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Post by monklady123 on Aug 17, 2014 10:49:33 GMT
Really, the child, (yes, I know this is different child than the OP's friend's child) as a Catholic, should not take communion in the Lutheran church. Depending on the synod, this may be addressed at that time and the child may be asked to choose between the two faiths before confirmation in the Lutheran church takes place. Because the faiths view communion much differently, it is generally not considered acceptable by either faith to take communion at the other church. Well, I shouldn't speak for the ELCA synod, as I'm not very familiar with it, and I know that it is more liberal than the other synods. I would encourage the parents to seek out the advice of their pastors with this unique situation. Just fyi, the mainline Lutheran church welcomes all baptized Christians to their communion table. Most, and I suspect all but I don't know for sure, mainline Protestant churches do. At my church (PCUSA Presbyterian) we don't even say "all baptized Christians" in our invitation at the beginning of the communion liturgy, merely "all are welcome". Our belief is that it isn't up to us to decide how grace may work in someone's heart, and if someone comes up for communion who isn't even Christian, well...that day might be the day they decide to become one. Who knows? But back on-topic, without much information my first through was that this is more about the marriage than anything else. I feel for the child who is undoubtedly going to hear about this from one side or the other or maybe both. Seems like a good way to confuse him and make him dislike religion in general.
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Post by miominmio on Aug 17, 2014 10:55:52 GMT
I think they should respect the child's religion and not bring him/ her to a different faith's service. In fact, I think they should go to a Catholic Church when they have the child, especially since they think it makes no difference to attend a church of a different faith. THIS!! If DH and I ever divorced, I would be livid if a new wife decided she had a right to make decisions about my children's religious upbringing. (Not catholic, in fact not christian at all, so bringing my kids to church would really bring out the worst in me).
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peabay
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Jun 25, 2014 19:50:41 GMT
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Post by peabay on Aug 17, 2014 11:39:08 GMT
I don't care if it has to do with the new marriage or not, it's not step-mom's place to take this kid to church. She should gracefully step back and not interfere in such a sensitive area.
You know how they say you shouldn't discuss sex, politics or religion in polite company? It applies here. Step-mom shouldn't impose her beliefs in any of these areas on this child.
Frankly, I'd be annoyed too if I was the mom. How would those of you from other Christian denominations feel if the new step-mom was taking the kid to a Catholic church?
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Post by anxiousmom on Aug 17, 2014 12:06:37 GMT
As I have mentioned a gazillion times before, I am a divorced and my ex has remarried.
I am a HUGE advocate of allowing each home to parent without interference from the other parent (barring abuse situations.)
But I have to say, *I* would be irritated in this case. I am not Catholic, but Episcopalian. I live in an area chock full of charismatic, fundamentalist and/or evangelical churches that are not compatible with the doctrine preached in the Episcopal church. I would prefer (rather strongly) that my children were not exposed before they are old enough to understand the differences. My children are more than welcome to refine their religious beliefs when they are older, but until then...
Back to the allowing each parent to parent in their own homes, the best thing to happen here is a discussion. I have found over the years that the very few times I had to step in and call my ex about opposing parenting choices were actually easy to get through by a simple conversation. Compromises can happen, sometimes things get out of hand because everyone is too mad to get over themselves and just talk.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
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Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Aug 17, 2014 12:16:31 GMT
However as a Catholic, I wouldn't want my pre-Confirmation age child regularly attending a non-Catholic Church - especially if I wasn't along to explain differences/answer questions. An older teen who has made Confirmation? That wouldn't bother me as much. Wouldn't that be a better time to expose a child to new teachings? Confirmation is a child deciding for themselves to continue in their Catholic faith and renew their baptismal vows that their parents made for them as babies. If that's all they are exposed to then it's a much easier decision for them. Perhaps they are being asked to confirm their faith at too young an age when you think about it. I say that knowing that I wouldn't want my children to attend a church that taught error from the pulpit either. It would make me uncomfortable. I don't get the step mother hate either. She loves this child enough to take him to church with her? What a blessing for the child and the biological parents.
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Post by pierkiss on Aug 17, 2014 12:35:50 GMT
Hmm. I'm catholic, and my first gut reaction would be that I didn't care. However, there are some "Christian churches" out there that are wacky and more cult like to me. So, I'd say I didn't care assuming this is a mainstream church with a well established history and not a cult-like religion.
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Post by gypsymama on Aug 17, 2014 12:55:04 GMT
my divorce states that whichever parent has posession of the child at the time gets to determine their religious teaching/practices so if my kids are at their dad's he has the right to take them to whatever church he wants. it doesn't mention stepparents but i assume my ex would defer to his wife if she wanted to take the kids to church. maybe he goes too maybe he's at work, maybe the kid wants to go...
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Post by mikklynn on Aug 17, 2014 12:56:14 GMT
In this case, it's probably more about the new marriage. However, to Catholics, you can't just go to any church on Sundays. It has to be a Catholic church. There are several reasons but the biggest is the sacrament of Holy Eucharist. To Catholics, communion is the actual body and blood of Christ. Other christian religions don't believe in transubstantiation. So their communion isn't the real thing to Catholics. For Catholics, going to church isn't just about hearing sermons and readings from the bible. Communion is an essential part. And yes, to some Catholics, you might as well not go to church if you aren't going to a Catholic one. Very well said. I no longer attend Catholic church, I belong to a Lutheran church. My mother will attend our church, but still has to go to mass. She was raised a very strict Catholic and can't conceive of doing anything else. I think stepmom should defer to dad.
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Post by kelly316 on Aug 17, 2014 13:01:55 GMT
Dad does go to church with step-mom. I'm guessing child never mentioned this to his mother before recently. Dad is Christian, but didn't attend any church before marrying. They did discuss church before getting married, but not with the mother of the child!
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Post by momofkandn on Aug 17, 2014 13:08:38 GMT
Dad does go to church with step-mom I'm guessing child never mentioned this to his mother before recently. Dad is Christian, but didn't attend any church before marrying. They did discuss church before getting married, but not with the mother of the child! Then biological mom and dad need to discuss this and come to an agreement. And step-mom needs to stay out of it.
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Post by M~ on Aug 17, 2014 13:28:45 GMT
I think the stepmother needs to back off. For all the reasons mentioned above, I can completely understand why a Catholic doesn't want her kid to attend a non-Catholic church. I would feel the same way if it were my kid.
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Post by Linda on Aug 17, 2014 13:45:32 GMT
However as a Catholic, I wouldn't want my pre-Confirmation age child regularly attending a non-Catholic Church - especially if I wasn't along to explain differences/answer questions. An older teen who has made Confirmation? That wouldn't bother me as much. Wouldn't that be a better time to expose a child to new teachings? Confirmation is a child deciding for themselves to continue in their Catholic faith and renew their baptismal vows that their parents made for them as babies. If that's all they are exposed to then it's a much easier decision for them. Perhaps they are being asked to confirm their faith at too young an age when you think about it. I say that knowing that I wouldn't want my children to attend a church that taught error from the pulpit either. It would make me uncomfortable. I don't get the step mother hate either. She loves this child enough to take him to church with her? What a blessing for the child and the biological parents. Expose to new teachings under my (or another Catholic's guidence) as they prepare for Confirmation - yes. Send to a church that doesn't teach the same things at an age when they are still learning what our Church teaches - no - especially if that church is likely to be trying to convert my child.
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Post by Pahina722 on Aug 17, 2014 13:47:29 GMT
The situation could have erupted because of resentment over the father's new marriage, it could be related to difference in doctrinal beliefs, or it could be some combination of the two. While I'm not Catholic, I have had to deal with grandparents taking DS to churches which I found objectionable, Southern Baptist being one of them. I can only imagine how pissed I would have been as a Catholic if someone tried to take my son to a church which taught, as my parents' SB one does, that the Pope is the "whore of Babylon" and that Catholics worship idols. If it were my child's stepmother trying to expose him to those beliefs, I'd be even MORE livid.
No matter what, it is the child's two parents who should be making this decision, not the stepmother. If that means Dad and family attend a Catholic Church when the child is with them, so be it.
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Deleted
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Oct 10, 2024 6:29:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 13:57:31 GMT
In the end, once again, adults will make it an unintended learning experience for the child. A negative one. And it will be the child who loses. Again. For the love of Pete, get over the petty crap and start taking into consideration ONLY the child's well being in such matters. Fighting over it, and you can bet its done in view/hearing of the child, HURTS the child. AGAIN! He hasn't gone through enough? 3 grown adults can't put their big boy/girl pants on and ACT like reasonable adults? Ugh. This Catholic wants to send them all a swift kick in the a$$. For the record, my family is Colorado is NOT Catholic. Yet, when I visit, I still attend Mass in the early a.m. on Sundays and their church's 11am service. I don't take their communion on the rare occasion it's offered when I'm there. I simply worship God with people I love. Why do Christians of any faith have to make this so hard? ?
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peabay
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,895
Jun 25, 2014 19:50:41 GMT
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Post by peabay on Aug 17, 2014 14:02:39 GMT
In the end, once again, adults will make it an unintended learning experience for the child. A negative one. And it will be the child who loses. Again. For the love Pete, get over the petty crap and start taking into consideration ONLY the child's well being in such matters. Fighting over it, and you can bet its done in view/hearing of the child, HURTS the child. AGAIN! He hasn't gone through enough? 3 grown adults can't put their big boy/girl pants on and ACT like reasonable adults? Ugh. This Catholic wants to send them all a swift kick in the a$$. For the record, my family is Colorado is NOT Catholic. Yet, when I visit, I still attend Mass in the early a.m. on Sundays and their church's 11am service. I don't in their communion on the rare occasion it's offered when I'm there. I simply worship God with people I love. Why do Christians of any faith have to make this so hard? ? We haven't heard the Catholic mom's side of this. And you're an adult. You can say "I'm just worshipping God" - a kid doesn't necessarily make that distinction. He may be listening (or, most likely, like a kid, is NOT, but...) and saying "huh. That's not what Mom teaches me at home." His parents need to get on the same page, FAST. And step mom needs to gracefully say: "I'll not take him to church until the two of you work this out."
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Post by freecharlie on Aug 17, 2014 14:05:24 GMT
The situation could have erupted because of resentment over the father's new marriage, it could be related to difference in doctrinal beliefs, or it could be some combination of the two. While I'm not Catholic, I have had to deal with grandparents taking DS to churches which I found objectionable, Southern Baptist being one of them. I can only imagine how pissed I would have been as a Catholic if someone tried to take my son to a church which taught, as my parents' SB one does, that the Pope is the "whore of Babylon" and that Catholics worship idols. If it were my child's stepmother trying to expose him to those beliefs, I'd be even MORE livid. No matter what, it is the child's two parents who should be making this decision, not the stepmother. If that means Dad and family attend a Catholic Church when the child is with them, so be it. Why is it that the mom's religious wants trump the dad's? I think the op probably said that the stepmother wanted to take the boy because she has heard from her friend. What if the decision was made by the dad?
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back to *pea*ality
Pearl Clutcher
Not my circus, not my monkeys ~refugee pea #59
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Jun 25, 2014 19:51:11 GMT
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Post by back to *pea*ality on Aug 17, 2014 14:06:24 GMT
I think if the mom and dad were both Catholic and they made a decision to baptize their child and raise the child as Catholic he should honor that decision even though they have divorced and he has decided to convert to the religion of his second wife.
The stepmother has no say in the matter.
I am Catholic and it is not uncommon that mass is said Saturday evening, all day Sunday and even Sunday evening in some parishes. He can take his child anytime on the weekend and get a sitter and attend service with his second wife if they want to worship together. It may be inconvenient but he can make everyone happy and honor his commitment to raise his child Catholic.
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Post by Erica on Aug 17, 2014 14:24:47 GMT
No, it would not. My daughter is attending youth group at a Baptist church. We are catholic. She enjoys it and I don't want to take that away.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 14:45:34 GMT
yeah - whatever. the custody order (at least in my state) lays out who had the right to control religious instruction, and it's typically that each parent controls when the kid is with that parent. do what the order says. the rest is just drama.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 14:54:50 GMT
would it matter to you if your child went to a Christian church vs. no church at all? My friend is recently married to a man with a child from a previous marriage. She wants the child to attend her Christian church, since they have the child every weekend. The mother of the child is furious, yet never takes the child when she does have him. I'm not catholic, so I would think some exposure is better than none. So would it matter to you if your child attended a Christian church? I assume you mean a Protestant church. A Catholic church is a Christian church so I don't get why you define the alternative as a Christian church. Yes,if I was the mother it would bother me. I'm not a Catholic but an Anglican ( Church of England). To me it would be wrong if a stepmother took it upon herself to take a child of mine to a different denominational church than the one the child has been brought up in every Sunday. It has nothing to do with Catholics as people but they and many other Christian denominations have different beliefs than I do. It wouldn't matter if the church was Baptist,Mormons,Presbyterian or any other, I would feel the same. It really doesn't matter if the child's mother attends every Sunday or not. My feelings on that is you don't need a dedicated building to confirm your belief or to visit one every Sunday. Very often the people ( not all of them) that actually DO attend every Sunday and make sure everyone knows about it are usually the biggest hypocrites there are. It doesn't make you a better Christian or makes your belief stronger by going to church every Sunday. The Mom and Dad need to discuss this and the stepmother needs to step away as it has nothing to do with her. How old is this child?
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Post by Tamhugh on Aug 17, 2014 15:22:54 GMT
FTR I am not Catholic. However, knowing what I know about teachings of both Catholic and protestant church doctrines, no, I would not want my child going to a non Catholic church on a regular basis. There are various sects within Christianity that have major doctrinal differences that total change the world view. And many protestant churches still actively make statements that are outright digs at the Catholic church specifically. I wouldn't want my child exposed to being taught the church she was baptised in is hell bound. Yes, there ARE protestant churches still preaching that. To be fair, some protestant churches say the same thing about other protestant denominations. I do agree with what you said though. I have been told on many occasions by my SIL that we are not true believers or Christians because we are Lutheran. She claims we are just Catholic Lite.
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Post by Tamhugh on Aug 17, 2014 15:28:32 GMT
Really, the child, (yes, I know this is different child than the OP's friend's child) as a Catholic, should not take communion in the Lutheran church. Depending on the synod, this may be addressed at that time and the child may be asked to choose between the two faiths before confirmation in the Lutheran church takes place. Because the faiths view communion much differently, it is generally not considered acceptable by either faith to take communion at the other church. Well, I shouldn't speak for the ELCA synod, as I'm not very familiar with it, and I know that it is more liberal than the other synods. I would encourage the parents to seek out the advice of their pastors with this unique situation. ELCA welcomes all baptised believers to take communion.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 15:46:12 GMT
FTR I am not Catholic. However, knowing what I know about teachings of both Catholic and protestant church doctrines, no, I would not want my child going to a non Catholic church on a regular basis. There are various sects within Christianity that have major doctrinal differences that total change the world view. And many protestant churches still actively make statements that are outright digs at the Catholic church specifically. I wouldn't want my child exposed to being taught the church she was baptised in is hell bound. Yes, there ARE protestant churches still preaching that. To be fair, some protestant churches say the same thing about other protestant denominations. I do agree with what you said though. I have been told on many occasions by my SIL that we are not true believers or Christians because we are Lutheran. She claims we are just Catholic Lite. Oh most definitely! Didn't mean to imply otherwise.
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Post by Basket1lady on Aug 17, 2014 16:27:34 GMT
I assume you mean a Protestant church. A Catholic church is a Christian church so I don't get why you define the alternative as a Christian church. Thank you! As I was typing my novel up above, I was going to put this in there. So many are taught that Catholics are not christian. I have NO idea why, but that is one of the doctrinal differences I was referring to.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2014 16:36:43 GMT
The situation could have erupted because of resentment over the father's new marriage, it could be related to difference in doctrinal beliefs, or it could be some combination of the two. While I'm not Catholic, I have had to deal with grandparents taking DS to churches which I found objectionable, Southern Baptist being one of them. I can only imagine how pissed I would have been as a Catholic if someone tried to take my son to a church which taught, as my parents' SB one does, that the Pope is the "whore of Babylon" and that Catholics worship idols. If it were my child's stepmother trying to expose him to those beliefs, I'd be even MORE livid. No matter what, it is the child's two parents who should be making this decision, not the stepmother. If that means Dad and family attend a Catholic Church when the child is with them, so be it. Why is it that the mom's religious wants trump the dad's? I think the op probably said that the stepmother wanted to take the boy because she has heard from her friend. What if the decision was made by the dad? The OP hasn't told us what Dad's religion is. But, if dad and mom, at the time they were married, had agreed to raise the child as Catholic then I don't think a change in dad's religious beliefs has a right to trump the prior agreement to raise the child as Catholic.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
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Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Aug 17, 2014 16:38:50 GMT
No matter what, it is the child's two parents who should be making this decision, not the stepmother. If that means Dad and family attend a Catholic Church when the child is with them, so be it. Why should the mother's church be the choice though? If the father wants his son to attend his step mother's church on their time together that's the way it should be. That's what happens when people marry and then they decide to divorce.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,314
Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Aug 17, 2014 16:42:14 GMT
Why is it that the mom's religious wants trump the dad's? I think the op probably said that the stepmother wanted to take the boy because she has heard from her friend. What if the decision was made by the dad? The OP hasn't told us what Dad's religion is. But, if dad and mom, at the time they were married, had agreed to raise the child as Catholic then I don't think a change in dad's religious beliefs has a right to trump the prior agreement to raise the child as Catholic. If their catholic faith was that important to them they would still be married and raising the child together. Obviously it's not. Divorce happens. Children are caught in the middle. And yes with Catholic vs Protestant churches it opens a whole kettle of fish about being saved or not. Every second Sunday that poor child has to attend church that teaches error and the parents themselves did this to the child. One thing I am very proud of. My extended families have divorces with remarriages in them. None of them treat the step parents as second class. The acknowledge that step parents are intregal parts of their child's new family.
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Post by Basket1lady on Aug 17, 2014 16:46:48 GMT
Really, the child, (yes, I know this is different child than the OP's friend's child) as a Catholic, should not take communion in the Lutheran church. Depending on the synod, this may be addressed at that time and the child may be asked to choose between the two faiths before confirmation in the Lutheran church takes place. Because the faiths view communion much differently, it is generally not considered acceptable by either faith to take communion at the other church. Well, I shouldn't speak for the ELCA synod, as I'm not very familiar with it, and I know that it is more liberal than the other synods. I would encourage the parents to seek out the advice of their pastors with this unique situation. Just fyi, the mainline Lutheran church welcomes all baptized Christians to their communion table. Most, and I suspect all but I don't know for sure, mainline Protestant churches do. At my church (PCUSA Presbyterian) we don't even say "all baptized Christians" in our invitation at the beginning of the communion liturgy, merely "all are welcome". Our belief is that it isn't up to us to decide how grace may work in someone's heart, and if someone comes up for communion who isn't even Christian, well...that day might be the day they decide to become one. Who knows? But back on-topic, without much information my first through was that this is more about the marriage than anything else. I feel for the child who is undoubtedly going to hear about this from one side or the other or maybe both. Seems like a good way to confuse him and make him dislike religion in general. This is interesting. DH wasn't up last night when I wrote the above, but he is Missouri synod, Lutheran. Their Order of Service states, "We believe, teach and confess that those who commune receive the true Body and Blood of our Lord-in, with and under the bread and wine... Those who are in agreement with this statement are invited to join us at the Altar." It sounds good, but Catholics believe that it IS the true Body and Blood. It's not under the bread and wine. So a Catholic wouldn't take communion here, even though they are welcome. But DH's church says it's up to each individual to decide for themselves. Now at my in laws Missouri synod church, you are expected to speak with the pastor prior to the service if you are a visitor. And they would not allow a Catholic person to take communion with their church. That would be the difference between doctrine and tradition, though.
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Post by hop2 on Aug 17, 2014 16:47:16 GMT
I do not think that a step parent has any right to dictate or impose religion on a child. The way the OP has written it out it is the step mother who is pushing for this not the father. And a step parent should not be pushy to their spouse over some issues of their children with another person, religion is one if them. But for me it may simply be that I do NOT like pushy religious people altogether.
As a catholic ( lapsed though ) myself I don't mind my child going to other houses if worship from time to time but I don't know how is feel about it on a regular basis. Also I would be extremely wary of any house of worship whose members came across so pushy like. That's a big red flag for me.
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Post by papersilly on Aug 17, 2014 16:48:12 GMT
my parents were Catholics but when we were young, they sent us to a Baptist church for Sunday. they would go to the Catholic church for services and the Baptist church bus would come and pick us up for Sunday school. I appreciate having gone to that church. When i got older, I had no interest in being a practicing Catholic. i stick to the teachings i learned all those years ago. it is more in line with my beliefs today.
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