scrappinghappy
Pearl Clutcher
“I’m late, I’m late for a very important date. No time to say “Hello.” Goodbye. I’m late...."
Posts: 4,306
Jun 26, 2014 19:30:06 GMT
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Post by scrappinghappy on May 1, 2020 18:34:47 GMT
Listening to my daughter and her friends who are Sanders supporters... Some of them will vote for Biden but a LOT are going to NOT vote at all. They would rather NOT vote than choose between these two.
I have sons and daughters. I keep thinking how I would feel if one of my sons was wrongly accused. How would I feel if my daughter was not believed?
She says she made a complaint. Ok, there should be a record of it and Biden is willing to let us see it IF it exists. He claims it won't.
I'll believe in INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and not jump to GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT. That is how our justice system is supposed to work.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Jun 2, 2024 1:11:31 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2020 18:37:37 GMT
You got me, what does Joe Biden’s university records have to do with this? The huge collection of Biden Senate records that Biden gave the Univ of Delaware From his statement above... “There is only one place a complaint of this kind could be — the National Archives. The National Archives is where the records are kept at what was then called the Office of Fair Employment Practices. I am requesting that the Secretary of the Senate ask the Archives to identify any record of the complaint she alleges she filed and make available to the press any such document. If there was ever any such complaint, the record will be there.”
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Post by myshelly on May 1, 2020 18:39:59 GMT
Because TPTB didn’t want Bernie as a candidate, so they ignored this until Bernie was out of the picture and then made it a national story the day after Bernie quit the race. Clearly that wasn’t a coincidence. IMO, the main reason Biden is the presumptive nominee is because people were trying to guess who would be most likely to beat Trump. There are a lot of people who liked other candidates better but didn’t know if enough other people felt the same way. If people had known about this in the primaries, some other moderate would have risen to the top to beat Bernie. I’m really Frustrated that this is coming out now. I could understand why CBF waited until the hearings to disclose about Kavanaugh. He was about to be appointed to a very important, lifetime position. But Biden has run for president before and was Vice President. This is not a moment of “omg, that guy who assaulted me might be president. I need to tell someone.” You’re assuming the issue is when the victim came forward. The real issue is when did the press start to cover it? The accusations have been known for years. The press chose not to cover it widely until now.
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Post by freecharlie on May 1, 2020 18:40:58 GMT
Listening to my daughter and her friends who are Sanders supporters... Some of them will vote for Biden but a LOT are going to NOT vote at all. They would rather NOT vote than choose between these two. Then they will be part of the reason that Trump wins again. Anything they hoped for or believed in will be worse in four years than it could have been. People like the non-voters piss me off. By not voting in this election, you are saying what Trump does is okay. I keep thinking how I would feel if one of my sons was wrongly accused. This terrifies me. It is so hard to prove a negative.
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Post by Darcy Collins on May 1, 2020 18:41:41 GMT
Because TPTB didn’t want Bernie as a candidate, so they ignored this until Bernie was out of the picture and then made it a national story the day after Bernie quit the race. Clearly that wasn’t a coincidence. IMO, the main reason Biden is the presumptive nominee is because people were trying to guess who would be most likely to beat Trump. There are a lot of people who liked other candidates better but didn’t know if enough other people felt the same way. If people had known about this in the primaries, some other moderate would have risen to the top to beat Bernie. I’m really Frustrated that this is coming out now. I could understand why CBF waited until the hearings to disclose about Kavanaugh. He was about to be appointed to a very important, lifetime position. But Biden has run for president before and was Vice President. This is not a moment of “omg, that guy who assaulted me might be president. I need to tell someone.” Really? A bunch of women came out last year talking about how Biden made them uncomfortable with his encroachment on personal space. I'm kind of shocked that anyone is really surprised. He's handsy. I am more surprised that Ms. Reade was not more explicit last year if she was going to choose to get explicit now.
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Post by myshelly on May 1, 2020 18:41:44 GMT
Listening to my daughter and her friends who are Sanders supporters... Some of them will vote for Biden but a LOT are going to NOT vote at all. They would rather NOT vote than choose between these two. I have sons and daughters. I keep thinking how I would feel if one of my sons was wrongly accused. How would I feel if my daughter was not believed? She says she made a complaint. Ok, there should be a record of it and Biden is willing to let us see it IF it exists. He claims it won't. I'll believe in INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and not jump to GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT. That is how our justice system is supposed to work. Yep. This is exactly what I am hearing widely - no good choices, so it doesn’t matter or they’re both the same, so it doesn’t matter.
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Post by crazy4scraps on May 1, 2020 18:42:13 GMT
Because TPTB didn’t want Bernie as a candidate, so they ignored this until Bernie was out of the picture and then made it a national story the day after Bernie quit the race. Clearly that wasn’t a coincidence. IMO, the main reason Biden is the presumptive nominee is because people were trying to guess who would be most likely to beat Trump. There are a lot of people who liked other candidates better but didn’t know if enough other people felt the same way. If people had known about this in the primaries, some other moderate would have risen to the top to beat Bernie. I’m really Frustrated that this is coming out now. I could understand why CBF waited until the hearings to disclose about Kavanaugh. He was about to be appointed to a very important, lifetime position. But Biden has run for president before and was Vice President. This is not a moment of “omg, that guy who assaulted me might be president. I need to tell someone.”This is how I feel too. If it is so important now, it should have been just as important when Biden was actually the VP. Or it should have come out when the whole me too thing was going full speed. To trot out that allegation right now just smacks of election interference at this point. FWIW, I’m all for listening to women when they come forward with things like this. But by the same token, we need to hear ALL of the facts. Not just the ones that one party wants us to hear, but all of it from anyone with relevant information. It is just as true in this case as it was with Kavanaugh and we all know how well that worked out. About as well as it did with the Senate investigation into the Ukraine scandal.
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Post by crazy4scraps on May 1, 2020 18:45:21 GMT
Listening to my daughter and her friends who are Sanders supporters... Some of them will vote for Biden but a LOT are going to NOT vote at all. They would rather NOT vote than choose between these two. I have sons and daughters. I keep thinking how I would feel if one of my sons was wrongly accused. How would I feel if my daughter was not believed? She says she made a complaint. Ok, there should be a record of it and Biden is willing to let us see it IF it exists. He claims it won't. I'll believe in INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and not jump to GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT. That is how our justice system is supposed to work. Yep. This is exactly what I am hearing widely - no good choices, so it doesn’t matter or they’re both the same, so it doesn’t matter. Well then I really hope they like what they end up with. They’re not the same. Not even close.
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Post by freecharlie on May 1, 2020 18:49:40 GMT
From the Times' story That makes it very difficult for him to try to disprove. ummm...even if you didn't want to come forward to accuse him, he didn't make her praise him
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Peal
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,524
Jun 25, 2014 22:45:40 GMT
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Post by Peal on May 1, 2020 18:51:26 GMT
Listening to my daughter and her friends who are Sanders supporters... Some of them will vote for Biden but a LOT are going to NOT vote at all. They would rather NOT vote than choose between these two. I have sons and daughters. I keep thinking how I would feel if one of my sons was wrongly accused. How would I feel if my daughter was not believed? She says she made a complaint. Ok, there should be a record of it and Biden is willing to let us see it IF it exists. He claims it won't. I'll believe in INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and not jump to GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT. That is how our justice system is supposed to work. It's a choice I'd rather not make either. But I will.
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Post by freecharlie on May 1, 2020 18:52:02 GMT
no good choices, so it doesn’t matter or they’re both the same, so it doesn’t matter. Nope. They are not the same. Biden was probably inappropriate with a number of women. He will not actively destroy our country and our world.
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Post by crazy4scraps on May 1, 2020 18:53:48 GMT
From the Times' story That makes it very difficult for him to try to disprove. ummm...even if you didn't want to come forward to accuse him, he didn't make her praise him Hmmm. Interesting!
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Post by myshelly on May 1, 2020 18:54:42 GMT
no good choices, so it doesn’t matter or they’re both the same, so it doesn’t matter. Nope. They are not the same. Biden was probably inappropriate with a number of women. He will not actively destroy our country and our world. Convincing me isn’t going to get large numbers of people to the polls. The Democrats knew people, especially young people, are not excited to get out and vote for Biden. They chose him anyway. It was not a good choice.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on May 1, 2020 18:54:54 GMT
IMO, the main reason Biden is the presumptive nominee is because people were trying to guess who would be most likely to beat Trump. There are a lot of people who liked other candidates better but didn’t know if enough other people felt the same way. If people had known about this in the primaries, some other moderate would have risen to the top to beat Bernie. I’m really Frustrated that this is coming out now. I could understand why CBF waited until the hearings to disclose about Kavanaugh. He was about to be appointed to a very important, lifetime position. But Biden has run for president before and was Vice President. This is not a moment of “omg, that guy who assaulted me might be president. I need to tell someone.” Really? A bunch of women came out last year talking about how Biden made them uncomfortable with his encroachment on personal space. I'm kind of shocked that anyone is really surprised. He's handsy. I am more surprised that Ms. Reade was not more explicit last year if she was going to choose to get explicit now. There is a difference between being “handsy” and what she is alleging. And I agree, if she was going to be explicit now, why wasn’t she then? I don’t know enough about the history of the allegations to know where to put the blame for this being brought up now vs in the past. I just know that I am frustrated that it wasn’t made more widely known until now. IMO, it isn’t too late for Biden to step down if there does seem to be credible evidence against him. But I will also be pissed if we are then stuck with Bernie because he has the next highest number of delegates. If Biden is the nominee, I will vote for him because he and trump are NOT the same. Not in their treatment of women and not in their ability to lead.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Jun 2, 2024 1:11:31 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2020 18:55:34 GMT
You got me, what does Joe Biden’s university records have to do with this? The huge collection of Biden Senate records that Biden gave the Univ of Delaware From Biden’s statement... ” There is only one place a complaint of this kind could be — the National Archives. The National Archives is where the records are kept at what was then called the Office of Fair Employment Practices. I am requesting that the Secretary of the Senate ask the Archives to identify any record of the complaint she alleges she filed and make available to the press any such document. If there was ever any such complaint, the record will be there.”
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Jun 2, 2024 1:11:31 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2020 18:55:42 GMT
The huge collection of Biden Senate records that Biden gave the Univ of Delaware From his statement above... “There is only one place a complaint of this kind could be — the National Archives. The National Archives is where the records are kept at what was then called the Office of Fair Employment Practices. I am requesting that the Secretary of the Senate ask the Archives to identify any record of the complaint she alleges she filed and make available to the press any such document. If there was ever any such complaint, the record will be there.”
Okay. So we are supposed to believe his look here and not here statement. If that is true, then why not say that those senate records held by the university can be released as well. Then it settles the discussion once and for all. Full and complete investigation.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on May 1, 2020 18:57:30 GMT
I think that lots of people won’t vote. I think the Dems’ only chance was to put forth someone who got people who don’t usually vote excited enough to vote. They didn’t do that. Then those who chose not to vote are stupid. Maybe not a nice thing to say but it’s true. It's not true, it's your opinion.
Believe it or not there are actually people who so much can't stomach all this bullshit that they simply cannot put their name to either candidate choosing instead a third party or vote of no confidence.
You don't have to agree with any of that but that is actually true, not just my opinion.
There are all kinds of reasons why people vote (or not) the way they do. It is the height of disdain and condescension for someone to claim others are stupid for not buying into a wholly corrupt system. That is my opinion.
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Post by FuzzyMutt on May 1, 2020 18:59:24 GMT
Every single person who blasted Kavanaugh and decided to believe Christine Blasey Ford when she had not one bit of supporting evidence for her wild and yet still oddly vague accusations against him owes it to all women to be consistent and get out there with their ME TOO posts of support for Tara Reade who does have contemporaneous support of her claim. I'm not holding my breath while I wait. Kavanaugh's accuser didn't state that she'd filed paperwork. I agree that we should see any paperwork on this incident that Tara believes/claims to have filed. I think both Joe and Trump have plenty of misogynistic behavior in their past. Trump has had 25 rape accusations. Joe, 1. I think let's listen to ALL the women in both cases. The one where the pervy dude perved comments on his grown daughter's body, admitted walking into dressing rooms on naked 15 yo beauty pageant contestants and has 25 rape allegations including a case trying to get his DNA evidence to check a dress (sound familiar?) and the case where the other too-handsy dude has one rape allegation. Let's listen to ALL the women! www.businessinsider.com/women-accused-trump-sexual-misconduct-list-2017-12 I disagree 100% that Ford did not have supporting evidence. She had people she told. FWIW, I grew up at the same time she went to Holton Arms (literally a couple miles from my house) and knew many of the people they both went to school with. The parties and crap that happened are all true. Absolutely. This woman does NOT have supporting evidence. In fact, a few of her accountings have changed, which is why the NYT discredited her story. Her brother said she told him nothing and then came back and said, "oh wait, yes she did." She says she reported it to numerous people in the Senate, yet zero of those people say that it happened. I worked in DC in the 90s. I know that while that is POSSIBLE that people would have brushed it under the table, someone would have remembered and an accounting would have been written if she did exactly what she said she did. The 2 (I believe) people who remember are her friends and we have only their word. Dr. Ford had written proof that she told people about it. Ms. Reade does not. So leftturnonly you are incorrect. I don't know why Ms. Reade is coming out now. She literally had years to do this while he was running for VP and was in office. She could have done it when he started the campaign. Instead she has come out once he is the apparent nominee. Yes, I find it strange. I want to believe all women. However, I think we all know that it is idiotic to believe everyone blindly. I gave Ms. Reade the benefit of the doubt, but looking into what she has said, it doesn't sound plausible. I wonder if she didn't have some uncomfortable interaction with Biden and has embellished it. I think this seems more likely at this point. And while I know this has NOTHING to do with the accusations, Biden is handling this correctly. He is not calling her ugly or saying he'd never "do" her. He is not being anything but as respectful as someone who feels they were wrongly accused can be. Trump has over a dozen verified accusations of molestation and rape against him. What are we doing about that? She didn't "just" come out now. She came out with it to her local press in April of 2019. And she wasn't the only one.
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Post by iamkristinl16 on May 1, 2020 18:59:47 GMT
Every single person who blasted Kavanaugh and decided to believe Christine Blasey Ford when she had not one bit of supporting evidence for her wild and yet still oddly vague accusations against him owes it to all women to be consistent and get out there with their ME TOO posts of support for Tara Reade who does have contemporaneous support of her claim. I'm not holding my breath while I wait. Conversely every single Trump and Kavanaugh defender should have zero to say about these accusations right? Definitely! I can’t believe that the trump and Kavanaugh supporters here have the nerve to be demanding investigations, etc.
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Post by Darcy Collins on May 1, 2020 19:01:18 GMT
Really? A bunch of women came out last year talking about how Biden made them uncomfortable with his encroachment on personal space. I'm kind of shocked that anyone is really surprised. He's handsy. I am more surprised that Ms. Reade was not more explicit last year if she was going to choose to get explicit now. There is a difference between being “handsy” and what she is alleging. And I agree, if she was going to be explicit now, why wasn’t she then? I don’t know enough about the history of the allegations to know where to put the blame for this being brought up now vs in the past. I just know that I am frustrated that it wasn’t made more widely known until now. IMO, it isn’t too late for Biden to step down if there does seem to be credible evidence against him. But I will also be pissed if we are then stuck with Bernie because he has the next highest number of delegates. I think that when a powerful political figure is well known for being handsy, it's not hard to believe that those hands could have done more - how much is a question we'll probably never really know. What she claimed last year is different than what she's saying now. I have little doubt Biden acted inappropriately and touched her in a way that made her uncomfortable. Whether it was the explicit things she's saying now or what she said earlier, is where I'm not sure. I don't know the feasibility of his stepping down and will say emphatically that I'll take a handsy Biden over insane Bernie. Right now, I'm much more focused on his running mate.
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Post by beebee on May 1, 2020 19:07:35 GMT
I have a question.....she supposedly filed a police report. Did she do this recently or at the time of the alleged attack? Does anyone know?
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Post by littlemama on May 1, 2020 19:07:38 GMT
I think his statement was very well done and I appreciate the fact that he is attempting to find record of this alleged complaint. I would take Biden over Trump every day and twice on Sunday
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Post by crazy4scraps on May 1, 2020 19:08:08 GMT
Conversely every single Trump and Kavanaugh defender should have zero to say about these accusations right? Definitely! I can’t believe that the trump and Kavanaugh supporters here have the nerve to be demanding investigations, etc. You know exactly what they’ll say. IOKIYAR! Everyone else though needs to be held to a much higher standard. ETA:
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Post by Darcy Collins on May 1, 2020 19:09:00 GMT
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Post by beebee on May 1, 2020 19:12:54 GMT
Can anyone explain why this was brought up now? Biden has run for office several times and was VP. Why is this coming up now, and not even during the primaries? I saw an interview a few days ago and the reporter said he was watching the information come out over a period of time. He said he did not decide to really give the story attention until other witnesses backed her up. Then when he found out about the fact that she filed a poiice report, he knew it was a story that needed to be considered. He said the fact that she filed the police report puts her at risk because she could be criminally liable if she is lying. Edited to add: He also brought up the Larry King call-in that was found from years ago and how that really got his attention.
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peabay
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,630
Jun 25, 2014 19:50:41 GMT
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Post by peabay on May 1, 2020 19:13:58 GMT
Nope. They are not the same. Biden was probably inappropriate with a number of women. He will not actively destroy our country and our world. Convincing me isn’t going to get large numbers of people to the polls. The Democrats knew people, especially young people, are not excited to get out and vote for Biden. They chose him anyway. It was not a good choice. I don't know that you're right on this. I have four young adult daughters - super woke. Bernie supporters. All 4, and all of their friends, will vote for Biden. The goal is to get rid of Trump, not grandstand.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on May 1, 2020 19:15:39 GMT
Which leaves her open to prosecution for filing a false report if she's lying. Ford never filed any report at any time.
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Post by Darcy Collins on May 1, 2020 19:15:51 GMT
Can anyone explain why this was brought up now? Biden has run for office several times and was VP. Why is this coming up now, and not even during the primaries? I saw an interview a few days ago and the reporter said he was watching the information come out. He said he did not decide to really give it attention until other witnesses backed her up and then when he found out about the fact that she filed a poiice report, he knew it was a story that needed to be considered. He said the fact that she filed the police report puts her at risk because she could be criminally liable if she is lying. It's not clear that it does as it's not an active investigation and wasn't ever intending to be - her statement on why she did it:
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Post by lisae on May 1, 2020 19:19:13 GMT
I'm in the 'don't know/ don't care' camp. Nineteen more women would have to come forward with never-before-heard claims to make him as bad as Trump. If he did what she accuses him of, he was wrong. But right now, we have issues to discuss that affect hundreds of millions of people. Life and death issues.
What I want to hear from Biden is what his plans are for 2020 and beyond regarding vaccine development/distribution and righting the economy. That latter will take considerable work even if we manage to reopen businesses in May and June without a devastating hike in cases.
My priority is surviving the pandemic alive with my loved ones alive and having money n the bank that is still worth something because the entire economy hasn't collapsed, the national debit isn't so far off the charts we can't recover and the dollar hasn't become worthless. What happened in a hallway 25 years ago just doesn't rate for me at the moment. Maybe if this were the normal election year, but not now.
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Post by bazinga on May 1, 2020 19:21:10 GMT
Definitely! I can’t believe that the trump and Kavanaugh supporters here have the nerve to be demanding investigations, etc. You know exactly what they’ll say. IOKIYAR! Everyone else though needs to be held to a much higher standard. ETA: I didn’t think it was right to put Kavanaugh through that, and I don’t think it’s right to put Biden through it. Kavanaugh did have to go through it though, so I don’t know why Biden wouldn’t either, unless we want to admit it was wrong to do it to Kavanaugh.
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