The Great Carpezio
Pearl Clutcher
Something profound goes here.
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Post by The Great Carpezio on Jul 9, 2018 5:54:17 GMT
At what age and how far?
I ask because we have had a couple situations recently, one today, in stores.
My my boys are 10.5. I will say that one of my twins is quite small for his age. We went into a run of the mill antique store today. Three adults and two kids. We entered and were not loud nor making quick movements. My son walked about ten to fifteen feet away (in eyesight of all adults) to look at a sign (he did not touch) and immediately he/we got the snippy, “you need to be with an adult at all times.”
A couple points: there was no noticeable sign upon entering. When we left, I had to look around a bunch of ads and signs to see a small handwritten sign on the window next to the door that read: unattended children will be given an espresso and a puppy (eye roll). Also, personally I feel “unattended children” varies from place to place and can be situational, but a well behaved child of probably 8 and up can certainly just be within eye/ear of an adult and not less than an arms length in a normal “stuff”store (like nothing that can kill them). Honestly my dh is more likely to break something than my kids.
If ten is too young, at what age? 13?16? Older?
full disclosure—there are days where I would not let my one son further than an arm length, but that’s when he is unmedicated. He was on meds today so was acting in a neurortypical ten year old way. And—-I wasn't pea livid and the boys stayed within a couple ft the rest of the time. Just a bit “miffed”and my son felt bad. He thinks they think he is younger than his brother too.
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Post by redhead32 on Jul 9, 2018 6:05:44 GMT
A 10.5 year old within eyesight of adults = attended.
I suppose the owners are a little snippy because people have not attended to their kids in the past. If he had been around a corner or not in eyesight, that might be different, IMO.
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The Great Carpezio
Pearl Clutcher
Something profound goes here.
Posts: 2,943
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Post by The Great Carpezio on Jul 9, 2018 6:09:35 GMT
A 10.5 year old within eyesight of adults = attended. I suppose the owners are a little snippy because people have not attended to their kids in the past. If he had been around a corner or not in eyesight, that might be different, IMO. Yeah—I don’t want them running around an antique store all willynilly without some supervison. |
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Post by katlady on Jul 9, 2018 6:09:41 GMT
Unattended to me means in a different aisle, or if the parent is on their phone not watching their child take toys off the shelf. Lol! Age would depend on the child. I think by 13 they can wander off to another aisle, but still close by.
But, we are talking about an antique store here. I would probably keep a 16-year old by my side the whole time. I feel like owners at antique stores are on the overcautious side.
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Post by redhead32 on Jul 9, 2018 6:16:59 GMT
A 10.5 year old within eyesight of adults = attended. I suppose the owners are a little snippy because people have not attended to their kids in the past. If he had been around a corner or not in eyesight, that might be different, IMO. Yeah—I don’t want them running around an antique store all willynilly without some supervison. We just got back from a road trip to visit family in New York. We all went into the city for a day - the Met, the subway, Central Park, etc. I threatened to buy one of those ropes like they use for elementary field trips at one point to keep the 5 kids in the same general vicinity. Ha. I was more concerned about the 13 year old falling into the subway track than property destruction, though. |
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Post by nlwilkins on Jul 9, 2018 8:06:03 GMT
In an antique store, or a place with valuables and breakables, it means that you can stop the child's hand reaching out to touch in time. A couple of feet away and something can be broke before you can stop it. From a couple of feet away, you can see what a child is doing, but that just means you watch the breakage happen. It can happen so fast. I used to sell breakable items in cat shows and I saw it time and time again. Child and parent within close proximity and before the adult could say stop, something would be broken. There is no way a stranger can determine what your child might do. Some children are just "touchers" and others do not respond to a spoken "stop" but will continue on to picking up an item and then ask why they cannot touch.
Your children sound like you have it all under control and well thought out, but not all children are that way and strangers do not know your children. Of course, it could have been said in a nicer way. Perhaps, they had just seen too much breakage lately.
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Post by katiejane on Jul 9, 2018 9:29:51 GMT
Attended means you are standing next to them in a store. Unattended they are walking around without you. You might trust your kids, but I have seen enough kids to know that not everyone can keep their hands to themselves or watch where they are walking. I would walk around with my 13 year old as I would make sure we weren't going to have to make a purchase we didn't intend.
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Deleted
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Jul 1, 2024 3:42:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2018 9:45:38 GMT
Unattended to me means that they are not standing right next to me, especially in an antique store.
I can understand the store owner being cautious, better to warn in advance than to have to pick up the pieces afterwards. They've probably experienced breakages in the past.
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Jul 9, 2018 10:03:19 GMT
A 10.5 year old within eyesight of adults = attended. I suppose the owners are a little snippy because people have not attended to their kids in the past. If he had been around a corner or not in eyesight, that might be different, IMO. Agreed. This is one of those situations where you tell your kids to just shake it off, that he wasn't doing anything wrong, the comment wasn't personal, and the owner is just a snippy person. |
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Post by Merge on Jul 9, 2018 11:13:16 GMT
I'm sure the owner has had some bad experiences with kids running amok. Many ten year olds are perfectly fine walking on their own within mom's sight, but some are not, and the store owner probably feels like she has to assume worst case scenario and not best.
I would just let it roll off your back. It's not personal.
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Post by myboysnme on Jul 9, 2018 11:22:13 GMT
I probably would not take my kids into an antique shop unless they themselves have an interest in collecting and we are looking for something. Just browsing to an antique store owner means picking up, touching, handling, knocking things over, probably not actually buying anything just passing time. I would not tell my son to blow it off. I would reinforce why you can't wander off and touch things in antique stores and that probably other kids have broken things.
In many antique stores there is one or two people taking a turn manning the store, and they don't want to be responsible for calling the item's owner and telling them someone broke it.
Unattended child means different things at different ages. If I see a somewhat older child, maybe 8, I look around for a parent. If I see a younger child I stop and wait for a parent to show up. Usually the parent is right there but the kid got away from them. A middle school child, like 12 I would not even pause.
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peabrain
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by peabrain on Jul 9, 2018 12:47:58 GMT
My question is: Did you buy anything? And will you go back?
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ginacivey
Pearl Clutcher
refupea #2 in southeast missouri
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Post by ginacivey on Jul 9, 2018 12:55:48 GMT
In an antique store, or a place with valuables and breakables, it means that you can stop the child's hand reaching out to touch in time. A couple of feet away and something can be broke before you can stop it. From a couple of feet away, you can see what a child is doing, but that just means you watch the breakage happen. It can happen so fast. I used to sell breakable items in cat shows and I saw it time and time again. Child and parent within close proximity and before the adult could say stop, something would be broken. There is no way a stranger can determine what your child might do. Some children are just "touchers" and others do not respond to a spoken "stop" but will continue on to picking up an item and then ask why they cannot touch. Your children sound like you have it all under control and well thought out, but not all children are that way and strangers do not know your children. Of course, it could have been said in a nicer way. Perhaps, they had just seen too much breakage lately. this - within arms reach even well behaved kids have accidents and they make ten year old decisions - sign or no i rarely took mine in places like that because it was stressful worrying and knowing shopkeepers were nervous about it too gina |
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Post by mustlovecats on Jul 9, 2018 12:56:39 GMT
I have one 10yo who could be trusted anywhere in a shop and another who can break things standing still. One I would allow to wander anywhere in a store as long as I knew where and the other I wouldn’t take in an antique store on a bet.
So with one “attended” means I know where she is and she’s within a few aisles of me. The other “attended” probably means leashed or left in the car with her father.
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ginacivey
Pearl Clutcher
refupea #2 in southeast missouri
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Post by ginacivey on Jul 9, 2018 12:58:10 GMT
and the owner is just a snippy person. or tired of kids running amok - (not the OPs but in general) or having to deal with the ramifications of unattended children not everyone is in a bad mood/hateful/a jerk if they make a comment about our children that we don't like gina |
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Post by jenjie on Jul 9, 2018 13:02:54 GMT
In an antique store, or a place with valuables and breakables, it means that you can stop the child's hand reaching out to touch in time. A couple of feet away and something can be broke before you can stop it. From a couple of feet away, you can see what a child is doing, but that just means you watch the breakage happen. It can happen so fast. I used to sell breakable items in cat shows and I saw it time and time again. Child and parent within close proximity and before the adult could say stop, something would be broken. There is no way a stranger can determine what your child might do. Some children are just "touchers" and others do not respond to a spoken "stop" but will continue on to picking up an item and then ask why they cannot touch. Your children sound like you have it all under control and well thought out, but not all children are that way and strangers do not know your children. Of course, it could have been said in a nicer way. Perhaps, they had just seen too much breakage lately. this - within arms reach even well behaved kids have accidents and they make ten year old decisions - sign or no i rarely took mine in places like that because it was stressful worrying and knowing shopkeepers were nervous about it too gina My parents made us wait in the car. Forevvvvver. |
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Loydene
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by Loydene on Jul 9, 2018 13:12:10 GMT
For me - known as a "mean mom" -- you and your son were fine.
I, however, wouldn't have "browsed" in such a store with DS -- too much potential for trouble and at that age his attention span for that sort of browsing was too short. Such a trip, ultimately, wouldn't have been enjoyable for either of us.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
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Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Jul 9, 2018 13:12:58 GMT
By that age when we would go shopping I let my kids my kids go into stores on their own and we had a meeting place. I did ask they stay together. 22 months between my kids. That means at a given point they would of been 10/11 (almost 12). One of the local antique stores sells ice cream cones so yeah by 10 a child should be capable of entering a store and buying something.
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Post by pierkiss on Jul 9, 2018 13:14:26 GMT
I think Under 13 they need to be within arms reach of you.
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Post by *sprout* on Jul 9, 2018 13:30:34 GMT
My dd is roughly the same age as your ds, just a little younger. She's gone to plenty of antique shops and outdoor antique markets with me. She's done everything from being my shadow to several feet away like your ds was. I'm sure there was a time or two I lost visual sight of her for a minute, or a time when she would leave me to go find her grandparents who were shopping with us. My choice to let her do that depends a lot on the contents of the shop (say, lots of furniture vs lots of glassware), the condition of the shop (cluttered walkways vs clear paths), and her attitude at the moment. That kind of thing. I think your ds was just fine.  |
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AnotherPea
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by AnotherPea on Jul 9, 2018 13:33:21 GMT
I can understand the lady's reminder to you and your son. I wouldn't be miffed if I were you and I would encourage my child to forget about the tone but remember to stay close by when fragile things are on the shelves.
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Post by littlemama on Jul 9, 2018 14:06:37 GMT
It means they are standing right next to you and you are aware of what they are doing. A 10.5 year old should always be attended in any store, not because they are bad, but because they tend to be goofy and unconcerned with their environment. I definitely would not tell my child that the clerk was snarky or snippy or whatever. Just that those are the rules of that store and both of you were unaware until she told you.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Jul 9, 2018 14:17:59 GMT
To address your OP, no I would not consider an 8 year old within eye/ear of a parent attended. And while you know their likelihood of breaking things - the shopkeeper doesn’t.
ETA. I’ll also say personally, I don’t think children need to be attended at all times in all stores - it absolutely depends on age and type of store. But an antique store is certainly going to be on the older side.
I’ll also say, having children with significant size differences where the older child is mistaken for the younger - I’m guessing this whole incident is more about him being mistaken for younger than his brother than any store policy.
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freebird
Drama Llama
'cause I'm free as a bird now
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Post by freebird on Jul 9, 2018 14:22:51 GMT
How can children know how to manage themselves in situations publicly if you don't show them how? I would take my kids to antique stores all the time. We talk about touching with your eyes and not with your hands, staying close by, don't roughhouse (they really wouldn't even try that, or running). Ask Mom or Dad before touching and walk with your hands behind your back. Which, I do that in most antique stores to this very day.
My son was making fun of his wife the other day, he says that he took her to Hobby Lobby on a fact finding mission for Christmas. He then proceeds to act like her: Hands behind back, head bent down, slow walking, lifts head, "Oh there's the glue sticks", turns to leave.
wife: "We were mission shoppers" (meaning, they never just went "shopping") lol.
OP, I think your kid was fine, but I think at 10.5 within arms reach or in the same booth would be more acceptable. Granddaughter is almost 14 and she still mostly follows this rule with us.
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Post by melanell on Jul 9, 2018 14:57:11 GMT
My feelings on "unattended" vary by location. I'd give my kid far more leeway in Target than in an antique store, for instance. So for me, in an antique store, I'd keep my kids quite close to me, even if they are typically are good with appropriate store behavior.
As for the situation described by the OP, I think what you were doing was probably just fine for your child, but as many have pointed out, the store owners don't know a well-mannered kid from one who will wind up causing damage so they tend to be overly-cautious. They didn't need to be snippy, though. Not in the first request, anyway. Friendliness typically serves a person better when you're hoping to make a sale.
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Post by Basket1lady on Jul 9, 2018 15:48:22 GMT
How can children know how to manage themselves in situations publicly if you don't show them how? I would take my kids to antique stores all the time. We talk about touching with your eyes and not with your hands, staying close by, don't roughhouse (they really wouldn't even try that, or running). Ask Mom or Dad before touching and walk with your hands behind your back. Which, I do that in most antique stores to this very day. My son was making fun of his wife the other day, he says that he took her to Hobby Lobby on a fact finding mission for Christmas. He then proceeds to act like her: Hands behind back, head bent down, slow walking, lifts head, "Oh there's the glue sticks", turns to leave. wife: " We were mission shoppers" (meaning, they never just went "shopping") lol. OP, I think your kid was fine, but I think at 10.5 within arms reach or in the same booth would be more acceptable. Granddaughter is almost 14 and she still mostly follows this rule with us.  DH calls this Commando Shopping and describes it as "being on a mission." Get in, get out. No unnecessary side trips. 5 minutes tops, including waiting in line. He's not fun to shop with at all! OP, you know the answer to this. The shop person was concerned with all the breakables in the store, your DS was fine because you know him and his shopping skills, and yes, your other DS is concerned with his size. Have you had your DS tested for his growth? My BFF's kids were small when they were young--off the charts small, even through HS. Both kids grew a TON the first year or two of college and are now 5'10" or so. They had the boys hands xrayed when they were preschoolers and from the growth plates, knew they were slow to grow, but the doc said they would be of normal height when they got older. I don't know all the science behind it, but he was right. |
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Post by epeanymous on Jul 9, 2018 15:54:47 GMT
It’s all context-dependent. I have a twelve-year-old, and while I now let him go to Starbucks or a game store by himself entirely, in an antique store with irreplaceable breakables, I’d probably keep him right next to me.
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 9, 2018 16:05:43 GMT
I'm sure the owner has had some bad experiences with kids running amok. Many ten year olds are perfectly fine walking on their own within mom's sight, but some are not, and the store owner probably feels like she has to assume worst case scenario and not best. I would just let it roll off your back. It's not personal. Yup, the store owner is protecting her assets. Many 10.5 year olds are just fine, but some of them are not. I also think that many parents tend to ignore their kids when they get interested in something and the storeowner probably sees that quite often. It wasn't personal, but if it had ticked me off, I wouldn't have purchased anything from that store either. I taught ten year olds and once in a while we would take a field trip somewhere that had a gift shop. We rarely allowed a kid to go into that shop because they all had been raised differently and I didn't want that responsibility. Kids that age do break stuff and once we had a kid steal something. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2018 16:22:49 GMT
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Post by freecharlie on Jul 9, 2018 16:53:16 GMT
Unattended at that age means that you can't see them
A younger child should be closer to the parent.
I would have told the owner, "okay" and left and gone somewhere else shopping l.
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