|
|
Post by Merge on Feb 22, 2022 14:41:53 GMT
Funny thing about insults. You don’t get to decide whether or not the other person feels insulted. You don’t get to make yourself the victim when you’ve insulted someone else. Now if you’ll excuse me, I’m off to teach some divisive concepts, like understanding how the music of African slaves is the root of all the music we enjoy today. LMK if you need more deets so you can report me. Nothing I said in that thread was insulting without twisting yourself into being offended. So, what you're saying is, you didn't REALLY want to see proof, you were just using that as another asinine way to dismiss. Just like you twisting yourself into an offended pretzel on my thread in order to diminish anything I say. Got it. As usual, you completely fail to understand context. You posting that thread in the context of everything you’ve said here is insulting. Like offering someone a sticker after you’ve stomped all over them for years. I don’t have time right now to go back and look for whatever proof you’re claiming. I’m not convinced you even understand what sort of proof was being asked for in that exchange. Based on your bringing up the other thread, you seem to believe we were asking for proof of conservative victimhood, but that wasn’t it at all. You are not and never have been the misunderstood victim you like to believe. We see you quite clearly. |
|
|
|
Post by pixiechick on Feb 22, 2022 14:59:06 GMT
Nothing I said in that thread was insulting without twisting yourself into being offended. So, what you're saying is, you didn't REALLY want to see proof, you were just using that as another asinine way to dismiss. Just like you twisting yourself into an offended pretzel on my thread in order to diminish anything I say. Got it. As usual, you completely fail to understand context. You posting that thread in the context of everything you’ve said here is insulting. Like offering someone a sticker after you’ve stomped all over them for years. I don’t have time right now to go back and look for whatever proof you’re claiming. I’m not convinced you even understand what sort of proof was being asked for in that exchange. Based on your bringing up the other thread, you seem to believe we were asking for proof of conservative victimhood, but that wasn’t it at all. You are not and never have been the misunderstood victim you like to believe. We see you quite clearly. I don’t have time right now to go back and look for whatever proof you’re claiming. Not now, but of course you will since you asked specifically for it, right? I don't believe for a second that I'm a victim, and especially don't believe that I'm misunderstood. At all. |
|
|
|
Post by pixiechick on Feb 22, 2022 15:00:40 GMT
That’s what amazes me about this site. No matter what someone’s point of view is, no matter what their beliefs are no matter what proof they have to back their story/post, if someone doesn’t like what they have to say, even if the proof is undeniable, that person will be shit on, swore at and degraded. There really is no room for neutral here. Why can’t people be entitled to their own beliefs and/or opinions without being told that their opinion/beliefs don’t matter??? Why is that? Can you show us where the lefties hurt you? When did you show "undeniable" proof? Usually when questioned, you back off and say, I never said it was fact, just my opinion. A half-baked opinion from you or your favorite infotainer is not "undeniable proof." A video or article that doesn't actually show what is being claimed is not "undeniable proof." An article based on wild assertions with no evidence to back them up is not "undeniable proof." |
|
|
|
Post by pixiechick on Feb 22, 2022 15:04:40 GMT
You absolutely just proved my point. I never said “me”. I meant it as a generalized statement. But there you go with the degrading. There you go with backing off and claiming you didn't mean what you said when you're asked for specifics. But I'll play your game. Read the "you" in my post as the general "you," just as you're claiming that the "someone" you reference was some other random person and not yourself. Link us up. Give us a screenshot. Show us where someone on the right here posted "undeniable proof" and was uniformly rebuffed by the left.
I'm not sure how my describing what isn't actually undeniable proof is "degrading," as you say, but this form of victimhood does seem to be a strong theme among the right-wing peas. I’m not convinced you even understand what sort of proof was being asked for in that exchange. Based on your bringing up the other thread, you seem to believe we were asking for proof of conservative victimhood, but that wasn’t it at all. Seems pretty obvious to me, but do point out what it is that you think I don't understand. What context is missing? |
|
|
|
Post by mollycoddle on Feb 22, 2022 15:22:07 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 24, 2024 1:26:04 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2022 16:07:05 GMT
Just a response to explain my definition of home research. It is not a substitute for peer reviewed science at all. It is about trying to understand information better to put things into context so that it can help to make informed decisions. Numbers are meaningless without full context. Variables can alter conclusions. Home research is more than trying to keep up with scientific developments for me , it also includes keeping up to date with parliamentary debates and questions , together with health legislation. Knowing funders of trials and any potential conflict of interest. Long term follow ups , selection criteria , reporting of harms , trial protocol, the list goes on. Basically it gives a much better depth of understanding than just a shallow grasp. The old UK health guidelines that were damaging to people with a type of post viral illness were overturned in part by public scrutiny and legal release of clinical trial data through Freedom of Information requests. A court case brought by the UK information Commissioner on behalf of an Australian patient ( harmed by his country following UK NICE guidelines ) was based on his Freedom of Information request . The judge ruled in favour and it was the breakthrough needed to expose manipulated data and false reporting of results . Independent scientific and medical researchers were then able to reanalyse the raw data according to the original trial protocol and publish correct results. It made international news. This all contributed to the previous trial data being officially downgraded through a process of review held by NICE the National Institute of Health and Care Excellence over several years. It was reported in the UK Parliament as the biggest medical scandal of the 21st Century. The new health guidelines introduced a few months ago would never have changed without patients and their families doing home research. It has been a collective effort. www.nice.org.uk/guidance/ng206 I don’t whether this is unique to this particular post viral illness but the collaboration between patients /advocates and biomedical researchers has changed the previous dynamics. Post viral research currently also has an impact on Long Covid so I think this pertinent enough to mention it during this thread. Home research is not instead of peer reviewed science but in addition to. Learning and questioning things can bring better understanding and result in significant changes to patient care. |
|
|
|
Post by cindosha on Feb 22, 2022 16:24:17 GMT
The protesters and everyone else I know, want the mandates ended. We want to go where we want, when we want, without restriction. The mask mandates as well as the vaccines have been proven to not be as effective as the drug companies thought they would be. EVERYONE is getting some form of covid whether you wear 6 masks or none, if you have been quadruple boosted or not. If you want to continue to wear a mask, by all means, do so. We now know that the overwhelming number of deaths, over 75%, occurred in people who had at least four comorbidities, so really these are people who were sick to begin with. We also know that the vaccine does not prevent you from getting covid and that you can get it from someone who is vaxed, boosted and masked, even if YOU are vaxed, boosted and masked. We also know that children are suffering in school because of this pandemic and that many are now far behind their learning because of virtual schooling. We know that the vast majority of people do not follow the mask mandates anyway, (super bowl and other very large sporting events, concerts, politicians not wearing masks at events, pro mask people being found on social medial without masks on, etc). We also know that a little piece of plexiglass in front of you at a register in a store does NOTHING to stop the airborne droplets from going over, under or around that little piece of plexiglass. That's just common logic FFS. At this point, we need to learn how to live with this virus and get on with life. You've made your selfishness regarding masks perfectly clear. And please show how children are suffering. Do you have any studies or personal experience? In my personal experience, elementary school kids are doing just fine with masks, even the littles and kids with sensory issues. The only ones that have a problem are adults. First of all, I never said masks on kids, I said virtual schooling...But as usual you twisted what I said. www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/education/2020/12/13/covid-online-school-tutoring-plan/6334907002/en.unesco.org/covid19/educationresponse/consequenceswww.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=252908www.insidehighered.com/news/2021/08/25/first-year-students-struggled-online-learning-last-year
You've made your selfishness regarding masks perfectly clear.
There is absolutely nothing selfish about not doing something that doesn't work and most people don't do anyway. AND there is nothing wrong with not wanting to be restricted in everything we do. |
|
|
|
Post by pixiechick on Feb 22, 2022 16:34:43 GMT
The protesters and everyone else I know, want the mandates ended. We want to go where we want, when we want, without restriction. The mask mandates as well as the vaccines have been proven to not be as effective as the drug companies thought they would be. EVERYONE is getting some form of covid whether you wear 6 masks or none, if you have been quadruple boosted or not. If you want to continue to wear a mask, by all means, do so. We now know that the overwhelming number of deaths, over 75%, occurred in people who had at least four comorbidities, so really these are people who were sick to begin with. We also know that the vaccine does not prevent you from getting covid and that you can get it from someone who is vaxed, boosted and masked, even if YOU are vaxed, boosted and masked. We also know that children are suffering in school because of this pandemic and that many are now far behind their learning because of virtual schooling. We know that the vast majority of people do not follow the mask mandates anyway, (super bowl and other very large sporting events, concerts, politicians not wearing masks at events, pro mask people being found on social medial without masks on, etc). We also know that a little piece of plexiglass in front of you at a register in a store does NOTHING to stop the airborne droplets from going over, under or around that little piece of plexiglass. That's just common logic FFS. At this point, we need to learn how to live with this virus and get on with life. You've made your selfishness regarding masks perfectly clear. And please show how children are suffering. Do you have any studies or personal experience? In my personal experience, elementary school kids are doing just fine with masks, even the littles and kids with sensory issues. The only ones that have a problem are adults. Not so.
From The Atlantic |
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 24, 2024 1:26:04 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2022 16:48:53 GMT
There is absolutely nothing selfish about not doing something that doesn't work and most people don't do anyway. Please post links to peer-reviewed studies showing that masks don't help slow the spread of covid. |
|
|
|
Post by onelasttime on Feb 22, 2022 16:51:04 GMT
You've made your selfishness regarding masks perfectly clear. And please show how children are suffering. Do you have any studies or personal experience? In my personal experience, elementary school kids are doing just fine with masks, even the littles and kids with sensory issues. The only ones that have a problem are adults. Not so.
From The AtlanticHow you coming along with the request below from @zima? You going to post the studies anytime soon? You “Especially given the new science and most recent information that has come out about who is most and least at risk. And the new science about the effectiveness of natural immunity.” @ zima “Please post this "new science" peer-reviewed study(ies).” Or are you going to continue to air your manufactured grievances? |
|
|
|
Post by cindosha on Feb 22, 2022 16:56:50 GMT
There is absolutely nothing selfish about not doing something that doesn't work and most people don't do anyway. Please post links to peer-reviewed studies showing that masks don't help slow the spread of covid. I don't need to post a peer reviewed study. All you need to know is that people who religiously wear masks still get covid. You don't need a study for that. It happens all the time. Ask some of the people on this board who have gotten covid despite wearing a mask and being vaxed. |
|
|
|
Post by cade387 on Feb 22, 2022 17:03:41 GMT
Please post links to peer-reviewed studies showing that masks don't help slow the spread of covid. I don't need to post a peer reviewed study. All you need to know is that people who religiously wear masks still get covid. You don't need a study for that. It happens all the time. Ask some of the people on this board who have gotten covid despite wearing a mask and being vaxed. That would be because the people around them who have COVId are supposed to be wearing the mask. The mask offers way less protection from getting as it does for preventing COVId. Two years in and you still don’t understand that? |
|
|
|
Post by cindosha on Feb 22, 2022 17:14:32 GMT
I don't need to post a peer reviewed study. All you need to know is that people who religiously wear masks still get covid. You don't need a study for that. It happens all the time. Ask some of the people on this board who have gotten covid despite wearing a mask and being vaxed. That would be because the people around them who have COVId are supposed to be wearing the mask. The mask offers way less protection from getting as it does for preventing COVId. Two years in and you still don’t understand that? Then the mask doesn't help at all does it. You would have to be infectious to spread it, right? How do you know you are infectious? You really think people are going to be wearing masks for the rest of their lives? Nothing is going to change when "the science" says the pandemic is over. The same people who are carriers are still going to be carriers and the people who catch it are still going to be catching it. Masks/vaccines or not. |
|
anonaname
Full Member
Posts: 256
Aug 18, 2021 0:04:22 GMT
|
Post by anonaname on Feb 22, 2022 17:30:55 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 24, 2024 1:26:04 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2022 17:36:42 GMT
ll you need to know is that people who religiously wear masks still get covid. Wow. How is it possible to be so ill-informed. Of course people will still get covid, even if masked. The question is WILL LESS GET IT THAN IF NO ONE IS MASKED. FFS. Do you have to work hard to be so uninformed? Or does it come naturally? |
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 24, 2024 1:26:04 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2022 17:38:38 GMT
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19216002/ Picked one at random since you were too lazy to blurb the findings in each. For the one above: Conclusion: Face mask use in health care workers has not been demonstrated to provide benefit in terms of cold symptoms or getting colds. A larger study is needed to definitively establish noninferiority of no mask use. |
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 24, 2024 1:26:04 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2022 17:41:25 GMT
bmjopen.bmj.com/content/5/4/e006577.long Man, you're really bad at this: "Conclusions This study is the first RCT of cloth masks, and the results caution against the use of cloth masks. This is an important finding to inform occupational health and safety. Moisture retention, reuse of cloth masks and poor filtration may result in increased risk of infection. F urther research is needed to inform the widespread use of cloth masks globally. However, as a precautionary measure, cloth masks should not be recommended for HCWs, particularly in high-risk situations, and guidelines need to be updated."This is about CLOTH MASKS for HEALTH CARE WORKERS. That is not what is being advocated. The CDC has long issued guidance on N95 EQUIVALENTS or double-masking. And we're not talking about the CLEARLY HIGH RISKS of health care settings. We're talking about indoor use like going to the grocery store. You really suck at presenting evidence to bolster your case. |
|
|
|
Post by Darcy Collins on Feb 22, 2022 17:46:34 GMT
The first actual large, randomized study of mask effectiveness in use in a population was just finished by Stanford and Yale, they posted their findings (which showed masks helped), but has not yet been published. The NIH is just beginning a large study on children looking at both effectiveness in spread and impact on milestones. Most information has come from looking at aersol size, results from looking at other viruses Flu, SARs etc. This study (peer reviewed) actually looked at all of the different types of evidence on which the CDC used to make their recommendations - not to mention the WHO and other country's health departments. www.pnas.org/content/118/4/e2014564118The Stanford/Yale study (not yet peer reviewed) med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2021/09/surgical-masks-covid-19.htmlIt's a pandemic, perfect information from large, random studies that can be written, reviewed and published take time - and decisions will be made and changed as more information becomes available, it frustrating for everyone involved, but there isn't a gotcha here. |
|
anonaname
Full Member
Posts: 256
Aug 18, 2021 0:04:22 GMT
|
Post by anonaname on Feb 22, 2022 17:47:55 GMT
You really suck at presenting evidence to bolster your case. Because I don't cherry-pick the research and only present evidence that supports my position? I could do that, but I'm not afraid that statement is in there because guess what? It does support the fact that MORE RESEARCH IS NEEDED but they locked down the entire world anyway. Do better.  |
|
|
|
Post by gar on Feb 22, 2022 17:51:38 GMT
It does support the fact that MORE RESEARCH IS NEEDED but they locked down the entire world anyway. So perhaps they should have said "Don't bother with masks during this pandemic" and when they found out later how many millions of deaths it could have prevented said "Oh well, we couldn't be 100% sure so we went with 'what the hell., why bother'. |
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 24, 2024 1:26:04 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2022 17:53:27 GMT
Because I don't cherry-pick the research and only present evidence that supports my position? Because you can't find peer-reviewed studies that bolster your bs opinion that "masks don't work", when the science shows THEY DO WORK when used as advised and in different configurations for different settings. |
|
|
|
Post by mollycoddle on Feb 22, 2022 18:01:13 GMT
You really suck at presenting evidence to bolster your case. Because I don't cherry-pick the research and only present evidence that supports my position? I could do that, but I'm not afraid that statement is in there because guess what? It does support the fact that MORE RESEARCH IS NEEDED but they locked down the entire world anyway. Do better. See, I would think that if more research is needed, that during a pandemic it would be wise to err on the side of caution. Guess some folks like to give Covid a sporting chance, eh? |
|
|
|
Post by cindosha on Feb 22, 2022 18:03:53 GMT
ll you need to know is that people who religiously wear masks still get covid. Wow. How is it possible to be so ill-informed. Of course people will still get covid, even if masked. The question is WILL LESS GET IT THAN IF NO ONE IS MASKED. FFS. Do you have to work hard to be so uninformed? Or does it come naturally? Then the mask doesn't help at all does it. You would have to be infectious to spread it, right? How do you know you are infectious? You really think people are going to be wearing masks for the rest of their lives? Nothing is going to change when "the science" says the pandemic is over. The same people who are carriers are still going to be carriers and the people who catch it are still going to be catching it. Masks/vaccines or not. FFS. Do you have to work hard to be so uninformed? Or does it come naturally?
Do you plan on wearing a mask for the rest of your life? Because covid, like the flu, will be around forever. And YOU DON'T KNOW IF SOMEONE WHO IS MASKED/VAXED OR SOMEONE WHO IS NOT MASKED/VAXED IS GIVING IT TO YOU BECAUSE THERE NO WAY TO TELL. AND YOU NEVER WILL BE ABLE TO MAKE THAT DIFFERENTIATION!!!!!!!!! You could be getting infected by someone who is fully masked and fully vaxed and boosted. If masks don't prevent you from getting it and vaccines don't prevent you from getting it, then what is the point of wearing a mask? Actually, logic comes naturally for me. |
|
|
|
Post by cindosha on Feb 22, 2022 18:10:05 GMT
Because I don't cherry-pick the research and only present evidence that supports my position? Because you can't find peer-reviewed studies that bolster your bs opinion that "masks don't work", when the science shows THEY DO WORK when used as advised and in different configurations for different settings. Except even your supposedly most prudent mask wearers (politicians, sports figures, actors, etc) didn't wear them and gathered, unmasked, countless times during the last two years and especially in the past 6 -12 months. So not everyone complied "as advised". |
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Nov 24, 2024 1:26:04 GMT
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2022 18:14:03 GMT
Guess some folks like to give Covid a sporting chance, eh? Read SorryAntiVaxxer site. Thousands and thousands of dead people who gave Covid the benefit of the doubt. Covid did not return the favor. Even for young and healthy people (as the latest meme on the right is that just fat and/or sick people got covid). |
|
|
|
Post by gar on Feb 22, 2022 18:16:52 GMT
So not everyone complied "as advised". There's that 100% or nothing thinking again. I thought you said you were logical. |
|
|
|
Post by aj2hall on Feb 22, 2022 18:26:05 GMT
These protestors think they are being oppressed, but they are not. I agree with this guy. The protesters and everyone else I know, want the mandates ended. We want to go where we want, when we want, without restriction. The mask mandates as well as the vaccines have been proven to not be as effective as the drug companies thought they would be. EVERYONE is getting some form of covid whether you wear 6 masks or none, if you have been quadruple boosted or not. If you want to continue to wear a mask, by all means, do so. We now know that the overwhelming number of deaths, over 75%, occurred in people who had at least four comorbidities, so really these are people who were sick to begin with. We also know that the vaccine does not prevent you from getting covid and that you can get it from someone who is vaxed, boosted and masked, even if YOU are vaxed, boosted and masked. We also know that children are suffering in school because of this pandemic and that many are now far behind their learning because of virtual schooling. We know that the vast majority of people do not follow the mask mandates anyway, (super bowl and other very large sporting events, concerts, politicians not wearing masks at events, pro mask people being found on social medial without masks on, etc). We also know that a little piece of plexiglass in front of you at a register in a store does NOTHING to stop the airborne droplets from going over, under or around that little piece of plexiglass. That's just common logic FFS. At this point, we need to learn how to live with this virus and get on with life. How are they suffering in school now? I thought you were referring to masks. Most of your rant and previous ones are about masks, it's not hard to see why someone might think you were referring to children suffering in school now from masks. If you were referring to virtual learning, what schools are doing remote learning right now? What exactly did you mean by suffering now? |
|
|
|
Post by cindosha on Feb 22, 2022 18:26:37 GMT
So not everyone complied "as advised". There's that 100% or nothing thinking again. I thought you said you were logical. Go two posts up where I was replying to zima. Apparently you didn't understand my point to her. |
|
|
|
Post by paigewh on Feb 22, 2022 18:28:04 GMT
We now know that the overwhelming number of deaths, over 75%, occurred in people who had at least four comorbidities, so really these are people who were sick to begin with. I rarely comment on these threads, but this comment right here makes me so mad I just can't let it go. My youngest daughter has an autoimmune disease. We kept her home until the vaccine was available, then she started school this fall fully vaccinated. When we had an Omincron surge after Christmas, she studied from home, then went back when the numbers dropped. Last week she had a high fever, and of course, it was COVID. She is still pretty sick this week, but thank the good lord for the vaccine. How dare you discount those deaths? That is someone's loved one. In our family we've known five people who died. Only two had significant comorbidities. Even then, any death is a death. We get it. You DO NOT want to be told what to do, but at least have respect to those who have lost loved ones or those who DO have medical issues. GRRRR. |
|
|
|
Post by cindosha on Feb 22, 2022 18:30:51 GMT
The protesters and everyone else I know, want the mandates ended. We want to go where we want, when we want, without restriction. The mask mandates as well as the vaccines have been proven to not be as effective as the drug companies thought they would be. EVERYONE is getting some form of covid whether you wear 6 masks or none, if you have been quadruple boosted or not. If you want to continue to wear a mask, by all means, do so. We now know that the overwhelming number of deaths, over 75%, occurred in people who had at least four comorbidities, so really these are people who were sick to begin with. We also know that the vaccine does not prevent you from getting covid and that you can get it from someone who is vaxed, boosted and masked, even if YOU are vaxed, boosted and masked. We also know that children are suffering in school because of this pandemic and that many are now far behind their learning because of virtual schooling. We know that the vast majority of people do not follow the mask mandates anyway, (super bowl and other very large sporting events, concerts, politicians not wearing masks at events, pro mask people being found on social medial without masks on, etc). We also know that a little piece of plexiglass in front of you at a register in a store does NOTHING to stop the airborne droplets from going over, under or around that little piece of plexiglass. That's just common logic FFS. At this point, we need to learn how to live with this virus and get on with life. How are they suffering in school now? I thought you were referring to masks. Most of your rant and previous ones are about masks, it's not hard to see why someone might think you were referring to children suffering in school now from masks. If you were referring to virtual learning, what schools are doing remote learning right now? What exactly did you mean by suffering now? Go read it again. I never said masks, and I never said now. Good Lord, woman!!! After you read the post, go back and read the links in my post. |
|
