Deleted
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Sept 30, 2024 19:32:37 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2019 15:39:04 GMT
linkShould she have said what she did? Probably not. But I don’t think she should apologize. And I have to wonder if Matthew here would have written this about a man. What is not helpful to the Democrats are Congresspersons chanting the word “impeach”. They should and need to hold off until there is a strong case to actually impeach trump. An opinion piece by Matthew Dowd.. “Congresswoman should apologize for cursing out Trump, and here's why: OPINION”“I was born on the West side of Detroit; in fact in a house that resides in Congresswoman Rashida Tlaib’s district and I was baptized at Christ the King Church at Six Mile and Grand River Avenue. We moved to Southfield, Michigan, in my youth, and I completely understand and relate to the “chip-on-your-shoulder” grittiness and saltiness of the area. I have retained much of that sentiment, but Congresswoman Tlaib should apologize for her recent comments to a cheering crowd about President Trump: “When your son looks at you and says, ‘Mamma, look you won, bullies don't win,' and I said, 'Baby, they don't,' because we’re gonna go in there and we're gonna impeach the m-----------." Why should she apologize? Here are just a couple of my reasons: First, she should apologize for her language, not necessarily to President Trump. Yes, Trump has said and done much worse things, and has lowered the bar of appropriate discourse in our country. The president has said many things that I would chastise my children for, and would not want them repeating, especially in a public forum of any kind. Republicans, who haven’t criticized the president for his degraded discourse, have no leg to stand on in calling out the congresswoman and need to clean up their own house. Second, from a purely political perspective, her comments aren’t helpful to the Democratic party in bridging divides and accomplishing what I know she wants to accomplish. In order to achieve success in politics, one must bring consensus to get the common good, and this kind of talk goes in the opposite direction of that. If she really wants the Democrats to succeed in Congress, and pass public policy, then her party is going to need the support of people who don’t feel the way she does. She is going to have to be part of building bridges with people who don’t think like her or talk in that way. And to that goal, her language sets her back. Third, as Martin Luther King Jr., who stood strong against injustice, said: “Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.” And I would add vulgarity won’t drive out vulgarity, and bullying won’t drive out bullies. The best way for all of us to make America a more perfect union, and achieve justice and goodness is to act and speak in a manner that patterns the type of country and community we want. And that starts with the words we use for those we oppose. It is easy to respect those who agree with us; showing decency to those who are against us is much harder, and much more important. I understand the anger, and I myself have cursed and used vulgarity in certain moments, especially in political campaigns. However, I really tried never to do this in a public way about any opposing candidate or party. As I said, I was born in Detroit, and have six brothers and four sisters, so I am accustomed to hearing and saying similar things as the Congresswoman. It is just something that should not be done when we are seen as examples for our children and for our fellow citizens. We can fight for what we believe, and push hard against inequity and injustice, but let’s all do it in such a way that diminishes the hate and bitterness, and increases love and compassion. I hope upon reflection that Congresswoman Tlaib realizes her statement will only achieve the opposite of what I am sure her good intentions are.“
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MDscrapaholic
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,585
Location: Down by the bay....
Jun 25, 2014 20:49:07 GMT
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Post by MDscrapaholic on Jan 5, 2019 15:43:23 GMT
She would be the bigger person if she did.
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Post by pierkiss on Jan 5, 2019 15:49:29 GMT
No I don’t think she should apologize.
Why should we hold her and people in her position to a higher standard regarding their public language when the actual president of the United States of america can’t even be bothered to stop his own name calling rants that he engages in publically almost every day?
This is where we are in American politics. Trump led the way with his toxic tweets and rally cries. If it’s ok for him to talk like that about Dems then it’s ok for Dems to talk that way about republicans.
Perhaps on a different day I would feel differently. But today I am feeling prickly and irritated by the state of politics in this country. So a little eye for an eye seems fine to me today.
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Post by mom on Jan 5, 2019 15:54:44 GMT
Do I think she has to apologize? No. Would I have more respect for her if she did? Yeah.
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Deleted
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Sept 30, 2024 19:32:37 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2019 15:56:54 GMT
"“Congresswoman Tlaib was elected to shake up Washington, not continue the status quo,” the statement said. “Donald Trump is completely unfit to serve as president. The congresswoman absolutely believes he needs to be impeached.”" -- Politico
Sound familiar?
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Post by MichyM on Jan 5, 2019 16:01:58 GMT
Do I think she has to apologize? No. Would I have more respect for her if she did? Yeah. Totally agree. Just because Trump is an ass doesn't give her a pass.
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Deleted
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Sept 30, 2024 19:32:37 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2019 16:03:39 GMT
Do you think there would be a call for an apology if a male Congressperson had said it?
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Post by MichyM on Jan 5, 2019 16:09:04 GMT
Do you think there would be a call for an apology if a male Congressperson had said it? I believe there would.
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Post by quinlove on Jan 5, 2019 16:09:08 GMT
Well, she got the attention that she wanted. For the asshole president, new congress, impeachment and herself. This should be interesting.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 30, 2024 19:32:37 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2019 16:11:58 GMT
Oh hell no!
No one would ask a white republican man to apologize. Talk to the mob in a language they understand.
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Post by mustlovecats on Jan 5, 2019 16:14:02 GMT
If she should apologize for one swear word, then I also think Brett K should apologize for how he acted in his hearing.
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Post by 16joy on Jan 5, 2019 16:22:25 GMT
No but I'm more surprised she said that in front of one of her sons. i suppose that's just how she conducts herself and It says a bit about her. I'm assuming we will hear a lot from her since the news tries to shock the viewers.
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Post by mom on Jan 5, 2019 16:22:26 GMT
Do you think there would be a call for an apology if a male Congressperson had said it? I actually don't think there would be a call for a white guy to apologize. But that doesn't mean he shouldn't. The way I see is it is this - the moment anyone stoops to Trumps level, they lose.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Jan 5, 2019 16:22:28 GMT
Do I think she has to apologize? No. Would I have more respect for her if she did? Yeah. Agree.......... Do you think there would be a call for an apology if a male Congressperson had said it? Probably not If she should apologize for one swear word, then I also think Brett K should apologize for how he acted in his hearing. Spot on! ETA: and dt said she disgraced her family.............. But he didn't disgrace his family on the 'Access Hollywood' tape?
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Deleted
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Sept 30, 2024 19:32:37 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2019 16:31:52 GMT
I think this is less about stooping to trump’s level and more about a set of double standards applied to men and women. Especially in politics.
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J u l e e
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,531
Location: Cincinnati
Jun 28, 2014 2:50:47 GMT
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Post by J u l e e on Jan 5, 2019 16:32:29 GMT
I curse (swear, whatever word you use for it). I know the arguments for and against it (especially what other Christian people like to tell me about it) but it just doesn't bother me. Words, combinations of letters, prettied up versions of the word fuck/shit/damn used in the same manner, I really just don't care. Language has different uses situationally, or with regard to intent, or behavior.
However, I hate the word motherfucker. Hate it. I can't see myself ever using it. But I'm also no badass. I don't have it in my personality to take on the shit that is our political climate right now. Or ever. So I do admire the people in there trying got turn things around. In my opinion, this isn't how you do it. But I'm also not on the front lines, so my opinion may not be worth much. I know how I feel about the mess that is our government right now and I'm on my couch at home. I can't imagine how it feels to be in the middle of it and try to get anything positive done.
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Deleted
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Sept 30, 2024 19:32:37 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2019 16:32:45 GMT
I watched Nancy Pelosi take this question last night on Joy Reeds special. I wasn't happy with her answer, although I so agree that focusing on this won't be productive.
Her immediate outburst and statement with the curse in it was wrong for a few reasons. It seems that everyone is focused on the bad language. That, in itself, was in very poor taste for someone who just won a prestigious seat in the House. More than that, IMO, was what she said, as though she is already planning on taking on this job just to "go get him". I disagree with that frame of mind entirely. Her job is to get more classified information and then to see what could be done.
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Post by lucyg on Jan 5, 2019 16:32:51 GMT
I think it was crass and I don’t like it. Also, much as I’d like to see Trump gone, I agree with @fred and Nancy Pelosi that we should wait for the evidence to come in and then see where we stand.
However, the spectacle of Republicans who stay silent over the antics of Donald Trump attacking this Congresswoman for using bad language leaves me completely unwowed. They should go on a hunt for their missing manhood(s) rather than wasting time trying to shut down outspoken women.
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Post by quinlove on Jan 5, 2019 16:36:00 GMT
I curse (swear, whatever word you use for it). I know the arguments for and against it (especially what other Christian people like to tell me about it) but it just doesn't bother me. Words, combinations of letters, prettied up versions of the word fuck/shit/damn used in the same manner, I really just don't care. Language has different uses situationally, or with regard to intent, or behavior. However, I hate the word motherfucker. Hate it. I can't see myself ever using it. But I'm also no badass. I don't have it in my personality to take on the shit that is our political climate right now. Or ever. So I do admire the people in there trying got turn things around. In my opinion, this isn't how you do it. But I'm also not on the front lines, so my opinion may not be worth much. I know how I feel about the mess that is our government right now and I'm on my couch at home. I can't imagine how it feels to be in the middle of it and try to get anything positive done. Well put. I believe she said that particular word for shock value - and it worked.
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sassyangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,456
Jun 26, 2014 23:58:32 GMT
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Post by sassyangel on Jan 5, 2019 16:41:00 GMT
Definitely a learning experience for her.
An apology would definitely make her come off the better person in comparison to Trump, who had said equally worse, and never does. But part of me thinks she was right, and she should simply take it as a learning experience and move on. 😏
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sassyangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,456
Jun 26, 2014 23:58:32 GMT
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Post by sassyangel on Jan 5, 2019 16:45:22 GMT
I think it was crass and I don’t like it. Also, much as I’d like to see Trump gone, I agree with @fred and Nancy Pelosi that we should wait for the evidence to come in and then see where we stand. However, the spectacle of Republicans who stay silent over the antics of Donald Trump attacking this Congresswoman for using bad language leaves me completely unwowed. They should go on a hunt for their missing manhood(s) rather than wasting time trying to shut down outspoken women. I think maybe this is why I can’t get worked up about it. The blatant double standard, and the feeling I have that the roots of it lie not in concerns over congressional professionalism, but in trying to silence outspoken women.
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amom23
Drama Llama
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Jun 27, 2014 12:39:18 GMT
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Post by amom23 on Jan 5, 2019 17:16:56 GMT
Do you think there would be a call for an apology if a male Congressperson had said it?
Nope! She doesn't have to apologize.
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Post by freecharlie on Jan 5, 2019 17:20:23 GMT
I think this is less about stooping to trump’s level and more about a set of double standards applied to men and women. Especially in politics. I disagree. I would find it equally as stupid if a man (of any color) in politics had said it. One phrase can completely detract from a topic, issue, or agenda. I absolutely HATE the argument, "well so and so did/does..." who the hell cares what someone else has done wrong in relation to how you act. IMO, being in Congress a person should have some decorum. Especially in relation to other people in office. She is not acting much better than the person she called the name. I think she set the timing of a possible impeachment back by her comments and that irritates me.
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Post by SockMonkey on Jan 5, 2019 17:22:20 GMT
What? She should give an apology only AFTER that Mar-A-Lago menace apologizes for every time he's sworn, insulted someone in a tweet, said something racist or misogynist. So, exactly fucking never.
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Post by freecharlie on Jan 5, 2019 17:24:44 GMT
FWIW, I think if she apologizes it should be something like
I'm sorry that my choice of language detracted from my historic first day in office. I can only get better from here.
Or something like that.
Also, I do not like the hypocrisy of people who dismissed Trumps language and comments as "locker room talk" and are throwing a fit over this phrase.
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Post by psoccer on Jan 5, 2019 17:27:27 GMT
She is not from my area, but I imagine people voted for her to make a change, for them, in the area that they live in. I haven't followed all what she has said, just that snippet, so maybe she had more to add. Whether she apologizes or not, I hope that she is able to show her voters that she is there for them, and to represent them. If she is in office to impeach Trump, then I imagine the majority of her time will be spent on outing the President, rather than working for the good of her people. Her platform may have been that if she was elected she would work on getting Trump impeached, but I would like to see all leaders use some sort of decorum in speaking with the public.
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Post by SockMonkey on Jan 5, 2019 17:30:22 GMT
Note: It's mostly white men/white women saying she should apologize. And, where were these folks every time Trump was swearing at one of his rallies?
Nah. Keep the tone policing. I love that this freshmen class of Congress people are kicking that door open and coming in like, "We're here" instead of meekly attempting to find mentors in the old white guard. Get 'em.
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Post by canadianscrappergirl on Jan 5, 2019 17:32:07 GMT
No I don't.
I was watching CNN and this was a private celebration party one of the commentators said. Yeah she should have maybe been aware that someone would record it but like the commentator said this wasn't at a public rally like Trump when he said MF.
People would probably have more respect but that would be the only benefit to apologizing.
I also agree that the conversation would be different if it was a male counterpart.
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Post by SockMonkey on Jan 5, 2019 17:32:44 GMT
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janeliz
Drama Llama
I'm the Wiz and nobody beats me.
Posts: 5,641
Jun 26, 2014 14:35:07 GMT
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Post by janeliz on Jan 5, 2019 17:33:18 GMT
No. She should not apologize. Maybe it’s just my personal headspace these days, but this country is in flames right now. We can go back to worrying about being the bigger people after we put the fire out.
And he is a motherfucker.
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