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Post by putabuttononit on Nov 20, 2016 4:01:44 GMT
You know, I am amazed at what this place has become. I have been here and the old boards since my kid was born. She will be 16 soon. I have come and gone a few times, but I think it is now time to go for good. I will tell you that I did vote for Obama the first time around, because I believed all of his talk. I personally felt he didnt do what he "sold himself as". As time has gone on, I have gotten really tired of how this country has become. I decided to vote Repub.. There was no way I was voting for Hilary. Maybe if there had been a candidate for the dems (of which I am registered) that had their own mind and stance, I would have voted for them. So, since I voted republican, not necessarily Trump, but Repub. I am now all kinds of nasty things, racist, white supremacist, hater ect. Yeah, because you know me personally. I am sick to death of it all. Why sit here and read things that many of you say to people you do not even know. So I'm done too. Commence at calling me yet more names. Just wanted to say I'm sorry somebody used this to further insult you, rather than showing some simple understanding to what you're trying to share here. I don't know if you are still here but I just wanted to say I'm sorry for what you are feeling, and I understand.
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AnotherPea
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,968
Jan 4, 2015 1:47:52 GMT
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Post by AnotherPea on Nov 20, 2016 13:02:01 GMT
I admire people that vote with their money. Most people put $$$ before convictions and it is refreshing to see companies that risk their income in order to stand by an issue they support. That goes for Penzy's as well as Chik-Fil-A and Hobby Lobby.
I don't like being preached at, however. It is one thing to walk into a store and see signs that support a stance. But to send out emails or to have posters up that condemn a belief is another. If I sign up for your emails, I want you to keep politics out of my inbox.
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Post by Skellinton on Nov 20, 2016 13:55:14 GMT
Trader Joe's, at least the local ones, has a very limited selection of herbs and spices. You really aren't missing anything besides low prices on maybe a dozen very basic seasonings. ETA they do carry a nice variety of different salts and peppers, though. Penzeys sent me a free Fox Point last time I ordered. If they do that again, I'll send it on to you if you like. At least you'll know they didn't make any money on it. She can buy spices from her local grocery store matching the ingredients from the fox point label. The point is Penzey isn't any better than other brands, they just market themselves well and charge more. I dnt know spice prices off the top of my head, but I do know Penzeys is cheaper in bottles then what our Fred Meyers or Safeway charges. I typically buy Penzeys in the bags and that makes it even cheaper. I disagree with the spices not being better too. Their cocoa powder makes an amazing difference when baking, it is so much richer then the brands from the grocery store. Their black pepper that starts with an o (ochello or something like that) is the best black pepper I have ever had. I think you have said you make your curry, but for me amounts do matter ( you said in another post you just taste and add what you like-paraphrasing ) and I don't have a recipe for homemade curry that I like- because curry is all over the place in flavor, so buying their Now Curry or the Marajhanng curry is perfect for me. Their cinnamon is amazing as well, so much better then store brands and they have different blends. I don't even really like cinnamon, But I use theirs at home and love it. The only spice I have tried I don't like there is their poultry seasoning because they use dill, and I hate dill. Oh, and don't even get me started on their cocoa mix. That stuff is manna from Heaven and no crap preservatives or chemicals in it, which I appreciate most of all. Toss in their frequent coupons and I don't believe for a second they are more expensive then the grocery store.
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Post by anxiousmom on Nov 20, 2016 14:08:05 GMT
In my mind, he is making generalizations about families and youth as well as suggesting that a donation will atone for what he considers "wrong" To be honest I'm not sure I've seen anything that shows a breakdown in the voting by age. So what age are the "youth" referenced in the e-mail. I am admittedly terrible at remembering exact statistics and their source. However, I did see a breakdown early on that showed something like 72% of people ages 25-35 voted for Hillary. (Please, if someone finds the exact numbers, don't criticize me! I am sure my numbers are off. All I know is that there was definitely an age correlation - younger voters tended to go for Hillary, older for Trump.) I also found that reference to "make a donation to make up for it" kind of weird. I think I understand what he's getting at, but it was definitely awkwardly phrased. My pretty liberal mother always says that most people drift toward the fiscal tenets of the republican platform as they get older. lol
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AnotherPea
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,968
Jan 4, 2015 1:47:52 GMT
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Post by AnotherPea on Nov 20, 2016 14:33:32 GMT
I am admittedly terrible at remembering exact statistics and their source. However, I did see a breakdown early on that showed something like 72% of people ages 25-35 voted for Hillary. (Please, if someone finds the exact numbers, don't criticize me! I am sure my numbers are off. All I know is that there was definitely an age correlation - younger voters tended to go for Hillary, older for Trump.) I also found that reference to "make a donation to make up for it" kind of weird. I think I understand what he's getting at, but it was definitely awkwardly phrased. My pretty liberal mother always says that most people drift toward the fiscal tenets of the republican platform as they get older. lol Not just fiscal - IME, people become more conservative in general as they experience more of life.
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Post by jenis40 on Nov 20, 2016 14:40:31 GMT
My pretty liberal mother always says that most people drift toward the fiscal tenets of the republican platform as they get older. lol Not just fiscal - IME, people become more conservative in general as they experience more of life. While I don't disagree that this mostly true, my husband and I (57&43) have become increasingly liberal the older we get. Our bi-racial grandchildren, my gay cousin and my life threatening health issues have cemented that.
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pyccku
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,817
Jun 27, 2014 23:12:07 GMT
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Post by pyccku on Nov 20, 2016 14:56:20 GMT
My pretty liberal mother always says that most people drift toward the fiscal tenets of the republican platform as they get older. lol Not just fiscal - IME, people become more conservative in general as they experience more of life. Out of curiosity, why do you think that is? I find it interesting - I suppose it depends upon your experiences. I find that I am more liberal as I get older - because I have traveled more, met more people, read more books, been exposed to more ideas. Instead of black & white, there are more and more shades of gray. But a lot of people do become more conservative. I see it as "well, this is how things were in MY day, and that's the way they should be in the future as well." I don't really agree with that - times change, people learn, and new ways of doing things come about. People would think it really odd if you insisted that things stay the way they were 200 years ago because life wasn't the same then. But they think nothing of those who insist that we should do things the way we did 50 years ago. The only constant is change.
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AnotherPea
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,968
Jan 4, 2015 1:47:52 GMT
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Post by AnotherPea on Nov 20, 2016 15:54:14 GMT
I think life experiences change us. Wisdom comes with knowledge and experience.
When I was younger I was naive about a lot of things - some of those things would fall under the "left" philosophy. For instance, I could not understand why anyone would consider an unborn child to be an actual person. Things changed as I learned more about embryological development. And then when I became pregnant my opinion changed even more.
I think for some people they work hard and gain more as time goes on. It is difficult for someone that worked very hard for a long time to get ahead to hear that other people want to take away some of their stuff (money/taxes, etc.) and give it to others that haven't put in the same effort.
And for some, it is their natural response to handle animosity/heated debate/fallacy by digging in their heels and moving farther away from their opponent. I think this is a large reason why Trump won, actually. People that didn't 100% agree with the liberal stance were painted as racists/homophobes, etc. and that didn't win any arguments. Instead, it just pushed people farther to the right. The vitriol made it difficult for some people to say "hmmm, well, I think you might be right about this portion but not completely about this..."
I personally could not have a conversation about Ferguson or other riots without being told my opinion didn't matter. Even here I was told to check my privilege if I dared to disagree. For a lot of white citizens it felt like there were only two choices: be a racist or commit your life (or at least your FB timeline) to proving you weren't a racist. If you dared to think private businesses owners should be able to honor their religious beliefs at work, you were a homophobe. Automatically. Didn't matter who you're married to, who you have in your family, who you love in general, you're a homophobe.
So sometimes people get tired of being treated a certain way. They get tired of others trying to tell them they don't love enough, give enough, care enough. As time goes on, as they get older, their views start to change.
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Post by shescrafty on Nov 20, 2016 16:09:42 GMT
I just ordered from Penzeys for the first time. Happy to do it and support them.
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Post by jenis40 on Nov 20, 2016 16:50:41 GMT
I think life experiences change us. Wisdom comes with knowledge and experience. When I was younger I was naive about a lot of things - some of those things would fall under the "left" philosophy. For instance, I could not understand why anyone would consider an unborn child to be an actual person. Things changed as I learned more about embryological development. And then when I became pregnant my opinion changed even more. I think for some people they work hard and gain more as time goes on. It is difficult for someone that worked very hard for a long time to get ahead to hear that other people want to take away some of their stuff (money/taxes, etc.) and give it to others that haven't put in the same effort. And for some, it is their natural response to handle animosity/heated debate/fallacy by digging in their heels and moving farther away from their opponent. I think this is a large reason why Trump won, actually. People that didn't 100% agree with the liberal stance were painted as racists/homophobes, etc. and that didn't win any arguments. Instead, it just pushed people farther to the right. The vitriol made it difficult for some people to say "hmmm, well, I think you might be right about this portion but not completely about this..." I personally could not have a conversation about Ferguson or other riots without being told my opinion didn't matter. Even here I was told to check my privilege if I dared to disagree. For a lot of white citizens it felt like there were only two choices: be a racist or commit your life (or at least your FB timeline) to proving you weren't a racist. If you dared to think private businesses owners should be able to honor their religious beliefs at work, you were a homophobe. Automatically. Didn't matter who you're married to, who you have in your family, who you love in general, you're a homophobe. So sometimes people get tired of being treated a certain way. They get tired of others trying to tell them they don't love enough, give enough, care enough. As time goes on, as they get older, their views start to change. I don't think you mean it this way but your post comes across a little bit like if you are liberal you are stupid. For me, the life experiences that I've had - Leukemia diagnosis, relapse, bone marrow transplant and not having to declare bankruptcy while fighting for my life- have shaped my viewpoint on Healthcare (don't think Conservatives want anyone to die or go bankrupt either). Having bi-racial grandchildren has opened my eyes to how much racism is still left in this world. People get tired of being told their not white enough, male enough, Christian enough, patriotic enough. Neither side has the corner on not being condescending to the "other" side.
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TheOtherMeg
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,541
Jun 25, 2014 20:58:14 GMT
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Post by TheOtherMeg on Nov 20, 2016 17:24:02 GMT
Not just fiscal - IME, people become more conservative in general as they experience more of life. Out of curiosity, why do you think that is? I find it interesting - I suppose it depends upon your experiences. I find that I am more liberal as I get older - because I have traveled more, met more people, read more books, been exposed to more ideas. Instead of black & white, there are more and more shades of gray. But a lot of people do become more conservative. I see it as "well, this is how things were in MY day, and that's the way they should be in the future as well." I don't really agree with that - times change, people learn, and new ways of doing things come about. People would think it really odd if you insisted that things stay the way they were 200 years ago because life wasn't the same then. But they think nothing of those who insist that we should do things the way we did 50 years ago. The only constant is change. "I find that I am more liberal as I get older - because I have traveled more, met more people, read more books, been exposed to more ideas. Instead of black & white, there are more and more shades of gray." Yes, ^^that^^ has absolutely been my experience, as well. My husband, though, has (mostly) gone the "everything was better in my day" and/or "we did it suchandsuch way when I was younger and it was fine, so why change it" route.
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Post by elaine on Nov 20, 2016 21:02:17 GMT
Out of curiosity, why do you think that is? I find it interesting - I suppose it depends upon your experiences. I find that I am more liberal as I get older - because I have traveled more, met more people, read more books, been exposed to more ideas. Instead of black & white, there are more and more shades of gray. But a lot of people do become more conservative. I see it as "well, this is how things were in MY day, and that's the way they should be in the future as well." I don't really agree with that - times change, people learn, and new ways of doing things come about. People would think it really odd if you insisted that things stay the way they were 200 years ago because life wasn't the same then. But they think nothing of those who insist that we should do things the way we did 50 years ago. The only constant is change. "I find that I am more liberal as I get older - because I have traveled more, met more people, read more books, been exposed to more ideas. Instead of black & white, there are more and more shades of gray." Yes, ^^that^^ has absolutely been my experience, as well. My husband, though, has (mostly) gone the "everything was better in my day" and/or "we did it suchandsuch way when I was younger and it was fine, so why change it" route. Yes. The same here. My husband was unflinchingly conservative and a Republican when we married at 35. Having 2 special needs kids and having more and more life experiences related to them and my many out-of-the-closet friends has led him to switch parties and become even more liberal than I am now that we are in our 50s. I think that the Republican Party has become more and more about social/moral issues - in a negative way - and moved away from being mostly about fiscal conservatism, the less we will see people become more conservative as they get older. The Republican Party has decided to try to legislate our bodies, our morals, who we can marry, how much freedom one can experience depending on one's religion, etc. As people age and gain life-experiences, they want government to legislate LESS about our personal lives. That has become the antithesis of the GOP Platform. It will continue to reverse what used to be the trend and as people age, many will continue to reject those notions.
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TheOtherMeg
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,541
Jun 25, 2014 20:58:14 GMT
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Post by TheOtherMeg on Nov 20, 2016 21:08:26 GMT
The Republican Party has decided to try to legislate our bodies, our morals, who we can marry, how much freedom one can experience depending on one's religion, etc. As people age and gain life-experiences, they want government to legislate LESS about our personal lives. That has become the antithesis of the GOP Platform. It will continue to reverse what used to be the trend and as people age, many will continue to reject those notions. Let's hope so!
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RosieKat
Drama Llama
PeaJect #12
Posts: 5,376
Jun 25, 2014 19:28:04 GMT
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Post by RosieKat on Nov 20, 2016 21:32:13 GMT
In a way, I think a lot of us on this last page are really saying we've become more moderate in our views. (Not necessarily the political definition of moderate.) We start out more towards one end and have moved towards the other as our life experiences show us there's more to the story than just what we knew at age 20. It seems to me that's probably a good thing, that we continue to learn and grow and are open to changing our minds as experience teaches us more. We may all be in a different part of the spectrum, but we all have that in common.
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Post by anxiousmom on Nov 20, 2016 21:40:12 GMT
Not just fiscal - IME, people become more conservative in general as they experience more of life. While I don't disagree that this mostly true, my husband and I (57&43) have become increasingly liberal the older we get. Our bi-racial grandchildren, my gay cousin and my life threatening health issues have cemented that. I think is a struggle for my mom. She is now, and always has been very socially liberal. A product of growing up in the 60's and being the hippie granola chic that she was. But over time, she and a lot of her boomer brethren, have worked, saved money, and don't want to lose it.
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Post by Merge on Nov 20, 2016 22:42:18 GMT
I've become much more liberal since I started teaching in diverse, urban public schools. I don't agree that age and wisdom make you more conservative. I think that as we age, people just settle more into who they really are.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 29, 2024 0:30:30 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2016 23:55:02 GMT
I thought the same thing when I was reading last night, but I just didn't want to "go there". A person can live for 50/60/70 years, and come to there own conclusions about moral issues based on what they have seen in that time. As long as those are the popular opinion, then they are applauded. A person can live for that amount of time and decide the best moral standards to follow were described thousands of years ago, and that person is admonished. It does seem a double standard to me. To me it is not the matter of a "popular opinion" when it comes to racism, misogyny, and bigotry. I thought that for most people across the board those things would be clearly wrong. It has been shocking to me that they aren't. When discussing Chickfila support, looking at some of the human rights atrocities conducted by the organizations that Chicagoland was giving money to it was an easy choice for many to disagree and not want "our" money to go there. They are for most people. What's shocking to a lot of people is what constitutes being labeled "racist" "misogynist" "bigot" etc. So many people and ideas have been labeled those (people and ideas that aren't logically those things) by one side, just because both sides want the same outcome but the difference of opinion on how to achieve it, earned the label in order to silence that "wrong" opinion. Sadly it works for them. As evidenced here, on this board.
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Post by buckeyegirl on Nov 20, 2016 23:58:44 GMT
I will never understand why any business would risk alienating at least half of their potential customer base.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 29, 2024 0:30:30 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2016 23:59:08 GMT
I've become much more liberal since I started teaching in diverse, urban public schools. I don't agree that age and wisdom make you more conservative. I think that as we age, people just settle more into who they really are. Save
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 29, 2024 0:30:30 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2016 0:02:31 GMT
I will never understand why any business would risk alienating at least half of their potential customer base. I do. Some people care about more than just money. Save
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Post by shescrafty on Nov 21, 2016 0:02:57 GMT
I will never understand why any business would risk alienating at least half of their potential customer base. Because they care about people and not just profits. Because they don't like the racist and bigoted comments that come from the PE's mouth and his appointments. Because they want people to know that it is okay to stand up against bigotry and racism and homophobia and say, "this is not okay."
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Post by buckeyegirl on Nov 21, 2016 0:27:59 GMT
I will never understand why any business would risk alienating at least half of their potential customer base. Because they care about people and not just profits. Because they don't like the racist and bigoted comments that come from the PE's mouth and his appointments. Because they want people to know that it is okay to stand up against bigotry and racism and homophobia and say, "this is not okay." They can believe whatever they want, but from a business perspective it is stupid unless you only want to sell your product or service to a certain segment of the population. Last time I checked, both liberals and conservatives like spices.
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Post by Merge on Nov 21, 2016 0:33:38 GMT
Because they care about people and not just profits. Because they don't like the racist and bigoted comments that come from the PE's mouth and his appointments. Because they want people to know that it is okay to stand up against bigotry and racism and homophobia and say, "this is not okay." They can believe whatever they want, but from a business perspective it is stupid unless you only want to sell your product or service to a certain segment of the population. Last time I checked, both liberals and conservatives like spices. I went into my Penzey's store this afternoon and it was packed, right here in super-conservative Texas. I think maybe some people are overestimating the damage this will do to their business. ETA: Kind of like all our liberal outrage hasn't hurt Chick Fil A one bit.
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Post by threegirls on Nov 21, 2016 0:39:56 GMT
Because they care about people and not just profits. Because they don't like the racist and bigoted comments that come from the PE's mouth and his appointments. Because they want people to know that it is okay to stand up against bigotry and racism and homophobia and say, "this is not okay." They can believe whatever they want, but from a business perspective it is stupid unless you only want to sell your product or service to a certain segment of the population. Last time I checked, both liberals and conservatives like spices. It's tough to make money and grow your business if you turn-off a significant percentage of your customers. When you don't make enough $ you start to lay people off and close stores. How is that good for the employees? I'm not saying that is going to happen to Penzy's but it is a risk they are taking.
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Post by Skellinton on Nov 21, 2016 0:40:57 GMT
I will never understand why any business would risk alienating at least half of their potential customer base. First, I highly doubt they are alienating half their customer base. That would partially assume that their customer base is split 50/50 Trump supporters, or 50/50 Politically liberal/conservative. I don't think that is a valid assumption to make. Even if that was true, you are assuming that all their customers receive and read their emails. My mother and husband both love Penzeys and neither of them heard about the email as they are not on the mailing list and it isn't exactly wide spread national news. You are then assuming that if all their customers were split evenly and all customers heard about or read the email that half of them would feel strongly enough to boycott. I don't think Penzeys has anything to worry about. And actually, I like Penzeys better now and as evidenced by this board they have at least gained some new customers and had loyal customers make extra orders.
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Post by lisacharlotte on Nov 21, 2016 0:43:07 GMT
People like to think their side is more "whatever" positive attribute. That's just the way humans are. And there are tons of statistics available to support your position even if it contradicts other statistics that support the other side. But we're all individuals with our own struggles and experiences that shape our world view and politics. You can decide that the "other" is wrong and horrible and stupid people. But we'll never resolve our differences taking that course of action.
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Post by shescrafty on Nov 21, 2016 1:23:55 GMT
They can believe whatever they want, but from a business perspective it is stupid unless you only want to sell your product or service to a certain segment of the population. Last time I checked, both liberals and conservatives like spices. It's tough to make money and grow your business if you turn-off a significant percentage of your customers. When you don't make enough $ you start to lay people off and close stores. How is that good for the employees? I'm not saying that is going to happen to Penzy's but it is a risk they are taking. I was not a customer before the email. I spent a good chunk of money today purchasing spices for my own house as well as to send as gifts. I guess time will tell how it impacts their business.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 29, 2024 0:30:30 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2016 1:57:00 GMT
Because they care about people and not just profits. Because they don't like the racist and bigoted comments that come from the PE's mouth and his appointments. Because they want people to know that it is okay to stand up against bigotry and racism and homophobia and say, "this is not okay." They can believe whatever they want, but from a business perspective it is stupid unless you only want to sell your product or service to a certain segment of the population. Last time I checked, both liberals and conservatives like spices. The name-calling really isn't necessary. Save
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Post by shescrafty on Nov 21, 2016 11:09:13 GMT
People like to think their side is more "whatever" positive attribute. That's just the way humans are. And there are tons of statistics available to support your position even if it contradicts other statistics that support the other side. But we're all individuals with our own struggles and experiences that shape our world view and politics. You can decide that the "other" is wrong and horrible and stupid people. But we'll never resolve our differences taking that course of action. For the most part I agree with you. When it comes to racism and the alt-right movement I disagree with you. i do think racists and bigots are horrible and stupid people.
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Nink
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,947
Location: North Idaho
Jul 1, 2014 23:30:44 GMT
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Post by Nink on Nov 21, 2016 12:15:50 GMT
I've never ordered from them before, but I think I've just found a place to buy some gifts.
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