Tim Holtz Addicts Group and Racism

After the whole Lara debacle and lies after lies after lies along with not having the guts to own up to the crap she started, I am going to need to see hard evidence for any issues brought up. And that is for any crafter, not just TH & Co.

I can't take any more of these cancel culture posts. Over it. They don't help. It takes the focus and important messages away from the real changes that need to happen.

So yeah, done and done.

This is where I am at. Im gonna need some hard, undeniable proof. And for me, him following his own rules for his group does not equate racist. I am actually a member of the group and they are pretty straight across the board with what they allow. A scroll through the photos and I don't see anything that stands out as obvious faith based or political or anything really other than mixed media stuff thats pretty generic in theme. Some halloween. Some Christmas (though not Christian themed). I did see an Easter card that wasn't faith based. 

Don't want to support him? Thats fine. I am not a huge supporter of Tim (though, I do love his scissors). As I have stated before (in the other thread), I am not his target audience. But I do think that anyone can start a group of any type they want and make whatever rules they want. I, personally, think adding one day a week/month/whatever to allow those projects that normally wouldn't be allowed could be a good compromise. But its not my name on the group, the products or having to deal with the general public. So my opinion doesn't matter. 

I don't mind cancelling racist behavior - at all. And those who equate the desire of BIPOC to LIVE with "being political" is privileged and racist - to me.

Not saying that's what's happened here. Just that I HAVE NO ISSUE W/ CANCEL CULTURE - if by "cancel culture" people mean boycotting. Money talks and stopping spending money on racism SCREAMS.

Apartheid anyone?

Follow the Addicts board also. Have for a while. What seems to be celebrated on there are not really any themes, per se, but rather a particular style. That grunge/distress style the TH has become known for. Scrolling through, most everything posted looks like it came from the same place. Not knocking the art, as it is seriously inspiring, but it is all pretty consistent with his products/brand/style. Theme seems more related to whatever the “theme” of the particular TH product being used is. His lines are not generic and neutral. They tend to define theme themselves. Also, I have a feeling something like a CAS pretty, lacy feminine pastel pink new baby card would not show up over there either. Style may have more to do with what does or does not stay more than theme of the work.

Most quotes, wording, etc are his stickers, stamps, or ideology products. Yes, Christmas and Easter are in there, but he has distinct product lines for those holidays, and aside from a wisemen die, those are secular. Used to be a requirement the only TH products be used. That has been relaxed in the last little while.

Discussion on posts is mostly technique and product driven. Does not usually delve into content or theme of the actual artwork outside of product choices. I have not personally seen any negativity in the interactions. Mostly praise, encouragement and how-to questions.

I will say that I have seen several projects using his paper dolls and vintage photos that feature ones of POC.

I fall in the camp of his brand-his board-his rules. I have not seen any targeted bias against artwork.

I see what you are saying about there being hurt feelings.  Part of me wonders, though, if the rawness of what is going on around us now is causing folks to jump to conclusions that maybe are not really there.  

I will admit to being someone that would not get that bent out of shape about my art being left up on a post or thread somewhere.  Regardless of why. The OP said this: This has taken a real life emotional toll on me and my mental health and I still suffer because of how I have been made to feel and I have no voice.”  And not being snarky here at all, or discounting that this is the way she feels, but I just cannot understand letting a post in a FB group tear me up that way or define anything about myself.   So maybe I am biased in that way to not understand what others are going through.

Also, looks at how many folks were disgruntled with MSP and the MISTI, and spoke out, some with repercussions and threats of lawsuits, all the mean fan girls, and consequences on boards like Splitcoast.  But they spoke out anyway.  I feel like if there were anything systemic going on with TH racism-wise,  the speaking out would be more than one or two, especially after all these years, and with all the available platforms to say your piece.

When I say "cancel culture" I am specifically talking about the he saud, she said, drama, non backed up, quick to judge community attacking persons/groups that seem to be popping up lately.

One small issue and they blow it WAY out of proportion and try to cancel who ever it was.

With no research. Just a simple well she said blah blah blah so lets run him/her to the ground.

That is what a lot of people (Lara included) were trying to do with Tim. And I have seen it with so many other things

Now with EC Condren? We had the facts. We had hard evidence. We had proof.

But there were people out there to eat her alive and destroy a company where others worked and make a living.

They didn't just simply want her to step aside/down and help the company fix the issues at hand.

That is what I am over.

I am also so over the camp of well my way is right, they are wrong (his group, his rules!).

I apologize for starting that thread. Makes me very doubtful of people these days. Which pisses nw off so bad. That totally takes away all of the work true activists are doing.

I feel bad for believing it was true. It isn't you I'm irritated with, it's Lara. Unfortunately, I still sometimes naively believe and forget there are people who lie for their own gain. I'm also very quick to defend the underdog. In this case, a POC that I thought experienced racism. Live and learn. I don't think I'm going to speak up for anything for quite a while.

I don’t think I’ll stop speaking up but I do think I’ll research better and not be so much “cancel culture”. All that thread did was set the blm back instead of pushing it forward.

Bullshit.

Lara Smith makes money off the backs of POC, as well as LBGTQ.

She shed NOTHING about another brand except lies made up by herself.

She got what she deserved. She alone wrecked her own business and livelihood.

And it’s NOT clear that she had to apologize because of alleged legal...it’s clear that she had to apologize because she made up shit that wasn’t true about a brand, people working for the brand, and that brands followers.

You’re either Lara, a troll, or a friend of Lara’s just wanting to stir up shit.

I was just trying to be a smart ass. Chill out and learn to laugh at yourself a little.

Glad we’re on the same page.

Ok, can you post some of the racist posts?

Lara said there were racist posts in the comment to his post about her video and I spent a good chunk of time looking and not seeing any.

I’m not a member of the group and posts might be removed that I did not see, but I have been unable to find the ones she referred to.