Deleted
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Apr 28, 2024 23:57:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2015 14:27:09 GMT
I agree. I feel badly for them for a myriad of reasons. I wonder how much they know about what is going on. If they aren't allowed to watch TV, they probably only know what their parents tell them. As Josh has proven, they don't necessarily follow the rules. As adults, they know as much as they want to know. Anna could leave if she wanted to, but is choosing to stay.
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amom23
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,329
Jun 27, 2014 12:39:18 GMT
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Post by amom23 on Aug 21, 2015 14:30:07 GMT
I don't necessarily agree with people needing to hit rock bottom, etc. Josh could very well be the type of person who doesn't want "help" and is perfectly happy with his cheating lifestyle. It has nothing to do with religion. Being a religious person has nothing to do with being a good person. You don't need to sit in the front pew every Sunday to have a good moral compass.
My guess is TLC is pleased as punch they axed the TV show now (even if it was a big money maker).
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Post by birukitty on Aug 21, 2015 15:20:17 GMT
Just to clarify nurseypants and birukitty that while I feel sorry for him, I do think that he is a hypocrite, contemptible and needs to stay a safe distance away from his family lest he continue the cycle of abuse. It also seems that he has an OK Cupid account link. Both @dottyscrapper and @mochimochi are probably right that there are more skeletons that will come out of the closet. I have to respond to the above statement, though. I think Christians are usually judged more harshly than others as (it's true) we are generally speaking about good values and staying away from sin. Everyone acts shocked when a Christian does something wrong. We're not Jesus! We're regular people. Think of the pastors of large churches who have been revealed to be adulterers. They were lambasted and immediately fired or resigned. I think people forget that Christians are sinners, just like everyone else. We ALL make mistakes. We are ALL tempted. Christians fall into traps and into dark places just like others. I don't say that as an excuse or a way to receive lighter punishment. It is simply the truth. The vast, vast majority of Christians are good, charitable people. A tiny fraction, like say the Westboro Baptist Church, use the pulpit to preach intolerance. I think the hypocrisy of the Duggars invites harsh judgment. Making a transphobic robocall recording is the biblical equivalent to casting the first stone. I'm sorry if this is confusing but I haven't figured out yet how to quote specific parts of a thread. I'm trying to just quote the top part where LeaP mentions my name (birukitty)-I don't feel sorry for him LeaP! What I was trying to say was that I felt his parents were to blame for not getting him the right treatment when he first came to them confessing the first time he molested his sisters. But that he was to blame for what he has done as an adult. Looking at his photo makes my skin crawl. I too think he's contemptible to say the least. I also think he should be supervised around his children lest he continue the cycle of abuse, and this last instance certainly sounds as though there might be proof as more comes out about what he was up too. If it comes out that he was viewing "kiddie porn" maybe that will be enough to do something to legally protect his children. I hope so, because I honestly think Anna is so brainwashed I don't think she'd even notice-abusers are smart about hiding their abuse, and sometimes poor Anna strikes me as being in a daze. Sadly I think it would take something to happen before the kids could be legally protected. You can't be punished for something you might do. It's beyond frustrating that these poor innocent children have to pay the price. That is who I feel sorry for. 100%! Debbie in MD.
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LeaP
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Posts: 3,939
Location: Los Angeles, CA where 405 meets 101
Jun 26, 2014 23:17:22 GMT
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Post by LeaP on Aug 21, 2015 15:39:56 GMT
I'm sorry if this is confusing but I haven't figured out yet how to quote specific parts of a thread. I'm trying to just quote the top part where LeaP mentions my name (birukitty)-I don't feel sorry for him LeaP! What I was trying to say was that I felt his parents were to blame for not getting him the right treatment when he first came to them confessing the first time he molested his sisters. But that he was to blame for what he has done as an adult. Looking at his photo makes my skin crawl. I too think he's contemptible to say the least. Debbie in MD. birukitty I know you don't feel sorry for him! I'm the one who does. I was trying to agree with all you posted.
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Post by birukitty on Aug 21, 2015 15:51:46 GMT
I'm sorry if this is confusing but I haven't figured out yet how to quote specific parts of a thread. I'm trying to just quote the top part where LeaP mentions my name (birukitty)-I don't feel sorry for him LeaP! What I was trying to say was that I felt his parents were to blame for not getting him the right treatment when he first came to them confessing the first time he molested his sisters. But that he was to blame for what he has done as an adult. Looking at his photo makes my skin crawl. I too think he's contemptible to say the least. Debbie in MD. birukitty I know you don't feel sorry for him! I'm the one who does. I was trying to agree with all you posted. Oh, okay-my mistake, so sorry. Must be lack of sleep. I was up reading last night and couldn't put the book down. Debbie in MD.
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Post by twinks on Aug 21, 2015 15:56:40 GMT
My grandmother always said, "Be careful of those who wear their religion on their sleeves." This has been proven correct many times. This is certainly true about Josh and the Duggars.
My grandmother was a good, Christian, salt-of-the-earth type person but didn't throw her good character or religion at others and hold herself up to others as an example of how one should live their lives. The Duggars certainly wear their religion on their sleeves.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 28, 2024 23:57:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2015 16:03:59 GMT
Where does she go if she initiates divorce? It will be her fault for not forgiving her husband. Who will support her? She grew up in a culture that the man is the head of the household. She has 4 kids under the age of 5. She's stuck. I don't know what religion she/they are, but it's just so hard for me to believe and understand any religion that would expect a woman to forgive, support, and stay with a man that's a child molester. This is just beyond my comprehension. The cheating is nothing compared to what he's done to children. And when the AM story first came out my initial thought was, "of course he's a member, is anyone even surprised?" ***eta***Does the wife have no family? Is there nobody in the church to help her and the children? Does she even want the help? It's my understanding she grew up in the same environment of the quiverful(sp?) movement. She all ready forgave him for being a child molester *before* they were married. I think short of abandonment divorce is not an option.
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luckyexwife
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,067
Jun 25, 2014 21:21:08 GMT
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Post by luckyexwife on Aug 21, 2015 16:52:09 GMT
If he wasn't smart enough to use protection, I wonder if there will be a pregnancy scandal??
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Apr 28, 2024 23:57:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2015 16:52:57 GMT
I don't know what religion she/they are, but it's just so hard for me to believe and understand any religion that would expect a woman to forgive, support, and stay with a man that's a child molester. This is just beyond my comprehension. The cheating is nothing compared to what he's done to children. And when the AM story first came out my initial thought was, "of course he's a member, is anyone even surprised?" ***eta***Does the wife have no family? Is there nobody in the church to help her and the children? Does she even want the help? It's my understanding she grew up in the same environment of the quiverful(sp?) movement. She all ready forgave him for being a child molester *before* they were married. I think short of abandonment divorce is not an option. Thanks for sharing that. I'll have to do some reading on that as I've never heard of it before. As I read more responses, it made me reflect back on my harshness towards the wife. I suppose it's easy for me to sit here and say WTH is wrong with her, when I haven't grown up in an environment where the church/parents/spouse, etc. have these beliefs. I dunno, maybe she really doesn't have a chance at a life without or after him. Or, at the least, doesn't think she has any other options. It definitely doesn't change my disgust towards a religion that would expect a spouse, and in this religion it sounds like, to forgive and support a child molester. I can't, and won't, be able to wrap my head around this.
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Post by RiverIsis on Aug 21, 2015 18:04:09 GMT
Just to clarify nurseypants and birukitty that while I feel sorry for him, I do think that he is a hypocrite, contemptible and needs to stay a safe distance away from his family lest he continue the cycle of abuse. It also seems that he has an OK Cupid account link. Both @dottyscrapper and @mochimochi are probably right that there are more skeletons that will come out of the closet. The vast, vast majority of Christians are good, charitable people. A tiny fraction, like say the Westboro Baptist Church, use the pulpit to preach intolerance. I think the hypocrisy of the Duggars invites harsh judgment. Making a transphobic robocall recording is the biblical equivalent to casting the first stone. I'm sorry if this is confusing but I haven't figured out yet how to quote specific parts of a thread. I'm trying to just quote the top part where LeaP mentions my name (birukitty)-I don't feel sorry for him LeaP! What I was trying to say was that I felt his parents were to blame for not getting him the right treatment when he first came to them confessing the first time he molested his sisters. But that he was to blame for what he has done as an adult. Looking at his photo makes my skin crawl. I too think he's contemptible to say the least. I also think he should be supervised around his children lest he continue the cycle of abuse, and this last instance certainly sounds as though there might be proof as more comes out about what he was up too. If it comes out that he was viewing "kiddie porn" maybe that will be enough to do something to legally protect his children. I hope so, because I honestly think Anna is so brainwashed I don't think she'd even notice-abusers are smart about hiding their abuse, and sometimes poor Anna strikes me as being in a daze. Sadly I think it would take something to happen before the kids could be legally protected. You can't be punished for something you might do. It's beyond frustrating that these poor innocent children have to pay the price. That is who I feel sorry for. 100%! Debbie in MD. I have often remarked about how the whole darn clan looks like they are just vacant upstairs. Clueless, Gormless, a few sandwiches short of a picnic, the light is on but no one is home, elevator doesn't go all the way to the top... I don't care how it is described, it is creepy as hell the vacant look on their faces.
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Post by wholarmor on Aug 21, 2015 18:51:28 GMT
So a bunch of articles coming out now reminding us of Michelle Duggar saying that the woman should be available for her husband to have sex whenever he desires, and Anna putting the blame partially on herself.
I had someone at church say to us once that we should be willing to have sex whenever our spouses wanted. I went home and told my dh that, and he disagreed and said that a guy couldn't blame infidelity on anyone but himself(of course, if there's no sex going on in a marriage, there is a problem somewhere that needs to be looked into).
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tincin
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,368
Jul 25, 2014 4:55:32 GMT
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Post by tincin on Aug 21, 2015 18:54:15 GMT
I just can't tell you how shocked I am by this. No, really, I can't.
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Post by RiverIsis on Aug 21, 2015 19:03:51 GMT
So a bunch of articles coming out now reminding us of Michelle Duggar saying that the woman should be available for her husband to have sex whenever he desires, and Anna putting the blame partially on herself. I had someone at church say to us once that we should be willing to have sex whenever our spouses wanted. I went home and told my dh that, and he disagreed and said that a guy couldn't blame infidelity on anyone but himself(of course, if there's no sex going on in a marriage, there is a problem somewhere that needs to be looked into). I'm pretty certain that Anna isn't getting herself pregnant ( I doubt she would know how), so if he can't be accommodating to her when she is physically in a situation that he has helped create then he is an even bigger arsehole. He should be worshiping the ground she walks on and rubbing her feet and back and making the mother of his children feel like the queen of the world whether he is getting some or not.
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Post by kimpossible on Aug 21, 2015 19:24:49 GMT
My grandmother always said, "Be careful of those who wear their religion on their sleeves." This has been proven correct many times. This is certainly true about Josh and the Duggars. My grandmother was a good, Christian, salt-of-the-earth type person but didn't throw her good character or religion at others and hold herself up to others as an example of how one should live their lives. The Duggars certainly wear their religion on their sleeves. Your grandmother was a very smart woman! I could not agree more about that!
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mallie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,253
Jul 3, 2014 18:13:13 GMT
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Post by mallie on Aug 21, 2015 20:05:03 GMT
I have no doubt that Anna is literally being told it's her fault for not putting out when and how he wanted 100% and or for not reading his mind to know he needed something and then providing it. That cult of theirs is also about controlling and silencing women via the shame and blame game.
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Post by knit.pea on Aug 21, 2015 20:36:10 GMT
I keep coming back to the "we are all human" mistake thing. Thing is, he didn't try to resist. He willingly paid almost $1,000 for TWO years of that site. Two years to have his conscience kick in ... nope. I would not want to raise my four children with that kind of man
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tduby1
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,979
Jun 27, 2014 18:32:45 GMT
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Post by tduby1 on Aug 21, 2015 20:47:52 GMT
So a bunch of articles coming out now reminding us of Michelle Duggar saying that the woman should be available for her husband to have sex whenever he desires, and Anna putting the blame partially on herself. I've read the articles and they are based on a statement from a "source close to the Duggars" that says they think she will take some of the blame herself. I believe it was a statement to People. Other outlets are then taking liberties to adjust the quote to make it sound as if that is already happening. She may or may not do so but I don't think she's taken any definitive stand as of yet.
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Post by JBeans on Aug 21, 2015 20:48:33 GMT
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Post by mommythree on Aug 21, 2015 20:51:58 GMT
I knew there was more to the whole JOSH DUGGAR pedophile scandal.....he is SICK!!! I also think he is deflecting the blame by saying he was addicted to porn and therefore had to cheat on his wife. no, he cheated on his wife because he felt like it, and probably knew he would get away with it. Anna Duggar will be Michelle Duggar in 20 years....20 kids, a year apart, bad hair, bad clothes, wondering what the hell happened to her life? I have no sympathy for any of them...including her, she was aware that her husband was a pedophile before she married him, and went ahead with it anyway, and now has four kids and counting....I feel sorry for her children, they are the true victims.
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Post by SunnySmile on Aug 21, 2015 23:06:48 GMT
I'm going to go out on a limb and saying that I feel sorry for him. He is, or will become, the scapegoat for his whacked out insane parents. When he confessed to inappropriately touching his sisters he did not get the help he needed. Instead his parents signed on to do a reality show and swept everything under the rug. He may be sick, sick, sick but it is his parents life choices that made him that way. Many of the less sanctimonious among us would have sought help for him. I think that Jim Bob and Michelle Duggar are responsible for much if not all of what he is done. I have wondered along these lines too. Do you suppose he developed a preoccupation with sex because their standards of morality are so extreme? Not ever kissing before marriage? Teaching that your body is secret...don't look, don't touch, etc. His parents haven't done him any favors, bringing him up this way, nor in the current problems. I have a hard time feeling sorry for him. He is not mentally ill and not knowing what he is doing. I think he knows good and well what he's doing, and now he got caught. I think it may have all started when he was 14 and younger even, and I agree that his parents should have gotten him real help then, and they did not.
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LeaP
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,939
Location: Los Angeles, CA where 405 meets 101
Jun 26, 2014 23:17:22 GMT
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Post by LeaP on Aug 21, 2015 23:14:18 GMT
I'm going to go out on a limb and saying that I feel sorry for him. He is, or will become, the scapegoat for his whacked out insane parents. When he confessed to inappropriately touching his sisters he did not get the help he needed. Instead his parents signed on to do a reality show and swept everything under the rug. He may be sick, sick, sick but it is his parents life choices that made him that way. Many of the less sanctimonious among us would have sought help for him. I think that Jim Bob and Michelle Duggar are responsible for much if not all of what he is done. I have wondered along these lines too. Do you suppose he developed a preoccupation with sex because their standards of morality are so extreme? Not ever kissing before marriage? Teaching that your body is secret...don't look, don't touch, etc. His parents haven't done him any favors, bringing him up this way, nor in the current problems. I have a hard time feeling sorry for him. He is not mentally ill and not knowing what he is doing. I think he knows good and well what he's doing, and now he got caught. I think it may have all started when he was 14 and younger even, and I agree that his parents should have gotten him real help then, and they did not. If I were a betting man, I would bet he was molested. If I were a reporter that is the first question I would ask him.
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Post by SunnySmile on Aug 21, 2015 23:41:26 GMT
@skellinton The Duggars are not Mormon. Mormon women ARE encouraged to be educated and self-sufficient, the opposite of what you said.
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Post by Skellinton on Aug 22, 2015 1:07:10 GMT
@skellinton The Duggars are not Mormon. Mormon women ARE encouraged to be educated and self-sufficient, the opposite of what you said. I apologize, I thought they were Mormon, I have no idea why, but I have always thought that (I have never seen their show though). The Mormon families I know though the women all stay home and raise the passel of children. I don't know any that work outside of home or have anything other than a high school education. Obviously if I was thinking I would realize that obviously BYU is not an all male school. I don't know very many Mormon families and most of them are related, so they must be the exception as the women act very subservient to the men, much like the Duggars. I do apologize for my misunderstanding. I do maintain what ever religion the Duggars are they are raised the subservient to the men and Anna was pretty much brainwashed since birth, so it is hard not to have some sympathy for her. I wish she could be deprogrammed and get her kids out of harm's way.
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Post by kelbel827 on Aug 22, 2015 2:00:15 GMT
I agree that he's got big issues. Is he a sexual predator? Maybe, for molesting his sisters and church girls. This is in no way saying what he did was OK. It's not. I blame his family and their crazy beliefs. He's a 14 year old boy with raging hormones. Normal 14 year old boys have ways of dealing with them. They have girlfriends and boyfriends, there is the internet, and porn, and VS catalogs. He had monitored internet, if any when he was 14. He had a somewhat arranged marriage. He couldn't date. He had to side hug. He had to have chaperoned dates. He didn't have his own room. He shared with a ton of siblings. He was brought up thinking that women are wives, and that his own family dressed very modestly to not give the boys sexual thoughts. Really, I can't imagine, even if my brother or sister were walking around naked, that I would be in to them. I don't get sexual thoughts off of my siblings I can only imagine that he thought his only way to get a little action was to molest them. At 14, though, you should know that touching your sisters is off limits.
He was not brought up normally. Whose to say the other boys are "normal".
Ugh...Maybe if he were brought up normally, understanding that his sexual feelings are normal, he wouldn't have molested multiple girls.
As for the accounts on AM and the cheating, people cheat. Does that make him a sexual predator? Nope. Is it the right thing to do, hell no. does it make him a porn addict? Nope. Almost seems like he's trying to make up for his upbringing. Hell, his first kiss was on his wedding day.
I hate how hypocritical this whole family is. Maybe if they stopped worrying about their Christian beliefs, and started worrying about their children, things might be different. If they don't believe in gay marriage, they shouldn't marry the same sex. They should keep their mouths shut and stop preaching their interpretation of Christianity to others.
So while I blame him for his actions, his family is just as much to blame. And his wife is creepy and I feel really sorry for her and their kids.
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Post by doesitmatter on Aug 22, 2015 2:13:41 GMT
This so isn't about religion. It's irritating to hear religions beaing bashed and blamed.
It's about a troubled man, a pedophile, or at the very least a sexual deviant imho.
I think he was on AM because he isn't fulfilled by his wife. He doesn't realize that he can't be fulfilled in an adult relationship and so he went to affairs, to meet his needs, but even that won't satisfy him if he truly is a pedophile...
I don't know exactly what his issues are, but he needs treatment and children need to be protected from him.
I am sad for Anna. I am sad for his siblings.
But it is not the fault of Christianity (or Mormonism as is now being brought up?)
I could care less about his affair or all fo the cheater's being outed, they put themselves in this position. I do feel for the families ..wives and children of the cheaters.
I do care the JD has assaulted children in the past - that is the real problem here.
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Post by Skellinton on Aug 22, 2015 3:14:32 GMT
This so isn't about religion. It's irritating to hear religions beaing bashed and blamed. It's about a troubled man, a pedophile, or at the very least a sexual deviant imho. I think he was on AM because he isn't fulfilled by his wife. He doesn't realize that he can't be fulfilled in an adult relationship and so he went to affairs, to meet his needs, but even that won't satisfy him if he truly is a pedophile... I don't know exactly what his issues are, but he needs treatment and children need to be protected from him. I am sad for Anna. I am sad for his siblings. But it is not the fault of Christianity (or Mormonism as is now being brought up?) I could care less about his affair or all fo the cheater's being outed, they put themselves in this position. I do feel for the families ..wives and children of the cheaters. I do care the JD has assaulted children in the past - that is the real problem here. I am not blaming what I thought was Mormonism for Josh's behavior, I was blaming what I thought was Mormonism for Anna not leaving. I still don't know what religion they are (quiverful I think is what I read here), but I think her religion has brainwashed her into thinking she can't leave him. She has no viable way to support herself, let alone 4 children. She probably doesn't have the self esteem to leave due to her religious upbringing. I also don't think she would have any famial support if she did leave. That I blame on their religion. I don't know if your post is directed at me or not, but since I brought up Mormonism (wrongly), I wanted to clarify that I don't think his religion has anything to do with his molesting his sisters or his cheater pants ways.
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raindancer
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,095
Jun 26, 2014 20:10:29 GMT
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Post by raindancer on Aug 22, 2015 4:04:29 GMT
This so isn't about religion. It's irritating to hear religions beaing bashed and blamed. It's about a troubled man, a pedophile, or at the very least a sexual deviant imho. I think he was on AM because he isn't fulfilled by his wife. He doesn't realize that he can't be fulfilled in an adult relationship and so he went to affairs, to meet his needs, but even that won't satisfy him if he truly is a pedophile... I don't know exactly what his issues are, but he needs treatment and children need to be protected from him. I am sad for Anna. I am sad for his siblings. But it is not the fault of Christianity (or Mormonism as is now being brought up?) I could care less about his affair or all fo the cheater's being outed, they put themselves in this position. I do feel for the families ..wives and children of the cheaters. I do care the JD has assaulted children in the past - that is the real problem here. If you don't think their religion plays a BIG fat role in this, then I've got some ocean front property in Arizona for you.
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Post by anonrefugee on Aug 22, 2015 4:11:11 GMT
@skellinton The Duggars are not Mormon. Mormon women ARE encouraged to be educated and self-sufficient, the opposite of what you said. As are MOST Christian women. Just because these people had a tv show does not mean they represent the majority or norm. Given that reality shows like to feature that outliers among us that shouldn't be hard to figure out.
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Post by RiverIsis on Aug 22, 2015 4:35:36 GMT
I don't think religion has anything to do with this. I do think the Duggar version of religion and their house being their church etc has everything to do with this. It absolutely facilitated his thinking that as a male he is entitled to sex on demand. That is the basis of their religion, that God makes them horny and they have to obey. That definitely gives a warped impression of an adult relationship.
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Post by circusjohnson on Aug 22, 2015 5:13:12 GMT
I know this is off topic, but I am a Mormon and I have a Bachelor degree. Almost every Mormon women I know has a degree, many have masters and a few have a phd. I did stay home for years to raise my passel of kids, but I do hold a job now. I know many who hold jobs and have careers. The subservient to men comment had my DH rolling on the floor. He wishes! Tina
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