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Post by Merge on May 21, 2019 18:57:17 GMT
Quick addendum as I've got work to do. Looking back for the article that prompted this post yesterday, it appears that I conflated the title I posted here (which was from the ABC13 video bit) with this long-form piece from NPR. The mom expresses the same sentiments in the NPR interview, namely: NPR article(I do apologize for not "bringing the receipts" yesterday when I first posted. I was reading a lot of news during a break and, TBH, had initially typed out a tweet in response to the article, but it occurred to me that the mom might see it, and I didn't want to create any drama for her. So I brought my comment here instead.) In the channel 13 video, it sounds to me as if the part about the lord choosing to save her was edited out for time after the printed transcript of the piece was created and posted. I don't have any reason to think that those words were made up in the transcript, especially given the mom's similar sentiment quoted in the NPR article. And again - my issue is not so much with the mom as with the particular religious culture that prompts this kind of talk. __________ This is the title of a news article covering the one year anniversary of the Santa Fe High School shooting; it's a direct quote from the mother of one of the survivors. I admit it rubs me the wrong way. I wonder how it feels to read that if you're the parent of one of the kids who didn't survive. I wouldn't speak out on this or say anything to the mom, but I do wish people would choose their words more carefully. I think it's pretty presumptuous to state that "the Lord" "saved" your child, when the implication is that he chose not to save others. I'm interested to know how others feel. |
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on May 21, 2019 18:59:00 GMT
I think it is insensitive to the other parents. Like her child was a chosen one, and the rest are not.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on May 21, 2019 19:00:40 GMT
Comments like that are one of my biggest pet peeves when it comes to Christianity, and honestly it makes me question religion even more. I often hear people credit prayer and God for "saving" or "blessing" they or their family member. So, if someone does die, does that mean that they didn't pray hard enough? Or that God didn't care enough about them?
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huskergal
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by huskergal on May 21, 2019 19:02:05 GMT
It is just as wrong as saying "so and so died for a reason".
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Post by Butterfly Momma on May 21, 2019 19:05:05 GMT
The further I remove myself from organized religion, the more I see the absolute self-centeredness behind statements like this, cloaked in the packaging of religion. It is a horrible thing to believe, never mind say.
Having been enveloped in a restrictive religious environment, in my past, I shudder to think about the times that I said similar hurtful things ... that mindset is engraved in some religious groups. That they are more superior, in every way, because they have God "on their side".
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inkedup
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,837
Jun 26, 2014 5:00:26 GMT
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Post by inkedup on May 21, 2019 19:07:38 GMT
I 100% agree with you.
And I never understood the idea of God saving certain people from something it could have prevented in the first place.
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pilcas
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,913
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Post by pilcas on May 21, 2019 19:12:25 GMT
I agree 100%. That and when someone’s child dies and they say God has a plan. Or that God wants a little angel.
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cherivall
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by cherivall on May 21, 2019 19:13:34 GMT
I think it is insensitive to the other parents. Like her child was a chosen one, and the rest are not. THIS 1000000000000000% |
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Deleted
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May 2, 2024 17:43:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2019 19:13:35 GMT
It is just as horrific as the cartoon that goes around after ever school shooting. Oh lord, why didn’t you stop this? Because I am not allowed in there.
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Post by Pahina722 on May 21, 2019 19:15:01 GMT
I 100% agree with you. And I never understood the idea of God saving certain people from something it could have prevented in the first place. Exactly! If this being is all powerful, it could have prevented the awful tragedy. And I don’t want hear any BS about how it’s all part of God’s plan, or God’s understanding is beyond our comprehension. That’s yet another way of saying, “Poof! It’s magic, and my sky-fairy is the bestest one out there. So there!” |
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Post by gar on May 21, 2019 19:18:17 GMT
😡
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Post by Linda on May 21, 2019 19:21:16 GMT
I think it's insensitive to say - given that others didn't survive but I imagine it's her parents way of making sense of what is a senseless tragedy.
[and no, I don't believe that God reaches out and saves this one and not that one. I believe that he gave us free will which combined with original sin means some people make very bad choices that hurt others - yes, he could prevent that but that would mean us losing our free will]
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sharlag
Drama Llama
I like my artsy with a little bit of fartsy.
Posts: 6,574
Location: Kansas
Jun 26, 2014 12:57:48 GMT
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Post by sharlag on May 21, 2019 19:21:18 GMT
I think a parent in this situation is sort of excused for the trite and offensive statement. The newspaper using it as a headline—. BAD JUDGEMENT.
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johnnysmom
Drama Llama
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Jun 25, 2014 21:16:33 GMT
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Post by johnnysmom on May 21, 2019 19:22:44 GMT
ITA with you, it rubs me the wrong way. It's as if the others weren't "worthy" of being saved.
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ginacivey
Pearl Clutcher
refupea #2 in southeast missouri
Posts: 4,685
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Post by ginacivey on May 21, 2019 19:23:10 GMT
Comments like that are one of my biggest pet peeves when it comes to Christianity, and honestly it makes me question religion even more. I often hear people credit prayer and God for "saving" or "blessing" they or their family member. So, if someone does die, does that mean that they didn't pray hard enough? Or that God didn't care enough about them? this is exactly how i feel and that if things don't go 'your way' you just didn't pray hard enough gina |
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Post by gar on May 21, 2019 19:25:01 GMT
[and no, I don't believe that God reaches out and saves this one and not that one. I believe that he gave us free will which combined with original sin means some people make very bad choices that hurt others - yes, he could prevent that but that would mean us losing our free will] So good things are god’s doing, bad things are nothing to do with him? |
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Post by leftturnonly on May 21, 2019 19:25:11 GMT
I'm interested to know how others feel. I think it's a very unfortunate way to express her feelings. I'm also not sure that there is a way for a person to express their gratitude without other people reading things into it that are not implied. #Lessons Learned at the Vegetable Board. |
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Post by leftturnonly on May 21, 2019 19:31:40 GMT
So, if someone does die, does that mean that they didn't pray hard enough? Or that God didn't care enough about them? Maybe if a person that is saved went on to live forever and never die. That doesn't happen, though. We all die. Just shoots this particular way of thinking to smithereens for me. |
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 2, 2024 17:43:29 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2019 19:35:32 GMT
Sometimes being the one surviving victim is not actually a gift. She’s entitled to her worldview though.
Grief is a horrible state. I give grieving people a pass when they say things I seem less than brilliant. Hurt clouds ones capacity.
When Christian people say things like “god has another angel now” I have to work really hard not to roll my eyes. There’s absolutely nothing in scripture to indicate that people become angels after life. But whatever.
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Post by canadianscrappergirl on May 21, 2019 19:36:54 GMT
Not cool and very insensitive!
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Post by Darcy Collins on May 21, 2019 19:37:45 GMT
I'm agnostic, and often don't really understand people's faith. I recently attended a funeral for a young person and was utterly dumbstruck by his father. He had a deep, deep faith and somehow was able to reconcile the loss of his only son within his faith and truly felt comfort from his religion. I don't understand it - and frankly haven't felt it when dealing with my own tragedy. I agree with a previous poster that while insensitive, she too is dealing with a lot. Survivors guilt is a real thing and perhaps she takes comfort in thinking there's a plan. I think projecting her comments to mean that others aren't worthy isn't fair.
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Post by hdoublej on May 21, 2019 19:38:06 GMT
I think it's insensitive to say - given that others didn't survive but I imagine it's her parents way of making sense of what is a senseless tragedy. [and no, I don't believe that God reaches out and saves this one and not that one. I believe that he gave us free will which combined with original sin means some people make very bad choices that hurt others - yes, he could prevent that but that would mean us losing our free will] I think a parent in this situation is sort of excused for the trite and offensive statement. The newspaper using it as a headline—. BAD JUDGEMENT. I have to agree with both of these quotes. I can't judge someone who has had a family member who has been through something so terrible and includes dealing with things like survivor's guilt. I just can't imagine how you cope with something like this and I feel like they get a pass from me on judging how they are coping. Now, the newspaper, that's a different story. I'm so tired of media grabbing up quotes like this! Completely bad judgement on their part! |
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Post by Linda on May 21, 2019 19:38:39 GMT
[and no, I don't believe that God reaches out and saves this one and not that one. I believe that he gave us free will which combined with original sin means some people make very bad choices that hurt others - yes, he could prevent that but that would mean us losing our free will] So good things are god’s doing, bad things are nothing to do with him? that's not exactly what I said (or at least, not exactly what I intended to say)....in MY worldview (and everyone is entitled to their own), God set the world in play (creation) and gave us free will to make good choices or bad choices. Bad choices have consequences - in this world and in the next (I believe in heaven, hell, AND purgatory but also in God's loving mercy and forgiveness). I don't believe that a murderer is so because God made him so -I believe that he exercised his free will and chose to murder. I don't believe that a good person is innately good because God made him so -I believe he exercised his free will and chose to do good. We all have the ability to make good choices but due to original sin, we all also have the ability to make bad ones - which we choose is dependent on our free will. [disclaimer - my personal beliefs and not necessarily those of the religion I follow - I'm not a theologian] |
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Post by shevy on May 21, 2019 19:42:05 GMT
I'm going to take this one farther. I HATE when someone says that she/he lost their battle with cancer/leukemia/Alzheimers. No one loses anything but a life. It makes it sound like they didn't fight hard enough, when likely they were fighting with everything.
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Post by Merge on May 21, 2019 19:43:25 GMT
I think a parent in this situation is sort of excused for the trite and offensive statement. The newspaper using it as a headline—. BAD JUDGEMENT. No, and as I said - if this sentiment was said out loud to me by a grieving person I would say nothing. I know very well how grief affects people, and I'm not about to make someone feel worse. I think my issue is more with the worldview/religious view that makes this way of thinking such a common one. I get irritated with people's need to find meaning where there was none, which seems to me to perpetuate the line of thinking that one was "saved" or "blessed" while another was not. And yes; unfortunately the particular media outlet in this case has a history of poor judgment with headlines. |
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Post by leftturnonly on May 21, 2019 19:46:03 GMT
The further I remove myself from organized religion, the more I see the absolute self-centeredness behind statements like this, cloaked in the packaging of religion. It is a horrible thing to believe, never mind say. Having been enveloped in a restrictive religious environment, in my past, I shudder to think about the times that I said similar hurtful things ... that mindset is engraved in some religious groups. That they are more superior, in every way, because they have God "on their side". I agree with you. I was raised in a non-restrictive religious environment. No one was considered superior to another. I was taught it was my choice whether or not to be on God's side, not so much that God was on my side. That's too vain-glorious. Because of this, I hear or see the same phrases completely differently than many of y'all. I don't make the same assumptions that y'all seem to make. I'm much more inclined to allow people to express things the best way that they know how and try to listen to what they are really trying to say without judgment. One thing that I find troubling is just how is someone to express their joy, their gratitude, their own selfish happiness that their child was spared without pissing everybody else off? Because believe you me, that's an ingrained human emotion that needs to be expressed somehow. |
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Post by Zee on May 21, 2019 19:46:06 GMT
That sure was nice of the Lord.
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Post by monklady123 on May 21, 2019 19:47:19 GMT
Comments like that are one of my biggest pet peeves when it comes to Christianity, and honestly it makes me question religion even more. I often hear people credit prayer and God for "saving" or "blessing" they or their family member. So, if someone does die, does that mean that they didn't pray hard enough? Or that God didn't care enough about them? And, one thing that annoys me is when people paint all Christianity with the same brush. Don't by annoyed at all of Christianity because of the beliefs of *some* Christians. This type of Christianity that's expressed by this sentiment (as well as others) is not anything that my particular church, or much of my denomination, believes. So you really should do some more research, if you care to find out differences I mean. Of course it is much easier just to brush it all off, and of course that is your prerogative...  |
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Post by Merge on May 21, 2019 19:48:01 GMT
I'm agnostic, and often don't really understand people's faith. I recently attended a funeral for a young person and was utterly dumbstruck by his father. He had a deep, deep faith and somehow was able to reconcile the loss of his only son within his faith and truly felt comfort from his religion. I don't understand it - and frankly haven't felt it when dealing with my own tragedy. I agree with a previous poster that while insensitive, she too is dealing with a lot. Survivors guilt is a real thing and perhaps she takes comfort in thinking there's a plan. I think projecting her comments to mean that others aren't worthy isn't fair. I don't think she meant to say that others weren't worthy of being saved. I think that is one potential interpretation that parents of victims who died might take, and I think that people in the right frame of mind to do so should choose their words more carefully. And I totally agree that the newspaper should never have made that their headline. My overall issue is with the belief system that teaches that some are "blessed" or "saved" and others are not. To me that's what results in comments like the one here. |
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Post by mikklynn on May 21, 2019 19:50:57 GMT
I think a parent in this situation is sort of excused for the trite and offensive statement. The newspaper using it as a headline—. BAD JUDGEMENT. Perfect distinction. |
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