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Post by yoursweetwhimsy on Aug 17, 2014 1:52:06 GMT
There is always more to the story. That is not Michael Brown. It doesn't even remotely look like Michael Brown. Shoplifting doesn't merit death. The only person with the "grab the gun" story is the cop. Who didn't file an incident report, and has left town. At least two witnesses outside of Brown's buddy have come forward. He was running away when the first two shots were fired. The police officer was treated at the hospital for injuries. This wasn't just a case of a man jaywalking, holding up his hands and getting killed. |
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Post by PEArfect on Aug 17, 2014 1:53:41 GMT
No shoplifting doesn't merit death. That's why I said there is always more to the story. We're only hearing the sensationalized media version right now.
Witnesses aren't always a reliable source.
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Post by *KatyCupcake* on Aug 17, 2014 2:02:56 GMT
There is always more to the story. That is not Michael Brown. It doesn't even remotely look like Michael Brown. Shoplifting doesn't merit death. The only person with the "grab the gun" story is the cop. Who didn't file an incident report, and has left town. At least two witnesses outside of Brown's buddy have come forward. He was running away when the first two shots were fired. Sounds like you were there when it happened. You are making it sound like leaving town makes the officer guilty. Perhaps he simply wants to protect himself and his family now that his name has been released. Seems like an obvious and rational decision. I'm still in the "we don't know what happened" and "let the investigation take place" before passing judgement camp. The only thing I'm willing to assume right now is that two people had an encounter and one didn't walk away from it. |
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Deleted
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Oct 10, 2024 18:27:26 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 2:03:32 GMT
There is always more to the story. Would you take this photo down, it is NOT factual at all. |
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ginacivey
Pearl Clutcher
refupea #2 in southeast missouri
Posts: 4,685 
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Post by ginacivey on Aug 17, 2014 2:04:47 GMT
2pea
i wasn't arguing the definition of jaywalking
the common picture of jaywalking is crossing the street at a place other than at a crosswalk
i was just clarifying
you seem to be awfully invested
gina
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ginacivey
Pearl Clutcher
refupea #2 in southeast missouri
Posts: 4,685
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Post by ginacivey on Aug 17, 2014 2:05:49 GMT
ksdk - channel 5 - reported the location of the officer's home
there have been numerous death threats
i'd have left town too
gina
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ginacivey
Pearl Clutcher
refupea #2 in southeast missouri
Posts: 4,685
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Post by ginacivey on Aug 17, 2014 2:11:28 GMT
last night in ferguson...911 was not taking calls in reference to the looting and rioting
the looters were rampant - business owners standing, armed, in front of their stores
it was complete havoc
there are just as many people outraged as there are looting - in ferguson
the stores look like a tornado has gone through
the curfew goes into effect in three hours
Lord only knows what will happen tonight
gina
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Post by pierogi on Aug 17, 2014 2:15:23 GMT
That is not Michael Brown. It doesn't even remotely look like Michael Brown. Shoplifting doesn't merit death. The only person with the "grab the gun" story is the cop. Who didn't file an incident report, and has left town. At least two witnesses outside of Brown's buddy have come forward. He was running away when the first two shots were fired. Sounds like you were there when it happened. You are making it sound like leaving town makes the officer guilty. Perhaps he simply wants to protect himself and his family now that his name has been released. Seems like an obvious and rational decision. I'm still in the "we don't know what happened" and "let the investigation take place" before passing judgement camp. The only thing I'm willing to assume right now is that two people had an encounter and one didn't walk away from it. Um, I never implied I was. The cop does not live in the community of Ferguson. He has every other cop in the area watching his back and protecting him. You don't seem to have a high opinion of the police force yourself if you think they can't protect this guy. Finally, I'm not passing judgement. That includes Michael Brown. |
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Deleted
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Oct 10, 2024 18:27:26 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 2:17:04 GMT
ksdk - channel 5 - reported the location of the officer's home there have been numerous death threats i'd have left town too gina That is awful. |
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Post by *KatyCupcake* on Aug 17, 2014 2:18:39 GMT
Basically what this is saying is that the only choices for Ferguson is a police state or complete anarchy.
I guess if I had to choose one of those options right now in response to the aftermath, I'd go with the police state.
Shame on those who think a young man's death is a valid excuse to rob, loot, and riot.
Shame on the law enforcement for not taking calls in regards to looting and rioting.
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Post by *KatyCupcake* on Aug 17, 2014 2:30:27 GMT
Sounds like you were there when it happened. You are making it sound like leaving town makes the officer guilty. Perhaps he simply wants to protect himself and his family now that his name has been released. Seems like an obvious and rational decision. I'm still in the "we don't know what happened" and "let the investigation take place" before passing judgement camp. The only thing I'm willing to assume right now is that two people had an encounter and one didn't walk away from it. Um, I never implied I was. The cop does not live in the community of Ferguson. He has every other cop in the area watching his back and protecting him. You don't seem to have a high opinion of the police force yourself if you think they can't protect this guy. Finally, I'm not passing judgement. That includes Michael Brown. Well forgive me for misunderstanding you. But you stated your opinion as fact, it sure sounded like you were there. The location of the officer's home was released and people are out violently rioting and breaking the law. It's anarchy and the law enforcement there isn't even dealing with it. It's safer for him, his family, and other law enforcement that he's left his residence rather than try to post other law enforcement to try to protect him from a potentially violent mob of rioters who might try to take justice into their own hands. Finally, when you stated that Michael Brown was in fact running away and was shot down you seem to be passing judgement on the officer. |
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azredhead
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,755
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Post by azredhead on Aug 17, 2014 2:38:26 GMT
I'm glad they finally put a curfew just for people safety. I wish that would have been done sooner to help sort things out and keep some sort of peace. I guess that would have been too much police force though. I don't know what the solution is to make it right?
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Post by *KatyCupcake* on Aug 17, 2014 2:50:09 GMT
I'll bet you wouldn't be so quick to "question his character" if he was white. Do you also question the character of the police officer? You seem to know a lot about this young black man; have you met him? Is the death penalty (imposed by the officer) just punishment for stealing cigars from a store? You have him arrested, charged, convicted and punished; the only thing we know he's guilty of for sure is walking down a road while black. I never claimed to know anything about Michael Brown. I'm simply stating what little has been shared about the incident. And you're wrong. I question the character of anyone who robs a store, resists arrest, and assaults a police officer regardless of skin color. I also question the character of people who pull the race card so quickly. If you read my posts, you'll notice I don't know who was in the wrong in the moment Brown was shot and I have reserved judgement until more facts come out from the currently ongoing investigation. I'm simply presenting a side that was being ignored by the person I quoted. |
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Deleted
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Oct 10, 2024 18:27:26 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 2:52:10 GMT
Is the death penalty (imposed by the officer) just punishment for stealing cigars from a store? Can we please stop saying that is why the officer killed him? |
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Post by yoursweetwhimsy on Aug 17, 2014 2:54:18 GMT
Watching that video of him strong arming the clerk and taking something that didn't belong to him because he was entitled to it is absolutely going to make anyone with any common sense judge his character! White or black! Are you kidding me? He had just committed a criminal act, thereby making him a criminal..period. That doesn't mean he should have been shot and killed over that offense but there is more to the story.
I just read a statistic on the FBI crime website. In 2012, there were 2,648 black victims were killed in the U.S. 193 of those homicides were carried out by white people, 2,142 were carried out by members of their own race. It makes no sense to be focused on these "racist" killings when they are killing each other 10 times over.
On the other side, there were 3,128 white victims of homicide, 2,614 were carried out by white people and 431 were carried out by black people.
Why don't people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton rally to stop ALL the homicides..white and black.
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Deleted
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Oct 10, 2024 18:27:26 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 2:54:34 GMT
PEArfect are you going to delete that photo since it has been shown it is NOT the deceased man.
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Post by gryroagain on Aug 17, 2014 3:04:33 GMT
This is America- we don't give the death penalty for jaywalking, stealing cigars and being an asshole, or even resisting arrest. Laws apply equally. Even if they happen in a "bad" neighborhood, by a resident of said neighborhood (and I am not saying it's clear any or all of the above happened) you don't expect to shoot someone for it unless in any neighborhood you would get shot for it. Which is the issue, IMO- a resident of a predominately white, upscale neighborhood doesmt get the same treatment (ie, being shot to death) for similar actions. Black on black violence is not the issue here- take your smelly red herrings somewhere else. This is about police brutality and equal application of law.
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Post by yoursweetwhimsy on Aug 17, 2014 3:09:21 GMT
This is America- we don't give the death penalty for jaywalking, stealing cigars and being an asshole, or even resisting arrest. Laws apply equally. Even if they happen in a "bad" neighborhood, by a resident of said neighborhood (and I am not saying it's clear any or all of the above happened) you don't expect to shoot someone for it unless in any neighborhood you would get shot for it. Which is the issue, IMO- a resident of a predominately white, upscale neighborhood doesmt get the same treatment (ie, being shot to death) for similar actions. Black on black violence is not the issue here- take your smelly red herrings somewhere else. This is about police brutality and equal application of law. What, in your opinion, should an officer do, if a person attacked them, injured them, and attempted to take their gun? Write them a jaywalking ticket and go on about their day? |
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Post by PEArfect on Aug 17, 2014 3:13:48 GMT
PEArfect are you going to delete that photo since it has been shown it is NOT the deceased man. I haven't seen proof that it's not him, but sure I can delete it. |
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Aug 17, 2014 3:16:55 GMT
This is America- we don't give the death penalty for jaywalking, stealing cigars and being an asshole, or even resisting arrest. Laws apply equally. Even if they happen in a "bad" neighborhood, by a resident of said neighborhood (and I am not saying it's clear any or all of the above happened) you don't expect to shoot someone for it unless in any neighborhood you would get shot for it. Which is the issue, IMO- a resident of a predominately white, upscale neighborhood doesmt get the same treatment (ie, being shot to death) for similar actions. Black on black violence is not the issue here- take your smelly red herrings somewhere else. This is about police brutality and equal application of law. What, in your opinion, should an officer do, if a person attacked them, injured them, and attempted to take their gun? Write them a jaywalking ticket and go on about their day? Arrest him? You know, like they did with Dzhokhar Tsarnaev and James Eagan Holmes? |
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Deleted
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Oct 10, 2024 18:27:26 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 3:19:00 GMT
Watching that video of him strong arming the clerk and taking something that didn't belong to him because he was entitled to it is absolutely going to make anyone with any common sense judge his character! White or black! Are you kidding me? He had just committed a criminal act, thereby making him a criminal..period. That doesn't mean he should have been shot and killed over that offense but there is more to the story. I just read a statistic on the FBI crime website. In 2012, there were 2,648 black victims were killed in the U.S. 193 of those homicides were carried out by white people, 2,142 were carried out by members of their own race. It makes no sense to be focused on these "racist" killings when they are killing each other 10 times over. On the other side, there were 3,128 white victims of homicide, 2,614 were carried out by white people and 431 were carried out by black people. Why don't people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton rally to stop ALL the homicides..white and black. And remember...he was shot and killed TEN MINUTES after the 911 call about the robbery came in. Fact. TEN MINUTES.
I know kids shoplift...this was NOT shoplifting. He went in and simply TOOK something that didn't belong to him. When confronted, he put his hands on another person and intimidated that person...and he just TOOK something that didn't belong to him.
I'll say again that he did not deserve to be shot in the street for taking those items...or simply for walking in the street. But I refuse to convict a law enforcement officer of being a racist killer based on what I know so far. And I refuse to condemn the Ferguson police dept or the state police for being forced to be so heavy handed because the residents of Ferguson (or non residents that have gathered there to stir the pot and cause trouble) don't know how to behave themselves like decent human beings. Frankly, with what I've heard from many of them, they're absolutely, 100% no better than the racist cop they'd like to murder.
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Aug 17, 2014 3:25:50 GMT
Watching that video of him strong arming the clerk and taking something that didn't belong to him because he was entitled to it is absolutely going to make anyone with any common sense judge his character! White or black! Are you kidding me? He had just committed a criminal act, thereby making him a criminal..period. That doesn't mean he should have been shot and killed over that offense but there is more to the story. I just read a statistic on the FBI crime website. In 2012, there were 2,648 black victims were killed in the U.S. 193 of those homicides were carried out by white people, 2,142 were carried out by members of their own race. It makes no sense to be focused on these "racist" killings when they are killing each other 10 times over. On the other side, there were 3,128 white victims of homicide, 2,614 were carried out by white people and 431 were carried out by black people. Why don't people like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton rally to stop ALL the homicides..white and black. And remember...he was shot and killed TEN MINUTES after the 911 call about the robbery came in. Fact. TEN MINUTES.
I know kids shoplift...this was NOT shoplifting. He went in and simply TOOK something that didn't belong to him. When confronted, he put his hands on another person and intimidated that person...and he just TOOK something that didn't belong to him.
Which had nothing to do with the shooting. Personally, I find it telling that they handed out a 19-page document about a robbery at a press conference about the shooting but said very little about that shooting. |
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Post by yoursweetwhimsy on Aug 17, 2014 3:27:32 GMT
What, in your opinion, should an officer do, if a person attacked them, injured them, and attempted to take their gun? Write them a jaywalking ticket and go on about their day? Arrest him? You know, like they did with Dzhokhar Tsarnaev and James Eagan Holmes? Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was shot by the police and could have easily been killed from those injuries. James Holmes was completely compliant when he was arrested, found with both hands on top of his car. He did not attempt to grab the officers gun, or attack the officer, making an uneventful arrest possible. |
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Post by PEArfect on Aug 17, 2014 3:31:09 GMT
www.kristineace.com/2014/08/ferguson-perspective-from-cops-wife.html?spref=fb"Then there's the media. God love them! It seems as if their goal in life is to drain the last bit of life blood out of these officer's souls. They expose them, draw attention to them, display them in an unfair light, call them out by name and expose every last ounce of dignity they might have had, all to bring ratings up and land that winning story or notable headline. They forget that these public servants are real human beings with feelings and emotion. With families and loved ones. With goals and hobbies. These men and women are doing a job....a job they once dreamt of doing and doing well, only to be villainized as the bad guy." I agree! I need more facts. The media is just selling headlines.
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elainebenis
Junior Member
Posts: 50
Jul 3, 2014 23:26:11 GMT
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Post by elainebenis on Aug 17, 2014 5:56:04 GMT
And remember...he was shot and killed TEN MINUTES after the 911 call about the robbery came in. Fact. TEN MINUTES.
I know kids shoplift...this was NOT shoplifting. He went in and simply TOOK something that didn't belong to him. When confronted, he put his hands on another person and intimidated that person...and he just TOOK something that didn't belong to him.
Which had nothing to do with the shooting. Personally, I find it telling that they handed out a 19-page document about a robbery at a press conference about the shooting but said very little about that shooting.
BINGO. That was quite......something, wasn't it?
Releasing the shoplifting info (against the wishes of the DOJ, FBI and the State Patrol Chief) achieved several goals: 1) it smeared the dead guy and - more importantly - it smeared the star witness, 2) it tainted the jury pool and 3) it re-stirred up anger in the community, undermining the calming efforts of the SP Chief and leading to more unrest from those 'animals'. Trifecta!
Then, a few hours later, coyly walk it all back? "Ooops?" You've got to be fucking kidding me.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Aug 17, 2014 6:46:41 GMT
[quote author="@iowa57girl"
ETA: It was handled horribly wrong from the get-go. That police department should be ashamed of how they treat their community.
[/quote]
The community is turning on itself right now.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Aug 17, 2014 6:51:41 GMT
Of course! Didn't my avatar or name give it away?  With my impending retirement looming, I haven't been around much because it's a time suck and the last thing I want to do is be online more than I already, but I just had to stop by tonight to see if my predictions on how a thread like this would go here were correct. Having a gun pointed at you might give you an idea. Well trained police officers don't just open fire without having a pretty good idea a suspect is armed. If they pull their weapons and fired every time they thought or suspected a suspect was armed, we'd be seeing a whole lot more of these shootings.
MB tried wrestling the officers gun away from him--that doesn't sound like someone who is going to stay unarmed for long if he can help it. |
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Aug 17, 2014 10:59:57 GMT
Arrest him? You know, like they did with Dzhokhar Tsarnaev and James Eagan Holmes? Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was shot by the police and could have easily been killed from those injuries. James Holmes was completely compliant when he was arrested, found with both hands on top of his car. He did not attempt to grab the officers gun, or attack the officer, making an uneventful arrest possible. And Michael Brown was unarmed, already shot, and was running away. |
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Post by Peace Sign on Aug 17, 2014 11:58:51 GMT
This is what the situation comes down to for me...black people are stopped by white police for stupid things every day. Harassed. Treated with suspicion for no reason...what's a black person doing in this neighborhood? Where did the black guy get that car?
Black people are tired of it, as well as afraid of being shot dead in the street for jaywalking.
I'm not anti police. But police forces do need to be diverse and have diversity training.
Rapist in Steubenville back at school and on football team. What a hero!! Michael brown shot dead in street. 10 to 35 feet away from police. Regardless of what sort if confrontation they had.
Remember , he was just a teenager. And remember those of you who say make bad choices bad things happen that you people were raised with privilege and parents and middle class and opportunities he didn't have. It's awfully judgemental of you to say.
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Deleted
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Oct 10, 2024 18:27:26 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 12:40:55 GMT
Which had nothing to do with the shooting. Personally, I find it telling that they handed out a 19-page document about a robbery at a press conference about the shooting but said very little about that shooting.
BINGO. That was quite......something, wasn't it?
Releasing the shoplifting info (against the wishes of the DOJ, FBI and the State Patrol Chief) achieved several goals: 1) it smeared the dead guy and - more importantly - it smeared the star witness, 2) it tainted the jury pool and 3) it re-stirred up anger in the community, undermining the calming efforts of the SP Chief and leading to more unrest from those 'animals'. Trifecta!
Then, a few hours later, coyly walk it all back? "Ooops?" You've got to be fucking kidding me.
 It's very sad, isn't it? I never said I approved of the looters and the rioting but I also can't imagine living somewhere where you have to put up with what they do because of the color of their skin. They're tired of it and unfortunately, the idiots come out in force but I guarantee you that their are mothers in that community scared shit less of what's going on and have to worry every freaking day if their son or daughter is going to run into trouble with an over zealous police department because of the color of their skin. I live right down the road from a community with a very large university who has repeatedly had to endure rioting, vandalism and destruction of public and private property because of a school sponsored event. This last time, the local police department couldn't handle it themselves and had to call in for assistance from the Highway Patrol and the State Troopers and I guarantee you they didn't come in armed like special forces. These were young, white, drunk kids who are predominately from small towns doing the rioting. Just two weeks ago, the President of the university made the decision to cancel and retire the event that dates back to 1922. But I'm not going to judge the entire community because of what the idiots do and certainly not a community that has a history of a not so good relationship with the very people who are being paid to protect them. I'm the daughter of a cop and have spent a good portion of my life around them so I've seen the good and the bad of that profession and can say first hand "Not all cops are assholes, but some assholes are cops" and just because someone wears a badge doesn't mean that person is honorable and just in their thinking. |
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