Each Passing the Buck

Thank you moodyblue. And you said what I was trying to far more eloquently.

Olan, you posted a lot of messages, many of them long and most of them not directly answering the questions you have been asked. I did read them. You posted what you did about it being a "life and death situation," and then admitted you hadn't watched the video before I asked you your thoughts on escalating the situation. So, I already had that information from you and still didn't understand what you were saying. And when you did answer me (by quoting yourself), you simply said you thought the person would be arrested and didn't discuss the escalating violence aspect of the question at all.

Again, I am sincerely trying to learn here so that I can do better. If you are sincere in your desire to be a resource, in having meaningful discussions about race, and encouraging white woman to be more involved then you should know that you would be much more effective if you directly answered our questions (and not refer obliquely to any of your numerous previous posts) and stopped automatically dismissing people.

Another pea successfully alienated despite her best efforts to learn and understand the other side 🙄

Nice try Dewryce, but she will not change. Post and run, deflect and blame but it’s never her fault. 

Don't waste your breath. It's NOT you. 

I've seen it over and over so have avoided commenting in these threads before to avoid exactly this. But I truly wanted to have a meaningful discussion about it, so I was optimistic. Now I know.

I still do want to have that discussion. How would you guys have handled this, or a similar situation, if you were there? How would you be an ally? I said earlier that I read about a woman seeing another single woman pulled over and she pulled over and stayed until the officer left to be a witness and making the woman feel safer. Do you think pulling over (or standing there) is a good idea? Or that it helps? 

There is a list I've seen of things that can help, and one of them was know your rights, whether you are allowed to record, etc. But I don't remember the quality of the source. When I think about "what if" scenarios my concern is always ticking the police off and making the sitation worse for the person involved. Much like I've heard about not saying anything when a stranger isn't treating their child well in front of you, but isn't abusing them. I just don't know the best way to handle the situation and would love for an expert in the area to spell it out.

In the Starbucks situation, would I have been allowed to slip the men my name and phone number? In this situation I could have given it to their friend, but that wouldn't always be an option.

An employee at Starbucks made a very poor judgement call, resulting in an appalling action.

This brought to the nation’s attention important issues, and is resulting in policy changes in both corporate and law enforcement.

A company, which is not of course able to completely control its tens of thousands of employees, completely takes responsibility, apologizes, and vows more education to prevent future scenarios.

The men in question, who handled themselves admirably, have the option of hiring lawyers to get justice for their trauma, and perhaps, are also at least taking satisfaction in the fact that this incident is showing up the unconscious prejudice and profiling that POC endure. A situation that resulted in no violence, but still furthers the discussion and education is a good thing in the war against prejudice and discrimination.

Will I boycott Starbucks? No, and neither will my black friends and family members. They have shown since their beginning that is not the kind of place they are. If they had discriminatory policies, that would be a completely different story. I only go once a week, so it’s not that big a deal. And there are plenty of other places that could make me an americano. But my DIL has been a SB barista for many years, and while the company is not perfect, they try hard. They’ve had people boycott them because there weren’t Christmas trees on their cups. They’ve had boycotts by Trump supporters. They’ve been boycotted because people lyingly said they refused to serve marines. You don’t get to be a big company without someone in your employ making mistakes and muddying your face. It’s how it’s handled that is important.

What would I have done? After watching the video,( and truly, that’s the only way for sure to even draw a conclusion), I too would have videoed, told the police loudly the men had done nothing wrong, and gone to the station to give witness. Would I have thought to hand my number to them? Maybe not, but I will now if an occasion of injustice ever occurs in front of me, thx for the idea! But I, too, would never do anything that could trigger violence or the use of force. I would think we’ve learned that by now.

I deplore violence, discrimination, injustice, and hate. Deplore it. I also know we need to reduce violence. If that makes me a “ woman like you” so be it. Only in my dreams will it be completely eradicated.

eta: I am NOT saying it is good this happened. But that good can come of the publicity 

eta #2: Starbucks has also been boycotted by breastfeeding mothers, because of another idiotic employee. 

FYI - Remember who we're dealing with here...

I'm trying to decide if I should be upset or not.

IMO, if someone physically came in between the police and the men, it most likely would have escalated the situation and put them and others more at risk.

For my part, I never said "I'm done with you, Olan", I said "I'm not having it anymore."  And by "it", I mean your bullshit.

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ETA:  "I won't go back and forth with you"  What the hell do you think a conversation is?  It's not a one sided thing, Olan...there is back and there is forth.  It's called an "informal exchange of ideas by spoken/written words."  You aren't interested in actual "back and forth", just expressing yourself without acknowledging anyone else.  That is what is so offensive.
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My goal isn't to make you hairflip, you have just as much right as anyone else to be here.  My goal is to call out your bullshit when I see it.  I'll happily acknowledge your fair points too but keep doing this "I'm not doing anything, just trying to have a conversation" all while you're actually ignoring and dismissing other fair points in threads you start - it's gonna be commented on.  I mean, what exactly do you mean by posting a video you won't even watch?!?  A video that completely countermanded your entire point, btw.  It's strange that you don't understand how you undermine yourself.



You do bring good things to the board, however, your tactics only frustrate the good you try to do. 

Whatever. 

I don't need your approval either.

If your goal is to educate, you are doing a horrible job.

The Peas are trying to participate in a class discussion and are respectfully asking questions about your perspective. You didn't prepare a lesson plan (watch the video) and when questions were asked you heaped on more reading. Then you kicked everyone out of class for being stupid. 

I don't feel you are seeking for others to understand. You're just venting. Or vomiting via keyboard.