oh yvonne
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Jun 26, 2014 0:45:23 GMT
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Post by oh yvonne on Jan 11, 2016 21:36:25 GMT
I'll just ITA with MerryMom's great post. I marathoned this weekend and went back and forth on this, but I honestly believe that there is enough to convict Steven, anyone who is capable of dousing the family cat with gasoline and tossing it into the fire is a sick son of a bitch who should not be roaming the streets, and I think he was fully capable of committing this heinous act, that poor girl! And the other thing that I just can't let go of is the fact that the nephew was so freaked out about his actions he could not eat and lost weight. When your appetite leaves you, there is some seriously heavy shit on your mind. Also his cousin's testimony against him. She didn't lie the first time, and I don't buy his story that he was trying to lose weight on purpose because of his girlfriend. I think he is slow and dim witted, and I think he was easily coerced into his actions, but I think he did it. During the trial, Brendan said he lost weight because people had started to call him fat and that he believed that is why he lost his girlfriend. Apparently it had nothing to do with Steven Avery. See, I don't buy that, at all. I don't think he went and got himself on a diet and lost weight, I just don't think he's that sophisticated. It takes quite a bit of effor to lose weight, planning, etc. Even when you are young and it comes off fairly easy. I just don't see him jogging, etc. Well, okay, I'm out. We all have our opinions,and that's mine. I think the documentary piece left out to much for me to buy everything hook, line and sinker. I will watch the other updated documentaries too, because I'm still curious about lots left out.
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Nink
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Jul 1, 2014 23:30:44 GMT
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Post by Nink on Jan 11, 2016 21:42:35 GMT
During the trial, Brendan said he lost weight because people had started to call him fat and that he believed that is why he lost his girlfriend. Apparently it had nothing to do with Steven Avery. See, I don't buy that, at all. I don't think he went and got himself on a diet and lost weight, I just don't think he's that sophisticated. It takes quite a bit of effor to lose weight, planning, etc. Even when you are young and it comes off fairly easy. I just don't see him jogging, etc. Well, okay, I'm out. We all have our opinions,and that's mine. I think the documentary piece left out to much for me to buy everything hook, line and sinker. I will watch the other updated documentaries too, because I'm still curious about lots left out. from the time that Theresa went missing until the arrest, how much time lapsed? Wasn't it just a matter of days? So how could he lose so much weight from the guilt of it, when he was arrested not too long after? And during the time of his video taped "confession" through the rest of the film, I did not see any giant weight fluctuations. Confused.
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Gennifer
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Jun 26, 2014 8:22:26 GMT
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Post by Gennifer on Jan 11, 2016 21:44:03 GMT
See, I don't buy that, at all. I don't think he went and got himself on a diet and lost weight, I just don't think he's that sophisticated. It takes quite a bit of effor to lose weight, planning, etc. Even when you are young and it comes off fairly easy. I just don't see him jogging, etc. Well, okay, I'm out. We all have our opinions,and that's mine. I think the documentary piece left out to much for me to buy everything hook, line and sinker. I will watch the other updated documentaries too, because I'm still curious about lots left out. I disagree. I see my kids weight fluctuate just from being in a semester that has PE. Hell, I have a nephew that you wouldn't even recognize as the same person from two photos taken just six months apart: one, at the height of football season, and one after he graduated (and lost 40 lbs). It's not nearly as difficult for a teenage boy with amazing metabolism to drop weight as it is for a woman, or even a teenage girl, for that matter!
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,579
Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 11, 2016 21:54:28 GMT
See, I don't buy that, at all. I don't think he went and got himself on a diet and lost weight, I just don't think he's that sophisticated. It takes quite a bit of effor to lose weight, planning, etc. Even when you are young and it comes off fairly easy. I just don't see him jogging, etc. Well, okay, I'm out. We all have our opinions,and that's mine. I think the documentary piece left out to much for me to buy everything hook, line and sinker. I will watch the other updated documentaries too, because I'm still curious about lots left out. from the time that Theresa went missing until the arrest, how much time lapsed? Wasn't it just a matter of days? So how could he lose so much weight from the guilt of it, when he was arrested not too long after? And during the time of his video taped "confession" through the rest of the film, I did not see any giant weight fluctuations. Confused. Brenden wasn't arrested until the end of February or the beginning of March, four months after the murder and after his second confession (I believe it was the second). So he could have been losing weight during that time. But I also don't believe assisting in a brutal rape and murder is the only reason a socially and intellectually stunted 16 year-old boy could have for a loss of appetite and signs of depression. I'm weighing the evidence against Brenden's multiple and conflicting confessions, and fully believe he deserves a new trial.
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Nink
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Jul 1, 2014 23:30:44 GMT
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Post by Nink on Jan 11, 2016 22:00:55 GMT
from the time that Theresa went missing until the arrest, how much time lapsed? Wasn't it just a matter of days? So how could he lose so much weight from the guilt of it, when he was arrested not too long after? And during the time of his video taped "confession" through the rest of the film, I did not see any giant weight fluctuations. Confused. Brenden wasn't arrested until the end of February or the beginning of March, four months after the murder and after his second confession (I believe it was the second). So he could have been losing weight during that time. But I also don't believe assisting in a brutal rape and murder is the only reason a socially and intellectually stunted 16 year-old boy could have for a loss of appetite and signs of depression. I'm weighing the evidence against Brenden's multiple and conflicting confessions, and fully believe he deserves a new trial. That's right. Ok thanks for the clarification. Too many dates going on. And I agree with you 100%.
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Deleted
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May 12, 2024 13:26:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2016 7:59:53 GMT
I'm weighing the evidence against Brenden's multiple and conflicting confessions, and fully believe he deserves a new trial. 1000x this! Disregarding EVERYTHING else, this is why Brendan deserves a new trial. PERIOD.
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AmeliaBloomer
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Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Jan 13, 2016 0:23:49 GMT
After binging the show, I've spent too much time reading Reddit's very lively Making a Murderer subreddit. What's disheartening is that people who are rightfully up in arms about the documentary's theme of suspects being presumed guilty because of reputation or demeanor are all over Reddit making accusations about OTHERS, based on nothing more than - what? - hunches.
Example: In addition to scads of general criticism about the Halbach family, there's an astonishing number of accusations that Teresa's ex-boyfriend and/or brother killed her. Even if they don't think the brother is a murderer, it's disheartening how many are calling him a douchebag, an @sshole, a f^ckface...criticizing him for acting as the family spokesman, for believing Steven is guilty, for not displaying sufficient grief on camera, for obviously helping the police plant evidence. The irony - that people don't understand that they are doing to other people exactly what they are railing against with the treatment of the Averys - is undeniable. The point the filmmakers were trying to make seems to have missed its mark with too many.
(Even on this thread, there are those who claim it's obvious that Steven is silently reliving the crime in his head in one scene...or that Steven looking at the jury indicates innocence.)
Often, when I read how people form their perceptions about guilt/innocence from demeanor, body language, or spoken language, I fervently hope that neither I nor my family members will ever have to be judged by a "jury of peers." (Of course, the foibles of the jury system was another theme of the film.)
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AmeliaBloomer
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Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Jan 13, 2016 0:32:56 GMT
And why wouldn't Avery just crush the car. He has a crusher. If he is smart enough to leave a pristine crime scene but leave blood evidence in a car on his property. It doesn't make sense. His business is car crushing. It would make more sense to have the car destroyed and some evidence (real not planted) at the "kill site". Even though I just dissed Redditers in the post above, some of them can be a font of knowledge. There was a post there explaining car crushing. It's not as easy as it sounds: It requires at least two people; it requires another large forklift-like piece of equipment; it takes several hours; it is very loud; even when crushed, a vehicle's VIN number is now stamped on many different parts in the car, instead of just inside the door. I also learned more than I'll ever want/need to know about incinerating bodies from some fire experts...
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
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Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 13, 2016 1:52:07 GMT
Yeah, I've followed a lot of links off the Reddit board, and am also enlightened by the lawyers, scientists, and other experts chiming in. You do have to take some of it with a grain of salt. I too am learning things I'd never thought I would . I for one don't suspect the brother, and think the boyfriend is a possibility, but probably not. I do wonder why it took three full days for Teresa to be declared missing (last seen the afternoon of the 31st, not declared missing until the afternoon of the 3rd), and I wish that had been explained better in the documentary, but maybe she just didn't have that much contact with family and friends on a regular basis. If Avery didn't murder her, though, there were still several other men on the property that day that would be much more likely suspects than anyone in her own circle.
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AmeliaBloomer
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Posts: 6,842
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Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Jan 13, 2016 2:49:05 GMT
I do wonder why it took three full days for Teresa to be declared missing (last seen the afternoon of the 31st, not declared missing until the afternoon of the 3rd), and I wish that had been explained better in the documentary, but maybe she just didn't have that much contact with family and friends on a regular basis. I keep reading this same question, so I just googled. A newspaper article reports that her boss contacted her family after she missed work on Tuesday and Wednesday, It didn't say whether the boss called on Wednesday or Thursday. Family called police on Thursday. I can see how a single person that age might not be in contact with family/friends during the week. I was like that - work late, then veg out. She had a roommate, but maybe he was out of town...staying at a girlfriend's...clueless.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 12, 2024 13:26:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2016 8:10:29 GMT
After binging the show, I've spent too much time reading Reddit's very lively Making a Murderer subreddit. What's disheartening is that people who are rightfully up in arms about the documentary's theme of suspects being presumed guilty because of reputation or demeanor are all over Reddit making accusations about OTHERS, based on nothing more than - what? - hunches. Example: In addition to scads of general criticism about the Halbach family, there's an astonishing number of accusations that Teresa's ex-boyfriend and/or brother killed her. Even if they don't think the brother is a murderer, it's disheartening how many are calling him a douchebag, an @sshole, a f^ckface...criticizing him for acting as the family spokesman, for believing Steven is guilty, for not displaying sufficient grief on camera, for obviously helping the police plant evidence. The irony - that people don't understand that they are doing to other people exactly what they are railing against with the treatment of the Averys - is undeniable. The point the filmmakers were trying to make seems to have missed its mark with too many. (Even on this thread, there are those who claim it's obvious that Steven is silently reliving the crime in his head in one scene...or that Steven looking at the jury indicates innocence.) Often, when I read how people form their perceptions about guilt/innocence from demeanor, body language, or spoken language, I fervently hope that neither I nor my family members will ever have to be judged by a "jury of peers." (Of course, the foibles of the jury system was another theme of the film.) I do not base my conclusions of guilt or innocence on facial expressions because that is a basis of opinion. While I cannot say with 100% certainty that Avery is innocent, the FACTS (evidence) present a wide enough doubt for me to feel he did not commit the crime. But realize perception is all people have to go on as no one was there to see the crime.
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Post by uksue on Jan 13, 2016 10:19:02 GMT
I have been waiting for LipTv ( on YouTube) to discuss this and am just watching a measured discussion with Mike Cavalluzzi. Next week they have Jim Clemente ( the ex FBI guy who is a consultant for Criminal Minds) discussing it ( he is a profiler so that will be very interesting .)
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Post by giatocj on Jan 13, 2016 11:21:36 GMT
I have not watched the show so have no opinion one way or the other about any of the details, But I'm confused on a detail of the process. I thought I had read that all of Avery's appeals have been exhausted but saw this morning that he and his new attorney have filed a new one. It was my understanding that only the nephew had any appeals left to file.
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
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Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 13, 2016 15:50:14 GMT
I have not watched the show so have no opinion one way or the other about any of the details, But I'm confused on a detail of the process. I thought I had read that all of Avery's appeals have been exhausted but saw this morning that he and his new attorney have filed a new one. It was my understanding that only the nephew had any appeals left to file. I believe that particular appeal is one Avery did himself, and sent before his new attorney signed on. It will most likely hit the garbage can again. His new attorney seems very confident she'll get him out somehow though. Looking at her record that's what she does, and does well. I hope there is new evidence that will show as conclusively as possible who killed Teresa Halbach. I think both she and her family deserve that. From what I understand, new evidence is also one of the few chances Avery has left to clear his name if he wasn't the killer.
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Post by mandolyn9909 on Jan 13, 2016 16:06:23 GMT
See, I don't buy that, at all. I don't think he went and got himself on a diet and lost weight, I just don't think he's that sophisticated. It takes quite a bit of effor to lose weight, planning, etc. Even when you are young and it comes off fairly easy. I just don't see him jogging, etc. Well, okay, I'm out. We all have our opinions,and that's mine. I think the documentary piece left out to much for me to buy everything hook, line and sinker. I will watch the other updated documentaries too, because I'm still curious about lots left out. I disagree. I see my kids weight fluctuate just from being in a semester that has PE. Hell, I have a nephew that you wouldn't even recognize as the same person from two photos taken just six months apart: one, at the height of football season, and one after he graduated (and lost 40 lbs). It's not nearly as difficult for a teenage boy with amazing metabolism to drop weight as it is for a woman, or even a teenage girl, for that matter! My son as well over the last 6 months has lost 35 pounds and totally doesn't look like the same kid. The only changes we have made is less TV time and he joined volleyball at school. People don't even recognize him right now. I totally believe a 16 yr old boy could transform that much in a short amount of time.
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Post by mandolyn9909 on Jan 13, 2016 16:26:15 GMT
Ok: * Coerced interview of Brendan * Tampered evidence discovered from previous Avery case * More than one person having access to Teresa's voicemail account * Brendan's brother making heresay comments ON THE STAND that the judge does not strike from jury * the discovery of Teresa's vehicle on the salvage yard in 20 minutes * The call in of the plates by the cop BEFORE the vehicle was found B.L.O.W.S. my mind!!!!!!!!!! Sure there are coincidences in life, BUT when there are this many AND in a court of law....it is just not possible. I keep seeing reports outside of the documentary that the public is not being presented with the whole picture. But I have yet to see any FACTUAL smoking gun evidence. Is it just me? Not just you. Since binge watching this serious about two weeks ago it still bothers me so much. How the jury had NO REASONABLE DOUBT in both of their cases baffles me. I know one juror came forward to the producers of this show and said that they were scared for their lives to go against the grain and honestly that is the only thing that makes sense to me. Brendan's case is seriously hard for me to understand. If I am being honest even if he did "help" his uncle with this murder and cover up which I seriously doubt, but if he did he still doesn't belong in jail...he was a victim from his uncle. He was a 16 yr old boy with a very low IQ.....developmentally disabled being convinced by an adult he looked up to. He should be in a juvenile centre focused on rehabilitation and education. SO FREAKING SAD!
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,579
Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 13, 2016 16:49:41 GMT
The key they found keeps bothering me too. I think even the prosecution came close to conceding it was likely planted in Avery's trailer, but the nature of the key itself seems off. It's a secondary or "valet" key to the RAV4, which could start the car and open the doors, but not open the glove box. It's intended as a backup or to be given to a valet, and the manufacturer suggested keeping it in a safe place in the car. It was attached to one part of a lanyard, and the other part of the lanyard was found in the RAV4. But it was only one key. Most people I know have at least one other key, usually to their residence, on their key ring.
Maybe Teresa only used that key to drive her car, or maybe only used it that day for some reason, leaving the regular key and any other keys at home or somewhere else. Or, maybe whoever killed her has the regular key and maybe keychain, and those who possibly planted the valet key found it in her glove box. Only Avery's DNA was found on the valet key, which is also unusual if it was a key Teresa used regularly. I don't remember and haven't read that they ever found another key or key chain, even with her remains, or that her family found one. I tend to believe that if Avery didn't kill her, the real killer still has that key.
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Post by giatocj on Jan 13, 2016 16:50:18 GMT
I have not watched the show so have no opinion one way or the other about any of the details, But I'm confused on a detail of the process. I thought I had read that all of Avery's appeals have been exhausted but saw this morning that he and his new attorney have filed a new one. It was my understanding that only the nephew had any appeals left to file. I believe that particular appeal is one Avery did himself, and sent before his new attorney signed on. It will most likely hit the garbage can again. His new attorney seems very confident she'll get him out somehow though. Looking at her record that's what she does, and does well. I hope there is new evidence that will show as conclusively as possible who killed Teresa Halbach. I think both she and her family deserve that. From what I understand, new evidence is also one of the few chances Avery has left to clear his name if he wasn't the killer. Thank you!! I was so confused when I saw that news this morning. I also hope that the Halbach family will get a conclusive answer as to who murdered Teresa. What a horrible thing for them to have to relive this like this. If any good comes from it, I hope it is clarity and finality for them.
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Post by mandolyn9909 on Jan 13, 2016 19:09:31 GMT
The key they found keeps bothering me too. I think even the prosecution came close to conceding it was likely planted in Avery's trailer, but the nature of the key itself seems off. It's a secondary or "valet" key to the RAV4, which could start the car and open the doors, but not open the glove box. It's intended as a backup or to be given to a valet, and the manufacturer suggested keeping it in a safe place in the car. It was attached to one part of a lanyard, and the other part of the lanyard was found in the RAV4. But it was only one key. Most people I know have at least one other key, usually to their residence, on their key ring. Maybe Teresa only used that key to drive her car, or maybe only used it that day for some reason, leaving the regular key and any other keys at home or somewhere else. Or, maybe whoever killed her has the regular key and maybe keychain, and those who possibly planted the valet key found it in her glove box. Only Avery's DNA was found on the valet key, which is also unusual if it was a key Teresa used regularly. I don't remember and haven't read that they ever found another key or key chain, even with her remains, or that her family found one. I tend to believe that if Avery didn't kill her, the real killer still has that key. I didn't realize that the key found was a valet key. I was under the impression that valet keys also limited the speed at which you could drive...is that true? If so it makes it more unlikely that she was using that key to drive everyday. I also agree that most people I know don't just have one key on a key-chain....especially a girl that lives with a room mate given that they would have totally different schedules and wouldn't necessarily discuss when each other are home to ensure doors are locked or unlocked.....strange.
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,579
Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 13, 2016 19:31:51 GMT
The key they found keeps bothering me too. I think even the prosecution came close to conceding it was likely planted in Avery's trailer, but the nature of the key itself seems off. It's a secondary or "valet" key to the RAV4, which could start the car and open the doors, but not open the glove box. It's intended as a backup or to be given to a valet, and the manufacturer suggested keeping it in a safe place in the car. It was attached to one part of a lanyard, and the other part of the lanyard was found in the RAV4. But it was only one key. Most people I know have at least one other key, usually to their residence, on their key ring. Maybe Teresa only used that key to drive her car, or maybe only used it that day for some reason, leaving the regular key and any other keys at home or somewhere else. Or, maybe whoever killed her has the regular key and maybe keychain, and those who possibly planted the valet key found it in her glove box. Only Avery's DNA was found on the valet key, which is also unusual if it was a key Teresa used regularly. I don't remember and haven't read that they ever found another key or key chain, even with her remains, or that her family found one. I tend to believe that if Avery didn't kill her, the real killer still has that key. I didn't realize that the key found was a valet key. I was under the impression that valet keys also limited the speed at which you could drive...is that true? If so it makes it more unlikely that she was using that key to drive everyday. I also agree that most people I know don't just have one key on a key-chain....especially a girl that lives with a room mate given that they would have totally different schedules and wouldn't necessarily discuss when each other are home to ensure doors are locked or unlocked.....strange. From my quick search, it appears a valet key only restricts what you can open with it, not anything else about the car. I'm wondering why the investigators didn't ask her family or especially the roommate if Teresa usually carried any other kind of keychain, given the nature of the key they did find. I've not seen the possibility of another set of keys brought up in any of the limited testimony documents that I've read, or by anyone who was an eyewitness to the trial.
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Kerri W
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Jun 25, 2014 20:31:44 GMT
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Post by Kerri W on Jan 13, 2016 19:41:32 GMT
The key they found keeps bothering me too. I think even the prosecution came close to conceding it was likely planted in Avery's trailer, but the nature of the key itself seems off. It's a secondary or "valet" key to the RAV4, which could start the car and open the doors, but not open the glove box. It's intended as a backup or to be given to a valet, and the manufacturer suggested keeping it in a safe place in the car. It was attached to one part of a lanyard, and the other part of the lanyard was found in the RAV4. But it was only one key. Most people I know have at least one other key, usually to their residence, on their key ring. Maybe Teresa only used that key to drive her car, or maybe only used it that day for some reason, leaving the regular key and any other keys at home or somewhere else. Or, maybe whoever killed her has the regular key and maybe keychain, and those who possibly planted the valet key found it in her glove box. Only Avery's DNA was found on the valet key, which is also unusual if it was a key Teresa used regularly. I don't remember and haven't read that they ever found another key or key chain, even with her remains, or that her family found one. I tend to believe that if Avery didn't kill her, the real killer still has that key. I didn't realize that the key found was a valet key. I was under the impression that valet keys also limited the speed at which you could drive...is that true? If so it makes it more unlikely that she was using that key to drive everyday. I also agree that most people I know don't just have one key on a key-chain....especially a girl that lives with a room mate given that they would have totally different schedules and wouldn't necessarily discuss when each other are home to ensure doors are locked or unlocked.....strange. A slight aside-I was with a group of people recently and the topic of keys and what's on your key ring came up. There was only one person in 15 or so that even HAD a house key and carried it with them. The rest of the group used the automatic garage opener or the programmable garage opener in their vehicle. That surprised us.
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Deleted
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May 12, 2024 13:26:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2016 19:44:17 GMT
I have been waiting for LipTv ( on YouTube) to discuss this and am just watching a measured discussion with Mike Cavalluzzi. Next week they have Jim Clemente ( the ex FBI guy who is a consultant for Criminal Minds) discussing it ( he is a profiler so that will be very interesting .) You do have to come back to this thread and summarize what he said. I would love to hear what he has to say.
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Deleted
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May 12, 2024 13:26:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2016 19:49:26 GMT
The key they found keeps bothering me too. I think even the prosecution came close to conceding it was likely planted in Avery's trailer, but the nature of the key itself seems off. It's a secondary or "valet" key to the RAV4, which could start the car and open the doors, but not open the glove box. It's intended as a backup or to be given to a valet, and the manufacturer suggested keeping it in a safe place in the car. It was attached to one part of a lanyard, and the other part of the lanyard was found in the RAV4. But it was only one key. Most people I know have at least one other key, usually to their residence, on their key ring. Maybe Teresa only used that key to drive her car, or maybe only used it that day for some reason, leaving the regular key and any other keys at home or somewhere else. Or, maybe whoever killed her has the regular key and maybe keychain, and those who possibly planted the valet key found it in her glove box. Only Avery's DNA was found on the valet key, which is also unusual if it was a key Teresa used regularly. I don't remember and haven't read that they ever found another key or key chain, even with her remains, or that her family found one. I tend to believe that if Avery didn't kill her, the real killer still has that key. I said EXACTLY the same thing upthread. It just makes no sense!! I don't believe they found her purse either. And where was the camera she was using to take pictures? Was that recovered?
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Post by mandolyn9909 on Jan 13, 2016 19:53:04 GMT
I didn't realize that the key found was a valet key. I was under the impression that valet keys also limited the speed at which you could drive...is that true? If so it makes it more unlikely that she was using that key to drive everyday. I also agree that most people I know don't just have one key on a key-chain....especially a girl that lives with a room mate given that they would have totally different schedules and wouldn't necessarily discuss when each other are home to ensure doors are locked or unlocked.....strange. A slight aside-I was with a group of people recently and the topic of keys and what's on your key ring came up. There was only one person in 15 or so that even HAD a house key and carried it with them. The rest of the group used the automatic garage opener or the programmable garage opener in their vehicle. That surprised us. I can see how that would be the case in some areas. Definitely would be a regional thing. I personally don't know anyone in my area with an automatic garage opener but in my area we are in a farming community and most garages are detached from the house. Did it say whether she lived in an apartment or house. It would be much more unlikely for someone living in an apartment not to have keys I would think.
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
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Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Jan 13, 2016 20:07:22 GMT
A slight aside-I was with a group of people recently and the topic of keys and what's on your key ring came up. There was only one person in 15 or so that even HAD a house key and carried it with them. The rest of the group used the automatic garage opener or the programmable garage opener in their vehicle. That surprised us. I can see how that would be the case in some areas. Definitely would be a regional thing. I personally don't know anyone in my area with an automatic garage opener but in my area we are in a farming community and most garages are detached from the house. Did it say whether she lived in an apartment or house. It would be much more unlikely for someone living in an apartment not to have keys I would think. I'm not sure what kind of home she lived in with the roommate. I don't even have a regular car key anymore, just an electronic fob. DH and I both have garage door openers, but we also always carry a house key. We don't usually lock the house door inside the garage if other people are home, but always lock it if we know the house will be empty. Different strokes though. It still doesn't explain why none of Teresa Halbach's DNA was found on the key or lanyard, particularly if it's the one she used exclusively. Was Avery was smart enough to clean it off, then dumb enough to leave his own? So many questions. The question above about her camera - I believe it was found with her phone and Palm Pilot in the Janda burn barrel.
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Post by BoilerUp! on Jan 13, 2016 21:22:34 GMT
I have been waiting for LipTv ( on YouTube) to discuss this and am just watching a measured discussion with Mike Cavalluzzi. Next week they have Jim Clemente ( the ex FBI guy who is a consultant for Criminal Minds) discussing it ( he is a profiler so that will be very interesting .) How can one find this? I'd love to watch it also.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 12, 2024 13:26:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2016 21:44:19 GMT
I can see how that would be the case in some areas. Definitely would be a regional thing. I personally don't know anyone in my area with an automatic garage opener but in my area we are in a farming community and most garages are detached from the house. Did it say whether she lived in an apartment or house. It would be much more unlikely for someone living in an apartment not to have keys I would think. I'm not sure what kind of home she lived in with the roommate. I don't even have a regular car key anymore, just an electronic fob. DH and I both have garage door openers, but we also always carry a house key. We don't usually lock the house door inside the garage if other people are home, but always lock it if we know the house will be empty. Different strokes though. It still doesn't explain why none of Teresa Halbach's DNA was found on the key or lanyard, particularly if it's the one she used exclusively. Was Avery was smart enough to clean it off, then dumb enough to leave his own? So many questions. The question above about her camera - I believe it was found with her phone and Palm Pilot in the Janda burn barrel. Ok. I missed that. Guess the gnashing of my teeth over all this craziness, I could not hear that part!!!!
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Post by Scrapper100 on Jan 13, 2016 22:47:01 GMT
The key they found keeps bothering me too. I think even the prosecution came close to conceding it was likely planted in Avery's trailer, but the nature of the key itself seems off. It's a secondary or "valet" key to the RAV4, which could start the car and open the doors, but not open the glove box. It's intended as a backup or to be given to a valet, and the manufacturer suggested keeping it in a safe place in the car. It was attached to one part of a lanyard, and the other part of the lanyard was found in the RAV4. But it was only one key. Most people I know have at least one other key, usually to their residence, on their key ring. Maybe Teresa only used that key to drive her car, or maybe only used it that day for some reason, leaving the regular key and any other keys at home or somewhere else. Or, maybe whoever killed her has the regular key and maybe keychain, and those who possibly planted the valet key found it in her glove box. Only Avery's DNA was found on the valet key, which is also unusual if it was a key Teresa used regularly. I don't remember and haven't read that they ever found another key or key chain, even with her remains, or that her family found one. I tend to believe that if Avery didn't kill her, the real killer still has that key. I said EXACTLY the same thing upthread. It just makes no sense!! I don't believe they found her purse either. And where was the camera she was using to take pictures? Was that recovered? Interesting. I didn't know about the type of key either. If she was killed on the 31st like they say and just hid her car her other keys, camera, phone and purse should have been in the car or found. I don't know who killed her. Her brother always gave me the creeps but not knowing anything about him I can't explain it. Her boyfriend also seemed shady but again it was just news footage so who knows. I think that at least the kid deserves a new trial. No idea if Steve is guilty or not. He is a little odd in that he always has a girlfriend. If he didn't do it I hope they find out who did for her family's sake. It's one sided but sure doesn't seem like enough evidence to convict especially with the questions about the evidence. Also the lawyer said if he isn't guilty then that means you think the police did it and framed Steve. No one on the defense said the police did it just that they planted evidence. Being shot should have left blood splatter that was never found which leads one to believe she wasn't killed where they said.
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peabay
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,610
Jun 25, 2014 19:50:41 GMT
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Post by peabay on Jan 13, 2016 23:05:19 GMT
I'm glad to read this thread because after 3 episodes I had to stop watching. Just too damn depressing. Steven, with his 70 IQ, and the nephew, with his 'slow learning' - it's just too damn depressing. I don't know if he did it or not, but I think I want to stay with fiction. "Mozart in the Jungle" here I come.
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Post by uksue on Jan 13, 2016 23:20:05 GMT
I think Mike Cavalluzzi has many of the reservations a lot of us on this thread have about these convictions. When pushed he did state he doesn't think they are guilty. Crimetime on liptv is one of my twice weekly guilty pleasures - the host Alison Hope wiener (also a qualified attorney)irritates me a bit, because she always leads with extremely long introductions and opening questions, but once past that I find it fascinating. youtu.be/aEdZJZl9tNM
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