AmeliaBloomer
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Jan 24, 2019 12:17:33 GMT
I'm glad you don't know many Catholic one-issue voters. My family in the Midwest is filled with them and there are plenty of them here in Texas. Twitter is positively crawling with them. I'm basing my estimation that the Covington folks are not much interested in social justice issues on that experience and on the fact that so many of their sons are willing to walk around in a MAGA hat. I would not choose to send my daughter to a Catholic university; however, my family generally considered them bastions of evil Catholic liberalism, so YMMV.
It seems our experiences with the church and the folks in it has been vastly different. Both experiences are valid. We should probably just leave it at that. Bold mine. Well, they generally are. Bastions, that is. Even hotbeds. Actually, so was my high school. And my brothers’. So, yes, very different mileage, which I prefer to absolutes...which fits nicely as a closing, as my aversion to absolutes is one of the reasons I remain irredeemably lapsed.
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purplebee
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,728
Jun 27, 2014 20:37:34 GMT
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Post by purplebee on Jan 24, 2019 12:44:39 GMT
Just a comment:
I also registered a bit of surprise initially at the Catholic school students and chaperones being OK with the whole MAGA thing. Only speaking from my experience, I am from a family of devout, practicing, lapsed, indifferent, ex- and anti-Catholics, all from the New York area and most with some level of Catholic education. No one in this good sized group, which also includes family friends, has anything but contempt for Trump and his administration. Unfortunately for me, here in Arkansas, it's a different story.
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Sarah*H
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,973
Jun 25, 2014 20:07:06 GMT
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Post by Sarah*H on Jan 24, 2019 13:10:48 GMT
A few years ago I met a group of nuns at the gym who were fun and inspiring and kind of kick ass when it came to weight lifting, lol! They live in a local monastery which opens itself up to the public several times a year and has a pretty great bed and breakfast attached. Anyway, I became FB friends with one of them. That was great right up until Trump was elected and she started continually posting the most awful, ugly, horrible memes and comments that IMO, reflect no part of the Christianity I grew up with much less the social justice traditions I am familiar with in the Catholic Church. So seeing these kids behave that way was not shocking as I think the demographics and politics in Covington are fairly similar to where I live.
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Post by Merge on Jan 24, 2019 13:49:44 GMT
AmeliaBloomer, pierkiss, anyone else who took exception my comments: I appreciate that we can share our perspectives here and no one gets angry and storms out. Thank you for that. You've all given me a lot to think about.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
May 5, 2024 4:13:21 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2019 13:58:45 GMT
I'm sure if it had been a white priest or pastor chanting and a mob of African-American boys were hooting and hollering and parodying him, our MAGA-peas would be just as tolerant and forgiving of thatn.
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janeliz
Drama Llama
I'm the Wiz and nobody beats me.
Posts: 5,633
Jun 26, 2014 14:35:07 GMT
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Post by janeliz on Jan 24, 2019 14:05:26 GMT
Just a comment: I also registered a bit of surprise initially at the Catholic school students and chaperones being OK with the whole MAGA thing. Only speaking from my experience, I am from a family of devout, practicing, lapsed, indifferent, ex- and anti-Catholics, all from the New York area and most with some level of Catholic education. No one in this good sized group, which also includes family friends, has anything but contempt for Trump and his administration. Unfortunately for me, here in Arkansas, it's a different story. This has been my experience as well. The Catholics I was raised by and alongside in Rochester, NY are a different animal from many of the Catholics I’ve met down here in South Carolina. They are much more conservative, politically and socially, here. It’s also been my observation that many Catholics here in my area are converts who were attracted to the Catholic church’s strict tenets and structure.
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Post by pierkiss on Jan 24, 2019 14:08:40 GMT
AmeliaBloomer, pierkiss, anyone else who took exception my comments: I appreciate that we can share our perspectives here and no one gets angry and storms out. Thank you for that. You've all given me a lot to think about. Of course!
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Post by Peace Sign on Jan 24, 2019 14:09:42 GMT
I'm sure if it had been a white priest or pastor chanting and a mob of African-American boys were hooting and hollering and parodying him, our MAGA-peas would be just as tolerant and forgiving of thatn. I agree with this. It's the thing I'm angriest about. These boys, with several examples of extreme racism and hatred, are given time to "get the full story", given the benefit of the doubt, given defense. Black boys are rarely given the same. Young white boys who are raised in a completely homogenous setting, are never held accountable for their actions. Black boys are stopped and frisked. They are never defended.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Jan 24, 2019 15:11:25 GMT
Just another data point. Both sides of my family are Catholic - half being Irish and half being Spanish. Growing up in California, the vast majority of Catholics I knew were Hispanic, Irish or Italian. Catholicism was more about family heritage than church beliefs. I don't know a single one who believed in no birth control and frankly the vast majority were pro-choice. It's California, so I'm sure people aren't surprised that they also were far more likely to be democrats than republicans even before this administration. I think both my kids have a few jesuit schools on their preliminary college lists. It didn't even occur to me that people would affiliate the universities with this administration.
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Post by Merge on Jan 24, 2019 15:44:43 GMT
Just another data point. Both sides of my family are Catholic - half being Irish and half being Spanish. Growing up in California, the vast majority of Catholics I knew were Hispanic, Irish or Italian. Catholicism was more about family heritage than church beliefs. I don't know a single one who believed in no birth control and frankly the vast majority were pro-choice. It's California, so I'm sure people aren't surprised that they also were far more likely to be democrats than republicans even before this administration. I think both my kids have a few jesuit schools on their preliminary college lists. It didn't even occur to me that people would affiliate the universities with this administration. I don't think I would affiliate the universities with this administration, necessarily. My reason for avoiding Catholic universities is that I don't want my money going to the church in any way. Personal choice. They had plenty of my time and money in the first 34 years of my life. I want to clarify that my issue is with the sort of Catholic or any Christian who votes solely on abortion and ignores the church's teachings about social justice. The conservative Catholics with whom I grew up fall into this category. If you're sending your kids to the march for life and the kids buy and wear MAGA hats, I don't think it's an unfair stretch to believe their families likely also fall into this category.
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Post by gillyp on Jan 24, 2019 16:10:17 GMT
I’m not throwing anyone a lifeline but I did read yesterday that the hats were bought by the boys in Washington so it would appear that the school can not be blamed for allowing them to leave for the March with them. However, IMO it does compound the lack of judgment shown by their chaperones; not in allowing the purchases, anyone is free to buy what they want, but for failing to point out the ramifications of wearing them in a political area.
Did anyone see the NBC interview with Nick Sandman yesterday? I thought his body language/lack of facial expression to be most odd. I promise I do have a life other than obsessing over this incident! I was searching YouTube for the latest Finding Your Roots and the interview was shown as a recent upload.
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Post by tracyarts on Jan 24, 2019 16:12:30 GMT
I grew up in a Catholic family in the 70s and 80s. In a diverse working class neighborhood of a huge city. (Houston's Northside). And I agree. The church we attended was focused on community and heritage, not politics or religious dogma. The associated schools were only superficially religious too. Most of the parishioners were of Italian, Czech, Polish, and Mexican descent. There were a LOT of immigrants and children of immigrants. The conservative leanings were more cultural conservativism, not political or religious. But that was a different point in time. I even went to a Catholic (Basilian) university in the 90s, and the campus had a very secular feel and liberal political and social atmosphere. I don't go to church anymore but my friends who do, go for the community aspect. They don't necessarily agree with church teachings or politics. But the parish is their community and they aren't willing to walk away from that. Just another data point. Both sides of my family are Catholic - half being Irish and half being Spanish. Growing up in California, the vast majority of Catholics I knew were Hispanic, Irish or Italian. Catholicism was more about family heritage than church beliefs. I don't know a single one who believed in no birth control and frankly the vast majority were pro-choice. It's California, so I'm sure people aren't surprised that they also were far more likely to be democrats than republicans even before this administration. I think both my kids have a few jesuit schools on their preliminary college lists. It didn't even occur to me that people would affiliate the universities with this administration.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jan 24, 2019 16:17:14 GMT
Wow. The hate in here based on bits and pieces of unverified information is....sadly typical. Humans are stupid and never, ever learn a damn thing. It’s sad that given what is known, a few apologists just keep on whitewashing exactly what it is.
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Jan 24, 2019 16:21:30 GMT
I'm sure if it had been a white priest or pastor chanting and a mob of African-American boys were hooting and hollering and parodying him, our Conservative-leaning MAGA-peas would be just as tolerant and forgiving of thatn. ^^^ bears repeating, apparently. ETA: replaced "MAGA" with "conservative" to take the MAGA hat TOTALLY out of the equation.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jan 24, 2019 16:23:47 GMT
It’s amazing that some profess to revere Dr. Martin Luth King Jr, while making presumptions and labeling whites terrorists and hate mongers. You don’t know these kids but you claim to know their type. And in your mind stereotyping and profiling white nen is perfectly fine because if they aren’t guilty now, they must be somewhere else. I don’t think you can judge the content of character based on a hat. Unless it’s ok to justify by the clothing, sign, message you support. Many here would crucify these kids on the basis of being Catholic. Maybe you ought to look at what us known and what has been said by these kids. Their “type” was judged by their actions not their hat—but because some conservatives/apologists just have latched onto the hat so that they can claim their poor white persecution. What is clearly apparent is that once an apologist (trump/conservative) always an apologis—defending bad and offensive behavior against different ethnicity, POC, Women, immigrants....
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Post by Peace Sign on Jan 24, 2019 16:27:27 GMT
It’s amazing that some profess to revere Dr. Martin Luth King Jr, while making presumptions and labeling whites terrorists and hate mongers. You don’t know these kids but you claim to know their type. And in your mind stereotyping and profiling white nen is perfectly fine because if they aren’t guilty now, they must be somewhere else. I don’t think you can judge the content of character based on a hat. Unless it’s ok to justify by the clothing, sign, message you support. Many here would crucify these kids on the basis of being Catholic. Maybe you ought to look at what us known and what has been said by these kids. Their “type” was judged by their actions not their hat—but because some conservatives/apologists just have latched onto the hat so that they can claim their poor white persecution. What is clearly apparent is that once an apologist (trump/conservative) always an apologis—defending bad and offensive behavior against different ethnicity, POC, Women, immigrants.... i admit, i judge on the hat. it is not worth it to me to try to find the "upside" of a person in that hat. that is not my job. and it's dangerous for my family. it's best to steer clear.
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jan 24, 2019 17:46:44 GMT
Maybe you ought to look at what us known and what has been said by these kids. Their “type” was judged by their actions not their hat—but because some conservatives/apologists just have latched onto the hat so that they can claim their poor white persecution. What is clearly apparent is that once an apologist (trump/conservative) always an apologis—defending bad and offensive behavior against different ethnicity, POC, Women, immigrants.... i admit, i judge on the hat. it is not worth it to me to try to find the "upside" of a person in that hat. that is not my job. and it's dangerous for my family. it's best to steer clear. And you know what? There really is nothing wrong with judging by the hat. Wearing it speaks to whom one is; who they support. I’m sure I’m judged by saying the words “I’m a liberal” or when I wear my shirts promoting love trumping hate, or when I wear my rainbows in support of LBGTQ. I would venture a guess that those who wear it do so because they are proud to support the big asshole buffoon or that they want to see if it starts controversy—same as those people at trump rallies who were wearing *fuck Hillary* shirts—they did it for both the support and static it drew to them. (And then when anyone talked about their shirts they cried that they were being victimized by the left, just like some are doing now with the hats on those boys). It’s a tactic to change the narrative and redirect focus to the democrats as being mean and nasty, because the white boys/trump supporters are totally pure innocent victims. I’d rather them wear the red hats—so I can steer clear of their beliefs, because what that red hat has become to represent are not values I want, need, or support. They are the most unchristian like values and breed so much hatred, division, and exclusion. IRL experience, attacks based on seeing the “gang colors” (Democrats vs republicans), have started with the republicans/conservatives verbally denouncing, making fun of, mocking and being nasty to those in support of more liberal peoples and groups.
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Post by carly1030 on Jan 24, 2019 17:48:56 GMT
Maybe you ought to look at what us known and what has been said by these kids. Their “type” was judged by their actions not their hat—but because some conservatives/apologists just have latched onto the hat so that they can claim their poor white persecution. What is clearly apparent is that once an apologist (trump/conservative) always an apologis—defending bad and offensive behavior against different ethnicity, POC, Women, immigrants.... i admit, i judge on the hat. it is not worth it to me to try to find the "upside" of a person in that hat. that is not my job. and it's dangerous for my family. it's best to steer clear. I feel the same about the pussy hats.
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Post by Peace Sign on Jan 24, 2019 18:04:51 GMT
i admit, i judge on the hat. it is not worth it to me to try to find the "upside" of a person in that hat. that is not my job. and it's dangerous for my family. it's best to steer clear. I feel the same about the pussy hats. as is your right. but people in pussy hats aren't inciting racism and violence.
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TheOtherMeg
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,541
Jun 25, 2014 20:58:14 GMT
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Post by TheOtherMeg on Jan 24, 2019 19:23:34 GMT
Yeah, all those crazy people in pink knit caps, out there pushing for a clean environment and affordable healthcare.
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Post by missmiss on Jan 24, 2019 19:27:04 GMT
i admit, i judge on the hat. it is not worth it to me to try to find the "upside" of a person in that hat. that is not my job. and it's dangerous for my family. it's best to steer clear. I feel the same about the pussy hats. So what does the pussy hat say to you for you to steer clear? What bothers you about that hat and the people who wear them?
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Jan 24, 2019 19:29:16 GMT
i admit, i judge on the hat. it is not worth it to me to try to find the "upside" of a person in that hat. that is not my job. and it's dangerous for my family. it's best to steer clear. I feel the same about the pussy hats. So what? It’s funny that you post rants about pussy hats then go bat shit hypocritical on those who are offended or judge based on a red hat. 🙄🙄🙄
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Post by teach4u on Jan 24, 2019 20:02:51 GMT
What do the pussy hats say? That you judge white young men as racist if they don’t bash trump.that some wearing pussy hats advocate physically harming kids, expelling them and abusing them verbally. I would feel someone in a vagina hat is not one who would discuss issuesrationallt
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Post by teach4u on Jan 24, 2019 20:03:30 GMT
What do the pussy hats say? That you judge white young men as racist if they don’t bash trump.that some wearing pussy hats advocate physically harming kids, expelling them and abusing them verbally. I would feel someone in a vagina hat is not one who would discuss issues rationally
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Post by iamkristinl16 on Jan 24, 2019 20:13:03 GMT
I’m not throwing anyone a lifeline but I did read yesterday that the hats were bought by the boys in Washington so it would appear that the school can not be blamed for allowing them to leave for the March with them. However, IMO it does compound the lack of judgment shown by their chaperones; not in allowing the purchases, anyone is free to buy what they want, but for failing to point out the ramifications of wearing them in a political area. Did anyone see the NBC interview with Nick Sandman yesterday? I thought his body language/lack of facial expression to be most odd. I promise I do have a life other than obsessing over this incident! I was searching YouTube for the latest Finding Your Roots and the interview was shown as a recent upload. I saw bits of an interview and I wondered if the PR firm instructed him to try to look and act younger than he is.
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Post by crimsoncat05 on Jan 24, 2019 20:15:14 GMT
What do the pussy hats say? That you judge white young men as racist if they don’t bash trump.that some wearing pussy hats advocate physically harming kids, expelling them and abusing them verbally. I would feel someone in a vagina hat is not one who would discuss issues rationally <--- never worn a pussy hat. STILL think the kids were racist. And what the heck do you mean by "physically harming kids, expelling them and abusing them verbally" anyway? are we still talking about the Covington kids, here? (and psssst-- your vagina is *inside* not outside; you can't see it. from the Pussyhat project website: "The name Pussyhat™ was chosen in part as a protest against vulgar comments Donald Trump made about the freedom he felt to grab women’s genitals, to de-stigmatize the word “pussy” and transform it into one of empowerment, and to highlight the design of the hat’s ’pussycat ears’. ")
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Post by missmiss on Jan 24, 2019 20:16:48 GMT
What do the pussy hats say? That you judge white young men as racist if they don’t bash trump.that some wearing pussy hats advocate physically harming kids, expelling them and abusing them verbally. I would feel someone in a vagina hat is not one who would discuss issues rationally And what does the MAGA hat say to you?
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Post by missmiss on Jan 24, 2019 20:23:27 GMT
What do the pussy hats say? That you judge white young men as racist if they don’t bash trump.that some wearing pussy hats advocate physically harming kids, expelling them and abusing them verbally. I would feel someone in a vagina hat is not one who would discuss issues rationally Also can you help me out. Can you link me some articles about women in pussy hats physically harming kids, expelling them (where are they getting expelled from?), and abusing them verbally? I can link you articles and videos of people in red hats being racist. I can also link articles of teens in red hats doing the same thing as well. But I haven't seen anything on what you wrote.
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huskergal
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,990
Jun 25, 2014 20:22:13 GMT
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Post by huskergal on Jan 24, 2019 20:41:37 GMT
Read through the last 6 pages and never saw anyone accuse the MAGA boys of being terrorists. The boys that were called racist were the ones in blackface, not the DC smirkers.
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Post by revirdsuba99 on Jan 24, 2019 21:09:58 GMT
To those of you who think 'blackface' don't count. Florida Secretary of State resigns after newspaper obtains photos of him in blackfaceBY CHRIS MILLS RODRIGO - 01/24/19 03:26 PM EST Newly minted Florida Secretary of State Michael Ertel resigned from his post on Thursday after a newspaper obtained photos of him posing as a "Hurricane Katrina victim" in blackface. ** The photo, according to the Democrat, was taken two months after Hurricane Katrina devastated New Orleans. Taken in 2005, the photo shared by the Democrat shows Ertel in blackface and red lipstick. He is also wearing earrings, a New Orleans Saints bandana and a purple t-shirt that said "Katrina Victim," according to the paper. The photo was reportedly taken eight months after Ertel was appointed Seminole County supervisor of elections. ** "There's nothing I can say," he said. Ertel was named Secretary of State by Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) on Dec. 28. ** Bit more at link: thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/426843-florida-secretary-of-state-resigns-after-newspaper-obtains-photos-of-himUnfortunately, the Covington HS kids may have caused themselves far more problems then they ever thought. A public career may not be a good choice in their futures. Cameras are everywhere, and they KNOW it!
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