ReConTarian Sandbox

It matters because one is protected under the law and the other is not. You're being wilfully obtuse and/or disingenuous when you pretend not to understand the difference.

My personal opinion is that the restaurant owner should not have refused service, but she did not discriminate because Sander's choice of employer is not an immutable characteristic. She can choose not to work for Trump. A gay person cannot choose not to be gay.

And you trying to school me on tolerance is hilarious. You seem to need the law to tell you who is entitled to humane treatment, all while wasting tons of energy explaining why it's okay for the immigrants in question to be abused.

Guess what? I'm an atheist. My moral compass is pretty decent without the help of an imaginary dude in the sky or the government. It's one of the reasons I find your boy trump so abhorrent.

Just so we're clear, things that outrage you:

-The mean, fake media;
-liberals;
-children in detention centers;
-anything negative said about trump;
-nfl players kneeling;
-hillary

Things you will fall on the sword to defend:

-inhumane treatment of people at the border;
-president pussy grabber;
-destruction of relations with our allies;
-fostering relationships with legitimate dictators;

And on and on and on.

Fat people aren't protected under the law so by your standard it's okay to refuse them service because they're fat.


Uh, ya' got that a little backwards. 

The rest of your post is nothing but incorrect babble based on your hatred. Not worth responding to.

It may not be very kind to discriminate against fat people, but it's actually not illegal. Fat is not an immutable characteristic.

Pro-birthers only care about life until the birth of a child. After that, many are willing to ignore atrocities (like putting children in cages in detention centers) because ... well, I don’t know why. It makes no sense. It seems to me that that pro-birth segment of society should be the most morally outraged by the US treatment of minors. No “but immigrants are here illegally.” No “but we need stronger borders.”

Seems like it is a lot easier to protect and care about some abstract potential for life and a heck of a lot more difficult to care about living, breathing children undergoing serious psychological trauma.

Feigned outrage. How very Jesusy of you. Plenty of us care about unborn children. We are also capable of caring about already born children AT THE SAME TIME. I see a lot of moral outrage about baby killers by the same people who look away when regugees come to our border begging for asylum.

You know what? Some of us are trying to get rid of abortion. But we recognize that simply outlawing abortion won't end it. Instead, we're focused on making sure that every woman has what she needs to either (a) prevent an unwanted pregnancy or (b) get access to medical care, child care, good public education, etc. necessary to raise her baby if that's what she wants.

It's not the left who stands in the way of all those things, which would actually reduce abortions. It's y'all. Colorado started providing free birth control to all women and their abortion rate dropped by 30%.  Imagine! But because the religious right thinks birth control is immoral and providing it for free is one step from full-on socialism, the likelihood of this policy being implemented in all states is nil. Also, the religious right looooves abstinence-only sex ed programs, which are actually linked with a higher rate of teen pregnancy (some of which certainly end in abortion).

You all want an end to abortion, but you're not willing to put policies in place that would actually reduce abortions. You do understand that making it illegal just drives poor women underground to shady practitioners, right? And that wealthier women will find office doctors who are willing to perform a D&C for a price.

Unless and until you're wiling to talk about policies that will actually put an end to abortion, and that recognize that life continues and must be supported past birth, please stop calling yourself pro-life. You're anything but.

Conservatives believe if you are “responsible” enough to be fucking be responsible enough to take care of your family, don’t expect the rest of society to take care of them. If liberals are so concerned about the life of the illegals why don’t you go to their country and change things?

This is where my (recovering republican, democrat in denial) husband stands as well. He is anti-abortion, with exceptions. But he is beginning to recognize that his party's stances and policies on sexual education, and affordable and accessible healthcare and birth control are actually helping to create more unwanted pregnancies. And he acknowledges that even if abortion were made illegal it wouldn't stop them from happening, especially with the widespread availability of the internet. People make bombs with instructions from the internet, to ignore that methods for abortion will be readily available and used is reckless. He also recognizes how these issues disproportionately affect women and minorities, and how once these children are born, his party is often unwilling to provide support when needed. So while his strong preference is to make most abortions illegal, he understands that the realistic goal is to reduce them as much as possible by helping lower the rate of unwanted pregnancies. And the Republican Party will not acknowledge this, and therefore are not working towards it. It's been a hard conclusion for him to come to, understandably.

Thank you for the information about Colorado, I'll go read up on that. In one of the Scandanavian countries there was a strong push for education and easily accessible birth control with positive results as well. I'll see if I can find it again and link here.

Andrew Cuomo told conservatives they were not welcome in NYS: link

.[/quote]If the "plenty of you" really cared about unborn children, there would be "plenty" more people trying to get rid of abortion. 
[/quote]

I would love a world where we don’t need abortion, where no woman ever finds herself with an unplanned or unwanted pregnancy. I’m trying to “get rid” of abortion by fighting for access to safe and affordable birth control, by advocating for comprehensive sex education rather than abstinence only programs that have been proven not to work, and fighting for affordable child care. I work towards health care that sees women through pregnancies, maximizing their health and the health of their babies, and carries those babies through a healthy life without having to declare bankruptcy if they become ill. I work to empower women to have control over their bodies so they don’t have to be worried about being forced or coerced into unprotected sex and unwanted pregnancies. But since we still have teenagers being told to wait for marriage with no further education on how not to get pregnant, and women who are raped, and women who can’t afford birth control, or who realize they cannot afford to bring a child into the world since they can’t afford health or child care, I will continue to fight to keep abortion safe, legal and accessible. And as to the “murder” argument, abortion is an incredibly unique circumstance. A fetus can not survive on its own, it is entirely dependent on the mother. We do not force people to donate kidneys, even dead bodies do not have to share their organs, but we feel justified in telling pregnant women what they must do with their organs.

I am also on the train to provide free birth control.  So yes, MAYBE we've found common ground.  

If the "plenty of you" really cared about unborn children, there would be "plenty" more people trying to get rid of abortion. 
[/quote]

I would love a world where we don’t need abortion, where no woman ever finds herself with an unplanned or unwanted pregnancy. I’m trying to “get rid” of abortion by fighting for access to safe and affordable birth control, by advocating for comprehensive sex education rather than abstinence only programs that have been proven not to work, and fighting for affordable child care. I work towards health care that sees women through pregnancies, maximizing their health and the health of their babies, and carries those babies through a healthy life without having to declare bankruptcy if they become ill. I work to empower women to have control over their bodies so they don’t have to be worried about being forced or coerced into unprotected sex and unwanted pregnancies. But since we still have teenagers being told to wait for marriage with no further education on how not to get pregnant, and women who are raped, and women who can’t afford birth control, or who realize they cannot afford to bring a child into the world since they can’t afford health or child care, I will continue to fight to keep abortion safe, legal and accessible. And as to the “murder” argument, abortion is an incredibly unique circumstance. A fetus can not survive on its own, it is entirely dependent on the mother. We do not force people to donate kidneys, even dead bodies do not have to share their organs, but we feel justified in telling pregnant women what they must do with their organs. [/quote]

But sometimes birth control fails and women should have the right to affordable, safe abortions. I do believe there should be more limits. For example in the case of there being no medical reason it shouldn’t even allowed after the first trimester. But then again I’m allowing the government to make moral decisions about a woman’s body so it’s a tough one.

Did you notice that his definition of "extreme conservatives" was defined as those who oppose abortion and gun control measures? 

I think he'd be pretty stunned if all those "extreme conservatives" actually decided to leave since we pay a HUGE portion of the state's taxes. He'd be begging..and I mean begging...us to reconsider. 

But that aside, I'm pretty sure that the GOVERNOR of any state has crossed a major line when he says that massive portions of his population are not welcome in the state where they peacefully pay taxes and own property. Simply for not agreeing with him on political issues. We're not talking about a specific group putting up road signs here--we're talking about a state's governor! Seems to me there's a lot to worry about there.

I am a citizen just like you. I don’t care how many abortions a person has, I just don’t believe somebody else should pay for it. I am all for legal abortion. I am also anti welfare, food stamps etc.
My family owns a business that is in several towns one has been there 52 years. The neighborhood use to be nice, now it’s the hood. You tell me why I should have to pay for grown ass men and women walking the streets all day. This particular building has to have lots of security (I could post a video from the cameras daily). One of my employees at this buildings wife is the fraud food stamp investigator, so we get to know who are abusing the system in this particular town. They walk in the shop daily asking for money. I can guarantee you that not a liberal here would spend one dime of their money to live in a neighborhood like this one.