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Post by Darcy Collins on Apr 19, 2016 22:20:52 GMT
I'll be honest, I've been reading this thread and the posts that say that they would demand their children attend a funeral at the cost of other important events make me really sad. Funerals may be for the living but they are not the be all and end all in the method of grieving or remembering a loved one. To be honest, I think they are gong shows that can create more trauma and drama than they are worth. I think it should be up to every person whether they attend or not. Grieving is not one size fits all. I'd much rather remember my grandmother or my DH's grandmother without the funeral being part of it. I am so happy that my final memory of my dad is when he was alive, not a funeral. I know my opinion means nothing, just wanted to say that it makes me sad how black and white people can be about funerals. But it's not just about "you" people are connected. One's actions impact their family and their spouse's family. As I acknowledge - families are different - but when your actions have a direct impact on grieving family members, one should at least acknowledge how their actions impact those around them and whether their family members need them there.
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Post by Delta Dawn on Apr 19, 2016 22:25:30 GMT
My parents gave us the choice to go to Granny's funeral when she died. I had just finished the school year (first year university) and had a full-time job for the summer. This was my first "big" job so to speak. My parents didn't want us to come, but my sister and I decided we needed to say good-bye to Granny. I would have lamented not going my entire life had I listened to them (they did say we didn't need to go and they would handle everything). It's really hard right now to make the right decision when you are a teenager. I mean they have BOTH been asked to prom, right? Do you know you will get the funeral home that day? We put off my Mom's funeral for a couple of weeks until everyone could make travel arrangements, book hotels, etc. We found a day that worked for all of us including the cemetery, the funeral home, our friends and family etc. The funeral can be on any day that the home has free unless your religion pre-decides what day you can hold a funeral. (Asian society wouldn't have a funeral on a day of Taian-great pease, Tomobiki-the day you lose a friend or a Butsumetsu-Day to remember Buddha). In Islam we try to hold the funeral as soon as possible. In our society it doesn't have to be within a week. There is no law stating this. It's just whenever it suits the family and the provider. (Please keep that in mind). One last thing, I am so sorry for your coming loss. I am very saddened by the news. Any time a parent (or in-law) passes it is very sad.
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grinningcat
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Post by grinningcat on Apr 19, 2016 22:33:36 GMT
I'll be honest, I've been reading this thread and the posts that say that they would demand their children attend a funeral at the cost of other important events make me really sad. Funerals may be for the living but they are not the be all and end all in the method of grieving or remembering a loved one. To be honest, I think they are gong shows that can create more trauma and drama than they are worth. I think it should be up to every person whether they attend or not. Grieving is not one size fits all. I'd much rather remember my grandmother or my DH's grandmother without the funeral being part of it. I am so happy that my final memory of my dad is when he was alive, not a funeral. I know my opinion means nothing, just wanted to say that it makes me sad how black and white people can be about funerals. But it's not just about "you" people are connected. One's actions impact their family and their spouse's family. As I acknowledge - families are different - but when your actions have a direct impact on grieving family members, one should at least acknowledge how their actions impact those around them and whether their family members need them there. So does that mean that their grieving trumps your grieving? That's certainly how it's coming across. Families are not borgs, I guess I just don't understand why everyone has to do everything the same. I guess this is why there are black sheep in families, if you don't toe the line of faaaaaaaamily and do it the way they want it done instead of in a way that works for yourself, you're just not good enough. I don't know. It makes me extremely uncomfortable to see the body of the deceased on display at a funeral. I think it's so disrespectful to the deceased and I choose to not view the body. There has only been one funeral that I've ever been to that thought about this, the rest just give you no choice. I don't know. I guess I understand the whole coming together as a family but I don't think that any one person's feelings should trump another's... especially when it comes to grieving and mourning. And if someone thinks they would do more good supporting a family member by either visiting at a different time or celebrating life by attending an important event, I think they should be allowed to make that choice without retribution or guilt. But as I said, it makes me sad. Doesn't mean my opinion means shit to anyone posting or that it will change anyone minds. It just bugs me that grieving seems to be a "one size fits all" kind of thing for some people and any kind of deviation or change is taken as an offence and just downright unacceptable.
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Post by supersoda on Apr 19, 2016 22:34:39 GMT
I've been in pretty much this exact situation. This time last year my mother was in hospice. My daughter was booked for prom, and her robotics team was competing in the world championships out of state.
First, there is no planning death. Both my mother and MIL had exceptionally long stays in hospice, both weeks after we got "she has hours left" calls.
Second, it really does depend on family dynamics. I was not close to my mother and neither were my girls. I had decided that my daughter would attend her events, even if they conflicted with the funeral. I was there mostly to support my brother.
On the other hand, when my beloved grandmother passed away last month, I wanted and needed my girls nearby. Likewise, we were all very close to my MIL. I can't imagine my girls not attending her funeral.
There's no right or wrong answer. You just have to figure out your family's needs.
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AnotherPea
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Post by AnotherPea on Apr 19, 2016 22:35:47 GMT
Just an FYI , my MIL was in hospice over two months. Once I got a call at school, which really negatively affected my students on that particular day. I was told I had about 30 minutes before she passed. Everyone else was over 45 minutes away. I was not going to let her die alone. A custodian watched my students until a teacher could come. She lived for five more weeks.
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Post by katiekaty on Apr 19, 2016 22:38:09 GMT
I guess I lack compassion. I don't really do funerals. I go to funerals very rarely. I would allow my kids to go to the prom. It is a big event in THEIR lives. I never would require my children to go to a funeral, period. whether they had events or not. Funerals are not a place to learn compassion, caring, build community feelings etc. As a child, I went a few and it was horrible, family fighting, nasty gossip, etc. This was not what I felt a funeral was like. As an adult I never found it to be different. The last funerals I attended were 4 years ago, my mom's, and 3 years ago, my DH's, grandmother's. Both were awful. I did not make my kids go. No thanks. I would prefer to share memories at other times and not forget the person rather than go to a funeral. Give me a family reunion-more fun, and when the arguments and words start, at least there is food to go with the entertainment! It is easier to deal with them alive than when everyone fakes it when they are dead.
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grinningcat
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Post by grinningcat on Apr 19, 2016 22:40:01 GMT
I guess I lack compassion. I don't really do funerals. I go to funerals very rarely. I would allow my kids to go to the prom. It is a big event in THEIR lives. I never would require my children to go to a funeral, period. whether they had events or not. Funerals are not a place to learn compassion, caring, build community feelings etc. As a child, I went a few and it was horrible, family fighting, nasty gossip, etc. This was not what I felt a funeral was like. As an adult I never found it to be different. The last funerals I attended were 4 years ago, my mom's, and 3 years ago, my DH's, grandmother's. Both were awful. I did not make my kids go. No thanks. I would prefer to share memories at other times and not forget the person rather than go to a funeral. Give me a family reunion-more fun, and when the arguments and words start, at least there is food to go with the entertainment! It is easier to deal with them alive than when everyone fakes it when they are dead. That's so true. I agree with you. Why would someone choose to have their last memory of a loved one be of grief and sadness instead of life and vigour? I've never understood that.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Apr 19, 2016 23:03:28 GMT
For me - the needs of the grieving spouse/children/parents of the deceased trump other family members grief. People are different, their needs are different, their support system is different. In our family, sometimes the spouse doesn't want a large funeral - and will plan something later for the extended family - but yes sometimes they do need a coming together of the family. One of my aunts died unexpectedly - and relatively young. My uncle and cousins desperately needed to see and hear all of the people who loved her and would remember her. A few people were conspicuously absent and it hurt them - as much as people may want to say it shouldn't - it did - and I do my very best not to further hurt people during such a difficult time.
Eta I'm sure there are regional difference / but I've literally been to 20+ funerals and never viewed the body. Hell I've been to a dozen viewings and never viewed the body. It's never been forced.
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paigepea
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Post by paigepea on Apr 19, 2016 23:24:21 GMT
I guess I lack compassion. I don't really do funerals. I go to funerals very rarely. I would allow my kids to go to the prom. It is a big event in THEIR lives. I never would require my children to go to a funeral, period. whether they had events or not. Funerals are not a place to learn compassion, caring, build community feelings etc. As a child, I went a few and it was horrible, family fighting, nasty gossip, etc. This was not what I felt a funeral was like. As an adult I never found it to be different. The last funerals I attended were 4 years ago, my mom's, and 3 years ago, my DH's, grandmother's. Both were awful. I did not make my kids go. No thanks. I would prefer to share memories at other times and not forget the person rather than go to a funeral. Give me a family reunion-more fun, and when the arguments and words start, at least there is food to go with the entertainment! It is easier to deal with them alive than when everyone fakes it when they are dead. I was talking about the boys understanding why the girls might choose to attend the funeral over prom.
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Post by dewryce on Apr 20, 2016 0:51:17 GMT
I am very sorry for your family's loss.
A few questions I would be asking myself are, does your husband need them there? Your FIL? Do you think either of your girls likely to regret or hold onto guilt for not going?
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Post by txdancermom on Apr 20, 2016 0:59:41 GMT
If your mil is anything like my family, they would rather the kids have their lives than have them give up a big event to attend a funeral. When my step mom died, we delayed the memorial service for almost 2 weeks because of ds's wedding, and other events so that we could get most of the family there. And when one couldn't my dad was of the opinion that doing what they were doing was more important than being there.
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Post by chlerbie on Apr 20, 2016 2:42:36 GMT
I guess I lack compassion. I don't really do funerals. I go to funerals very rarely. I would allow my kids to go to the prom. It is a big event in THEIR lives. I never would require my children to go to a funeral, period. whether they had events or not. Funerals are not a place to learn compassion, caring, build community feelings etc. As a child, I went a few and it was horrible, family fighting, nasty gossip, etc. This was not what I felt a funeral was like. As an adult I never found it to be different. The last funerals I attended were 4 years ago, my mom's, and 3 years ago, my DH's, grandmother's. Both were awful. I did not make my kids go. No thanks. I would prefer to share memories at other times and not forget the person rather than go to a funeral. Give me a family reunion-more fun, and when the arguments and words start, at least there is food to go with the entertainment! It is easier to deal with them alive than when everyone fakes it when they are dead. That's so true. I agree with you. Why would someone choose to have their last memory of a loved one be of grief and sadness instead of life and vigour? I've never understood that. I guess it all depends on how you look at it. I remember my mother's funeral as a time that I got to see family I hadn't seen in years, a time I was super close to my brothers, cousins and uncle and I loved and appreciated the support I got from family and friends. I wasn't close to my father, but his funeral was similar and I met people who knew my father as a child and teenager, people who'd worked with him, etc. and got to hear all kinds of stories. Of course, it was sad--but it was also a time of togetherness that brought me a lot of comfort.
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julieb
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Post by julieb on Apr 20, 2016 2:58:34 GMT
My grandfather died 37 years ago the weekend I was going to Homecoming. I didn't have the distance issues, so I went to Homecoming on Friday night and missed the wake. I was able to attend the funeral on Saturday.
My Mom and Grandmother insisted I go to the dance. As a 16 yo, as much as I loved my Grandpa, I think my Mom knew I needed to be a kid enjoying her high school years. It's not like I loved my Grandpa any less. I remember being at the dance and having a good time thinking that he was happy knowing I was dancing (he spent his last years in a wheelchair) and enjoying youth.
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julieb
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Post by julieb on Apr 20, 2016 3:00:44 GMT
I'm going against the grain: they'd be going to the funeral. My mom died 5 months ago and I needed my children with me; and they were glad to be of support to me and to be a part of honoring their grandmother. How do you say to people when they ask where your children are: "they chose to go to the prom?" I'll get flak for this, I'm sure, but that's how I feel. But with something like Prom, not only would the two girls miss out but also their dates. I couldn't put my needs/desires before those of four other people who don't have the same emotional attachment I do.
OP - you shouldn't care what others think about your decisions. You're the parent.
I didn't think about the dates - my gosh, let them be kids. There's enough death and sadness in this world.
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Post by epeanymous on Apr 20, 2016 3:31:10 GMT
I am sorry you are dealing with this. We have had two relatives in hospice in recent years who have been given "any hour now" notices who have lived for months afterwards; it is possible that you will not be faced with the conflict, although I understand wanting to figure out now how to approach it.
I think it affects me here that your girls essentially lost the grandmother they knew years ago; they have likely done the mourning that they would normally do, as have, I imagine, many people in your family (not that death itself isn't very affecting and upsetting, but the person that your family knew has been gone for some time). When death is sudden and unexpected, I think people are less likely to have processed those emotions. I think it also affects me that the funerals I've been to haven't all been family coming together in loving support -- I've seen some truly horrible things at funerals, even from people who normally are reasonable to deal with, and I don't know how I feel about putting my kids in the crosshairs of that against their will. For those reasons, and at your girls' ages, I think I would leave it up to them.
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M in Carolina
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Post by M in Carolina on Apr 20, 2016 4:01:11 GMT
I am so sorry for your loss.
I hope that your family can arrange the funeral so your dds missing the prom won't be an issue. I do think that there's a difference in how you need family to lean on when it's an unexpected death or one after a few months in hospice compared to a death after years of dementia.
My mom and her oldest sister got together and decided to arrange my grandmother's funeral so I could get back to school to be at my dh's high school graduation and attend the last day of classes before finals, so I could get the study materials.
I remember my aunt sitting down with me and talking to me about dh--when she realized that we were more than just puppy love/childhood first love, she insisted that my mom and younger sister arrange everything for me, and she also went with my mom and me on the trip back to school and met my dh and in-laws.
I am so glad that I was there for dh. I really needed that after being there with my mom and aunts for my grandmother's last weekend and death, as well as going with my mom to fix my grandmother's hair like she had requested--my mom was a mess. I also met dh's grandparents for the first time, and they fell in love with me and "adopted" me. although grandma died a few months later, dh's grandfather considered me his granddaughter and even came to visit my family when he was in the area.
Whether the dds went to prom would also depend on how important it was to them--are they really, really wanting to go, are they seriously dating someone? If they were just going stag, it would be different.
I didn't go to my grandfather's funeral. My MIL did get judgmental about it--it happened a few months after I went away to school, but after I explained that he was estranged from my family and how badly he had treated my grandmother (when her Alzheimer's got too bad, he decided one day to split the assets, sell their house, get rid of their stuff (followed her will), and he even chose a different rest home so he didn't have to see her and started "dating") His family (my dad's step-siblings) weren't close, and one step-sister even sabotaged a box of china my granny gave me that she wanted so some of the china broke. My dad didn't go to the funeral either because of the family's attitude.
Family dynamics makes a huge difference.
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Post by smokeynspike on Apr 20, 2016 4:29:35 GMT
I would let them choose what they want to attend.
Melissa
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Post by freecharlie on Apr 20, 2016 4:40:58 GMT
I had to make a similar choice when I was a teen. I chose my event and everytime I think about it I wish my Mom would've made me go to the funeral. is it possible it is the "road not traveled" speaking? I wonder if those forced to go to the funeral look back and wish their mom would have let them go to the event. OP is there a reason why Sunday doesn't work? Dh's grandma died (I know a little different) and because of when the family chose to have the memorial (4 months later) I could not attend and because of the school ds had already missed neither could he. I think the girls should go to prom if the funeral is that day. Honestly, I'd selfishly cross my fingers that she held on until after prom or at least until it was too late to plan the service.
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mallie
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Post by mallie on Apr 20, 2016 13:12:18 GMT
If it's so important that the last memory of a loved one be happy, I suppose we all should stop visiting loved ones when they are ill or dying or, just sad. Just freeze our memories when they are young, happy, and vital and never visit them again. Because it's nicer for us, so screw them.
My beloved grandfather had a series of strokes that gradually incapacitated him and stole his memories. It took years for him to die. It was painful to visit, but I did just the same. Because I loved him and felt a sense of obligation to repay him for all of my diapers he'd changed, all the times he'd cared for me when he could have been out with his buddies or fishing. I did feel I owed him, not because he ever acted like I should owe him, but because he and my grandmother raised me to believe in the value of reciprocity of caring. It was my turn now to show love by showing up at his bedside, by providing a comforting presence, by advocating, etc. . It was also instructive watching my mother, who was a hard nut, so tenderly care for her father -- I leaned something about my mother and even when I was 30 years old, my mother taught me some very important lessons about the value of demonstrating love and acts of service. Those values are important to me.
So I have to wonder what we are teaching our children when we don't make them visit the sick, the elderly, the dying or attend their funerals? Are we teaching them that they don't have to give anything back, but just take take take?
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Post by mtscrapper on Apr 20, 2016 13:23:02 GMT
OP is there a reason why Sunday doesn't work? Dh's grandma died (I know a little different) and because of when the family chose to have the memorial (4 months later) I could not attend and because of the school ds had already missed neither could he. I think the girls should go to prom if the funeral is that day. Honestly, I'd selfishly cross my fingers that she held on until after prom or at least until it was too late to plan the service. We are LDS and we will be using an LDS church building for the funeral. It just isn't possible on a Sunday to use an LDS building because it is being used for services all day. And my FIL would not want it anywhere else. My husband came home last night and did tell me that I will likely be in on the planning more than he will be (totally understandable because he is not good at planning things), so that will help. I am, as you say, selfishly crossing my fingers that she holds off at least until next week so we can schedule it for the first week in May. I did talk to my girls that it might be a possible conflict and their reactions were about what I expected - conflicted. I told them to just carry on and if it is an issue, we will discuss it when it comes. Thanks again for everyone's kind words.
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Post by Linda on Apr 20, 2016 13:43:08 GMT
coming in late...
I'm so sorry for your impending loss.
My Aunt-in-law died on hospice care a couple of weeks ago. She chose not to be embalmed and the funeral arrangements were made very quickly (died Mon, family viewing Tues, closed casket funeral Wed). Not everyone made it to the funeral - some out of town family members (great nieces) were hurt that they weren't invited/weren't able to attend. My own daughters didn't attend the funeral - one chose not to (she doesn't handle hospitals/funerals/ emotional stuff well), we chose not to bring the youngest - but they attended the luncheon afterwards. I'm sure there were people who would judge us on that decision but we made the decision that was best for US.
My MIL (81) was sent to a hospice facility from the hospital in mid-March with days to live (they said 3, maybe 5 at most). She was released from hospice to a rehab about 2.5 weeks ago. She went back in the hospital two days ago and has been released back to (home) hospice. They aren't giving a time frame this - she may surprise us again and recover or she may continue to decline. My oldest is overseas (Navy) - he won't be returning for her funeral when the time comes - he said his goodbyes to her and to his greatgrandma (99) before he left for the 3-yr tour knowing they almost certainly won't be here when he returns. My older daughter will probably not attend a funeral when she passes - the little one probably will unless she has another committment.
All in all - there are no guarantees time-wise with Hospice. And there's no requirement to attend a funeral - if they want to go to Prom, I would encourage them to do so and to say their goodbyes a different way
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GiantsFan
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Post by GiantsFan on Apr 20, 2016 14:30:33 GMT
I had to make a similar choice when I was a teen. I chose my event and everytime I think about it I wish my Mom would've made me go to the funeral. is it possible it is the "road not traveled" speaking? I wonder if those forced to go to the funeral look back and wish their mom would have let them go to the event. OP is there a reason why Sunday doesn't work? Dh's grandma died (I know a little different) and because of when the family chose to have the memorial (4 months later) I could not attend and because of the school ds had already missed neither could he. I think the girls should go to prom if the funeral is that day. Honestly, I'd selfishly cross my fingers that she held on until after prom or at least until it was too late to plan the service. It's possible. But I didn't have a good time and I'm sure my friends wished I had gone to the funeral. I was sad and teary-eyed and no fun at all. I put a damper on their fun.
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Post by mtscrapper on Apr 22, 2016 20:19:37 GMT
Update in OP
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Post by jeremysgirl on Apr 22, 2016 20:24:02 GMT
I'm so sorry for your loss. Hugs to you.
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Post by leslie132 on Apr 22, 2016 20:25:09 GMT
Update: My MIL passed away this morning. The funeral will be on prom day, just as I suspected it would be. There are so many people that have to travel (no family members live even close to them) that the logistics are better on a Saturday for as many as can be involved. This is at my FIL's request, and we want to honor this, but he told my girls to stay and go to prom, so they are going to do that. I think they felt better that their Papa told them it was okay to stay. My girls will go up sometime after my senior daughter is back from Boston and spend a weekend with him. I think that will be a nice thing for all of them. Thanks again for all the condolences. We have a great community here! ________ My MIL is on her last days. Hospice says days to a week. If this is the case, her funeral will likely be next weekend (April 30). She lives a good 8-hour drive from here and I'm fairly certain the funeral will be there. My girls (junior and senior) have both been asked to prom for that day. What would you do if you were their mom? Would you make them go to the funeral? Would you let them make their own choice? I know their Papa (grandpa) might really want to see them, but I'm torn. I haven't talked to them about this yet since death is so uncertain even if it is this close, but I'm just wanting some ideas of what other people would do in the event that it does happen. They do know she is dying, just not that it could happen on that weekend. (We just found out yesterday about the days to week and the girls were asked a week or so ago.) If it happens on the following weekend, my senior daughter is supposed to be in Boston for a week for National BPA competition. The airplane ticket is already bought and commitment made with the school that she will be there. Would this be a different scenario than prom? I would love to encourage doing the funeral on a Friday or Monday because we could make that work, but there are other family members to consider (my husband has a brother and 2 sisters who all live even farther away than us plus my oldest daughter who is in her final weeks of her masters degree and might have a hard time with the timing on a weekday). I see your update and I'm so sorry for your loss. My father passed away and his funeral was in homecoming. Now homecoming isn't as big as Prom. Not even by a long shot, but my Mom insisted that the kids go to Homecoming. She said that being with their friends is exactly where their Poppy would have wanted them. Hope they can still enjoy themselves!
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Post by christine58 on Apr 22, 2016 20:47:50 GMT
My girls will go up sometime after my senior daughter is back from Boston and spend a weekend with him. I think that will be a nice thing for all of them. Perfect! When my Uncle died, three of his grandsons couldn't get here due to job obligations (and they had just been here for a huge reunion), their grandmother told them it was ok. So they came here when they were able and spent time with her. Don't let anyone tell you that this is wrong.
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AnotherPea
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Post by AnotherPea on Apr 22, 2016 20:53:47 GMT
So sorry for your family's loss. I hope your girls have a wonderful time tomorrow.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Apr 22, 2016 22:16:06 GMT
Again, I'm so sorry for your family's loss. It was sweet of the girl's grandpa to tell them to go to their prom. I hope they are able to have a nice visit with him later on.
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peabay
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Post by peabay on Apr 22, 2016 22:30:23 GMT
I'm so sorry for your loss.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2016 22:41:09 GMT
Update: My MIL passed away this morning. The funeral will be on prom day, just as I suspected it would be. There are so many people that have to travel (no family members live even close to them) that the logistics are better on a Saturday for as many as can be involved. This is at my FIL's request, and we want to honor this, but he told my girls to stay and go to prom, so they are going to do that. I think they felt better that their Papa told them it was okay to stay. My girls will go up sometime after my senior daughter is back from Boston and spend a weekend with him. I think that will be a nice thing for all of them. Thanks again for all the condolences. We have a great community here! ________ My MIL is on her last days. Hospice says days to a week. If this is the case, her funeral will likely be next weekend (April 30). She lives a good 8-hour drive from here and I'm fairly certain the funeral will be there. My girls (junior and senior) have both been asked to prom for that day. What would you do if you were their mom? Would you make them go to the funeral? Would you let them make their own choice? I know their Papa (grandpa) might really want to see them, but I'm torn. I haven't talked to them about this yet since death is so uncertain even if it is this close, but I'm just wanting some ideas of what other people would do in the event that it does happen. They do know she is dying, just not that it could happen on that weekend. (We just found out yesterday about the days to week and the girls were asked a week or so ago.) If it happens on the following weekend, my senior daughter is supposed to be in Boston for a week for National BPA competition. The airplane ticket is already bought and commitment made with the school that she will be there. Would this be a different scenario than prom? I would love to encourage doing the funeral on a Friday or Monday because we could make that work, but there are other family members to consider (my husband has a brother and 2 sisters who all live even farther away than us plus my oldest daughter who is in her final weeks of her masters degree and might have a hard time with the timing on a weekday). I'm sorry for your loss. I'm glad that everything was able to be worked out with no hard feelings.
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