|
Post by crimsoncat05 on Apr 1, 2020 15:04:28 GMT
What difference would a test make to the ones showing symptoms? if they were tested, their cases would be recorded in the official COVID-19 numbers. Since they're just symptomatic, I don't think they're counting them.
|
|
|
Post by LuvAgoodPaddle on Apr 1, 2020 15:12:18 GMT
What difference would a test make to the ones showing symptoms? If they are showing symptoms they should use their brain and do as they are told - STAY HOME and totally isolate themselves from everything and anyone and advice anyone they have been in touch with over the previous week or so to also self isolate themselves as a precaution for 14 days. If anyone is showing symptoms they shouldn't visit the Doctor's office either risking the spread to others, UNLESS you show more severe symptoms and need hospitalisation, visiting your Doctor isn't going to help you, you need an ambulance. I can't understand how people can be so irresponsible knowing they have symptoms and still go out This is so infuriating to me!! I do not understand why people who have any symptoms need a positive COVID test to tell them to STAY HOME! We've been told from the start of all this if you have any symptoms, stay home!! But no, people with symptoms went out and about their business with no care about who they infected along their merry way. Why do you need a test to tell you to do the right thing and not infect others? Maybe we should of just done it like China and had our military forcefully keep people in their homes since people can't seem to choose to do the right thing when they show symptoms. Then you have those who want everyone to be tested. Sure you are negative today, until you go to the grocery store and might not be tomorrow. So are we supposed to test every person every day until this is over? Makes no sense to me at all unless the CDC wants exact numbers of infected at a given time. A negative test at this point means nothing unless you are 100% away from another person or public place from the previous 2 weeks until we are done with all this. Plus I had read that the less symptoms you have, the more likely a false negative will happen. It sounds like the more severe the symptoms, the more accurate the test is. Although testing issues seem to change day to day, so maybe this isn't true anymore?
|
|
|
Post by sleepingbooty on Apr 1, 2020 15:28:21 GMT
French newspaper Libération has an interesting article today ( behind paywall) about the estimates of the true death toll due to the novel coronavirus in China. They referenced Canada-based Chinese website Caijing Lengyan who worked on collecting testimonies from China, particularly the Wuhan region, and used data to compare numbers. Their conclusion is that the real death toll for the height of the Covid-19 crisis in China (late January - 1st week of March) is around 97 000 - nowhere close to the announced 3300! - of which 59 000 for Wuhan alone. The article details the various reasons why we will never have an accurate number of the actual deaths due to Covid-19 in China. It's all extremely interesting but the estimated true death toll is the standout information.
|
|
|
Post by LuvAgoodPaddle on Apr 1, 2020 15:36:52 GMT
French newspaper Libération has an interesting article today ( behind paywall) about the estimates of the true death toll due to the novel coronavirus in China. They referenced Canada-based Chinese website Caijing Lengyan who worked on collecting testimonies from China, particularly the Wuhan region, and used data to compare numbers. Their conclusion is that the real death toll for the height of the Covid-19 crisis in China (late January - 1st week of March) is around 97 000 - nowhere close to the announced 3300! - of which 59 000 for Wuhan alone. The article details the various reasons why we will never have an accurate number of the actual deaths due to Covid-19 in China. It's all extremely interesting but the estimated true death toll is the standout information. I don't think I've read a single news source that believes China has given accurate numbers of any kind. I still think 97,000 is very low for a country that has nearly 1.4 billion people compared to how it's tracking with every other country right now. With the exception of Italy, which I think is the opposite extreme with their high numbers. I wonder if we will ever know the true extent of how this effected (affected???) China.
|
|
|
Post by hop2 on Apr 1, 2020 15:46:15 GMT
French newspaper Libération has an interesting article today ( behind paywall) about the estimates of the true death toll due to the novel coronavirus in China. They referenced Canada-based Chinese website Caijing Lengyan who worked on collecting testimonies from China, particularly the Wuhan region, and used data to compare numbers. Their conclusion is that the real death toll for the height of the Covid-19 crisis in China (late January - 1st week of March) is around 97 000 - nowhere close to the announced 3300! - of which 59 000 for Wuhan alone. The article details the various reasons why we will never have an accurate number of the actual deaths due to Covid-19 in China. It's all extremely interesting but the estimated true death toll is the standout information. I don't think I've read a single news source that believes China has given accurate numbers of any kind. I still think 97,000 is very low for a country that has nearly 1.4 billion people compared to how it's tracking with every other country right now. With the exception of Italy, which I think is the opposite extreme with their high numbers. I wonder if we will ever know the true extent of how this effected (affected???) China. We will probably never know how many ‘had it’ here as there just aren’t enough tests available for that. Period.
|
|
|
Post by sleepingbooty on Apr 1, 2020 15:54:58 GMT
French newspaper Libération has an interesting article today ( behind paywall) about the estimates of the true death toll due to the novel coronavirus in China. They referenced Canada-based Chinese website Caijing Lengyan who worked on collecting testimonies from China, particularly the Wuhan region, and used data to compare numbers. Their conclusion is that the real death toll for the height of the Covid-19 crisis in China (late January - 1st week of March) is around 97 000 - nowhere close to the announced 3300! - of which 59 000 for Wuhan alone. I don't think I've read a single news source that believes China has given accurate numbers of any kind. I still think 97,000 is very low for a country that has nearly 1.4 billion people compared to how it's tracking with every other country right now. With the exception of Italy, which I think is the opposite extreme with their high numbers. I wonder if we will ever know the true extent of how this effected (affected???) China. We will not know how much SARS-CoV-2 affected people in Western countries either. We're not testing enough. Except if the serological test becomes mandatory for all down the line, we simply won't know exactly how many will have contracted the virus. Notable exceptions are the very few countries who have tested and continue to mass test like South Korea and Taiwan. The Chinese lockdown was/is extreme. One person allowed to leave the home once every 4-5 days only. Heavy monitoring in front of every building by Chinese Communist Party volunteers, barricades in front of buildings to prevent people from leaving without going through the checkpoints, etc. Tracking of every contaminated person via an app available on everyone's phone. I watched inside documentaries on this and I'm not surprised they managed to stop the spread. Our strict lockdown in France is nowhere close to what China was imposing. It's one of the (rare) upsides to dictature during a sanitary crisis: there are no human rights or acquired freedom they can't bulldoze to impose the strictest rules to stop a virus from spreading.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2020 17:43:07 GMT
|
|
|
Post by crimsoncat05 on Apr 1, 2020 17:47:56 GMT
not read the story yet, but I thought price gouging like this in a time of crisis was illegal? aren't there laws that limit the profit to something like 10% over list price, or something like that? just reprehensible. eta: it is NOT legal, and they are looking into it. good.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2020 18:49:08 GMT
|
|
|
Post by LuvAgoodPaddle on Apr 1, 2020 19:00:03 GMT
We will probably never know how many ‘had it’ here as there just aren’t enough tests available for that. Period. Or more like we will probably never know how many had it because upwards of 80% show mild or no symptoms and had no need to be tested. That's a lot of people who do not need to be tested and won't clog up the testing facilities for the tests that need to be done right now.
|
|
|
Post by LuvAgoodPaddle on Apr 1, 2020 19:07:38 GMT
So are YOU going to choose to use this advice and move out of the fear zone? Because your posts tend to mostly be just that.
|
|
tanya2
Pearl Clutcher
Refupea #1604
Posts: 4,422
Jun 27, 2014 2:27:09 GMT
|
Post by tanya2 on Apr 1, 2020 19:38:52 GMT
Up until Saturday I was in Honduras. We had been there since March 1, with plans to come home on the 28th. On March 15 Honduras - without any prior notice - closed all airports & borders. All stores and businesses were closed except on certain select days that people could go out to get food & other supplies. People there don't have the money to hoard anything, they just buy what they need for the immediate future. We were allowed to go out one day for groceries, had to stand outside in the 95 degree sun for an hour, before being allowed into the store to get what we needed. Although once we got inside the store was very well stocked & we were able to get enough of everything. Now this wasn't a horrible place to be stuck LOL. Right on the beach in a very small gated community, pretty much the definition of social isolating. Sun shine & perfect weather everyday, with plenty of food. We were registered on the list of Canadians abroad & getting constant updates from the embassy. But no flights were going in or out until last Thursday and then only 1 per day. We were on a whatsapp chat of Canadians in Honduras and there were over 150 on the list of just canadians trying to get out, plus an unknown number of Americans and other foreigners to Honduras. So with only 1 flight a day, as you can imagine they filled up very quickly. And even though price gouging is supposed to be illegal - United airlines took full advantage. Now granted all we could get were business class seats because everything was all sold out, but I could have purchased an older used car for what a one-way 3 hour flight to Houston ended up costing me. Not including the other $1000 I had to spend to fly Delta from Houston to Atlanta and then to Toronto. We needed a letter from the Canadian embassy to be able to drive on the highway the 2 hours to the airport, and got stopped 4 times at military/police checkpoints. One of those times they sprayed the outside of our car with a bleach solution And then they wouldn't allow anybody into the airport without masks on, and they took everyone's temperatures first. They were all very nice, just doing their jobs. Once I got to Houston I did not see another person wearing a mask that wasn't a passenger. And from what I've heard since, in Honduras everyone is assigned a day they may be out to get supplies based on the last digit of your passport, and if you are caught on the streets on any different days they are arresting people and impounding cars. All this for a country that only had 9 cases as of Saturday! They are taking it VERY seriously there.
|
|
tanya2
Pearl Clutcher
Refupea #1604
Posts: 4,422
Jun 27, 2014 2:27:09 GMT
|
Post by tanya2 on Apr 1, 2020 19:40:46 GMT
Now we're on a mandatory 14 day self-quarantine having been outside of the country. Thank heaven for my kids taking care of getting us food & supplies!
|
|
|
Post by roxley on Apr 1, 2020 19:44:33 GMT
We will probably never know how many ‘had it’ here as there just aren’t enough tests available for that. Period. Or more like we will probably never know how many had it because upwards of 80% show mild or no symptoms and had no need to be tested. That's a lot of people who do not need to be tested and won't clog up the testing facilities for the tests that need to be done right now. There have been articles about being able to due an antibody test in the future on large portions of the population to determine the percentage of people who were infected. Someone is apparently already working on it. I think we will be surprised at how big a percentage actually had it but never knew. They are also hoping to identify these people to see if they are immune in the future. If they are, they would be a safe workforce if compromised people need to isolate again in the fall or whenever it comes back.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2020 20:11:47 GMT
What difference would a test make to the ones showing symptoms? if they were tested, their cases would be recorded in the official COVID-19 numbers. Since they're just symptomatic, I don't think they're counting them. What benefit is recording the numbers going to do though? I think it's impossible to get accurate numbers ever unless you test everyone everyday.That test is only going to confirm that you either have it or you don't at that particular time. You could have a negative today but a positive tomorrow unless you haven't been out or in contact with anyone in that time. And how would you get a test if you haven't been out anywhere? It's not going to make anyone better because they've been tested. Many people get a mild form of it and the only thing they can do is to self isolate. No country's figures are accurate in that respect as non of them are testing every citizen. I'm sure we wouldn't have been told that Prince Charles had it if he was ordinary Jo Bloggs. I bet there's hundreds if not thousands in many countries that are now at home with a mild form of it that don't need hospitalization or even have no symptoms at all as yet. Staying at home is the best way to break that chain together with hand washing,surface cleaning etc. Testing or record keeping isn't going to make it go away. It's each persons actions that is going to lower the number affected by it.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2020 20:13:11 GMT
So are YOU going to choose to use this advice and move out of the fear zone? Because your posts tend to mostly be just that. I reject your assertion.
|
|
|
Post by elaine on Apr 1, 2020 20:23:16 GMT
I’m sorry, but anyone who subscribes to “I recognize that everyone is doing their best whilst facing an extremely complicated situation” probably wouldn’t develop a chart meant to chastise a large group of people who do any of the behaviors the chart developer decides are in the “Fear Zone.” I find this chart yet one more attempt to divide people, putting them into categories, with the implication that we/us (my group) are better than them (the “lower” group(s)). Me, personally, I get irritated easily (as evidenced by this post), I bought a ton of paper products in February (successfully anticipating this and haven’t bought any in the month of March when everyone else went crazy), I do recognize everyone is doing their best, and I think of others and how I can help them (sewing masks, starting a thread about how stressful this is for my family as an attempt to reach other families who are also stressed). So, apparently I both suck and am an enlightened being according to the chart...
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2020 20:24:50 GMT
not read the story yet, but I thought price gouging like this in a time of crisis was illegal? aren't there laws that limit the profit to something like 10% over list price, or something like that? just reprehensible. eta: it is NOT legal, and they are looking into it. good. Legal or not that is just a downright disgusting thing to do when people's lives are at risk. I hope that not one of those, that run that company ever ever need to go into hospital and expect the medical staff to take care of them - you know, the same people that are now trying to save the lives of others at the risk of their own lives. They should be ashamed of themselves.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2020 20:57:00 GMT
I’m sorry, but anyone who subscribes to “I recognize that everyone is doing their best whilst facing an extremely complicated situation” probably wouldn’t develop a chart meant to chastise a large group of people who do any of the behaviors the chart developer decides are in the “Fear Zone.” I find this chart yet one more attempt to divide people, putting them into categories, with the implication that we/us (my group) are better than them (the “lower” group(s)). Me, personally, I get irritated easily (as evidenced by this post), I bought a ton of paper products in February (successfully anticipating this and haven’t bought any in the month of March when everyone else went crazy), I do recognize everyone is doing their best, and I think of others and how I can help them (sewing masks, starting a thread about how stressful this is for my family as an attempt to reach other families who are also stressed). So, apparently I both suck and am an enlightened being according to the chart... I think you are magnificent. And I think that's what the chart would say about you. You're doing your best and recognizing that others are too. You don't suck even a little bit. PS - being 'in fear' doesn't mean someone sucks. It just means they may not act in the most reasoned ways that they could do if they weren't in fear.
|
|
|
Post by Scrapper100 on Apr 1, 2020 21:05:39 GMT
I think the numbers would be a lot higher in California if we had more tests. People with symptoms unless really sick and needing hospitalization are just being sent home or told by their doctors to not go for a test but to stay home. While I think the early stay at home has helped so many here are not taking it seriously and I think we are going to have a surge at some point - I really hope I am wrong. I just know I am only going out for food or medical supplies. Getting what I can mailed vs doing pickups when possible as well. I guess we will know in the next two weeks if things are still staying low or not. What difference would a test make to the ones showing symptoms? If they are showing symptoms they should use their brain and do as they are told - STAY HOME and totally isolate themselves from everything and anyone and advice anyone they have been in touch with over the previous week or so to also self isolate themselves as a precaution for 14 days. If anyone is showing symptoms they shouldn't visit the Doctor's office either risking the spread to others, UNLESS you show more severe symptoms and need hospitalisation, visiting your Doctor isn't going to help you, you need an ambulance. I can't understand how people can be so irresponsible knowing they have symptoms and still go out The stay home advice isn't just to keep you ( general you) from being infected, it also means that you, with symptoms or having possibly been exposed to someone that has, do not infect anyone else. There's not a lot anyone can do with the people that unknowingly carry it, without or prior to having symptoms, unless one is going to test EVERY citizen - an impossible task! . I’m not saying they should be out spreading it but they aren’t getting counted and therefore giving a false sense of security in the low numbers. No one with symptoms should just go to an ER or dr office but there are testing sites. I totally see your point but saying oh we only have so many cases because hundreds or thousands of people do have it but are doing what they should be doing and staying home. I kept hearing oh it’s not a big deal we don’t have that many cases and I just want to scream. I’m doing my part along with my family we are staying home.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2020 21:25:12 GMT
What difference would a test make to the ones showing symptoms? If they are showing symptoms they should use their brain and do as they are told - STAY HOME and totally isolate themselves from everything and anyone and advice anyone they have been in touch with over the previous week or so to also self isolate themselves as a precaution for 14 days. If anyone is showing symptoms they shouldn't visit the Doctor's office either risking the spread to others, UNLESS you show more severe symptoms and need hospitalisation, visiting your Doctor isn't going to help you, you need an ambulance. I can't understand how people can be so irresponsible knowing they have symptoms and still go out The stay home advice isn't just to keep you ( general you) from being infected, it also means that you, with symptoms or having possibly been exposed to someone that has, do not infect anyone else. There's not a lot anyone can do with the people that unknowingly carry it, without or prior to having symptoms, unless one is going to test EVERY citizen - an impossible task! . I’m not saying they should be out spreading it but they aren’t getting counted and therefore giving a false sense of security in the low numbers. No one with symptoms should just go to an ER or dr office but there are testing sites. I totally see your point but saying oh we only have so many cases because hundreds or thousands of people do have it but are doing what they should be doing and staying home. I kept hearing oh it’s not a big deal we don’t have that many cases and I just want to scream. I’m doing my part along with my family we are staying home. Oh I agree but I don't think if those numbers went into hundreds of thousands those kind of people still wouldn't change their ways, some just wouldn't no matter what. Provided it didn't affect them or anyone they know they just don't care.
|
|
|
Post by hop2 on Apr 1, 2020 21:36:29 GMT
I’m sorry, but anyone who subscribes to “I recognize that everyone is doing their best whilst facing an extremely complicated situation” probably wouldn’t develop a chart meant to chastise a large group of people who do any of the behaviors the chart developer decides are in the “Fear Zone.” I find this chart yet one more attempt to divide people, putting them into categories, with the implication that we/us (my group) are better than them (the “lower” group(s)). Me, personally, I get irritated easily (as evidenced by this post), I bought a ton of paper products in February (successfully anticipating this and haven’t bought any in the month of March when everyone else went crazy), I do recognize everyone is doing their best, and I think of others and how I can help them (sewing masks, starting a thread about how stressful this is for my family as an attempt to reach other families who are also stressed). So, apparently I both suck and am an enlightened being according to the chart... I agree, I could be anywhere on that chart depending on which day it is or even what time of day. What did I just do. If I have a headache and a dry throat I’m in super panic mode because I live alone and I’ve heard how fast people can go from fine to ICU. Every do often I get a spurt of hey this great let me do this long avoided task. But mostly I’m just plugging along doing my job and the like, reminding myself how lucky I am right now. But I am all the levels of that chart and none of those levels. It is a minute by minute thing right now
|
|
|
Post by Laurie on Apr 1, 2020 21:48:58 GMT
I’m sorry, but anyone who subscribes to “I recognize that everyone is doing their best whilst facing an extremely complicated situation” probably wouldn’t develop a chart meant to chastise a large group of people who do any of the behaviors the chart developer decides are in the “Fear Zone.” I find this chart yet one more attempt to divide people, putting them into categories, with the implication that we/us (my group) are better than them (the “lower” group(s)). Me, personally, I get irritated easily (as evidenced by this post), I bought a ton of paper products in February (successfully anticipating this and haven’t bought any in the month of March when everyone else went crazy), I do recognize everyone is doing their best, and I think of others and how I can help them (sewing masks, starting a thread about how stressful this is for my family as an attempt to reach other families who are also stressed). So, apparently I both suck and am an enlightened being according to the chart... Exactly! I also bought quite a bit of toilet paper but thanks to this board it was well before people around here started buying it. Actually I wonder if more people would have done so it may have helped with the shortage. Since I bought early there was time to restock shelves before things went crazy. Anytime someone that lives around me wants to give me flack for having a “stockpile” I have no problem letting them know I started buying in February because I believed what people were saying rather than buying in to the “it’s just the flu” bs.
|
|
|
Post by sleepingbooty on Apr 1, 2020 21:57:02 GMT
Here's your happy news from France tonight: two presidents of region (Grand-Est, the east of France which is the national epicentre right now, and PACA, the south-east where I live) have denounced that Americans are snapping up mask orders at the Chinese airport they were departing from. Apparently, there's some wild wild west negotiating happening from American representatives in China right now. Per these elected officials, they are offering up to 3-4 times the price originally negotiated to get their hands on these ready-to-go deliveries just before they are on their way out to their destination countries.
And now, several millions of masks won't get delivered to France in the next few days just as our peak is expected to take place. They're pretty upset. They were meant for essential workers, including public hospital personnel. Yah, make of that what you will.
|
|
|
Post by Scrapper100 on Apr 1, 2020 22:18:39 GMT
. I’m not saying they should be out spreading it but they aren’t getting counted and therefore giving a false sense of security in the low numbers. No one with symptoms should just go to an ER or dr office but there are testing sites. I totally see your point but saying oh we only have so many cases because hundreds or thousands of people do have it but are doing what they should be doing and staying home. I kept hearing oh it’s not a big deal we don’t have that many cases and I just want to scream. I’m doing my part along with my family we are staying home. Oh I agree but I don't think if those numbers went into hundreds of thousands those kind of people still wouldn't change their ways, some just wouldn't no matter what. Provided it didn't affect them or anyone they know they just don't care. Your probably right. I thought the test numbers also helped with planning and modeling to figure out the number of beds and ventilators needed. That’s more why I’m thinking it’s important. Our numbers in our city went up snd it seems to have slowed a few people down snd woke them up others are not going to let it mess up their lives and are going to treat this like a vacation and time to do all the projects around their homes while possibly exposing others. I’m very thankful that my husband can work from home snd that my son will be doing school from home. I only go out for grocery pickups and don’t think I have any other reasons to go out for a while. Tons of stuff to keep us busy from home.
|
|
inkedup
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,837
Jun 26, 2014 5:00:26 GMT
|
Post by inkedup on Apr 1, 2020 23:07:26 GMT
Here's your happy news from France tonight: two presidents of region (Grand-Est, the east of France which is the national epicentre right now, and PACA, the south-east where I live) have denounced that Americans are snapping up mask orders at the Chinese airport they were departing from. Apparently, there's some wild wild west negotiating happening from American representatives in China right now. Per these elected officials, they are offering up to 3-4 times the price originally negotiated to get their hands on these ready-to-go deliveries just before they are on their way out to their destination countries. And now, several millions of masks won't get delivered to France in the next few days just as our peak is expected to take place. They're pretty upset. They were meant for essential workers, including public hospital personnel. Yah, make of that what you will. When you say "the Americans", do you mean the federal government or private entities? Not that it's right either way. I'm sorry that resources are being abused in this way.
|
|
|
Post by revirdsuba99 on Apr 2, 2020 2:10:49 GMT
eta: it is NOT legal, and they are looking into it. good dis-Barr-him did a song and dance at one of the recent Covid-19 briefings that it is illegal to price goug, report it and he will prosecute it vigorously.... sure not, Texas is a RED state!!
|
|
|
Post by revirdsuba99 on Apr 2, 2020 2:38:23 GMT
Gov Brian Kemp (R-GA) has had a revelation! Unknown prior to today, he did not know that an Asymptomatic Covid patient could infect others!! Great revelation. Where has he been for the last TWO months? Georgia is now stay-at-home!
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2020 13:31:08 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
May 6, 2024 4:20:49 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2020 13:53:31 GMT
People getting all whipped up on conspiracy theories and then going out and acting on it. "Investigators arrested a California train engineer Tuesday after he allegedly derailed a train in a bid to crash into the USNS Mercy, the hospital ship treating non-COVID-19 patients at the Port of Los Angeles to lessen the burden on area hospitals, prosecutors said. Eduardo Moreno, 44, was expected to appear in court Wednesday for arraignment on train wrecking charges. Around 1 p.m. Tuesday, Moreno allegedly ran the train at full speed off the end of the tracks near the Navy medical boat, smashing through several concrete and chain barriers, before sliding through a parking lot nearly 250 yards from the Mercy, according to the criminal complaint. No one was injured and the boat wasn't damaged, however, the train leaked a substantial amount of fuel, the complaint said." www.yahoo.com/gma/engineer-tried-crash-train-usns-mercy-los-angeles-233500380--abc-news-topstories.html
|
|