tears, I understand having trouble dealing with seeing someone you love (whether it's family or friends) in pain, injured etc. But if you are at point where YOU are the center of attention and are requiring comfort, leave and come back when you're better able to deal with the situation.
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Gravity
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Post by Gravity on Aug 30, 2015 12:51:23 GMT
I'm sorry that you sister did not receive a better pathology report. ((Hugs)) to you and your family.
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grinningcat
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Post by grinningcat on Aug 30, 2015 12:53:06 GMT
Perhaps you should hand out pamphlets or give a lecture on the behaviour you deem acceptable for visiting your sister. Maybe if you tell people how they should behave, maybe they will live up to your standards.
The person's feelings you never mentioned in your attack on how other people behave is your sister. Did she have a problem with it? Was she uncomfortable? Or was it just you.
Honestly? I think you need to step back and stop expecting others to follow your rules. I think people react to this kind of information differently and to say that people were acting "wrong" is just ridiculous and callous.
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grinningcat
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Post by grinningcat on Aug 30, 2015 12:56:41 GMT
I might be overly sensitive on this issue as I recently dealt with a very serious sudden injury to a young family member. I understand that young people in particular have difficult controlling their emotions - but at times I just wanted to bang some teenagers heads together and tell them to either get their shit together or leave. It's incredibly difficult for not only the patient, but the family to deal with hysterical visitors. I understand shedding tears, I understand having trouble dealing with seeing someone you love (whether it's family or friends) in pain, injured etc. But if you are at point where YOU are the center of attention and are requiring comfort, leave and come back when you're better able to deal with the situation. And as that teenager once, you have no idea how to react to this kind of stuff. We had trauma in our high school years. We saw more permanent injury and death happen in our circle than most people see in a life time. We were young and new to this whole grief thing... we didn't know that being hysterical and upset was a bad thing. We had hormones raging and new emotions that we were discovering. I'm sorry you felt that teenagers didn't behave the way you wanted them to. As that teenager, I can tell you that no one prepares you for this kind of shit or the emotions that it creates. I wish I could say I'm sorry that teenagers don't behave the way you want them to in a time of tragedy, but I'm not sorry. It's new territory for them and to expect them to act as an adult and be perfectly composed at all time so the adults in the room don't get uncomfortable is completely unreasonable. |
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grinningcat
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Post by grinningcat on Aug 30, 2015 12:58:03 GMT
You can't always control your emotions. I know I cant always. And it's not always crying that's a problem. Sometimes it's over perky positiveness that can be a drag. However I think it's imperative though to be aware of your emotions and redirect your self ( or leave ) if you the visitor are becoming a burden to the person who is ill. The point of visiting is to be a means of support not a burden. It's not even specifically the crying but over all behavior and or expectations. If the person needs someone to have a good cry with then have at it but if the ill person has to comfort the visitor it's gone too far. Don't bring a gift, magazine, book etc and then require it's immediate use. You can't place expectations on a person battling an illness. If something gets put to the side, it's not what they needed right then, move on. That's exactly it. Not allowing true emotion and expecting perky, fake positiveness is what makes a person feel worse. |
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Post by mikklynn on Aug 30, 2015 13:00:28 GMT
I'm so sorry! Cancer sucks.
People are going to do and say stupid things. They don't realize it and generally mean well.
I hope you are able to surround yourself and your sister with people who lift you up.
Hugs.
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Post by jamielynn on Aug 30, 2015 13:01:58 GMT
I, like most have had an immediate family member with terminal cancer. When we were going to break down we took a few deep breaths then made an excuse to leave the situation a few minutes ... Get coffee, check the kids, use the restroom. We felt the family men ever had far more to come to terms with than us going in the room upset and feeling bad for us.
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