lesley
Drama Llama
My best friend Turriff, desperately missed.
Posts: 7,298
Location: Scotland, Scotland, Scotland
Jul 6, 2014 21:50:44 GMT
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Post by lesley on Aug 21, 2014 18:04:49 GMT
I just wondered how many non-UK peas were aware of the Scottish independence referendum taking place on 18th September, and what the implications are for the UK? Scottish Peas - do you mind sharing if you're a Yes or a No? I'm a No.
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Post by anxiousmom on Aug 21, 2014 18:08:17 GMT
I'm not from the UK, but follow BBC on twitter and have been seeing tweets about this. I wish I knew more about what is going on...has this not been an issue on and off for the longest time? I would love it if you would explain to those of us who don't know the details!
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wellway
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,026
Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
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Post by wellway on Aug 21, 2014 18:13:08 GMT
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Post by pierogi on Aug 21, 2014 18:17:52 GMT
I've been following it for several months. I've read it could go either way.
What's the consensus among the Scottish peas?
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Dalai Mama
Drama Llama
La Pea Boheme
Posts: 6,985
Jun 26, 2014 0:31:31 GMT
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Post by Dalai Mama on Aug 21, 2014 18:21:58 GMT
I was aware, yes. My high school roommate lives there now and we're friends on FB. She's mentioned it a few times.
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oldcrow
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,828
Location: Ontario,Canada
Jun 26, 2014 12:25:29 GMT
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Post by oldcrow on Aug 21, 2014 18:41:22 GMT
Wow, what a complicated question. I live in Canada.
I know Scotland has a separate parliament and I believe their laws are different than England's but what about all the social programs and things like immigration and foreign affairs. They mentioned the money which can be a problem either way.
Speaking from my heart (I am Scottish heritage) I would like to see independence but from my brain I am not so sure.
I can say that I am glad I don't have to make a decision.
I did like the statement that if it does not go through that Scotland's parliament should get more power over it's self. That was how it worked for Canada and eventually we brought our constitution home.
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Post by anxiousmom on Aug 21, 2014 21:08:12 GMT
Thank you...I will read this and do a bit more research. It would be a historical vote, no?
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Post by gar on Aug 22, 2014 8:40:49 GMT
Thank you...I will read this and do a bit more research. It would be a historical vote, no? It certainly will! Honestly I think it will be a No, and that's what I would hope for. I understand that many Scots don't feel the same but I just can't envisage it happening. I definitely feel that Stronger Together is accurate and I'd prefer to stay that way. I'm English.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 10, 2024 12:22:05 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2014 9:35:00 GMT
I don't think it will go through either and I'm also hoping it won't.
I don't think Alex Salmond has done all his homework correctly in his quest for independence. According to reports out today the figures on his oil predictions have been distorted according to Sir Ian Wood. He had no idea what was going to happen if they had to give up the pound when he was faced with the question on the debate he had with Alistair Darling. A currency union isn't going to happen. All three parties at Westminster are against it,so are most leading businesses in Scotland.
Is he offering to pay a share of the national debt before they break away?
If one wants independence, one doesn't have the right to pick and choose what they would like to keep and expect the other side to agree with you. It's either all or nothing IMO. As an English person I don't think it would benefit Scotland one bit to be independent.
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Post by gar on Aug 22, 2014 9:43:02 GMT
I have to say that I think Alex Salmond is the independence proponents' worst enemy in some ways. His disdain is so obvious and he's the only thing that makes me want the vote to go through. And yes, currency issues are definitely their weak spot!
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Post by I-95 on Aug 22, 2014 11:20:53 GMT
I think Salmond has his eye on the oil revenues and is not looking a whole lot further than that. Scotland's own currency, not tied to the pound...get your own military - very expensive, your own health care system...Scotland could be in a world of hurt.
My cousin lives in Scotland, she's voting no and her husband is voting yes...their two daughters are also split, so that doesn't help much. However, if they represent the average family, it will be an interesting vote.
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Post by gar on Aug 22, 2014 11:26:25 GMT
My cousin lives in Scotland, she's voting no and her husband is voting yes...their two daughters are also split, so that doesn't help much. However, if they represent the average family, it will be an interesting vote. Interesting for them!
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oblibby
Full Member
Posts: 211
Location: Bonnie Scotland
Jul 10, 2014 10:30:12 GMT
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Post by oblibby on Aug 22, 2014 11:27:19 GMT
Undecided but definitely veering towards yes. The swing to the right politically in England has played a part in this, as I feel the Westminster government relates less and less to Scottish beliefs as time goes on.
I dislike Alex Salmond immensely but don't see a yes vote as supporting him, it's a much longer term thing. I also think if the yes vote wins there won't be any benefit to our generation, again it's a long-term change.
It's not only Scots who have a vote and not all Scots will have one. The vote is given to Scottish residents.
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Post by anxiousmom on Aug 22, 2014 11:28:03 GMT
I read yesterday that there are restrictions on who can vote, as in citizens who live in other parts of the UK? Who is that determined? Will it effect the vote?
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Post by gar on Aug 22, 2014 11:29:05 GMT
Undecided but definitely veering towards yes. The swing to the right politically in England has played a part in this, as I feel the Westminster government relates less and less to Scottish beliefs as time goes on. Out of interest, what sort of Scottish beliefs are you thinking of?
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BarbaraUK
Drama Llama
Surrounded by my yarn stash on the NE coast of England...............!! Refupea 1702
Posts: 5,961
Location: England UK
Jun 27, 2014 12:47:11 GMT
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Post by BarbaraUK on Aug 22, 2014 11:36:56 GMT
My cousin lives in Scotland, she's voting no and her husband is voting yes...their two daughters are also split, so that doesn't help much. However, if they represent the average family, it will be an interesting vote. I've got relatives there who are voting in a similar way. It will definitely be an interesting vote for Scotland if, as you say, they represent the average family there!
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Post by I-95 on Aug 22, 2014 11:39:13 GMT
I read yesterday that there are restrictions on who can vote, as in citizens who live in other parts of the UK? Who is that determined? Will it effect the vote? If you were born in Scotland but live in another part of the UK, you cannot vote. However, if you born anywhere in the UK and now live in Scotland, as long as you're registered to vote, you can vote. Approximately 750K native born Scots live in England, Wales and Ireland.
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oblibby
Full Member
Posts: 211
Location: Bonnie Scotland
Jul 10, 2014 10:30:12 GMT
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Post by oblibby on Aug 22, 2014 11:45:21 GMT
Probably 'Scottish beliefs' was a poorly chosen phrase. I think as a whole we've tended to be more left-wing politically. The conservatives only have 1 MP from 59 in seats in Scotland and only 15 from 129 MSPs. I think with the current government's recent swing to the right, it has led to feeling very little connect with the parties in power. Should have added as a note in my first post that, of my English friends living in Scotland, I'd say they're probably split 50/50. Sorry I can't explain it well - would end up like an essay and my thought and writing just aren't interesting enough for that
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 10, 2024 12:22:05 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2014 11:53:26 GMT
My relatives are split 50/50 as well. The younger ones - mid twenties - are voting yes, the older cousins are voting no.
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Post by anxiousmom on Aug 22, 2014 11:55:13 GMT
I read yesterday that there are restrictions on who can vote, as in citizens who live in other parts of the UK? Who is that determined? Will it effect the vote? If you were born in Scotland but live in another part of the UK, you cannot vote. However, if you born anywhere in the UK and now live in Scotland, as long as you're registered to vote, you can vote. Approximately 750K native born Scots live in England, Wales and Ireland. So, if you are a native born Scot, but live somewhere else, why is it that they are not allowed to vote? I ask because my experience (which is from the view point of an American) is that if you are a US citizen, no matter where you live in the world you are allowed a vote in any election.
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Post by gar on Aug 22, 2014 12:00:22 GMT
Thanks Oblibby, I get your drift
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BarbaraUK
Drama Llama
Surrounded by my yarn stash on the NE coast of England...............!! Refupea 1702
Posts: 5,961
Location: England UK
Jun 27, 2014 12:47:11 GMT
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Post by BarbaraUK on Aug 22, 2014 12:04:53 GMT
Probably 'Scottish beliefs' was a poorly chosen phrase. I think as a whole we've tended to be more left-wing politically. The conservatives only have 1 MP from 59 in seats in Scotland and only 15 from 129 MSPs. I think with the current government's recent swing to the right, it has led to feeling very little connect with the parties in power. Should have added as a note in my first post that, of my English friends living in Scotland, I'd say they're probably split 50/50. To be fair though, the 59 Scottish MPs are, at the moment, allowed to vote on matters relating only to England as well as UK wide legislation even though the Scots have their own Parliament. And we have a General Election happening in the not too distant future and after that, who knows, there could be a swing more towards the way the Scots feel politically.
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wellway
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,026
Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
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Post by wellway on Aug 22, 2014 12:14:19 GMT
If you were born in Scotland but live in another part of the UK, you cannot vote. However, if you born anywhere in the UK and now live in Scotland, as long as you're registered to vote, you can vote. Approximately 750K native born Scots live in England, Wales and Ireland. So, if you are a native born Scot, but live somewhere else, why is it that they are not allowed to vote? I ask because my experience (which is from the view point of an American) is that if you are a US citizen, no matter where you live in the world you are allowed a vote in any election. I think Alex Salmond is determined to get this vote through, hence reducing the voting age to sixteen for this vote. It does seem wrong that people of Commonwealth heritage can vote because they live in Scotland but Scots who live in any other part of the UK can't.
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Post by dulcemama on Aug 22, 2014 12:39:34 GMT
I'm with you here. And I confess to not really understanding all the ins and outs of this.
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Peamac
Pearl Clutcher
Refupea # 418
Posts: 4,229
Jun 26, 2014 0:09:18 GMT
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Post by Peamac on Aug 22, 2014 12:42:54 GMT
Very interesting! My grandmother's parents came to America from Scotland in the early 1900's and my sister's husband's family is of Scottish decent too. They even went to Scotland for their honeymoon a couple years ago. And I'm fond of MC Beaton's Hamish MacBeth series (the book, not the tv show). So there's my Scottish connection.
Is there a chance that even if the vote doesn't go through this time, the subject will continue to come up (but with better ideas as to how to make it work, etc), eventually leading to a yes vote (in ten years or so)? Or maybe Parliament will listen to why people voted yes, the changes they'd like to see, and actually make those changes?
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Post by jmurray on Aug 22, 2014 12:51:39 GMT
So, if you are a native born Scot, but live somewhere else, why is it that they are not allowed to vote? I ask because my experience (which is from the view point of an American) is that if you are a US citizen, no matter where you live in the world you are allowed a vote in any election. I think Alex Salmond is determined to get this vote through, hence reducing the voting age to sixteen for this vote. It does seem wrong that people of Commonwealth heritage can vote because they live in Scotland but Scots who live in any other part of the UK can't.
I get that Scots living outside Scotland may not be impacted immediately by a Yes vote outcome, as they're not living or paying taxes there (presumably). However that's not to say that a Scottish government may not introduce policies impacting all natural born Scots regardless of where they live at present. Also many people live away from their country of birth for a period of time then return to it later in life. So for those and a bunch of other reasons I'm not seeing the logic in not allowing them to vote? If I were a Scot and not able to vote I'd be pissed. Has that been an issue or are people generally ok with that ruling?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 10, 2024 12:22:05 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2014 13:40:11 GMT
I read someone that it's only people that are already registered to vote in Scotland, as it normally applies to the General Election & the Voting for the Scottish Parliament elections, that are allowed to vote with the addition of the 16 & 17 year old that are not normally eligible to vote.
Which makes sense, as at present they're part of the UK and that is the rule that applies to all of the UK. Wasn't that also the rule years ago when they had the devolved parliament both for them and Wales at the time?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 10, 2024 12:22:05 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2014 13:51:39 GMT
I think Alex Salmond is determined to get this vote through, hence reducing the voting age to sixteen for this vote. It does seem wrong that people of Commonwealth heritage can vote because they live in Scotland but Scots who live in any other part of the UK can't.
I get that Scots living outside Scotland may not be impacted immediately by a Yes vote outcome, as they're not living or paying taxes there (presumably). However that's not to say that a Scottish government may not introduce policies impacting all natural born Scots regardless of where they live at present. Also many people live away from their country of birth for a period of time then return to it later in life. So for those and a bunch of other reasons I'm not seeing the logic in not allowing them to vote? If I were a Scot and not able to vote I'd be pissed. Has that been an issue or are people generally ok with that ruling? They might be Scottish from their heritage/culture but they're actually British, they hold a UK passport and are classed as British Citizens. So if that was the case then all of the UK would be allowed to vote.Where would one draw the line?........ you (general you ) are Scottish,your mother/father are or was Scottish, your Grandparents.....where would it end.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 22, 2014 13:59:11 GMT
Thanks for starting this thread, I had no idea the vote was happening.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 10, 2024 12:22:05 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2014 14:05:28 GMT
If you were born in Scotland but live in another part of the UK, you cannot vote. However, if you born anywhere in the UK and now live in Scotland, as long as you're registered to vote, you can vote. Approximately 750K native born Scots live in England, Wales and Ireland. So, if you are a native born Scot, but live somewhere else, why is it that they are not allowed to vote? I ask because my experience (which is from the view point of an American) is that if you are a US citizen, no matter where you live in the world you are allowed a vote in any election. Lets take something similar to compare.....you are all Americans citizens but if, as a state, North Dakota decided they wanted to be independent would you think it right if the people that were born in North Dakota but have lived in Texas for about 20 years would be able to vote yes or no to the future of North Dakota?
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