lizacreates
Pearl Clutcher
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Aug 29, 2015 2:39:19 GMT
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Post by lizacreates on May 2, 2019 0:00:55 GMT
When it comes to abortion, it’s always been a mystery to me why the party of constitutional textualists will always support a law that’s unconstitutional. For someone not familiar with your constitution can you explain please? My pleasure. For over four decades, blanket bans of abortion have been illegal. They’re illegal because they violate the Due Process Clauses of the 5th and 14th Amendments of the Constitution, and no state law can conflict with federal law under the Supremacy Clause in Article VI. The word “Liberty” in the Due Process Clauses has already been defined by the Supreme Court as inclusive of right to physical autonomy. That’s been settled in two landmark cases - Roe v Wade and Planned Parenthood v Casey. That’s black letter law. Re this specific Alabama law, this is what we call trigger bans. Even when passed, they cannot be implemented while Roe v Wade is standing as legal precedent. Legislation like this in Alabama and other red states will only be “triggered” if and when the Supreme Court overturns RvW. In other words, have it on the books and once RvW is overturned, the law immediately goes into effect. Since I was a young woman states were already doing this (well, maybe not in this many states), ever since the Supreme Court decriminalized abortion and they just sort of languish in the books or are shot down in court. States can ban only after the “point of viability” in the second trimester (24-26 weeks as established in Planned Parenthood v Casey). They can close down abortion clinics. They can chip away at access. They can do all sorts of things to make getting an abortion harder. But a blanket ban? No. That’s why the ACLU will challenge the moment it passes. (ETA: I probably should have noted that the relevant clauses read: "...no one shall be "deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law ..." and "...nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law ...")
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sassyangel
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Jun 26, 2014 23:58:32 GMT
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Post by sassyangel on May 2, 2019 0:00:58 GMT
I'm quite glad I don't live in Alabama.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on May 2, 2019 0:02:50 GMT
This is what I posted in response: Those with money and/or those with connections have ALWAYS had access to safe abortions. That is not the case with those of lesser means. They had to deal with back alley butchers!
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Post by gar on May 2, 2019 6:23:29 GMT
For someone not familiar with your constitution can you explain please? My pleasure. For over four decades, blanket bans of abortion have been illegal. They’re illegal because they violate the Due Process Clauses of the 5th and 14th Amendments of the Constitution, and no state law can conflict with federal law under the Supremacy Clause in Article VI. The word “Liberty” in the Due Process Clauses has already been defined by the Supreme Court as inclusive of right to physical autonomy. That’s been settled in two landmark cases - Roe v Wade and Casey v Planned Parenthood. That’s black letter law. Re this specific Alabama law, this is what we call trigger bans. Even when passed, they cannot be implemented while Roe v Wade is standing as legal precedent. Legislation like this in Alabama and other red states will only be “triggered” if and when the Supreme Court overturns RvW. In other words, have it on the books and once RvW is overturned, the law immediately goes into effect. Since I was a young woman states were already doing this (well, maybe not in this many states), ever since the Supreme Court decriminalized abortion and they just sort of languish in the books or are shot down in court. States can ban only after the “point of viability” in the second trimester (24-26 weeks as established in Casey v Planned Parenthood). They can close down abortion clinics. They can chip away at access. They can do all sorts of things to make getting an abortion harder. But a blanket ban? No. That’s why the ACLU will challenge the moment it passes. (ETA: I probably should have noted that the relevant clauses read: "...no one shall be "deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law ..." and "...nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law ...") Thank you for taking th time to explain that
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me2
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Oct 3, 2016 3:32:09 GMT
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Post by me2 on May 2, 2019 8:24:25 GMT
The idea of putting the words abortion into Google makes me apprehensive, so do you mind sharing the statistics? Why does researching abortion make you apprehensive? It’s easy enough to find reputable abortion statistics. Whatever somebody considers reputable. And it’s informative to read everything that is out there regardless of the side that is being presented. I’m not going to provide the statistics. In full disclosure, I had an abortion at the age of 35. I never ever ever thought I would choose that option ever. NEVER. For many reasons. I had a harder time making the decision than what I have read many women do when faced with the same situation AND my recovery from my choice was brutal, which also doesn’t appear common for women like me in this situation. I wouldn’t say I regretted my decision as much as I regretted being in a situation where I had to make a choice. Did you know many OB doctors provide abortions in their office before a certain number of weeks? Did you know Planned Parenthood doesn’t actually provide a large number of abortions? Planned parenthood refers a lot of patients out to other doctors or hospitals who perform the procedure. My own OB office would do this procedure in their office up until a certain number of weeks after which they referred a patient to hospital for procedure or another doctor office. In my situation, my OB no longer performed abortions but other doctors in her practice did right there in their office. We hear about abortion clinics but that isn’t where a lot of abortions happen. I was so surprised. I had my abortion at a doctor’s office (not in my OBs office) that you would never have figured for an ‘abortion clinic.’ Because it wasn’t that. They did do pregnancy terminations via doctor referrals. Perhaps for medical reasons and perhaps for selfish reasons. You wouldn’t know from outside looking in. I was suicidal for almost a year after and still have my moments. Did you know it takes pregnancy related hormones almost 18 months to leave your body, regardless of how you become not pregnant anymore? Through birth, pregnancy death, or pregnancy termination? I was a shit show of emotions and sometimes still have my moments of complete devastation. I spent years in therapy trying to heal through the grief some said I had no right to feel. And you know what? If I hadn’t gone through my situation, I may have thought some of the same things and cast some of the same judgement against a woman who made the same decision I did. Abortion, for me, was not an easy choice nor a simplistic decision. It was difficult and complex. Today I’m about to embark on my first round of IVF as a 43 year old. It is hard to reconcile all of this. But you know what? My life and my body and my children. 🤷♀️ Until you live the childhood I did and the adult situations I lived, you (general you) don’t get to tell me what I should do. My life experiences influenced my choice. Anything somebody tells me at this point wont be worse than anything I told myself in the almost 8 years since I had to make a very tough decision for me. You will never truly know what you would do until you are faced with this exact choice in this situation. I thought I knew and I was oh so wrong. (Sorry for any typos) And I’m sharing this publicly because other wome after me need to know they are not alone. I share with people in my real life even when I shouldn’t because I must put a face and voice to this very real and personal decision. I don’t expect everybody to understand or agree with my choice but I have no doubt my words and my story will help another woman. Even if it’s at a cost to my own reputation. I'm so sorry you went through that. I'm glad you're still here with us. ❤️
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anniebygaslight
Drama Llama
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I'd love a cup of tea. #1966
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Jun 28, 2014 14:08:19 GMT
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Post by anniebygaslight on May 2, 2019 8:39:16 GMT
You can bet your arse that the people voting on this issue are predominantly male.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Jul 6, 2024 18:22:22 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2019 13:16:40 GMT
Donate, donate, donate. You have the right to determine what other human being can use your body, blood, bone marrow, organs for their life support. You cannot even use the organs of a DEAD PERSON without their pre-consent. But pregnant women in Alabama no longer have that right. Donate, donate, donate. www.prochoiceamerica.org/state-law/alabama/![](http://cdn-webimages.wimages.net/0524dced33e35e1ee0df6c9a7f893ec0c86bd3-wide-thumbnail.jpg?v=3)
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Deleted
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Jul 6, 2024 18:22:22 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2019 13:33:06 GMT
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lizacreates
Pearl Clutcher
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Aug 29, 2015 2:39:19 GMT
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Post by lizacreates on May 2, 2019 14:10:47 GMT
This is what I posted in response: Those with money and/or those with connections have ALWAYS had access to safe abortions. That is not the case with those of lesser means. They had to deal with back alley butchers! "Are these people helping with raising kids?" No. They're too busy dismantling Obamacare. And apparently, Trump made good on his promise since the DOJ has already filed briefs to dismantle ACA in one fell swoop. Who cares that approx. 56 million women will lose contraception coverage, approx 29 million children will lose preventive care including vaccines at no cost, expanded Medicaid for low-income families will disappear?
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Post by revirdsuba99 on May 2, 2019 14:25:19 GMT
Donate, donate, donate. You have the right to determine what other human being can use your body, blood, bone marrow, organs for their life support. You cannot even use the organs of a DEAD PERSON without their pre-consent. But pregnant women in Alabama no longer have that right. Donate, donate, donate. www.prochoiceamerica.org/state-law/alabama/Done! When your pro-Trump relatives fresh from church insist they must support him because of abortion, you might ask: How much of that is really about the unborn, and how much is just a righteous excuse for a far less noble agenda? You might refer them to revered Catholic nun Joan Chittister , who’s anti-abortion, but has famously said, “Your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed. . . . That’s not pro-life. That’s pro-birth.”
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Post by crazy4scraps on May 2, 2019 15:08:56 GMT
This is what I was getting at, and it is absolutely disgusting! I just cannot in any way, shape or form wrap my head around the fact that women and girls who have been sexually abused or assaulted in this way would be forced to undergo further abuse by way of the government. It is abominable. It is cruel. It is sick. So much for the party of smaller government, fewer restrictions, etc. I guess that only applies if you are rich and male. ![](http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r481/2peasrefugees/Smilies/censored.gif) ![](http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r481/2peasrefugees/Smilies/flamingmad.gif)
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Post by femalebusiness on May 2, 2019 15:48:57 GMT
I'm quite glad I don't live in Alabama. And don't understand why anyone would voluntarily live in that backward thinking place.
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craftymom101
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,664
Jul 31, 2014 5:23:25 GMT
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Post by craftymom101 on May 2, 2019 16:55:24 GMT
I haven't read all the replies but this bill will be overturned by the supreme court, yes? It directly contradicts Roe V. Wade, which was a federal supreme court case legalizing abortion. Alabama can pass all the anti-abortion bills it wants but until Roe is overturned (ughhhh), the states cannot ban abortion. lizacreates you answered this post much better than I did! Thanks!
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Post by pierkiss on May 2, 2019 17:29:16 GMT
I haven't read all the replies but this bill will be overturned by the supreme court, yes? It directly contradicts Roe V. Wade, which was a federal supreme court case legalizing abortion. Alabama can pass all the anti-abortion bills it wants but until Roe is overturned (ughhhh), the states cannot ban abortion. lizacreates you answered this post much better than I did! Thanks! I think the point of these bills is to chip and chip away at the rights, sending them all over to the SC until they finally hear one of the cases, with enough conservatives on the bench who are anti-abortion and move to overturn Row v Wade.
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Post by pierkiss on May 2, 2019 17:30:35 GMT
I haven't read all the replies but this bill will be overturned by the supreme court, yes? It directly contradicts Roe V. Wade, which was a federal supreme court case legalizing abortion. Alabama can pass all the anti-abortion bills it wants but until Roe is overturned (ughhhh), the states cannot ban abortion. lizacreates you answered this post much better than I did! Thanks! And, while they can’t outright ban abortion, they CAN make it damn near impossible to get one in their state. There is another state where there are only like 2 abortion clinics or clinics that provide the procedure in the entire state. Can’t remember all the details but it was a big thing a few years ago.
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inkedup
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,837
Jun 26, 2014 5:00:26 GMT
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Post by inkedup on May 2, 2019 17:30:51 GMT
I haven't read all the replies but this bill will be overturned by the supreme court, yes? It directly contradicts Roe V. Wade, which was a federal supreme court case legalizing abortion. Alabama can pass all the anti-abortion bills it wants but until Roe is overturned (ughhhh), the states cannot ban abortion. lizacreates you answered this post much better than I did! Thanks! I think the point of these bills is to chip and chip away at the rights, sending them all over to the SC until they finally hear one of the cases, with enough conservatives on the bench who are anti-abortion and move to overturn Row v Wade. Yup. I think this is the endgame. Absolutely. And they'll have plenty of time to do this if Trump gets a second term.
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schizo319
Pearl Clutcher
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Jun 28, 2014 0:26:58 GMT
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Post by schizo319 on May 2, 2019 19:19:34 GMT
I'm quite glad I don't live in Alabama. And don't understand why anyone would voluntarily live in that backward thinking place. It must be nice to have the privilege to just pick up and move to a place where the majority of the state agrees 100% with your values. My family and home are here in Alabama. Sure, I could sell it all and abandon my aging mother to move to some utopia where the cost of living is far beyond my earning potential in my chosen career OR I can stay where I'm at and fight the good fight with like-minded folks who are trying to drag Alabama (if kicking and screaming) into the current century. This "law" (which our lawmakers have screamed from the rooftops that they're going to fight all the way to the Supreme Court - because ostensibly, we have nothing better to do with our tax dollars) is not a surprise, it's simply another way for them to make abortion virtually impossible to obtain like they have been doing for decades. Women who are lucky enough to live on/near a border can and do go to other states to have abortions (we also cross the border into GA, FL, TN, and MS to buy our lottery tickets). People here are convinced that Brett Kavanaugh is the second coming of Christ and he will slay the Roe v. Wade dragon - freeing up a ton of unwanted babies for Christian charities to profit from when they sell adopt them out to loving homes. At this point, I'm just hopeful that there are enough Republican lawmakers who won't vote against Roe v. Wade because they still want the option available to their mistresses and daughters.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on May 2, 2019 19:40:36 GMT
At this point, I'm just hopeful that there are enough Republican lawmakers who won't vote against Roe v. Wade because they still want the option available to their mistresses and daughters. THEY can afford whatever they want... They don't need a law to accomplish what they want.
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Post by kmcginn on May 2, 2019 21:02:19 GMT
manda, I'm so sorry for your loss and what you had to go through.
Abortion is a very personal thing, made for many and various reasons. Being a Catholic, I believe life starts at the moment of conception. That being said, I would never presume to judge anyone for whatever choice they make.
I have come to realize that many people who claim to be "pro-life" today, are really "pro-birth". Once the baby is born, they don't care what happens. Caging children at the border and deporting DACA kids is a prime example.
To the OP, in my opinion, this would happen in almost any Southern state, as most of them are very conservative, especially about this issue. I live in LA - probably as, if not more, conservative than AL. I have not read the bill, so I can't comment as to its specifics.
Just my opinion for what it's worth.
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scrappinghappy
Pearl Clutcher
“I’m late, I’m late for a very important date. No time to say “Hello.” Goodbye. I’m late...."
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Jun 26, 2014 19:30:06 GMT
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Post by scrappinghappy on May 2, 2019 21:07:40 GMT
You can bet your arse that the people voting on this issue are predominantly male. Yet the person pushing this through who wants to see it go to the supreme court is a woman: "State Rep. Terri Collins (R), a sponsor of the measure, said the bill is intended to go all the way up to the Supreme Court and challenge Roe v. Wade, the landmark decision that legalized abortion nationwide. And then what happens to all these unwanted children? It is a documented proof that where there is freely available abortion, there is less crime. There is less child abuse. There are lower levels of poverty. To quote Joan Chittister , a nun who is anti-abortion: "I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed. And why would I think that you don't? Because you don't want any tax money to go there. That's not pro-life. That's pro-birth. We need a much broader conversation on what the morality of pro-life is."
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Post by kmcginn on May 2, 2019 21:11:58 GMT
You explained it very well!! I didn't realize the law would just sit on the books until RvW is overturned. But it makes perfect sense! I g8uess I never really thought about it that way.
What's that saying - You learn something new everyday!!
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Post by frenchie on May 3, 2019 14:24:43 GMT
You can bet your arse that the people voting on this issue are predominantly male. Yet the person pushing this through who wants to see it go to the supreme court is a woman: "State Rep. Terri Collins (R), a sponsor of the measure, said the bill is intended to go all the way up to the Supreme Court and challenge Roe v. Wade, the landmark decision that legalized abortion nationwide. And then what happens to all these unwanted children? It is a documented proof that where there is freely available abortion, there is less crime. There is less child abuse. There are lower levels of poverty. To quote Joan Chittister , a nun who is anti-abortion: "I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed. And why would I think that you don't? Because you don't want any tax money to go there. That's not pro-life. That's pro-birth. We need a much broader conversation on what the morality of pro-life is." [ I will never understand how a woman would want to take away another woman's choice to do something. As manda said, it was something she never would've thought she would/could do. But life sometimes throws curve balls and circumstances change. As the mother of 2 daughters, I will do everything in my power to make sure they always have choice.
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Deleted
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Jul 6, 2024 18:22:22 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2019 14:46:52 GMT
Yet the person pushing this through who wants to see it go to the supreme court is a woman: "State Rep. Terri Collins (R), a sponsor of the measure, said the bill is intended to go all the way up to the Supreme Court and challenge Roe v. Wade, the landmark decision that legalized abortion nationwide. And then what happens to all these unwanted children? It is a documented proof that where there is freely available abortion, there is less crime. There is less child abuse. There are lower levels of poverty. To quote Joan Chittister , a nun who is anti-abortion: "I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed. And why would I think that you don't? Because you don't want any tax money to go there. That's not pro-life. That's pro-birth. We need a much broader conversation on what the morality of pro-life is." [ I will never understand how a woman would want to take away another woman's choice to do something. As manda said, it was something she never would've thought she would/could do. But life sometimes throws curve balls and circumstances change. As the mother of 2 daughters, I will do everything in my power to make sure they always have choice. If you can understand someone wanting to save an already created life, then you can understand why someone would feel they're doing the right thing. I believe that there are reasons and circumstances where you would need to make the choice to have an abortion and that it should be a choice made between a woman and her doctor, but I can understand why people are pro-life.
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Just T
Drama Llama
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Post by Just T on May 3, 2019 14:54:21 GMT
I've been watching Call the Midwife and they have been dealing with the backstreet abortions of the 1960s as abortion was illegal. A lot of the women either die or end up unable to have children due to the illegal procedures they are forced to have. This is not something women take lightly and I personally know someone who had to have an illegal procedure. 50 years later and for some there is no alternative, very sad. No one is forcing women to have an abortion. Legal or otherwise. Yes, there are alternatives. I don't think she meant forced in the literal sense of the word. Some women, due to their life circumstances, feel as if they have no choice but to have an abortion. I can't and won't ever judge that.
On the other hand, I do know someone who was forced to have an abortion when she was 15. By her father who drove her to the clinic and told her that it was her choice--she could either have an abortion or move out. What is a 15 year old who has no where to go supposed to do in that situation?
We haven't all had the same life experiences, and again, I will not judge anyone who has an abortion if they feel that is what is best for them at that time. And like others have already said, making abortion illegal isn't going to stop women from having them. Those who are wealthy will be able to get around the law, as they did prior to Roe vs. Wade, and poor women with little resources and/or support will have to resort to unsafe procedures.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Jul 6, 2024 18:22:22 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2019 14:58:59 GMT
No one is forcing women to have an abortion. Legal or otherwise. Yes, there are alternatives. I don't think she meant forced in the literal sense of the word. Some women, due to their life circumstances, feel as if they have no choice but to have an abortion. I can't and won't ever judge that.
On the other hand, I do know someone who was forced to have an abortion when she was 15. By her father who drove her to the clinic and told her that it was her choice--she could either have an abortion or move out. What is a 15 year old who has no where to go supposed to do in that situation?
We haven't all had the same life experiences, and again, I will not judge anyone who has an abortion if they feel that is what is best for them at that time. And like others have already said, making abortion illegal isn't going to stop women from having them. Those who are wealthy will be able to get around the law, as they did prior to Roe vs. Wade, and poor women with little resources and/or support will have to resort to unsafe procedures.
I understand, thank you for explaining your position so kindly.
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Post by crazy4scraps on May 3, 2019 16:49:33 GMT
Yet the person pushing this through who wants to see it go to the supreme court is a woman: "State Rep. Terri Collins (R), a sponsor of the measure, said the bill is intended to go all the way up to the Supreme Court and challenge Roe v. Wade, the landmark decision that legalized abortion nationwide. And then what happens to all these unwanted children? It is a documented proof that where there is freely available abortion, there is less crime. There is less child abuse. There are lower levels of poverty. To quote Joan Chittister , a nun who is anti-abortion: "I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed. And why would I think that you don't? Because you don't want any tax money to go there. That's not pro-life. That's pro-birth. We need a much broader conversation on what the morality of pro-life is." I just wanted to touch on what I’ve bolded for a minute. I’m sure what a lot of the pro-birthers believe is that by making abortion illegal again, the floodgates for adoption will be flung open wide and suddenly there will be bunches of babies being given up. What they DON’T consider is this. How many of the women who find themselves pregnant when they don’t want to be, and many of whom may probably lack health care coverage and all the other financial resources to get through a pregnancy healthy, are going to end up going through their unwanted pregnancies without adequate prenatal care? Sometimes without enough resources to sustain themselves such as food, shelter, clothing or transportation to get to all of the required appointments? How many would seriously consider hurting themselves in an effort to end their troubles? How many might do drugs or use alcohol during their pregnancy because they simply don’t care, because they are addicted, or because they’re under the thumb of someone else who doesn’t want them to be pregnant? Now think for a second about the babies that could result from such circumstances. Who is going to want those babies? Who is going to voluntarily choose a kid with confirmed fetal alcohol syndrome, or born addicted to crack or meth or opioids, or with other significant developmental difficulties and who will no doubt face a lifetime of medical and other intervention? Because if they were interested in a special needs child there are already many languishing in the system waiting for homes that could be placed right NOW. So where are all the pro-birthers right now in that scenario? Why are so many special needs and older children waiting in foster care right now, today? You would think that with so many people beating that drum that there wouldn’t be a single child waiting ever, and yet there are. And then abortion is abolished and even more children are born with these significant issues. Who is ultimately the one who ends up suffering most, even if they are adopted out? Just something else to think about. I totally believe that unless the people claiming to be “pro-life” are seriously putting their money where their mouth is and doing EVERYTHING humanly possible to see that ALL of these waiting children find loving homes and have everything they will need throughout their lives (including but not limited to adequate health care, adequate special education in public schools, adequate affordable housing for their families, etc.) and especially since some of these kids may require government assistance throughout their lives, then those people aren’t pro-life at all and they really are just pro-birth.
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Deleted
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Jul 6, 2024 18:22:22 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2019 22:42:46 GMT
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Post by manda on May 7, 2019 8:14:47 GMT
Ladies and friends.
I have been very afraid to return to this thread after my post. Sometimes I share too much and then later regret it. So I avoid.
I am stunned that all of you, whether you agree with my choice or not, have been so kind. Thank you. Thank you for letting me share and say what I needed to say. Thank you for not responding in contradiction even when I know many of you may not understand why I did what I did. Thank for not responding with hate. Thank you.
It makes me want to share my experience more. Thank you so much.
I would not recommend this path for anybody. As I said before, I wish this was a choice I never had to make. I thought it was a choice I would never have to make. I assumed I would make a different choice if ever in this position. It wasn’t an easy choice for me.
I often wonder what if. But I can’t get stuck on what if.
Thank you for extending kindness and compassion. Even if you don’t understand or wouldn’t choose the outcome I did.
Thank you for listening. Even if you don’t understand.
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Post by sabrinae on May 7, 2019 12:54:53 GMT
Ladies and friends. I have been very afraid to return to this thread after my post. Sometimes I share too much and then later regret it. So I avoid. I am stunned that all of you, whether you agree with my choice or not, have been so kind. Thank you. Thank you for letting me share and say what I needed to say. Thank you for not responding in contradiction even when I know many of you may not understand why I did what I did. Thank for not responding with hate. Thank you. It makes me want to share my experience more. Thank you so much. I would not recommend this path for anybody. As I said before, I wish this was a choice I never had to make. I thought it was a choice I would never have to make. I assumed I would make a different choice if ever in this position. It wasn’t an easy choice for me. I often wonder what if. But I can’t get stuck on what if. Thank you for extending kindness and compassion. Even if you don’t understand or wouldn’t choose the outcome I did. Thank you for listening. Even if you don’t understand. Thank you for taking the risk and telling your story. No one hasn’t to tell their story and no one should feel like they have to tell their story, but until women share their own stories it’s easy for others to demonize every one who has an abortion
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Post by revirdsuba99 on May 7, 2019 14:37:20 GMT
""(State)Representative Kelly Townsend (R-AZ)on Thursday Our country is sovereign, our State is sovereign, our family is sovereign, our God is sovereign and the most holy and sacred last frontier of sovereignty is our own body. Dearest friends and people of Arizona, it seems we are prepared to give up our liberty, the very sovereignty of our body, because of measles. I read yesterday that the idea is being floated that if not enough people get vaccinated, then we are going to force them to. The idea that we force someone to give up..."" After some online backlash, Townsend wrote another Facebook post later Thursday defending her comments, saying that “maybe [she] meant to say Socialist.” “The point here isn't whether or not we should vaccinate, that's for another post,” she said. “The point is whether or not your body is sovereign or if the government can force you to be injected against your will.”
** thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/432168-arizona-republican-mandatory-vaccines-are-communistRepublican stating your body is SOVEREIGN, thinking that may be useful in time!! Abortions are very personal. Vaccines affect ALL of humanity!!
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