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Post by darkchami on May 10, 2020 22:36:36 GMT
Then 50% is from younger populations, which is as, if not more, troubling, because that means the virus is attacking demographic age groups differently than was initially predicted. They (the experts) have been saying since the early days of the virus that the elderly would be the age group most severely impacted. That led large numbers of people in the USA to blow off the lethality of the virus, thinking that it only killed old people, and, you know, they are expendable. That younger age groups may be equally, or at least significantly, impacted is big news. Half of the deaths in my county are people over 65 (not necessarily from nursing homes, but I do expect a spike, since we recently discovered a nursing home with 100 infections). But yes, the other half have been people aged 18-65. I do not understand the reasoning of “its only old people,” in any case. Whether it is or it isn’t. I also don’t understand the response when people have underlying health conditions. I have 4 underlying health conditions that put me in a high risk group. I can’t even begin to tell you how many times I have read, “Well, they probably would have died in a year anyway.” Please. I have had 3 of those conditions for 20 years. One developed 8 years ago. I work 50 hours a week. We went on vacation and walked over 6 miles a day. To be told that I am a disposable drain on society is insulting. People seem to think an underlying condition means that you are confined to bed waiting to die. It’s so much easier to think that person’s life is worthless than to consider the loss.
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pyccku
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,817
Jun 27, 2014 23:12:07 GMT
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Post by pyccku on May 10, 2020 22:41:34 GMT
Dismissing the high risk groups is a way of self-preservation. Telling yourself that you are safe is easier than dealing with the reality that you might get sick, and you might even die.
It’s no different than telling yourself that if you don’t wear slutty clothes or go to clubs, you don’t need to worry about being raped. Or telling yourself that if you work hard, you won’t be unemployed.
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Post by LuvAgoodPaddle on May 11, 2020 0:07:47 GMT
I don't look at those stats and think - oh it's just old people that are affected who cares. I think as a public health crisis that disproportionately affects older Americans what steps make the most sense to protect those most at risk. Exactly! If we had locked down nursing and long term care facilities and made sure they were protected from this (as done in other countries), then our death count could possibly be half right now. The people in these facilities are generally not out and about in communities, so they were not spreading it. Someone brought it to them and also passed it patient to patient. The Life Care center in WA where this pretty much started had gotten a huge fine the previous year because they didn't follow procedures when the flu went through there. Seems we have some issues in the US with infection control guidelines in these facilities as proven by how bad they were hit by COVID-19.
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Post by lucyg on May 11, 2020 0:11:03 GMT
Update, I gave you guys the wrong data for my county. Because apparently I can’t read. 2/3 of our cases are in people under 65. 2/3 of our deaths are in people over 65, with no distinction between nursing homes or not. Again, I do expect those numbers to go up in the next week or so, since we have a big outbreak at a nursing home.
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Post by LuvAgoodPaddle on May 11, 2020 0:21:22 GMT
2/3 of our deaths are in people over 65, with no distinction between nursing homes or not. Again, I do expect those numbers to go up in the next week or so, since we have a big outbreak at a nursing home. The majority of our new cases and deaths over the past few weeks is because it went through our VA home. 45 residents have tested positive, 6 deaths so far and then 23 employees tested positive.
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Post by dewryce on May 11, 2020 0:25:20 GMT
We seem to be really lucky in our little community. One of the nursing homes tested everyone that worked there and all of the residents. Two nurses were found to have it and quarantined, but no residents tested positive at the time and we don’t think my one else has since the beginning. DH works at another nursing home in our small town, and used to work at the affected facility, so likely would have heard if they were trying to keep things quiet. When I heard about the two positive nurses my heart stopped, we are so very thankful that company decided to test everyone and it hadn’t spread!
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 19, 2024 18:50:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2020 4:12:48 GMT
Rachel Maddow..
”Sioux City Iowa "metro area COVID-19 cases passed 3,000 Friday, an infection rate of 18 residents per 1,000. That gave the metro area the dubious distinction of being the U.S. city with the nation's fastest virus growth rate."
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 19, 2024 18:50:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2020 13:07:18 GMT
Six flaws in the arguments for reopening' Most cases of covid-19 are mild. We can keep older people at home and allow young, healthy people to go back to school and work. Instead of preventing covid-19, we should let people infect each other to achieve herd immunity. Most cases of covid-19 are mild. We can keep older people at home and allow young, healthy people to go back to school and work. People are getting sick and dying from other illnesses in greater numbers than covid-19. We’ve been in lockdown for more than a month and cases aren’t declining; social distancing doesn’t work. We can’t keep the country in lockdown until a vaccine is developed, which could take years. www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/05/10/six-flaws-arguments-reopening/
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Post by FuzzyMutt on May 11, 2020 14:06:11 GMT
What should also be included, not really dying from covid but as a result of it... All the people who die of heart attacks, and other health emergencies, who don’t go to the hospital because they’re scared of getting Covid, cancer patients who can’t treatment or haven’t started treatment because they are just getting diagnosed or not getting diagnosed because they are too scared to go to the hospital, many other people who should be going to ERs for emergency care and who are not because they are scared of going to the hospital and end up dying. My husband is an actuary, he works for a huge company that works with mortality all the time and they are seeing huge shifts in patterns like these. The true numbers, when they say deaths from heart attacks, cancer and diabetes are down, is that more people than usual are dying AT HOME and death certificates just say of natural causes. I worry about those folks, for sure. It's truly a shame that they are allowing fear to keep them from the treatment they need. Especially because in the vast majority of communities it is quite safe to procure care. We've let the media hype this all to hell that rural podunk is as balls to the wall crazy as NYC. And that is criminal. My old NC hospital has had insanely low census rates and that is terrifying because that means that all the things in your first paragraph are totally happening. And there is NO REASON for people on the I40 corridor to be afraid to seek care. The media and the people to scared to function should be ashamed of themselves. Those deaths are horrible. Maybe even preventable. But they are NOT covid deaths. They are fearmonger deaths. Attributable to driving human action with hyperbole.
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Post by FuzzyMutt on May 11, 2020 14:16:35 GMT
I don't look at those stats and think - oh it's just old people that are affected who cares. I think as a public health crisis that disproportionately affects older Americans what steps make the most sense to protect those most at risk. Exactly! If we had locked down nursing and long term care facilities and made sure they were protected from this (as done in other countries), then our death count could possibly be half right now. The people in these facilities are generally not out and about in communities, so they were not spreading it. Someone brought it to them and also passed it patient to patient. The Life Care center in WA where this pretty much started had gotten a huge fine the previous year because they didn't follow procedures when the flu went through there. Seems we have some issues in the US with infection control guidelines in these facilities as proven by how bad they were hit by COVID-19. Here in MA we are seeing the same thing. We utterly failed our elderly and veterans and disabled in group home environments. Part of the reason (in addition to shameful and criminal mismanagement)? Low paying CNA jobs that those places typically employ. Young. Teens in co-ops. We served it up on a platter to those folks. While we aren't protecting our elderly and at risk folks, at least they are doing a great job (I think) of reporting the rate of diagnosis/hospitalization/deaths in these group homes, and it clearly supports that we should have protected them better. Hopefully, going forward there have been better practices put in place.
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Post by FuzzyMutt on May 11, 2020 14:19:21 GMT
Exactly! If we had locked down nursing and long term care facilities and made sure they were protected from this (as done in other countries), then our death count could possibly be half right now. The people in these facilities are generally not out and about in communities, so they were not spreading it. Someone brought it to them and also passed it patient to patient. The Life Care center in WA where this pretty much started had gotten a huge fine the previous year because they didn't follow procedures when the flu went through there. Seems we have some issues in the US with infection control guidelines in these facilities as proven by how bad they were hit by COVID-19. Here in MA we are seeing the same thing. We utterly failed our elderly and veterans and disabled in group home environments. Part of the reason (in addition to shameful and criminal mismanagement)? Low paying CNA jobs that those places typically employ. Young. Teens in co-ops. We served it up on a platter to those folks. While we aren't protecting our elderly and at risk folks, at least they are doing a great job (I think) of reporting the rate of diagnosis/hospitalization/deaths in these group homes, and it clearly supports that we should have protected them better. Hopefully, going forward there have been better practices put in place. *** edited to add... I meant to say better practices put in place for states that aren't international hub/destinations with Biogen conferences that kick started densely populated portion of MA before testing was available. My hope is that states not yet in the thick of it can use what we did terribly wrong, to do it better.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 19, 2024 18:50:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2020 14:34:33 GMT
May 11, 2020
Confirmed cases of the COVID -19 in the US: 1,345,192 Deaths: 80,737
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Post by Darcy Collins on May 11, 2020 14:39:30 GMT
Here in MA we are seeing the same thing. We utterly failed our elderly and veterans and disabled in group home environments. Part of the reason (in addition to shameful and criminal mismanagement)? Low paying CNA jobs that those places typically employ. Young. Teens in co-ops. We served it up on a platter to those folks. While we aren't protecting our elderly and at risk folks, at least they are doing a great job (I think) of reporting the rate of diagnosis/hospitalization/deaths in these group homes, and it clearly supports that we should have protected them better. Hopefully, going forward there have been better practices put in place. *** edited to add... I meant to say better practices put in place for states that aren't international hub/destinations with Biogen conferences that kick started densely populated portion of MA before testing was available. My hope is that states not yet in the thick of it can use what we did terribly wrong, to do it better. My hope is that as we learn more we do more. There was an interesting article a few days ago about the UK and how their response also left those in care facilities vulnerable. www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-britain-elderly-sp/special-report-in-shielding-its-hospitals-from-covid-19-britain-left-many-of-the-weakest-exposed-idUSKBN22H2CRMy state specifically tracks cases and deaths in long term care facilities and has been emphasizing testing everyone. No doubt the unexpected number of asymptomatic people drove the rates higher as too many workers had no idea they were sick and passing it on to the patients.
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Post by LuvAgoodPaddle on May 11, 2020 15:01:02 GMT
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Post by BSnyder on May 11, 2020 21:25:29 GMT
I listened to a podcast recently that interviewed some EMTs and paramedics in NYC. They said the number of heart attack/stroke calls they are going on is unprecedented and for many the family members say the person had been ill with fever, cough, etc. I don't know how they are treating these deaths, but I think it is possible deaths are being undercounted. Of course, that is anecdotal. But if you look at the data plotting average deaths per month and see the spikes since Covid is around - something is causing a huge Delta in deaths from normal. And if it isn't Covid - what is it? Response from healthcare workers seems to be heavily influenced by their location and exposure to Covid. I think we have all seen the posts written by workers in NYC and they are horrifying. The people who seem to be minimizing the danger have not been in the thick of it. And anyone who blows this off saying it is like the flu pretty much instantly loses any credibility in my mind. The flu is serious too and there is a lot we are still learning about Covid, but so far the science and data indicate this is most definitely not "just like the flu". My DD is an EMT in MD and works in the coronary unit in a hospital in DC. Early on she said the medical personnel were seeing the a high number of people having complications because of thickened blood. So thick that they were not able to do blood draws without treating with thinners first, causing other complications. These patients tested positive for covid, were critically ill, but it wasn’t typical cold and pneumonia complications making them so sick. Covid was leading to blockages due to blood thickness causing heart attacks, strokes, liver and kidney failure, and lung complications. Many of their patients are not elderly, think 30s, 40s, and 50s. Their department just recently celebrated several patients pulling through. The thickening of the blood has been reported in some news outlets, but not widely. To this point, I don’t think there has been anything definitive about why some patients are susceptible to this and some are not. So cause of death is not cut and dry in these cases, which was the cause of death? I realize this thread is dying, but I thought I would leave this link for anyone interested. Scientific American: Blood Clot are Mysteriously Linked to Many Coronavirus Problems
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 19, 2024 18:50:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2020 17:01:59 GMT
May 12, 2020
Confirmed cases of COVID- 19 in the US: 1,365,427 Confirmed deaths from COVID -19 in the US: 82,004
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 19, 2024 18:50:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2020 21:55:12 GMT
CNN...
”A key coronavirus model often cited by the White House has again raised its death projection, now predicting 147,000 deaths in the US by August 4 cnn.it/2T0t10L”
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Post by elaine on May 12, 2020 22:17:24 GMT
CNN... ”A key coronavirus model often cited by the White House has again raised its death projection, now predicting 147,000 deaths in the US by August 4 cnn.it/2T0t10L” Huh. Just a month ago Trump et al. were claiming that the death toll would only hit 60,000. Anyone who believes anything that comes out of the White House regarding COVID-19 is a fool. History will not be kind to this administration. All the glaring lies and passing-of-the-buck will be highlighted for posterity. We just watched the American Experience about GW Bush and the film clips of his handling of Katrina showed him to be a bumbling fool. And in comparison, W was a genius compared to how Trump has handled the Coronavirus pandemic.
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Just T
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,544
Jun 26, 2014 1:20:09 GMT
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Post by Just T on May 12, 2020 22:44:03 GMT
Anyone who believes anything that comes out of the White House regarding COVID-19 is a fool. I agree. I am shocked and dismayed by the stuff I see people posting on FB. They believe every word Trump says, but think that Dr. Fauci is behind it all, has a dark side, etc. I can't believe that people believe the crap Trump says while dismissing what the lead epidemiologist for decades has to say. It's mind boggling.
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Post by elaine on May 12, 2020 23:23:27 GMT
Anyone who believes anything that comes out of the White House regarding COVID-19 is a fool. I agree. I am shocked and dismayed by the stuff I see people posting on FB. They believe every word Trump says, but think that Dr. Fauci is behind it all, has a dark side, etc. I can't believe that people believe the crap Trump says while dismissing what the lead epidemiologist for decades has to say. It's mind boggling. It is mind boggling. My only consolation is that history will show Trump for the utter colossal bloated orange failure that he is. And if he doesn’t die before the documentaries come out, he will die a bitter unhappy narcissistic idiot (as opposed to just a narcissistic idiot) because the media will not be kind. I naively believe that, in the long term, truth with prevail.
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Post by kokomo on May 13, 2020 0:14:22 GMT
It all is such a sad state with many unknowns . I am in Ontario . My 95 year old mom has had dementia for 2 years . 3 weeks ago she tested positive for COVID 19 . She showed know signs or symptoms of COVID . It was her dementia that caused her to stop eating and drinking ,not COVID. On her death certificate it stated the cause of death was COVID which is NOT true. I then read a article that stated in the States any patient who dies from COVID the hospital gets paid 1500 dollars from the government . How is that right Is that not fraud. ?We haven’t been able to determine any thing like that in Ontario . They just said because there are so many deaths happening that they automatically say you died of COVID if you where positive
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Post by elaine on May 13, 2020 0:30:31 GMT
It all is such a sad state with many unknowns . I am in Ontario . My 95 year old mom has had dementia for 2 years . 3 weeks ago she tested positive for COVID 19 . She showed know signs or symptoms of COVID . It was her dementia that caused her to stop eating and drinking ,not COVID. On her death certificate it stated the cause of death was COVID which is NOT true. I then read a article that stated in the States any patient who dies from COVID the hospital gets paid 1500 dollars from the government . How is that right Is that not fraud. ?We haven’t been able to determine any thing like that in Ontario . They just said because there are so many deaths happening that they automatically say you died of COVID if you where positive I am so sorry for your loss. So sorry. May her memory be a blessing. I don’t know about Canada, but here in the USA hospitals don’t get paid for COVID patients. Even if they did, $1500 is peanuts - that isn’t even 1 day’s stay in a regular room at a USA hospital for non-COVID issues. COVID isn’t a cash cow, in the USA. Finally, I mean this gently, but your mom had dementia for 2 years, but only stopped eating after contracting COVID. How do you know that she stopped eating solely due to dementia and not due to COVID? Nausea and digestive issues are a symptom in a large number of cases, even though it is primarily a virus that attacks the respiratory system. The experts here in the USA are saying that deaths due to COVID are more likely being under, rather than over, counted.
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used2scrap
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,036
Jan 29, 2016 3:02:55 GMT
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Post by used2scrap on May 13, 2020 0:31:36 GMT
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Post by kokomo on May 13, 2020 2:05:59 GMT
Elaine, thank you for sharing your point of view. Why we think this because her eating issues were a gradual decline over the last 10 months. First she forgot how to chew. She went from a reg diet to puréed food . Then very little puréed food maybe 4 tbsps a day for the last month and then nothing at the end. This decline in eating started way before COVID and then peaked during COVID. So that’s how I came to that conclusion.It was like she forgot how to chew and then forgot how to swallow. Her gag reflex was tested often , so it’s seems little her refusal to eat was not COVID related. Actually, my mom was very active and was known as the “walker” as she never wanted to sit still. Her speech was still audible and in a way articulated ..... she just didn’t make sense when talking
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sassyangel
Drama Llama
Posts: 7,456
Jun 26, 2014 23:58:32 GMT
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Post by sassyangel on May 13, 2020 2:21:06 GMT
It all is such a sad state with many unknowns . I am in Ontario . My 95 year old mom has had dementia for 2 years . 3 weeks ago she tested positive for COVID 19 . She showed know signs or symptoms of COVID . It was her dementia that caused her to stop eating and drinking ,not COVID. On her death certificate it stated the cause of death was COVID which is NOT true. I then read a article that stated in the States any patient who dies from COVID the hospital gets paid 1500 dollars from the government . How is that right Is that not fraud. ?We haven’t been able to determine any thing like that in Ontario . They just said because there are so many deaths happening that they automatically say you died of COVID if you where positive I am not sure where you are getting the $1500 figure from, can you elaborate what paper that was in? I haven’t heard of that. I can tell you a $1500 payment per patient for someone dying of COVID-19 would definitely not be financial payday and worth the risk of fraud. Actually, not even the up to 39k Medicare payment would be worth it. ICU stays are expensive - non complicated ones, I mean. COVID-19 ICU stays are often lengthy and full of complications requiring regular interventions. They’d be doing well to break even on that kind of payment. I’m so sorry about your mom. Dementia took my grandma, and the end of her life was very much like your moms. It’s a really cruel disease too.
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Post by lucyg on May 13, 2020 3:32:30 GMT
Elaine, thank you for sharing your point of view. Why we think this because her eating issues were a gradual decline over the last 10 months. First she forgot how to chew. She went from a reg diet to puréed food . Then very little puréed food maybe 4 tbsps a day for the last month and then nothing at the end. This decline in eating started way before COVID and then peaked during COVID. So that’s how I came to that conclusion.It was like she forgot how to chew and then forgot how to swallow. Her gag reflex was tested often , so it’s seems little her refusal to eat was not COVID related. Actually, my mom was very active and was known as the “walker” as she never wanted to sit still. Her speech was still audible and in a way articulated ..... she just didn’t make sense when talking I’m very sorry about your mom. I lost my dad who had Alzheimer’s years ago, but he had a stroke that killed him. My friend’s mom actually died of the Alzheimer’s and it was so hard to watch. We took a priest over, and she died immediately after he finished giving her the last rites. So I think on some level, she was ready.
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Post by elaine on May 13, 2020 3:41:31 GMT
Elaine, thank you for sharing your point of view. Why we think this because her eating issues were a gradual decline over the last 10 months. First she forgot how to chew. She went from a reg diet to puréed food . Then very little puréed food maybe 4 tbsps a day for the last month and then nothing at the end. This decline in eating started way before COVID and then peaked during COVID. So that’s how I came to that conclusion.It was like she forgot how to chew and then forgot how to swallow. Her gag reflex was tested often , so it’s seems little her refusal to eat was not COVID related. Actually, my mom was very active and was known as the “walker” as she never wanted to sit still. Her speech was still audible and in a way articulated ..... she just didn’t make sense when talking I’m so sorry for your loss, your love for you comes through in your words about her.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 19, 2024 18:50:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2020 5:25:58 GMT
"A leaked unreleased White House coronavirus task force report showing cases spiking in areas across the country has undercut President Donald Trump's claim that cases are declining across the nation. "You know, the numbers are coming down very rapidly all throughout the country, by the way," Trump declared at a Monday news conference. "There may be one exception, but all throughout the country, the numbers are coming down rapidly." This is, of course, not true. Though cases are decreasing in 14 states, they are rising in nine states, according to The New York Times. A lack of widespread testing in 27 other states, plus Washington and Puerto Rico, suggests that cases in those areas are being undercounted. But a leaked coronavirus task force report obtained by NBC News shows that some parts of the country — rural counties in Tennessee and Kansas — have seen cases balloon by more than 1,000% in a matter of one week. Other counties in Missouri, Nebraska, Minnesota and Wisconsin saw increases of more than 400%." www.salon.com/2020/05/12/leaked-white-house-data-shows-infections-spiking-more-than-1000-in-rural-areas-that-backed-trump/
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 19, 2024 18:50:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2020 13:51:03 GMT
May 13, 2020
Confirmed cases of the COVID -19 in the US: 1,369,384 Deaths: 82,386
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SweetieBsMom
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,612
Jun 25, 2014 19:55:12 GMT
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Post by SweetieBsMom on May 13, 2020 15:05:59 GMT
Ok, so an ER nurse on my brother’s FB page is telling me that this is all a bunch of hype and nonsense, and people should go out and live their lives. Supposedly she is treating Covid patients and it’s just not the big deal the media is making it out to be. She says all the healthcare workers she knows feel the same way. She’s in Phoenix, so not exactly the boonies. The numbers in the OP suggest that she’s full of shit. Can any healthcare workers here confirm or deny? I don’t know if we have ER or ICU workers here, but I’d live to hear some first hand opinions. I have several friends working COVID floors in Boston. They have soul crushing stories and they have to pack a bag every time they go to work in case they get held over. That being said, MA is third in cases behind NY & NJ. All the healthcare workers I know are hoping the stay at home is extended.
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