jennamama
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Posts: 114
Jul 13, 2018 18:42:10 GMT
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Post by jennamama on Jul 1, 2019 18:48:53 GMT
Sidenote - NOT A POLITICAL DEBATE.
My kids (12 and 14) were with my in-laws this weekend ( I was not there). Apparently, talk turned to politics and my 12 year old questioned them why they "didn't like" Hillary Clinton. They proceeded to tell him she kills babies, etc. FYI - he had no idea what abortion was before this. They also felt free to share their political views on immigration and other conservative views. Talk went on and on at length about hot button topics but I don't want to spark debate here.
To be clear, I don't agree with ANY of these views - AT ALL. And I am absolutely LIVID they felt this was appropriate. I knew we differed politically but would never guess they would talk to my child like this. My daughter knows better - my son was left confused and doesn't know what to think.
How should I handle this? I am going to have a very hard time getting over this and I am sick to my stomach. I'm otherwise close to my husband's family and they have been there for us in good and bad times. As I said, I'm really sick they chose to do this.
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Post by mom on Jul 1, 2019 18:52:15 GMT
The only way I would handle this is to discuss what *I* believe with my kids. The reality is, your kids are old enough to start hearing different opinions than yours. But as a parent, you can try and guide them and explain why YOU feel differently than person xyz. I would totally use this as a learning experience for your kids.
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Post by Merge on Jul 1, 2019 18:53:39 GMT
Sidenote - NOT A POLITICAL DEBATE. My kids (12 and 14) were with my in-laws this weekend ( I was not there). Apparently, talk turned to politics and my 12 year old questioned them why they "didn't like" Hillary Clinton. They proceeded to tell him she kills babies, etc. FYI - he had no idea what abortion was before this. They also felt free to share their political views on immigration and other conservative views. Talk went on and on at length about hot button topics but I don't want to spark debate here. To be clear, I don't agree with ANY of these views - AT ALL. And I am absolutely LIVID they felt this was appropriate. I knew we differed politically but would never guess they would talk to my child like this. My daughter knows better - my son was left confused and doesn't know what to think. How should I handle this? I am going to have a very hard time getting over this and I am sick to my stomach. I'm otherwise close to my husband's family and they have been there for us in good and bad times. As I said, I'm really sick they chose to do this. I would also be livid. Since you otherwise have a good relationship with them, though, it might be best to have a private conversation asking that they no longer discuss political issues with your kids, out of respect for your differing views. Hopefully they are reasonable people and will respect your wishes on this. If not, you may need to limit the time your kids spend with them unattended, at least until they’re older. |
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seaexplore
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Apr 25, 2015 23:57:30 GMT
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Post by seaexplore on Jul 1, 2019 18:54:53 GMT
Deep breath.....
First of all, at 12 and 14 a kiddo should have a basic knowledge of what an abortion is, we discuss it as the termination of a pregnancy in my 7th grade family life class. NOT gory details but basics.
Now, this is a great learning experience for your kids. They have gotten to see a differing political view from yours. Perfect opportunity for you to sit down with the kids and talk about what was said and what your views are. Kids may not always agree with their parents political views but it helps if they see both sides and can collect knowledge to make their own decisions. In 4 more years, your 14 year old will be voting and in 6 more years, your 12 year old will be voting. Never too young to talk about the basics of politics and figuring out fact from fiction and scare tactics. Good lesson on how to vet out good information for both parties. Go online with them, search up some of the topics that were discussed- find information on both sides of the event.
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Post by lisacharlotte on Jul 1, 2019 19:01:42 GMT
I’m with mom in this one. They should be exposed to other views and you can discuss why you disagree or agree. Also, your children are not clones of you, one day you may be surprised to find out they have different opinions that you don’t agree with. if you’ve modeled how to discuss differences with civility you can agree to disagree as adults.
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Post by gar on Jul 1, 2019 19:02:12 GMT
I think I would talk (calmly and nicely) to in laws and say that while differences of opinion are fine and normal, the things they told him were ‘too much too soon’ and included some things you haven’t talked about with him yet which have left him unsettled. Ask that they refrain from that subject if they don’t feel they can keep lighter in tone.
ETA - definitely a teaching/ discussion moment with your kids too.
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freebird
Drama Llama
'cause I'm free as a bird now
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Post by freebird on Jul 1, 2019 19:02:55 GMT
I guess it's probably a good thing that kids learn that there's two sides to every debate and it's ok to hear the other side and their opinion. All you can do is explain why you don't agree with grandma and grandpa about it. It's nothing to to "get sick" about. Someone doesn't agree with you. That doesn't mean they "turned" your kid against what you believe. They have a right to decide what they believe in no?
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Post by disneypal on Jul 1, 2019 19:04:31 GMT
How should I handle this? I would tell them that in the future, if your kids ask them about politics for them to please kindly reply with..."we don't think we should discuss politics with you until you are older" Just explain that they are too young to really understand and you'd rather them not get involved with politics at their again. |
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pilcas
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by pilcas on Jul 1, 2019 19:07:33 GMT
As others have said, use this as a discussion starter. Tell your kids your point of view. Next have a conversation with your in laws as to how you feel about their actions.
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moodyblue
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Jun 26, 2014 21:07:23 GMT
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Post by moodyblue on Jul 1, 2019 19:31:24 GMT
I think your kids are absolutely old enough to understand differing opinions, and why some people believe one thing and others believe differently. This is a teachable moment - you can present your counter beliefs and explain them and why you feel the way you do. And you can talk about how to handle family members who have opposing beliefs - and they need to know this because those family members aren’t going away. They are also likely to have friends, and parents of friends, who have opinions unlike yours. Unless you keep them in a bubble, they are going to meet lots of people with varying beliefs and experiences, and hear those opinions. They are at an age to discuss and learn. No benefit to waiting until they are voting age!
I am also a little surprised a 12-year-old would not already know generally what an abortion is.
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mlana
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Post by mlana on Jul 1, 2019 19:31:45 GMT
Deep breath..... First of all, at 12 and 14 a kiddo should have a basic knowledge of what an abortion is, we discuss it as the termination of a pregnancy in my 7th grade family life class. NOT gory details but basics. Now, this is a great learning experience for your kids. They have gotten to see a differing political view from yours. Perfect opportunity for you to sit down with the kids and talk about what was said and what your views are. Kids may not always agree with their parents political views but it helps if they see both sides and can collect knowledge to make their own decisions. In 4 more years, your 14 year old will be voting and in 6 more years, your 12 year old will be voting. Never too young to talk about the basics of politics and figuring out fact from fiction and scare tactics. Good lesson on how to vet out good information for both parties. Go online with them, search up some of the topics that were discussed- find information on both sides of the event. Well before they were 12 I'd had conversations with my kids regarding the hot topics of the day. AIDS, homosexuality, sexuality in general, racism, etc, were regularly discussed in our house. We also discussed how there were people, namely the Grands, who believed differently than we did and how this was ok. We spoke about treating other people's opinions with respect while not adopting them as our own. As part of homeschooling the kids, I taught them to ask someone who held a different opinion to cite their sources so we could do research on the different view. This is also the time I taught them to evaluate a source for worthiness. My family still laughs at the time my dad got started on a ant about something and my DD, who was about 6 at the time and had been listening to her brother's lessons, piped up "Cite your sources, Papa, cite your sources" Apparently it's really hard to rant when you're laughing as hard as my dad was. It doesn't sound like your folks intended to lecture your kids - your son asked a question and your parents answered it honestly, according to their view. The rest of the conversation just went from there and they probably didn't think about your son's age since he started the original conversation. I might have a conversation with them regarding how detailed they were, if you feel they were too graphic, but I wouldn't go beyond that. Honestly, I feel like this is on you. You already knew about their differing views, so why had you not thought to have some conversations with your son about how to handle this? He obviously knew their views differed from your and he was comfortable asking them why. How do you think they should have answered? Do you think they should have told a 12 yo to 'ask his mama'? Take this as a teaching moment and teach him how to respectfully ask questions. Teach him when to respectfully disagree. Teach him how to continue to see good things in people even when you have a different opinion. There is no reason to be sick over this - look at it as now you know an area of knowledge that you need to work on with your kids and go from there. My dad dearly loves to debate the day's topics with my kids and they love it, too. We are about as far apart on the political spectrum as you can get, but they still enjoy the debate. Any time someone throws out a number, every one yells 'Cite your source!' and we all crack up. Marcy |
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Post by busy on Jul 1, 2019 19:46:34 GMT
I'm on your side politically, but I disagree that kids should only be exposed to parents' viewpoints. I don't want my son to believe what we do because he doesn't know any other viewpoint. I want him to decide what he believes for himself because he's well-informed, which includes exposure to a variety of opinions. Believing something because it's the only thing you know isn't a belief of any depth.
Nothing of what you said here sounds age-inappropriate. I think kids that age should be able to have a reasonable conversation on any of the topics you mentioned.
For the record, my son is 11 and has been aware for the concept of abortion for at least 2 or 3 years. I think a 12 year old should know what it is.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Jul 1, 2019 19:50:48 GMT
I think you should keep in mind that your child initiated the conversation - clearly they were interested in their viewpoints. I would certainly use it as a jumping off point for discussing things more thoroughly. And really emphasize how to research and learn about different issues - instead of relying upon others opinions. If there was specific inflammatory language that was used that you have issue with, I would address that specifically. I'd say it's pretty typical for those 12+ to start really being aware of the issues around them and to start to form their own opinions. Mine are only a bit older and they have some opinions that I don't agree with - interestingly some more liberal and some more conservative.
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jennamama
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Jul 13, 2018 18:42:10 GMT
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Post by jennamama on Jul 1, 2019 20:02:47 GMT
I'm on your side politically, but I disagree that kids should only be exposed to parents' viewpoints. I don't want my son to believe what we do because he doesn't know any other viewpoint. I want him to decide what he believes for himself because he's well-informed, which includes exposure to a variety of opinions. Believing something because it's the only thing you know isn't a belief of any depth. Nothing of what you said here sounds age-inappropriate. I think kids that age should be able to have a reasonable conversation on any of the topics you mentioned. For the record, my son is 11 and has been aware for the concept of abortion for at least 2 or 3 years. I think a 12 year old should know what it is. You think a 12 year old should be told Hillary Clinton is a baby killer? That's not inappropriate? I also absolutely disagree that it is in any way appropriate to talk about topics in the way they were discussed without child's parents present. My 14 year old daughter I feel is old enough to engage in healthy conversation. My 12 year old son is entering 6th Grade and ALL of these topics should have been discussed MUCH more diplomatically than they were. That's cool that you discussed abortion with your 8 old son, I guess we were still getting there?!? There seems to be confusion that I don't want my children exposed to different viewpoints. I guess that's not what I meant to come across. Again, I don't really want to spell out every topic that was discussed as it was very inflamatory and that's not my intent here. I have already discussed what happened with my children and how they feel and how I feel. However, I definitely feel my in-laws should have known better and I am very surprised at their actions. My question was more: how should I handle things with them? Especially since we have had a good relationship until now. It also included aunts, uncles and cousins. And everybody was on the same side - there were no debates. I guess it's not the environment I expected when I sent them up to go camping, but I will know better for next time. |
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Post by Merge on Jul 1, 2019 20:08:46 GMT
Yes, kids that age can certainly hear differing viewpoints, but it’s up to the adults in their lives to keep inflammatory language to a minimum, IMO. If grandparents had said they disagreed with Hillary’s views on abortion rights, that would be expressing a different viewpoint. “Killing babies” is unnecessarily inflammatory and designed to play on a young person’s emotions. It’s manipulative IMO.
Imagine if my 12 year old niece asked my views on religion. I’m sure my sister would have no issue with me stating that I don’t believe in god as they do, but she might take exception if I followed that statement up with, “and I think religion is followed only by weak-minded fools.” It’s unnecessary, and not an appropriate statement to make between family members.
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Post by leftturnonly on Jul 1, 2019 20:11:18 GMT
I want you to see this from a different perspective just for a moment here...
What child today is not inundated with Trump hate, pro-abortion, etc talk?
How should you handle it? Encourage your children to hear from people with different perspectives and let them think for themselves.
But, maybe that's just the way I chose to raise my children. Your children, your rules.
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Post by leftturnonly on Jul 1, 2019 20:16:23 GMT
Yes, kids that age can certainly hear differing viewpoints, but it’s up to the adults in their lives to keep inflammatory language to a minimum, IMO. That means restricting your child from CNN, MSNBC, NBC, etc. I bet that's not what you intended though. |
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inkedup
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Jun 26, 2014 5:00:26 GMT
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Post by inkedup on Jul 1, 2019 20:17:51 GMT
I think your in-laws crossed a line.
I think abortion, like sex, is part of a conversation between children and their parents. For me, it would have nothing to do with a fear of opposing viewpoints; rather, it isn't anyone's damn place to discuss those issues with my children.
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jennamama
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Jul 13, 2018 18:42:10 GMT
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Post by jennamama on Jul 1, 2019 20:18:16 GMT
Yes, kids that age can certainly hear differing viewpoints, but it’s up to the adults in their lives to keep inflammatory language to a minimum, IMO. If grandparents had said they disagreed with Hillary’s views on abortion rights, that would be expressing a different viewpoint. “Killing babies” is unnecessarily inflammatory and designed to play on a young person’s emotions. It’s manipulative IMO. Imagine if my 12 year old niece asked my views on religion. I’m sure my sister would have no issue with me stating that I don’t believe in god as they do, but she might take exception if I followed that statement up with, “and I think religion is followed only by weak-minded fools.” It’s unnecessary, and not an appropriate statement to make between family members. Exactly. Hell- my HUSBAND and I have vastly differing viewpoints on many points. On many of the topics that were discussed actually. However, we chose to handle these conversations in our household in a much different manner. I am really very surprised that some terms and language were used when talking to children. I would have never guessed they would do that and that's why I am hurt. My kids already knew their viewpoints were different - hence the question in the first place. I definitely am taking into consideration that he asked and hence, did open up this conversation. He certainly got an earful - we'll see if he EVER asks again!  |
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Post by mom on Jul 1, 2019 20:22:38 GMT
I'm on your side politically, but I disagree that kids should only be exposed to parents' viewpoints. I don't want my son to believe what we do because he doesn't know any other viewpoint. I want him to decide what he believes for himself because he's well-informed, which includes exposure to a variety of opinions. Believing something because it's the only thing you know isn't a belief of any depth. Nothing of what you said here sounds age-inappropriate. I think kids that age should be able to have a reasonable conversation on any of the topics you mentioned. For the record, my son is 11 and has been aware for the concept of abortion for at least 2 or 3 years. I think a 12 year old should know what it is. You think a 12 year old should be told Hillary Clinton is a baby killer? That's not inappropriate? I also absolutely disagree that it is in any way appropriate to talk about topics in the way they were discussed without child's parents present. My 14 year old daughter I feel is old enough to engage in healthy conversation. My 12 year old son is entering 6th Grade and ALL of these topics should have been discussed MUCH more diplomatically than they were. That's cool that you discussed abortion with your 8 old son, I guess we were still getting there?!? There seems to be confusion that I don't want my children exposed to different viewpoints. I guess that's not what I meant to come across. Again, I don't really want to spell out every topic that was discussed as it was very inflamatory and that's not my intent here. I have already discussed what happened with my children and how they feel and how I feel. However, I definitely feel my in-laws should have known better and I am very surprised at their actions. My question was more: how should I handle things with them? Especially since we have had a good relationship until now. It also included aunts, uncles and cousins. And everybody was on the same side - there were no debates. I guess it's not the environment I expected when I sent them up to go camping, but I will know better for next time. How should you handle things with them? Handle them like you would any other time - smile and go on. They are 12 & 14 and since this seems to be a shock to you, I am going to assume this hasn't happened before. So there is no pattern. One conversation went too far, in your opinion. Ok? If you feel you absolutely must address this with the inlaws, I would be prepared to not have such a great relationship with them. They've been good up to this point, but now you are going to rethink the kids spending time with them and their camping trips? I guess if you are really that concerned about it you can start going on the family camping trips and guiding the conversations and stopping anything you feel is inflammatory. Edited: I stand by initial opinion that you talk to your kids about what you believe and move on. |
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Post by Merge on Jul 1, 2019 20:23:51 GMT
Yes, kids that age can certainly hear differing viewpoints, but it’s up to the adults in their lives to keep inflammatory language to a minimum, IMO. That means restricting your child from CNN, MSNBC, NBC, etc. I bet that's not what you intended though. I don’t think anyone should subject themselves or their children to any cable news. It’s all trash. I read yesterday that Tucker Carlson said on the air that killing people is just part of leading a country. Can you imagine? No one should listen to that bullshit, least of all impressionable pre-teens. |
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Post by busy on Jul 1, 2019 20:30:23 GMT
I'm on your side politically, but I disagree that kids should only be exposed to parents' viewpoints. I don't want my son to believe what we do because he doesn't know any other viewpoint. I want him to decide what he believes for himself because he's well-informed, which includes exposure to a variety of opinions. Believing something because it's the only thing you know isn't a belief of any depth. Nothing of what you said here sounds age-inappropriate. I think kids that age should be able to have a reasonable conversation on any of the topics you mentioned. For the record, my son is 11 and has been aware for the concept of abortion for at least 2 or 3 years. I think a 12 year old should know what it is. You think a 12 year old should be told Hillary Clinton is a baby killer? That's not inappropriate? I also absolutely disagree that it is in any way appropriate to talk about topics in the way they were discussed without child's parents present. My 14 year old daughter I feel is old enough to engage in healthy conversation. My 12 year old son is entering 6th Grade and ALL of these topics should have been discussed MUCH more diplomatically than they were. That's cool that you discussed abortion with your 8 old son, I guess we were still getting there?!? There seems to be confusion that I don't want my children exposed to different viewpoints. I guess that's not what I meant to come across. Again, I don't really want to spell out every topic that was discussed as it was very inflamatory and that's not my intent here. I have already discussed what happened with my children and how they feel and how I feel. However, I definitely feel my in-laws should have known better and I am very surprised at their actions. My question was more: how should I handle things with them? Especially since we have had a good relationship until now. It also included aunts, uncles and cousins. And everybody was on the same side - there were no debates. I guess it's not the environment I expected when I sent them up to go camping, but I will know better for next time. I think the "baby killer" rhetoric is terrible no matter what, because it's inaccurate, obscures the real issue, and so on. But there are people - apparently including your in-laws - who use it. I think pre-teens and up are mature enough to understand why people might choose to use that term, why it's a misleading and unnecessarily inflammatory term, and the bigger concept of reproductive rights. And if they understand those things, that kind of language choice has little to no impact. I'm not saying I'd appreciate other adults talking to my kid that way. Of course I wouldn't. But at a certain point, we can't shelter them so much anymore. And honestly, do you think saying something to your in-laws is going to help anything? I can't imagine it will, based on what you said here. It sounds like it will only make things worse. I guess I'm shocked that anyone who has those kinds of feelings reveals them out of the blue to children. I've never known anyone who kept those kinds of opinions under wraps. Are you saying that you are on the opposite side of the political spectrum from his entire family and didn't know it? |
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Post by busy on Jul 1, 2019 20:31:08 GMT
No one is pro-abortion. But nice inflammatory language of your own. |
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Post by Merge on Jul 1, 2019 20:35:32 GMT
I guess I come at this from a different perspective than some. I’m a teacher. Kids at school ask us things and we have to be very circumspect. I would never share my true feelings about Trump or any other political figure with a 12 year old student, and I’d certainly never use inflammatory language to express any political or religious opinion with kids. The same has been true of how I talk with my own kids. I save all my inflammatory language for the board, where presumably we’re all adults. 😚
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jennamama
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Posts: 114
Jul 13, 2018 18:42:10 GMT
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Post by jennamama on Jul 1, 2019 20:36:52 GMT
I guess I'm shocked that anyone who has those kinds of feelings reveals them out of the blue to children. I've never known anyone who kept those kinds of opinions under wraps. Are you saying that you are on the opposite side of the political spectrum from his entire family and didn't know it? No, I DID know we are on opposite sides - they also know they are opposite of me. I will say that we never debate at all - I try to steer clear of politics with family as a general rule. Thanks for offering your opinion, I do appreciate the different sides and it is helping to hear others perspectives on this. |
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Post by Merge on Jul 1, 2019 20:43:04 GMT
You think a 12 year old should be told Hillary Clinton is a baby killer? That's not inappropriate? I also absolutely disagree that it is in any way appropriate to talk about topics in the way they were discussed without child's parents present. My 14 year old daughter I feel is old enough to engage in healthy conversation. My 12 year old son is entering 6th Grade and ALL of these topics should have been discussed MUCH more diplomatically than they were. That's cool that you discussed abortion with your 8 old son, I guess we were still getting there?!? There seems to be confusion that I don't want my children exposed to different viewpoints. I guess that's not what I meant to come across. Again, I don't really want to spell out every topic that was discussed as it was very inflamatory and that's not my intent here. I have already discussed what happened with my children and how they feel and how I feel. However, I definitely feel my in-laws should have known better and I am very surprised at their actions. My question was more: how should I handle things with them? Especially since we have had a good relationship until now. It also included aunts, uncles and cousins. And everybody was on the same side - there were no debates. I guess it's not the environment I expected when I sent them up to go camping, but I will know better for next time. I think the "baby killer" rhetoric is terrible no matter what, because it's inaccurate, obscures the real issue, and so on. But there are people - apparently including your in-laws - who use it. I think pre-teens and up are mature enough to understand why people might choose to use that term, why it's a misleading and unnecessarily inflammatory term, and the bigger concept of reproductive rights. And if they understand those things, that kind of language choice has little to no impact. I'm not saying I'd appreciate other adults talking to my kid that way. Of course I wouldn't. But at a certain point, we can't shelter them so much anymore. And honestly, do you think saying something to your in-laws is going to help anything? I can't imagine it will, based on what you said here. It sounds like it will only make things worse. I guess I'm shocked that anyone who has those kinds of feelings reveals them out of the blue to children. I've never known anyone who kept those kinds of opinions under wraps. Are you saying that you are on the opposite side of the political spectrum from his entire family and didn't know it? Nope, we can’t shelter them. But I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect that your own family might refrain, especially knowing that you have different views. I’m not saying that the OP should cut them out of their lives or anything wild like that. But a civil discussion between adults is an appropriate response IMO. |
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Post by Pahina722 on Jul 1, 2019 20:45:29 GMT
To a degree, we’ve had this come up with both my parents and my in-laws, more aimed at religion than politics, though. Both grandmothers told my son that he should get us to go to church because they wanted to be with us in heaven. Also, my mother complained that so many of my friends are LGBTQ and didn’t I have any “normal” friends. To a 10 to 14 year old. Of course, DS immediately came home upset about his grandparents denigrating his parents.
Our solution was simple. DS spoke to his parents, both together and separately, and I spoke to mine, letting them know that we didn’t appreciate what they were doing to DS. If they had issues with our parenting, they could speak with us, but to leave DS out of it. They stopped until DS had gotten into high school and then started in again. At that point, DS just started telling them what he believed (more liberal than either of his parents), which shut them up.
Of course, now that he’s finishing college, all they ever talk about is what a great job we did raising him. Yup! We raised him to think for himself and evaluate evidence. Glad you approve.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 18, 2024 2:28:18 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2019 20:52:23 GMT
At 12, your child is old enough to understand that family members can disagree on certain topics and still love and respect each other. Open conversations are never a bad thing.
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Post by Linda on Jul 1, 2019 21:09:52 GMT
DH and I have VERY different political views and he's pretty outspoken about his views (and very uninterested in having an open mind about other views). I spend a LOT of time talking to my 12 y/o about how different people see things differently and that when she's old enough to vote, she'll need to research the issues that are important to her and make up her own mind and that it's okay that different people think differently and so on...
My goal is that she'll be openminded and not just parrot what someone else says (whether that's me, or DH, or someone else) and that she realises that you can love and respect people who hold views you disagree with. We'll see...
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Post by 950nancy on Jul 1, 2019 21:28:57 GMT
Maybe your in-laws introduced them to their political views, but you have a good number of years to teach them about yours. No one has the effect on a child that a parent does. Start with short discussions and go from there.
My kid worked in a business where all but one of the employees was a white male who had definite positive opinions on Trump and Republicans. He was there three years. He would come home and share the things that he heard. We'd talk about it since he knew I felt quite the opposite and I believe he is only a better person for hearing both sides and developing his own ideas.
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