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Post by lucyg on Oct 21, 2016 18:43:44 GMT
Trump announced to the entire dinner audience that Hillary hates Catholics. (It's a Catholic event put on by Catholics, to honor the first Catholic candidate for president.) Yes, he did. Contemptible. What is contemptible is the disdainful way the Democrats write about Catholics in their e-mail and have actually started liberal organizations in the Catholic church whose purpose is to foment a "Catholic spring". It looks like a good many of you missed that story:
The Hill reports that some conservative Catholic organizations are demanding Palmieri's resignation: thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/300543-catholic-group-demands-top-clinton-aide-resign-over
Aside from the fact that you are quoting from a hacked, private conversation (I would prefer not to glorify the hackers) AND that these were members of Hillary's campaign, not the candidate herself ... suggesting that the Catholic Church could use some liberalizing is hardly the same thing as being a "hater" of Catholics. I'm kind of surprised I need to explain this to you.
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Deleted
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Jun 2, 2024 5:14:51 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2016 18:55:00 GMT
I agree completely. They were both acting like spoiled 10 year olds. I am not a fan of either, but I thought Hillary would have taken her high road. It would have made me think a bit harder about voting for her. You expect this from Trump, I had higher hopes for her. I am still undecided..... Comments like this puzzle me. (Not picking on you purplebee--I agree it's usually best to take the high road) Why is it always up to Hillary to take the higher road?Because if Trump won't, what good does it do to sink down to his level?
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Oct 21, 2016 19:18:24 GMT
Comments like this puzzle me. (Not picking on you purplebee--I agree it's usually best to take the high road) Why is it always up to Hillary to take the higher road?Because if Trump won't, what good does it do to sink down to his level? And that is what keeps him going. Kowtowing to a narcissist keeps him thinking his behavior is acceptable. 😡
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Jun 2, 2024 5:14:51 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2016 19:21:33 GMT
Because if Trump won't, what good does it do to sink down to his level? And that is what keeps him going. Kowtowing to a narcissist keeps him thinking his behavior is acceptable. 😡 Refusing to stoop to his level is in no way "kowtowing." If two parties are going to go round and round acting like children, nothing is going to get better. What a ridiculous way to behave.
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suzastampin
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,587
Jun 28, 2014 14:32:59 GMT
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Post by suzastampin on Oct 21, 2016 20:18:32 GMT
I didn't watch the videos, but saw some on the morning news. Did anybody else notice that Donald patted Hillary's shoulder as he walked up to the podium? It looked like a friendly pat pat.
Personally, I hate watching roasts. They always seem so mean spirited.
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Sarah*H
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,983
Jun 25, 2014 20:07:06 GMT
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Post by Sarah*H on Oct 21, 2016 20:41:18 GMT
There is also the small fact that Jennifer Palmieri is Catholic. As is John Podesta. As is John Halpin.
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linda~lou
Pearl Clutcher
Keep calm and eat crumpets
Posts: 2,744
Location: Motown but my heart is in San Francisco
Jun 25, 2014 21:57:08 GMT
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Post by linda~lou on Oct 21, 2016 20:58:22 GMT
Just watched another clip of speeches. Not earth shattering but I noticed Trump pulled wrinkled notes out of his pocket while Hillary came to the dias with a lovely leather binder. I noticed the same thing at the debates. He had a pad of paper while Hillary again had a professional looking binder.
Yes, minor, but it spoke volumes to me who is more polished and fit for the presidency.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Jun 2, 2024 5:14:51 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2016 21:01:23 GMT
Hillary doesn't need to sink to Trump's level. She should just keep doing what she is doing which is getting under his skin.
And I quote "I'm not puppet, I'm not a puppet, you're a puppet".
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Oct 21, 2016 21:02:28 GMT
^^^ Stephen Colbert did a short bit about this during his monologue with actual sock puppets-- it was hilarious!! eta: my rank with this post is now 'What's For Dinner' in memory of Akathy... I don't want to post again for a while, to keep it!
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Post by lucillebluth on Oct 21, 2016 21:03:21 GMT
Didn't miss it, but Trump said Hillary hated Catholics, and these emails weren't to/from Hillary. Many in the Catholic church seem to think that Hillary "owns it" because Podesta, her campaign manager, was involved. I'm not justifying anything, I'm just reporting.
I don't know whether you're Catholic or not, but surely you're aware that many Catholics would like to see the Church take a different direction on several fronts, including the role of women in the Church. A private conversation about this isn't really that shocking to many, I would think. On the other hand, the awful Katrina Pierson has made at least one public slam on Catholicism: Catholics demand an apology
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Post by BeckyTech on Oct 21, 2016 21:56:34 GMT
suggesting that the Catholic Church could use some liberalizing is hardly the same thing as being a "hater" of Catholics. I'm kind of surprised I need to explain this to you. It wasn't me that summarized it as "hater" of Catholics, but from many of the responses you received, it didn't appear that many understood why he would say such a thing. Maybe you missed the utter disdain in some of the communications; it was more than just suggesting some "liberalizing". But you would need to keep up on the news to know that, as distasteful as it may be to read hacked communications.
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Post by lucyg on Oct 21, 2016 22:02:52 GMT
suggesting that the Catholic Church could use some liberalizing is hardly the same thing as being a "hater" of Catholics. I'm kind of surprised I need to explain this to you. It wasn't me that summarized it as "hater" of Catholics, but from many of the responses you received, it didn't appear that many understood why he would say such a thing. Maybe you missed the utter disdain in some of the communications; it was more than just suggesting some "liberalizing". But you would need to keep up on the news to know that, as distasteful as it may be to read hacked communications. Per Sarah*H above, the people making the comments are Catholics themselves. I dunno. One way or another, I think it was a huge jump for him to make, and wildly inappropriate for the setting, as witnessed by the unprecedented booing he elicited from the audience.
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linda~lou
Pearl Clutcher
Keep calm and eat crumpets
Posts: 2,744
Location: Motown but my heart is in San Francisco
Jun 25, 2014 21:57:08 GMT
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Post by linda~lou on Oct 21, 2016 22:14:12 GMT
And to continue my silly rant on Trump's appearance. His suits are so ill fitting. I'm sure they cost more than most of us make in a month, however he always looks so rumpled, like he just got out of bed. (hummmm, perhaps he did).
You would think spending that much on a tailored made suit, the damn thing would fit properly. I loathe some of Hillary's pant suits but at least they fit her impeccably.
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Post by imkat on Oct 21, 2016 22:55:01 GMT
I love HRC, but thought they were both awful last night. What they should have done:
1. Make a lot of self deprecating comments. (5 minutes) 2. Make a few light hearted comments about each other and people in the room. (1 minute) 3. Thank the hosts, talk about all the good things Catholic Charities does (2 minutes) 4. Sit down
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purplebee
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,738
Jun 27, 2014 20:37:34 GMT
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Post by purplebee on Oct 21, 2016 23:08:47 GMT
I agree completely. They were both acting like spoiled 10 year olds. I am not a fan of either, but I thought Hillary would have taken her high road. It would have made me think a bit harder about voting for her. You expect this from Trump, I had higher hopes for her. I am still undecided..... Comments like this puzzle me. (Not picking on you purplebee--I agree it's usually best to take the high road) Why is it always up to Hillary to take the higher road? I guess what I am trying to say here is that this type of rhetoric is Trump's SOP, and I expected it. I think Hillary had some good lines, some funny stuff that wasn't mean, but she would have come across as a kinder, nicer? person if she had not hit back so hard. I felt like she was descending to his level a bit.....
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AmeliaBloomer
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Oct 21, 2016 23:15:59 GMT
[long post about Catholics ...I deleted for space]
You're writing with a lot of authority, so I assume you're Catholic? If so, you seem to have a different perspective than most on the traditional interplay between American Catholicism and politics. The idea of "starting" liberal organizations within the American church is a head-scratcher as there is a very rich history of liberalism and social justice. Catholics are still a very strong presence in the Democratic Party, although their numbers are decreasing. (Because they're leaving the Church, not because they're staying and switching parties.) [As you know, the emergence of some very vocal ultra-conservative, even "fundamentalist," Catholics in the last two decades parallels the strategy by the previous two popes to stack the College of Cardinals with all doctrinal conservatives, which has had the intended trickle-down effect in American dioceses both doctrinally and politically...and dovetailed with the rise of conservative Evangelicalism to make some strange, if uneasy, bedfellows. Now the growing fundamentalists want to turn back the clock doctrinally and have become a thorn in the sides of even the most conservative cardinals.] The two outraged Catholic organizations in your link are fringe organizations. The Catholic League is a sham, as is Bill Donahue, the reactionary man who runs it. He's so obsessed with anti-Catholicism, he thinks we are still living through the anti-papist throes of Al Smith's campaign. (And he's currently furious because the pope has asked Christians to make amends to LGBTQ people.) The "Catholic Vote" also sounds uber conservative. I don't personally know ANY Catholics who would give much credence to those organizations, including the priests in my family. You may have different experiences as a Catholic, but considering the flux state of the Church in America, and its close-to 100,000,000 members, it's definitely a mistake to make any general statements about "the Catholics." It's as mistaken in this thread as it it is among Clinton staffers. (And in some of those cases, the comments reflect the staffers' own discontent as Catholics themselves.) ETA: "Disdain"? Have you seen the list of people Trump appointed to his Catholic Advisory Council? In addition to being overwhelmingly conservative Catholics, many would speak/have spoken with disdain about liberal Catholics. (Heck, they talk about the POPE with disdain.) So, it works both ways. We don't need WikiLeaks to show us that. We're talking about the oldest organization in the world, drenched in politics. The divisions within it are as sharp as the divisions on this board.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Oct 22, 2016 0:17:26 GMT
I watched it and for the 1st 10 minutes of Trumps speech I wondered what the kerfuffle was about. But the last 10 minutes of his speech was over the top. I think we make too many concessions for him. I was tempted to say.. meh.. not as bad as I imagined. But we have lowered our standards so much to accommodate him as a "viable" candidate that our standards are pretty non-existent. So Congratulations Donald... you weren't as horrible as you could have been. Hillary.. we expect better from you. Doesn't this just represent the double standard with which we treat boys and girls?? This is what I meant by my first post!! Lol @ilovecookies purplebee😁
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Oct 22, 2016 0:25:42 GMT
I watched it and for the 1st 10 minutes of Trumps speech I wondered what the kerfuffle was about. But the last 10 minutes of his speech was over the top. I think we make too many concessions for him. I was tempted to say.. meh.. not as bad as I imagined. But we have lowered our standards so much to accommodate him as a "viable" candidate that our standards are pretty non-existent.
So Congratulations Donald... you weren't as horrible as you could have been.
Hillary.. we expect better from you.
Doesn't this just represent the double standard with which we treat boys and girls?? ^^^ interesting that you put it that way... on NPR this morning, I heard a commentator say that comparing the two of them in this manner is sort of a 'false equivalency' because they are so different in their experience, etc. So the fact that there is so much negative about Donald Trump (his comments, his business dealings, etc.) that we (the media, the public, etc.) are looking extra-hard to find all the negative things about her as well. But if it was any other 'political' opponent instead of Trump, the negativity of this campaign (as it relates to Hillary) most likely wouldn't be happening, because in the commentator's opinion, the issues surrounding Hillary Clinton are not out of the ordinary for politicians in general. (and I'm paraphrasing, but that's basically, the gist of it was sort of comparing apples and oranges, and Hillary Clinton as a politician is suffering by the comparison.) ETA: as to this quote regarding the WikiLeaks comments about the Catholic church: “There needs to be a Catholic Spring, in which Catholics themselves demand the end of a middle ages dictatorship and the beginning of a little democracy and respect for gender equality in the Catholic Church,” I've heard a fair number of news stories recently about the Catholic church (in regards to Zika virus & birth control, womens' place- or lack of it- in the Church hierarchy, the Church's position towards the LGBTQ community, etc.) and I think it's probably a fair assessment to say that a number of Catholic Church members THEMSELVES would actually AGREE with that statement!! And they do! (Referencing the last paragraph). There is "a movement" within the church by its members to work for change. It's going on with our church's here because there are not enough young men entering and choosing priesthood--if they don't do something churches are going to start closing. I live in an area that has a very large LBGTQ population and many of my friends are Catholic! It IS happening!
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Oct 22, 2016 0:26:40 GMT
Maybe so he could see what it's really like?
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jayfab
Drama Llama
procastinating
Posts: 5,531
Jun 26, 2014 21:55:15 GMT
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Post by jayfab on Oct 22, 2016 0:43:44 GMT
This video shows the face of a man sitting behind Trump when Trump started his nasty crap. The booing starts right at this point. omg
Here's a longer clip. The guy goes from jovial to what the hell in seconds. omg wth
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Oct 22, 2016 1:09:40 GMT
Bill was sitting next to Hillary. It wasn't trump that said they need to work together, it was Hillary. I haven't heard what his response was to that. Bill wasn't there. Hillary sat between the Cardinal and Alfred E. Smith IV, the MC of the event and great-grandson of Al Smith. Sorry. I thought I saw Hillary giving bill a look when trump made the comment about her not liking Catholics but I must have seen someone else.
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Post by MsChiff on Oct 22, 2016 1:39:15 GMT
OMG that guy looked like he had a stick up his ass all night didn't he!! Everyone knows you're supposed to smile and laugh, no matter how annoying the other candidate gets. Hillary just kept laughing at Trump's jabs. Even Trump kept laughing at Hillary's jabs. But Rudy Giuliani? I'm going to repeat my concerns of a week or two ago. I think he's showing signs of being not up to intellectual par anymore. He used to be quick-witted. The old Rudy Giuliani would have known to laugh, even if he was being poked a bit. Not anymore. The last few times I've seen Rudy Giuliani on TV, I've noticed that he's quite different. I wonder if it's a medical issue. SaveSave
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Post by lucyg on Oct 22, 2016 2:08:40 GMT
Everyone knows you're supposed to smile and laugh, no matter how annoying the other candidate gets. Hillary just kept laughing at Trump's jabs. Even Trump kept laughing at Hillary's jabs. But Rudy Giuliani? I'm going to repeat my concerns of a week or two ago. I think he's showing signs of being not up to intellectual par anymore. He used to be quick-witted. The old Rudy Giuliani would have known to laugh, even if he was being poked a bit. Not anymore. The last few times I've seen Rudy Giuliani on TV, I've noticed that he's quite different. I wonder if it's a medical issue. SaveSaveYeah. I'm not even being snarky for once. The past few months, he's been alternately either over-the-top angry and spittle-flecked, or else seemingly just a little slow-witted. I would not be surprised to hear there's a medical issue going on.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Oct 22, 2016 2:25:38 GMT
Comments like this puzzle me. (Not picking on you purplebee--I agree it's usually best to take the high road) Why is it always up to Hillary to take the higher road? I guess what I am trying to say here is that this type of rhetoric is Trump's SOP, and I expected it. I think Hillary had some good lines, some funny stuff that wasn't mean, but she would have come across as a kinder, nicer? person if she had not hit back so hard. I felt like she was descending to his level a bit..... In a way, I agree (see my above post about my lack of sense of humor and not liking "roasts") but it seems that the way Hillary was acting was more in line with the tradition of the event. Trump didn't even try to sound like he was joking when he was saying those things, and Hillary was clearly trying to be a good sport through most of it by laughing. I did find it a little odd that you were giving Trump a pass since that is his "SOP" (and are considering still voting for him) but you are disappointed in Hillary and it seems to have reduced your likelihood of voting for her. Does seem to speak to the double standards that have been discussed in this thread.
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Post by imkat on Oct 22, 2016 3:32:24 GMT
This video shows the face of a man sitting behind Trump when Trump started his nasty crap. The booing starts right at this point. omg
Here's a longer clip. The guy goes from jovial to what the hell in seconds. omg wth
Oh my gosh, I was dying last night when I saw this. The whole time I was thinking that the three men and Maria Bartiromo had the worst seats in the room, and then that happened....
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smginaz Suzy
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Je suis desole.
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Jun 26, 2014 17:27:30 GMT
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Post by smginaz Suzy on Oct 22, 2016 6:55:27 GMT
I have to disagree with the peas who didn't like the Statue of Liberty joke, I thought it was funny. That being said I read an article about her best lines for the night. Could someone please explain this on to me? 12. People say… I’m boring compared to Donald. But I’m not boring at all. In fact, I’m the life of every party I attend. And I’ve been to three! I'm missing something here. She's an introvert. Being social is part of the job.
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Post by lucyg on Oct 22, 2016 6:59:37 GMT
I have to disagree with the peas who didn't like the Statue of Liberty joke, I thought it was funny. That being said I read an article about her best lines for the night. Could someone please explain this on to me? 12. People say… I’m boring compared to Donald. But I’m not boring at all. In fact, I’m the life of every party I attend. And I’ve been to three! I'm missing something here. She's an introvert. Being social is part of the job. Right. She's saying she has only been to three parties. ha ha
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purplebee
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,738
Jun 27, 2014 20:37:34 GMT
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Post by purplebee on Oct 22, 2016 15:45:39 GMT
I guess what I am trying to say here is that this type of rhetoric is Trump's SOP, and I expected it. I think Hillary had some good lines, some funny stuff that wasn't mean, but she would have come across as a kinder, nicer? person if she had not hit back so hard. I felt like she was descending to his level a bit..... In a way, I agree (see my above post about my lack of sense of humor and not liking "roasts") but it seems that the way Hillary was acting was more in line with the tradition of the event. Trump didn't even try to sound like he was joking when he was saying those things, and Hillary was clearly trying to be a good sport through most of it by laughing. I did find it a little odd that you were giving Trump a pass since that is his "SOP" (and are considering still voting for him) but you are disappointed in Hillary and it seems to have reduced your likelihood of voting for her. Does seem to speak to the double standards that have been discussed in this thread. ACK! Sorry that I did not make myself clear. I am NOT voting for Donald Trump. I do not want to vote for Hillary either, but she may be my only viable choice. I was considering not voting at all, but that too is a bad choice. That is what we have this election day, bad choices. However, I do believe that Hillary will win decisively regardless of my choice.
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