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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Jul 12, 2015 17:08:17 GMT
link to articleI just put a library hold on the book Hand To Mouth: Living In Bootstrap America by Linda Tirado. I'm looking forward to reading it.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 23:21:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2015 17:15:51 GMT
Sounds very insightful and realistic. I think so many people don't understand how complex poverty, or just not being well-off, really is.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 23:21:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2015 17:19:35 GMT
But if you just work hard, everything will be ok, right? Sarcasm
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katybee
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,378
Jun 25, 2014 23:25:39 GMT
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Post by katybee on Jul 12, 2015 17:20:49 GMT
Very interesting. Makes me so grateful for what I do have...
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Post by gmcwife1 on Jul 12, 2015 17:21:53 GMT
Too many people view things through their eyes and experiences only and can't relate to others so they just don't understand.
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Post by lumo on Jul 12, 2015 17:27:11 GMT
Thanks for posting. I just downloaded the book from my library. Looks like it'll be an interesting read.
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huskergal
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,002
Jun 25, 2014 20:22:13 GMT
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Post by huskergal on Jul 12, 2015 17:50:33 GMT
So many people are one catastrophe away from poverty. I know people will come on and say that most people in poverty are living outside their means, but in reality they can't be, because they don't have credit. They have to pay cash for everything. When the cash runs out, they have nothing until the next paycheck.
When I was a first year teacher, granted it was a long time ago, I took home $985 a month. I was lucky enough to have a fixed income apartment in the small town where I taught, but I had student loan payments and a car payment. The last week before my next pay check, I was living off what I had in the house to eat and hoping nothing happened. I did have a credit card, but I tried not to use it.
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Post by Amelia Bedelia on Jul 12, 2015 18:04:20 GMT
Thanks for sharing. I'll be checking into the book as well.
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Post by momof3pits on Jul 12, 2015 18:06:10 GMT
Thanks for sharing. Some people on my newsfeed need t read this.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Jul 12, 2015 18:12:08 GMT
So many people are one catastrophe away from poverty. I know people will come on and say that most people in poverty are living outside their means, but in reality they can't be, because they don't have credit. They have to pay cash for everything. When the cash runs out, they have nothing until the next paycheck. When I was a first year teacher, granted it was a long time ago, I took home $985 a month. I was lucky enough to have a fixed income apartment in the small town where I taught, but I had student loan payments and a car payment. The last week before my next pay check, I was living off what I had in the house to eat and hoping nothing happened. I did have a credit card, but I tried not to use it. You can be living outside your means without credit. I have two young nephews who are experiencing this right now. They're young and struggling to find regular, steady employment. They asked for my assistance in developing a budget - and I have to say despite their circumstances, they are still living outside their means - and it's not through credit. Their biggest issue will be housing. The reality of their income means they really, really need to economize drastically right now when it comes to housing, or they will see the article's scenario of one too many rainy days = unsteady work = eviction. But they insist they need a 2 bedroom apartment. I fully understand that it's not ideal to share a room when you're 21 and 23. But if they would share a room for a short period of time and build a bit of a cushion for the times when they know they won't have full income (their work is VERY seasonal) they wouldn't be facing a near certainty of eviction with all the associated costs involved. They went forward with renting an apartment that they really can only afford if everything goes perfectly - and we all know that things will not go perfectly. I completely agree with the previous posters that poverty is complex and there aren't easy fixes. But there are some things that I do wish were emphasized and housing, as it's such a huge portion of everyone's budget, is one of them. Proximity to transportation is another. It's one of the things that drives me crazy with low income housing. There is often little to no emphasis on proximity to transportation routes and/or jobs and shopping. You can't just throw up some low income housing in the middle of nowhere and expect people to thrive or even sustain themselves with no reliable transportation to schools and work.
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Post by smalltowngirlie on Jul 12, 2015 18:18:33 GMT
Working in Head Start I work mainly with families at or below poverty level. I see the cycle so many times, some are very comfortable there. I have also seen families work their ass off to get out of the cycle, it is not easy. I have had the pleasure of saying to a family you no longer qualify for Head Start. It is done with mixed emotions. YEAH, they are better than where they were a year or two ago, but sad because they are most likely not to a point where they can afford quality PreK for their child and they want it so bad, and this is most likely a family I will miss working with.
I will have to look into this book. Thanks
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 23:21:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2015 18:18:39 GMT
So many people are one catastrophe away from poverty. I know people will come on and say that most people in poverty are living outside their means, but in reality they can't be, because they don't have credit. They have to pay cash for everything. When the cash runs out, they have nothing until the next paycheck. When I was a first year teacher, granted it was a long time ago, I took home $985 a month. I was lucky enough to have a fixed income apartment in the small town where I taught, but I had student loan payments and a car payment. The last week before my next pay check, I was living off what I had in the house to eat and hoping nothing happened. I did have a credit card, but I tried not to use it. You can be living outside your means without credit. I have two young nephews who are experiencing this right now. They're young and struggling to find regular, steady employment. They asked for my assistance in developing a budget - and I have to say despite their circumstances, they are still living outside their means - and it's not through credit. Their biggest issue will be housing. The reality of their income means they really, really need to economize drastically right now when it comes to housing, or they will see the article's scenario of one too many rainy days = unsteady work = eviction. But they insist they need a 2 bedroom apartment. I fully understand that it's not ideal to share a room when you're 21 and 23. But if they would share a room for a short period of time and build a bit of a cushion for the times when they know they won't have full income (their work is VERY seasonal) they wouldn't be facing a near certainty of eviction with all the associated costs involved. They went forward with renting an apartment that they really can only afford if everything goes perfectly - and we all know that things will not go perfectly. I completely agree with the previous posters that poverty is complex and there aren't easy fixes. But there are some things that I do wish were emphasized and housing, as it's such a huge portion of everyone's budget, is one of them. Proximity to transportation is another. It's one of the things that drives me crazy with low income housing. There is often little to no emphasis on proximity to transportation routes and/or jobs and shopping. You can't just throw up some low income housing in the middle of nowhere and expect people to thrive or even sustain themselves with no reliable transportation to schools and work. They may face an issue of not being allowed to rent a one bedroom apartment. States and even cities can stipulate how many people are allowed to live in a house based on bedrooms and relationships. Sometimes a one bedroom apartment is restricted to a single person or a married couple.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 23:21:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2015 18:28:38 GMT
They may face an issue of not being allowed to rent a one bedroom apartment. States and even cities can stipulate how many people are allowed to live in a house based on bedrooms and relationships. Sometimes a one bedroom apartment is restricted to a single person or a married couple. Really? !!! Where are the rules that strict? I have never heard of that. I'm not saying I don't believe you - I do - it just doesn't happen around here. There are certain limits in some areas on the maximum number of unrelated adults who can share a home, but it's in the neighborhood of 4+ (regardless of size of dwelling), not two. Families (including distant relations) are exempt. I can't imagine such stringent regulations, especially in higher cost of living areas.
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Post by meridon on Jul 12, 2015 18:32:40 GMT
I'm pretty sure the federal fair housing guidelines are no more than two people per bedroom, but with no stipulations on the relationship...so a married couple or parent/child or partners or whoever.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 23:21:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2015 18:36:01 GMT
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Post by Darcy Collins on Jul 12, 2015 18:43:01 GMT
You can be living outside your means without credit. I have two young nephews who are experiencing this right now. They're young and struggling to find regular, steady employment. They asked for my assistance in developing a budget - and I have to say despite their circumstances, they are still living outside their means - and it's not through credit. Their biggest issue will be housing. The reality of their income means they really, really need to economize drastically right now when it comes to housing, or they will see the article's scenario of one too many rainy days = unsteady work = eviction. But they insist they need a 2 bedroom apartment. I fully understand that it's not ideal to share a room when you're 21 and 23. But if they would share a room for a short period of time and build a bit of a cushion for the times when they know they won't have full income (their work is VERY seasonal) they wouldn't be facing a near certainty of eviction with all the associated costs involved. They went forward with renting an apartment that they really can only afford if everything goes perfectly - and we all know that things will not go perfectly. I completely agree with the previous posters that poverty is complex and there aren't easy fixes. But there are some things that I do wish were emphasized and housing, as it's such a huge portion of everyone's budget, is one of them. Proximity to transportation is another. It's one of the things that drives me crazy with low income housing. There is often little to no emphasis on proximity to transportation routes and/or jobs and shopping. You can't just throw up some low income housing in the middle of nowhere and expect people to thrive or even sustain themselves with no reliable transportation to schools and work. They may face an issue of not being allowed to rent a one bedroom apartment. States and even cities can stipulate how many people are allowed to live in a house based on bedrooms and relationships. Sometimes a one bedroom apartment is restricted to a single person or a married couple. That's not an issue where they live. Some of the areas have limits on no more than 3 unrelated residents - that's primarily near the university where they're trying to avoid frat house atmospheres in residential neighborhoods.
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lesley
Drama Llama
My best friend Turriff, desperately missed.
Posts: 7,179
Location: Scotland, Scotland, Scotland
Jul 6, 2014 21:50:44 GMT
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Post by lesley on Jul 12, 2015 18:45:45 GMT
@busypea, your link to occupancy standards just seems to come straight back to this page.
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Post by donna on Jul 12, 2015 18:49:31 GMT
This book could be describing a co-worker of mine. She is 41 and lives with her mother and brother. Their life is one bad thing after another happening to them. It will look like they are finally going to get a break and bang something else happens.
I am so thankful for the opportunities I have had in my life. Both sets of my grandparents were very poor. The fact that they lived on farms and could raise most of their food helped them to dig their families out of poverty. Things are so different now and really difficult if you live in a city.
Thanks for sharing this article.
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raindancer
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,095
Jun 26, 2014 20:10:29 GMT
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Post by raindancer on Jul 12, 2015 18:51:07 GMT
They may face an issue of not being allowed to rent a one bedroom apartment. States and even cities can stipulate how many people are allowed to live in a house based on bedrooms and relationships. Sometimes a one bedroom apartment is restricted to a single person or a married couple. Really? !!! Where are the rules that strict? I have never heard of that. I'm not saying I don't believe you - I do - it just doesn't happen around here. There are certain limits in some areas on the maximum number of unrelated adults who can share a home, but it's in the neighborhood of 4+ (regardless of size of dwelling), not two. Families (including distant relations) are exempt. I can't imagine such stringent regulations, especially in higher cost of living areas. In the 90's this was the case in Idaho around what is now BYU-Idaho. Lots of rental restrictions in the town based on the rules and requirements set up by the LDS church and the apartment complexes didn't break those rules because they relied on the college kids to rent there. So if you weren't LDS or if you were but thought the rules were dumb, that was too bad. They even had curfew rules for having the opposite sex in your apartment if you weren't married and what is called a "chastity" door that was the physical boundary of where you were permitted to be in the apartment of someone the opposite sex as you.
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Post by hop2 on Jul 12, 2015 18:56:53 GMT
They may face an issue of not being allowed to rent a one bedroom apartment. States and even cities can stipulate how many people are allowed to live in a house based on bedrooms and relationships. Sometimes a one bedroom apartment is restricted to a single person or a married couple. Really? !!! Where are the rules that strict? I have never heard of that. I'm not saying I don't believe you - I do - it just doesn't happen around here. There are certain limits in some areas on the maximum number of unrelated adults who can share a home, but it's in the neighborhood of 4+ (regardless of size of dwelling), not two. Families (including distant relations) are exempt. I can't imagine such stringent regulations, especially in higher cost of living areas. Yes really. Here technically a single parent with a child over 2 must rent a 2br apartment. Then they get a 1 br because it's all they can afford and are super afraid to let anyone in.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 17, 2024 23:21:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2015 19:11:14 GMT
I'm pretty sure the federal fair housing guidelines are no more than two people per bedroom, but with no stipulations on the relationship...so a married couple or parent/child or partners or whoever. It isn't quite that simple, and states/cities can make some stipulations as long as the stipulations aren't aimed solely at discriminating against families with children. If a bedroom is sufficiently small it can be deemed a one person room. www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A19437-2004Aug20.html?nav=rss_rentals/rentyourplace
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Post by Blind Squirrel on Jul 12, 2015 19:20:14 GMT
Thanks for posting; I've reserved it at my library.
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Post by lucyg on Jul 12, 2015 19:25:59 GMT
It's too bad, because I think one of the best ways a person (or family) can save big money is to share housing. What a pity if the bureaucracy makes that effort toward fiscal independence difficult or impossible.
Also, if you're a homeowner and you'd like to rent out a room in your home, the law (at least in California) is so unfavorable to landlords that it can be a real burden. It takes months to evict someone, for example, and if that person is actually living inside your home with you the whole time ... can you imagine?
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paget
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,751
Jun 25, 2014 21:16:39 GMT
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Post by paget on Jul 12, 2015 20:01:35 GMT
They may face an issue of not being allowed to rent a one bedroom apartment. States and even cities can stipulate how many people are allowed to live in a house based on bedrooms and relationships. Sometimes a one bedroom apartment is restricted to a single person or a married couple. Really? !!! Where are the rules that strict? I have never heard of that. I'm not saying I don't believe you - I do - it just doesn't happen around here. There are certain limits in some areas on the maximum number of unrelated adults who can share a home, but it's in the neighborhood of 4+ (regardless of size of dwelling), not two. Families (including distant relations) are exempt. I can't imagine such stringent regulations, especially in higher cost of living areas. When my oldest daughter was looking for apartment in college she faced this. She and best friend got a two bedroom apartment. Dd was willing to have another person share her bedroom to cut costs but none of the apartment complexes would allow it (the bedroom was microscopic so not sure how it would have worked, anyway). Also, she couldn't find a friend willing to share with her anyway - everyone "had" to have their own room. This rule could have been special because it was a college town and they want to reduce the number of college students living in one apartment, but I don't think 3 people living in a two bedroom apartment is unreasonable! Busypea, this was Bellingham.
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Post by crazy4scraps on Jul 12, 2015 22:30:30 GMT
This book could be describing a co-worker of mine. She is 41 and lives with her mother and brother. Their life is one bad thing after another happening to them. It will look like they are finally going to get a break and bang something else happens. We have friends like this too, it's like they're stuck in a revolving door of bad luck.
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Post by Pahina722 on Jul 12, 2015 22:34:25 GMT
I have a unit in the American Dream in my Comp 1 class, so I'm thinking about adding Tirado's original article to our readings as well as some of the responses it inspired. At the community college level, many of our students fight with the same issues Tirado brings up that interfere with getting ahead.
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scorpeao
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,521
Location: NorCal USA
Jun 25, 2014 21:04:54 GMT
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Post by scorpeao on Jul 12, 2015 23:56:22 GMT
It's too bad, because I think one of the best ways a person (or family) can save big money is to share housing. What a pity if the bureaucracy makes that effort toward fiscal independence difficult or impossible. Also, if you're a homeowner and you'd like to rent out a room in your home, the law (at least in California) is so unfavorable to landlords that it can be a real burden. It takes months to evict someone, for example, and if that person is actually living inside your home with you the whole time ... can you imagine? I really want to rent out a bedroom in my house after my dd leaves, but I'm terrified to because of the laws in CA. I'm afraid I'm going to worst case scenario roommate and I'll be forced to let my house go into foreclosure just to rid myself of the squatter. Yes, I'm a bit of a 'worst case scenario' gal.
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smginaz Suzy
Pearl Clutcher
Je suis desole.
Posts: 2,606
Jun 26, 2014 17:27:30 GMT
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Post by smginaz Suzy on Jul 13, 2015 0:20:09 GMT
Another good read in this same vein is Nickel and Dimed: On (Not) Getting By in America by Barbara Ehrenreich
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Post by peasapie on Jul 13, 2015 0:36:32 GMT
link to articleI just put a library hold on the book Hand To Mouth: Living In Bootstrap America by Linda Tirado. I'm looking forward to reading it. Interesting. thanks for sharing. 3k comments. This article obviously struck a chord with many people.
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Post by kckckc on Jul 13, 2015 0:47:21 GMT
If you are interested in this subject, I would also recommend the Minimum Wage episode of 30 Days. Morgan Spurlock (of Super Size Me fame) and his fiancé try to live 30 days on minimum wage - it was quite eye opening - they would be squeaking by and then some little thing would go wrong and they would be trying to dig themselves out of a financial hole. link to synopsis
thanks for sharing the article - I put the book on reserve at the library.
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