tracylynn
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,899
Jun 26, 2014 22:49:09 GMT
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Post by tracylynn on Jun 2, 2015 20:38:25 GMT
He can do whatever he wants to change his outward appearance but he is still the same on the inside and he's still a man. He was born a man and his DNA will prove he is a man. I think he's living a bigger lie now because he is NOT a woman. Seriously, move along. No one wants to hear your drivel. Her life doesn't effect your life and I pray to god you never have a family member who is going through such a thing.
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tracylynn
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,899
Jun 26, 2014 22:49:09 GMT
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Post by tracylynn on Jun 2, 2015 20:41:48 GMT
I just don't see how you can follow Christian values and be so unsupportive of someone else. I hope no one in your life comes to you in any kind of identity crisis because it doesn't seem like you have what it takes to be supportive and loving. You don't know me so don't make conclusions on what I would and would not do. In this case, I refuse to be his cheerleader. That would mean I'd be condoning it. All the makeup, surgery and corsets won't make him a woman. I'll stick by my Christian values thank you. I can love someone and still not agree with that they do. I'm not sure you understand what christian values mean. But go on with your bad self.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2015 20:46:40 GMT
Of course you can, I wouldn't agree with my brother taking drugs or beating his girlfriend but I'd still love him. If on the other hand he had done something that meant he was finally living the life he wanted in the body he wanted, if he'd at long last found peace and acceptance of self I'd be over the moon for him. That is I think the difference.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2015 20:48:29 GMT
I just don't see how you can follow Christian values and be so unsupportive of someone else. I hope no one in your life comes to you in any kind of identity crisis because it doesn't seem like you have what it takes to be supportive and loving. You don't know me so don't make conclusions on what I would and would not do. In this case, I refuse to be his cheerleader. That would mean I'd be condoning it. All the makeup, surgery and corsets won't make him a woman. I'll stick by my Christian values thank you. I can love someone and still not agree with that they do. Matthew 7:1-5
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2015 20:49:02 GMT
I just typed out a long response then deleted it. You're not worth the time or the effort, you're so entrenched in your narrow minded little word nothing anyone says will change that. I've read all these posts about how good he looks and how happy most people are for him and I'm not attacking anyone. I just stated my opinion which you obviously can't handle because it's different than yours. And you are right, nothing you can say will change my mind because I know in my heart what is right and what is wrong and I know what the Bible teaches. I form my opinions on that basis. If you perceive that as being narrow minded that's fine. God made him a man and he'll always be a man. If he wants to deceive himself that's not my problem. Tell me you see the irony in this statement.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2015 20:51:43 GMT
I had no idea the Bible addressed transgender issue or how to determine what gender one is.
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Post by M~ on Jun 2, 2015 21:00:21 GMT
What I find beautiful is that she is loving who she is and can finally show it. So many of us battle issues of self-identity and self-perception. Whether it's gender, sex, weight, etc. it's heartwarming to see that someone is happy with what/who they really are. I really don't care about the picture one way or the other---it's great that she's happy. That's what matters. And, if you are a believer, you're no one to judge. That's what God is there for.
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back to *pea*ality
Pearl Clutcher
Not my circus, not my monkeys ~refugee pea #59
Posts: 3,149
Jun 25, 2014 19:51:11 GMT
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Post by back to *pea*ality on Jun 2, 2015 21:02:08 GMT
I just don't see how you can follow Christian values and be so unsupportive of someone else. I hope no one in your life comes to you in any kind of identity crisis because it doesn't seem like you have what it takes to be supportive and loving. You don't know me so don't make conclusions on what I would and would not do. In this case, I refuse to be his cheerleader. That would mean I'd be condoning it. All the makeup, surgery and corsets won't make him a woman. I'll stick by my Christian values thank you. I can love someone and still not agree with that they do. No one is suggesting you change your "Christian values". I think what is missing from your post is compassion for another human being. Someone who was born in a male body but whose soul is female.
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Post by Regina Phalange on Jun 2, 2015 21:04:40 GMT
And you're still a judgmental troll. Live and let live. Does it really affect your life in any way? This is the new Duggar apologist. I'm wondering if they found this site while googling the Duggar situation and they joined just so they can spew their crap and now they are on to Caitlyn.
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Post by tarheelgurl on Jun 2, 2015 21:35:11 GMT
I've read all these posts about how good he looks and how happy most people are for him and I'm not attacking anyone. I just stated my opinion which you obviously can't handle because it's different than yours. And you are right, nothing you can say will change my mind because I know in my heart what is right and what is wrong and I know what the Bible teaches. I form my opinions on that basis. If you perceive that as being narrow minded that's fine. God made him a man and he'll always be a man. If he wants to deceive himself that's not my problem. Tell me you see the irony in this statement. Irony? I commented on Bruce Jenner and was attacked for my opinion because it wasn't in line with most everyone else. I didn't attack anyone here. The negative comments don't surprize me. I know I'm in the minority but I still have the right to think the way I do. Refusing to be a cheerleader for what is clearly wrong is not a lack of human compassion and disagreeing with it is not being judgmental. We will just have to agree to disagree.
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,600
Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Jun 2, 2015 21:51:54 GMT
Tell me you see the irony in this statement. Irony? I commented on Bruce Jenner and was attacked for my opinion because it wasn't in line with most everyone else. I didn't attack anyone here. The negative comments don't surprize me. I know I'm in the minority but I still have the right to think the way I do. Refusing to be a cheerleader for what is clearly wrong is not a lack of human compassion and disagreeing with it is not being judgmental. We will just have to agree to disagree. Clearly not judgemental at all . It would appear that most of the posters here don't see it as "clearly wrong". Just you and the few that believe like you, and the god you worship. Funny how an individual's god shares the same predjudices they do. That's convenient.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Jun 2, 2015 22:06:12 GMT
I just typed out a long response then deleted it. You're not worth the time or the effort, you're so entrenched in your narrow minded little word nothing anyone says will change that. I've read all these posts about how good he looks and how happy most people are for him and I'm not attacking anyone. I just stated my opinion which you obviously can't handle because it's different than yours. And you are right, nothing you can say will change my mind because I know in my heart what is right and what is wrong and I know what the Bible teaches. I form my opinions on that basis. If you perceive that as being narrow minded that's fine. God made him a man and he'll always be a man. If he wants to deceive himself that's not my problem. Your heart is wrong. Your opinion is moot.
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Post by ktdoesntscrap on Jun 2, 2015 23:14:30 GMT
Can I ask a stupid question - has she had breast augmentation? It sort of looks like it from the picture, but I'm not a good photoshop spotter so I don't know what's "real" vs. enhanced (I realize that doesn't make any sense). I give her credit for waiting to be post -menopausal to transition to a woman. At least she doesn't have to have periods because there isn't a man in the world - Olympic decathlete or not, that could handle a period from hell. Huh? A person who has had gender reassignment surgery doesn't have her period.... she doesn't have a uterus.
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Post by alittleintrepid on Jun 2, 2015 23:16:39 GMT
And you're still a judgmental troll. Live and let live. Does it really affect your life in any way? This is the new Duggar apologist. I'm wondering if they found this site while googling the Duggar situation and they joined just so they can spew their crap and now they are on to Caitlyn. I think the Duggar apologist had a few posts in February so I think it's a resident troll or alter-ego.
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Post by ktdoesntscrap on Jun 2, 2015 23:20:59 GMT
I just don't see how you can follow Christian values and be so unsupportive of someone else. I hope no one in your life comes to you in any kind of identity crisis because it doesn't seem like you have what it takes to be supportive and loving. You don't know me so don't make conclusions on what I would and would not do. In this case, I refuse to be his cheerleader. That would mean I'd be condoning it. All the makeup, surgery and corsets won't make him a woman. I'll stick by my Christian values thank you. I can love someone and still not agree with that they do. hmm what did Jesus say about it??/ How is this a Christian Value? Does the bible address cross dressing? Trans gender? Trans Sexuals? I don't think so... what the Bible does address is being a compassionate loving person.....
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Post by nightnurse on Jun 2, 2015 23:25:24 GMT
I just typed out a long response then deleted it. You're not worth the time or the effort, you're so entrenched in your narrow minded little word nothing anyone says will change that. I've read all these posts about how good he looks and how happy most people are for him and I'm not attacking anyone. I just stated my opinion which you obviously can't handle because it's different than yours. And you are right, nothing you can say will change my mind because I know in my heart what is right and what is wrong and I know what the Bible teaches. I form my opinions on that basis. If you perceive that as being narrow minded that's fine. God made him a man and he'll always be a man. If he wants to deceive himself that's not my problem. So why would a loving god create a man and then give him the feeling that he was really supposed to be a woman? Some kind of test? Punishment for some sin? Does the bible explain that? I'm not being snarky, just genuinely curious. I have heard from others that "god doesn't make mistakes, he's supposed to be a man" and that it must be the devil's influence or a mental health disorder or sin that makes a person identify with the opposite gender. To me, that's a giant cop out. God gets all of the credit and none of the blame, because the blame always falls on the individual or some nefarious evil spirit and not on the all-powerful creator who doesn't make mistakes but creates people to live lives of suffering. So I would love to hear what the prevailing Christian wisdom is on this.
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Post by tarheelgurl on Jun 3, 2015 0:15:20 GMT
I hesitated to reply because I don't want to hijack this thread but you did ask. We live in a fallen world where sin prevails. We choose our own path. Why would you want to blame a loving sovereign God for what sinful man chooses to do? People want to blame God so they don't have to take responsibility for their own actions when they suffer the consequences of their sin. God does not make mistakes. He would not create someone in his likeness and give him the desire to be the opposite gender. That is from the enemy. The more one sins the more it becomes natural to him.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 0:16:23 GMT
Can I ask a stupid question - has she had breast augmentation? It sort of looks like it from the picture, but I'm not a good photoshop spotter so I don't know what's "real" vs. enhanced (I realize that doesn't make any sense). I give her credit for waiting to be post -menopausal to transition to a woman. At least she doesn't have to have periods because there isn't a man in the world - Olympic decathlete or not, that could handle a period from hell. Huh? A person who has had gender reassignment surgery doesn't have her period.... she doesn't have a uterus. He has had PMS his entire life raising and being around that many women
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Jun 3, 2015 0:29:36 GMT
I hesitated to reply because I don't want to hijack this thread but you did ask. We live in a fallen world where sin prevails. We choose our own path. Why would you want to blame a loving sovereign God for what sinful man chooses to do? People want to blame God so they don't have to take responsibility for their own actions when they suffer the consequences of their sin. God does not make mistakes. He would not create someone in his likeness and give him the desire to be the opposite gender. That is from the enemy. The more one sins the more it becomes natural to him. Like the exploding human appendix or putting men's testicles on the outside? The fact that we have too many teeth for our jaws? How about the fact that we breathe and eat through the same opening? Or that the eye sees everything upside down?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 0:30:54 GMT
I hesitated to reply because I don't want to hijack this thread but you did ask. We live in a fallen world where sin prevails. We choose our own path. Why would you want to blame a loving sovereign God for what sinful man chooses to do? People want to blame God so they don't have to take responsibility for their own actions when they suffer the consequences of their sin. God does not make mistakes. He would not create someone in his likeness and give him the desire to be the opposite gender. That is from the enemy. The more one sins the more it becomes natural to him. So what about hermaphodites?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 0:33:44 GMT
I hesitated to reply because I don't want to hijack this thread but you did ask. We live in a fallen world where sin prevails. We choose our own path. Why would you want to blame a loving sovereign God for what sinful man chooses to do? People want to blame God so they don't have to take responsibility for their own actions when they suffer the consequences of their sin. God does not make mistakes. He would not create someone in his likeness and give him the desire to be the opposite gender. That is from the enemy. The more one sins the more it becomes natural to him. Like the exploding human appendix or putting men's testicles on the outside? The fact that we have too many teeth for our jaws? How about the fact that we breathe and eat through the same opening? Or that the eye sees everything upside down? This is the work of Satan? Really?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 0:35:24 GMT
I'm so glad the Christians in my life aren't so literal.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Jun 3, 2015 0:39:13 GMT
The other possibility is that God created Jenner a transgender woman to see if you would extend compassion or derision.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 0:40:45 GMT
The other possibility is that God created Jenner a transgender woman to see if you would extend compassion or derision. Or, God doesn't exist and biology is a spectrum.
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Post by Regina Phalange on Jun 3, 2015 0:47:47 GMT
I hesitated to reply because I don't want to hijack this thread but you did ask. We live in a fallen world where sin prevails. We choose our own path. Why would you want to blame a loving sovereign God for what sinful man chooses to do? People want to blame God so they don't have to take responsibility for their own actions when they suffer the consequences of their sin. God does not make mistakes. He would not create someone in his likeness and give him the desire to be the opposite gender. That is from the enemy. The more one sins the more it becomes natural to him. How can God have a plan but we choose our own path? Can't have it both ways depending on the situation.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Jun 3, 2015 0:50:27 GMT
The other possibility is that God created Jenner a transgender woman to see if you would extend compassion or derision. Or, God doesn't exist and biology is a spectrum. Yes, but if there's no God, that would mean that the only reason that we hold ourselves above others is that we're just dicks.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 0:51:44 GMT
Or, God doesn't exist and biology is a spectrum. Yes, but if there's no God, that would mean that the only reason that we hold ourselves above others is that we're just dicks. Hmmm... there's a sort of truthiness about that statement...
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 0:53:13 GMT
I'm so glad the Christians in my life aren't so literal. The Christians in my life ARE this literal unfortunately. They are also far away right now and don't need to debate it with them. This may sound like something way out in left field, but I am wondering if evolution failed Bruce Jenner. If he had been having these thoughts all his life since childhood, did Mother Nature just make a mistake and not make him born Caitlyn from the beginning? Sure it took him 65 years of anguish to realize he is a woman and needs to evolve as a human. I am happy for Caitlyn. She looks great, has a great body and face. She has a team working to preserve her great looks as she is a Kardashian Jenner even through divorce and I hope she makes the most of her 40 years left of her life. She is entitled to eternal happiness.
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Post by katiekaty on Jun 3, 2015 1:14:02 GMT
I hesitated to reply because I don't want to hijack this thread but you did ask. We live in a fallen world where sin prevails. We choose our own path. Why would you want to blame a loving sovereign God for what sinful man chooses to do? People want to blame God so they don't have to take responsibility for their own actions when they suffer the consequences of their sin. God does not make mistakes. He would not create someone in his likeness and give him the desire to be the opposite gender. That is from the enemy. The more one sins the more it becomes natural to him. And we live in a world where the is a Good and Kind and Loving and Forgiving God who has allowed us that wondrous thing to amongst us called science, medicine and free will to decide what to do with all the knowledge that making has gleaned while living on this world. Do you actually thinks we are supposed to be ignorant of this that we shouldn't use this knowledge to correct things that might go wrong on the production line called conception/pregnancy and birth? How many children would die from congenital heart disease? women with breast cancer? Cleft lip? Diabetes? Kidney failure and transplants?How can we not conclude that just the wrong genetic switch might not have been flipped and now we are able to compassionately assist this segment of people who need it? I really believe God lets us discover what we need to get along as this world evolves. To not move forward and accept that science is to tell God screw you. Of course you have the free will to believe as you wish and pick and choose what you want, but I firmly believe that if I died and didn't avail myself of scientific methods and medicine, God would probably laugh at me at the Pearly gates and tell me why didn't I get the help he sent me! I feel the same way about SRS-for some that is the assistance and it definitely is not my place to judge!
And the only other thing I have to say is: Why couldn't they make the corset fit her properly? It messy and loose! She deserves better!
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 6, 2024 21:19:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2015 2:01:20 GMT
I hesitated to reply because I don't want to hijack this thread but you did ask. We live in a fallen world where sin prevails. We choose our own path. Why would you want to blame a loving sovereign God for what sinful man chooses to do? People want to blame God so they don't have to take responsibility for their own actions when they suffer the consequences of their sin. God does not make mistakes. He would not create someone in his likeness and give him the desire to be the opposite gender. That is from the enemy. The more one sins the more it becomes natural to him. So what about hermaphodites? Adding to this, do you realize that 1 in 2000 babies are born with intersex sex organs - hermaphrodites. One in TWO THOUSAND. There are more people with both sexes (although a sex most likely was assigned) than there are Jews.
That doesn't exactly seem to be an abnormal birth defect. These people didn't choose it. And surely a baby in the womb is not being "punished." So what is your explanation. How could God do this? What if the "wrong" sex is selected for the baby (for what it's worth, it's against current wisdom to make a selection as an infant now, but it's been done since the beginning until just very, very recently) (Also, intersexed is the correct term now - not hermaphrodite.)
(There's an excellent documentary on this on Amazon - free on Prime - called Intersexion)
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