The Mail Order Rule and SC/AE/ABM
Nov 26, 2015 2:31:55 GMT
MDscrapaholic, LavenderLayoutLady, and 7 more like this
Post by awesomegabi on Nov 26, 2015 2:31:55 GMT
(New thread created as to not derail the Refugees thread plus information tends to get buried) With the holiday season ramping up and SC/AE doing black friday sales with a not so great track record for shipping, I thought this would be helpful information. It's all about the Mail Order Rule, and what rules vendors who sell by internet, phone, or mail have to abide by. SC does some seemingly shady stuff and while its a really bad customer experience, it isn't entirely illegal.
*Does not apply to International shipments, I am looking for that information since it varies greatly depending on the country/vendor/product*
- When you place an order online, the vendor has a certain time frame in which they have to ship your goods and this varies by vendor. This is called the Mail Order Rule and is regulated by the FTC.
- Since SC does not provide us with a promised shipping date when we place our order, they have 30 days from date of purchase/funds verification to ship it out. And yes, that means they can short ship us and only send half of the items if they believe they can ship the remaining units within those 30 days.
-However, if they know that the item is out of stock because it is delayed longer than 30 days or that it will not be replaced, they have to inform you immediately of the delay and provide you with option to keep waiting or cancel and receive a refund.
- If you decide to wait, SC needs to provide you with a new set shipping date. If that shipping date comes and goes with no merchandise being shipped, by law they have to cancel and refund you.
Our Most common example: If we are missing an item in our package and it suddenly is back in stock? On their FAQ page, it is stated that your missing item will ship with next months kit.
1. Well what if you're month to month? Or didn't order a kit? Then they should be shipping it immediately since there really is no reason to delay it. I can't imagine why they'd refuse to ship it ASAP.
2. If you are a subscriber, and the item is in stock, they still have that 30 day window to ship it, but a delay for no reason is a bad customer experience. But if next months kit will be shipping outside of the 30 day window, they have to provide you with an actual SET DATE that your item (and i'm assuming the kit) will be shipping. That date cannot change and at that time, there can be no more "sorry not sorry" pieces of paper if your item isn't shipped. By law, they need to reach out to you and give you the options of waiting up to another 30 days for a replacement or cancelling the order. After 60 days from date of purchase, all orders unfilled need to be cancelled.
SC gets around having to initiate conversation because of that little piece of shit paper in the box. Most customers receive their goods within 2 weeks and notice units are missing, then call and get a refund or wait. We beat them to it and we initiate everything once our package arrives. We are saving their asses legally, I wonder what would happen if no one contacted SC and how long it would take them to realize something wasn't shipped.
If we don't reach out, and they don't reach out, and our items don't ship within 30 days AND we aren't refunded, that is about a $16,000 fine. If that has happened to you, please file a claim with the BBB.
Part of the Mail Order Rules requires vendors to be aware of the capacity of their fulfillment systems and record-keeping for each individual transaction when selling goods. I have a hard time believing SC does this. Most cancels don't happen at a warehouse level, so its crucial that they be able to make note of what has shipped and what hasn't. Because SC doesn't like packing slips, where do they log this information? What if that piece of paper never made its way into your box?
Does this information even make its way to customer service so they can contact me while my package is in transit? If there is no paper trail, you aren't keeping good records of transactions and to me that is a clear violation of the MOR. But thats more of a debatable grey area since I don't work there and can't look at their process, but the well documented shipping problems SC is a pretty clear indicator of a bad warehouse system.
Hopefully this was helpful and informative on what your rights as a consumer are and what you can do if the ball has been dropped by a company. If I missed something above, my apologies, I tried to condense a lot of information into a small post. If you've got anything to add, please do and ask questions since logistics is what I do
I'll try to answer the best I can.
*Does not apply to International shipments, I am looking for that information since it varies greatly depending on the country/vendor/product*
- When you place an order online, the vendor has a certain time frame in which they have to ship your goods and this varies by vendor. This is called the Mail Order Rule and is regulated by the FTC.
- Since SC does not provide us with a promised shipping date when we place our order, they have 30 days from date of purchase/funds verification to ship it out. And yes, that means they can short ship us and only send half of the items if they believe they can ship the remaining units within those 30 days.
-However, if they know that the item is out of stock because it is delayed longer than 30 days or that it will not be replaced, they have to inform you immediately of the delay and provide you with option to keep waiting or cancel and receive a refund.
- If you decide to wait, SC needs to provide you with a new set shipping date. If that shipping date comes and goes with no merchandise being shipped, by law they have to cancel and refund you.
Our Most common example: If we are missing an item in our package and it suddenly is back in stock? On their FAQ page, it is stated that your missing item will ship with next months kit.
1. Well what if you're month to month? Or didn't order a kit? Then they should be shipping it immediately since there really is no reason to delay it. I can't imagine why they'd refuse to ship it ASAP.
2. If you are a subscriber, and the item is in stock, they still have that 30 day window to ship it, but a delay for no reason is a bad customer experience. But if next months kit will be shipping outside of the 30 day window, they have to provide you with an actual SET DATE that your item (and i'm assuming the kit) will be shipping. That date cannot change and at that time, there can be no more "sorry not sorry" pieces of paper if your item isn't shipped. By law, they need to reach out to you and give you the options of waiting up to another 30 days for a replacement or cancelling the order. After 60 days from date of purchase, all orders unfilled need to be cancelled.
SC gets around having to initiate conversation because of that little piece of shit paper in the box. Most customers receive their goods within 2 weeks and notice units are missing, then call and get a refund or wait. We beat them to it and we initiate everything once our package arrives. We are saving their asses legally, I wonder what would happen if no one contacted SC and how long it would take them to realize something wasn't shipped.
If we don't reach out, and they don't reach out, and our items don't ship within 30 days AND we aren't refunded, that is about a $16,000 fine. If that has happened to you, please file a claim with the BBB.
Part of the Mail Order Rules requires vendors to be aware of the capacity of their fulfillment systems and record-keeping for each individual transaction when selling goods. I have a hard time believing SC does this. Most cancels don't happen at a warehouse level, so its crucial that they be able to make note of what has shipped and what hasn't. Because SC doesn't like packing slips, where do they log this information? What if that piece of paper never made its way into your box?
Does this information even make its way to customer service so they can contact me while my package is in transit? If there is no paper trail, you aren't keeping good records of transactions and to me that is a clear violation of the MOR. But thats more of a debatable grey area since I don't work there and can't look at their process, but the well documented shipping problems SC is a pretty clear indicator of a bad warehouse system.
Hopefully this was helpful and informative on what your rights as a consumer are and what you can do if the ball has been dropped by a company. If I missed something above, my apologies, I tried to condense a lot of information into a small post. If you've got anything to add, please do and ask questions since logistics is what I do
I'll try to answer the best I can.
don't mess with the Refupeas because somewhere out there is someone with mad skills and the will to help others. 
