janeliz
Drama Llama
I'm the Wiz and nobody beats me.
Posts: 5,666 
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Post by janeliz on Nov 20, 2014 17:58:53 GMT
I haven't seen too many people comment on this and to me, it's the saddest comment in your whole post. It's easy for you to say that. It's easy for people who haven't struggled with gender identity to sit in judgment, feel smug or annoyed or skeptical. I have a friend whose child recently went through the public transition from being female to being male and I'm certain that the last thing any of them felt was that he was doing it to be "in" or that he wanted to be glorified. Living in tea party country where the KKK is making a last great stand, well, let's just say that open minded acceptance of openly living as who you are is not a sure thing. As to some of the responses, I'm beyond sick of hearing things that suggest we live in a post racial society or that we should celebrate heterosexuality because homosexuality has become so normal. It's bullshit; smelly, goopy, nasty bullshit. Spend 2 minutes reading the comments on any article or op ed discussing issues of race or sexuality. Spend 5 minutes asking people (here, on FB, in real life) their experiences dealing with these issues. There are a lot of ugly, hateful, stupid people in this world and they spend a lot of their energy spreading their ugly, hateful stupidity around. Thank you. This thread took off in such a weird direction, and I'm completely flummoxed by some of the things I'm reading. I can't speak to what kind of society anyone else is living in, but I'm in the state of South Carolina and there is no way in hell that LGBT issues will be accepted as "the norm" or "trendy" here anytime soon. As I mentioned earlier, we're just now, thanks to a series of court rulings, getting to see gay marriage as a reality in our state. And when I make the mistake of reading comments on Facebook about the recent news in our state, as I did last night, there's very little celebration and revelry. There are, on the other hand, lots of words like "disgusting", "sinful", and "perverted" being thrown around, and moms and dads worrying about how they're going to manage to raise their children in a world that has such "compromised values". I can't even try and make myself feel better by saying "well, the people saying those things were just some random mean people". Among them were our school nurse, a local softball coach, and the grandmother of one of my daughter's classmates. |
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Olan
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by Olan on Nov 20, 2014 18:10:24 GMT
Before I get flamed for somewhat agreeing, I have absolutely nothing against anyone being gay! Whatever turns you on! But here is my personal experience. I grew up with a neighbor girl in the 1960's that we all called a Tom boy. Not girly at all, but we had never even heard the term gay or homosexual, we just knew she was different and it didn't matter, we all played together and were friends. Even in high school when we knew about people being gay, we didn't care, we knew then she was gay, and she said she was and again, we didn't care, still hung out, still friends. Fast forward 40 years... She is a facebook friend. Every other post is about being gay and she posts about it 10 times a day. I have finally stopped all notifications from her. It's almost like she is looking for an argument. She sent me a go fund me request to help her friend pay for his surgery to become female. Sorry, that is cosmetic surgery and I'm not helping pay for that, he isn't going to die if he doesn't have it. That is the in the face thing that turns me and others off. Just my two cents. For the record I also stopped notifications from a cousin shilling Avon and a best friend shilling Lia Sophia and Plexus. But she just might kill herself. There are things in this world I don't understand but why approach it with such indignation? |
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
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Location: In the leaves and rain.
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Post by stittsygirl on Nov 20, 2014 18:11:31 GMT
Yep, still waiting for it to become "trendy" in our part of central Texas. My son would be thrilled to know he's finally part of the "popular" group. Right now it's just suspicion and scorn every day.
We're moving to Washington state next year, outside of Seattle. We're hoping he'll at least find more acceptance and fellowship there.
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Post by sisterbdsq on Nov 20, 2014 18:19:47 GMT
And to the point made here about not being who you are and feeling loved and accepted, your brother has few choices...all of them suck
1) live a lie in front of his parents, while you and yours harbor his "gay secret"
2) wait until his parents die for him to be able to live his life the way he is meant to. "The only way I can be who I am in public is if my mother and father are DEAD". If that isn't the saddest most painful thing, then this one is:
3) come out anyway and be disowned/shunned by his own parents...the people who brought him into this world and SHOULD love him for who is
Imagine sitting there listening to your father saying all these hurtful things against "the gays" knowing as you sit there "the gay" is you. It's a sad reality for so many.
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Post by gar on Nov 20, 2014 18:20:01 GMT
to help her friend pay for his surgery to become female. Sorry, that is cosmetic surgery and I'm not helping pay for that, he isn't going to die if he doesn't have it. No, no, it really isn't. It just isn't. |
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Post by lbp on Nov 20, 2014 18:20:02 GMT
Before I get flamed for somewhat agreeing, I have absolutely nothing against anyone being gay! Whatever turns you on! But here is my personal experience. I grew up with a neighbor girl in the 1960's that we all called a Tom boy. Not girly at all, but we had never even heard the term gay or homosexual, we just knew she was different and it didn't matter, we all played together and were friends. Even in high school when we knew about people being gay, we didn't care, we knew then she was gay, and she said she was and again, we didn't care, still hung out, still friends. Fast forward 40 years... She is a facebook friend. Every other post is about being gay and she posts about it 10 times a day. I have finally stopped all notifications from her. It's almost like she is looking for an argument. She sent me a go fund me request to help her friend pay for his surgery to become female. Sorry, that is cosmetic surgery and I'm not helping pay for that, he isn't going to die if he doesn't have it. That is the in the face thing that turns me and others off. Just my two cents. For the record I also stopped notifications from a cousin shilling Avon and a best friend shilling Lia Sophia and Plexus. But she just might kill herself. There are things in this world I don't understand but why approach it with such indignation? Who said anything about her killing herself??? What the hell!! She has known she is gay forever and has no problem with it. She is living with her partner and they have raised two lovely girls. She is happy as she can be! I just get tired of all the gay meme's she posts on Facebook! That is the "in the face" part I don't like. I also and tired of the half naked girls another friend's posts and he's about to be blocked too!
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Post by Regina Phalange on Nov 20, 2014 18:28:56 GMT
I agree with Elaine. I have many gay friends and I love them dearly. I would absolutely accept and love my children if either of them came out as gay, but I'm not stupid enough to think that just because I am fine with it that the world is. A gay person faces persecution from outsiders all the time. Many do not accept them. They are called abominations and told they are going to hell. If they say something about being gay or don't hide it while out in public, they are accused of shoving it down people's throats. So while I would accept my child and love them all the same, I would be worried for them and might lament that circumstances were different. I constantly worry about my brother being hurt because he is gay. He lives in NYC, so it's a much more diverse population, but he has some really scary stories about subway rides when he was with his boyfriend. A couple of years ago there was a sharp rise in violence against gay men, that scared the crap out of me because it seems like they were deliberately targeting gay men. Now, my brother doesn't fit a "stereotypical" type of gay man, so one probably wouldn't make the assumption looking at him, but still. I still worry about him every day. |
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Post by lucyg on Nov 20, 2014 18:32:14 GMT
to help her friend pay for his surgery to become female. Sorry, that is cosmetic surgery and I'm not helping pay for that, he isn't going to die if he doesn't have it. No, no, it really isn't. It just isn't. I am old and a little freaked out by gender reassignment surgery ... is that what it's called? And even *I* understand it isn't just "cosmetic" surgery. and if we're talking about in-your-facebook annoying crap you wish would go away, I have a few far-right-wing friends whose anti-Obama nuttiness I would happily live without. |
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Olan
Pearl Clutcher
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Post by Olan on Nov 20, 2014 18:43:08 GMT
But she just might kill herself. There are things in this world I don't understand but why approach it with such indignation? Who said anything about her killing herself??? What the hell!! She has known she is gay forever and has no problem with it. She is living with her partner and they have raised two lovely girls. She is happy as she can be! I just get tired of all the gay meme's she posts on Facebook! That is the "in the face" part I don't like. I also and tired of the half naked girls another friend's posts and he's about to be blocked too!
Okay because I made that midnight post about everyone having redeemable qualities I will show you that one of my many redeemable qualities is breaking down the complete obvious without being judgey. Okay here it goes: You said "I won't fund your cosmetic surgery its not like you are going to die!" So I was simply pointing out that people who have gender reassignment surgery often times are suicidal. A common theme is feeling like they were born into the wrong body. Luckily neither you or I know what that feels like. I use the pronoun her because well if someone is willing to turn their penis into a vagina they've make the choice to self identify as a SHE. I tried. |
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Post by compwalla on Nov 20, 2014 18:57:15 GMT
I've heard before that people are only so vocal about gay rights because it's trendy. I've been on the gay rights bandwagon forever since the gay is strong in my family and I will tell you that if gay rights are trendy and it causes more people to support the cause, then yay. Because the only way things like employment protection and marriage equality are going to happen nationwide is if more people vocally advocate for them - OUT LOUD ALL DAY EVERY DAY. High fucking five to your lesbian friend for standing up for herself. If you're not standing behind her then you're part of the problem. Once equal rights are a reality for 100 years or so maybe then you'll have grounds to tell them to shut up already. We still don't have marriage equality across all fifty states and we still have gay kids turned out onto the street by their asshole parents and we still have violent attacks on the trans community. So no, I do not expect them to shut up nor do I want them to. I am going to go on and on about it right with them until that sort of bullshit doesn't happen anymore.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,927
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Nov 20, 2014 18:57:39 GMT
RE: Gender reassignment surgery...found this information rather interesting: Here's more on the topic, just in case any one is interested. |
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Post by Laurie on Nov 20, 2014 19:02:49 GMT
I THINK she was making a correlation between what it is like for someone who is gay; that when people find out they are at risk of someone showing up at their house and beating the crap out of them, and then when the beating finally stopped they should be glad the persecution is over (which of course, it really isn't.) Anyway, I'm pretty sure this or something like it is what she was trying to say. Thank you. Someone understands perfectly! Oh I understood it perfectly. Doesn't mean that I have to high five you and think your comment was great. They are not mutually exclusive.  Instead I will make sure to keep in mind how you respond in future threads. |
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Post by lbp on Nov 20, 2014 19:07:30 GMT
Sorry Olan, I respect your opinion, however it doesn't change mine. If she is feeling suicidal, and there is nothing that even remotely suggests that she is, then she needs to be in counseling and perhaps she is. I have contributed to several "Go Fund" me accounts for people who will definitely die if they don't have a medical procedure, like chemotherapy or heart transplants, etc. Who said she couldn't have gender reassignment surgery?? No one. I just am not contributing to that when I feel there are more urgent requests.
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Post by pierogi on Nov 20, 2014 19:29:01 GMT
I've heard before that people are only so vocal about gay rights because it's trendy. I've been on the gay rights bandwagon forever since the gay is strong in my family and I will tell you that if gay rights are trendy and it causes more people to support the cause, then yay. Because the only way things like employment protection and marriage equality are going to happen nationwide is if more people vocally advocate for them - OUT LOUD ALL DAY EVERY DAY. High fucking five to your lesbian friend for standing up for herself. If you're not standing behind her then you're part of the problem. Once equal rights are a reality for 100 years or so maybe then you'll have grounds to tell them to shut up already. We still don't have marriage equality across all fifty states and we still have gay kids turned out onto the street by their asshole parents and we still have violent attacks on the trans community. So no, I do not expect them to shut up nor do I want them to. I am going to go on and on about it right with them until that sort of bullshit doesn't happen anymore. Thank you.  Both my husband and I have gay family, and I've found this thread disturbing, if not outright sickening. It also has not been explained what "in your face celebration" of gayness even means, or what an example of said behavior is. Also, I want to know exactly where being gay in this country is "trendy." I lived in LA for over a decade, and even in a liberal-leaning city with gay enclaves, assault and harassment were very much an issue. |
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Post by gar on Nov 20, 2014 19:42:04 GMT
Sorry Olan, I respect your opinion, however it doesn't change mine. If she is feeling suicidal, and there is nothing that even remotely suggests that she is, then she needs to be in counseling and perhaps she is. I have contributed to several "Go Fund" me accounts for people who will definitely die if they don't have a medical procedure, like chemotherapy or heart transplants, etc. Who said she couldn't have gender reassignment surgery?? No one. I just am not contributing to that when I feel there are more urgent requests. That's fine of course you get to choose anything to do with your money BUT you need to recognise that it is NOT cosmetic surgery. It may not be technically life saving but it is so very much more than cosmetic. |
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,927
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Nov 20, 2014 19:43:44 GMT
It also has not been explained what "in your face celebration" of gayness even means, or what an example of said behavior is. I can answer this (my opinion only), lol. My only experience with "in your face" celebration was in Portland in 1997. The same day as my wedding rehearsal - the entire wedding party was gathered at Salmon Street Springs fountain for a brief run through then, we were to head over to one of the local restaurants for the rehearsal dinner. About five minutes in, someone noticed a commotion down the main street leading up to the fountain. Lots of noise and some police lights too. So we stopped to watch. Turned out to be a Gay Pride March...and they were headed right for us, lol. We were from out of town and had no idea this was planned! And it wouldn't have been so bad except leading the parade was the "Dykes on Bikes" section - most topless and wearing S&M gear.  Now that is an image that is difficult to get out of your brain, lol! DH's best man grabbed his (then) 2 year old daughter, popped her up on his shoulders and literally led the entire parade into the fountain area. The rehearsal was officially over.  That's what I would call "in your face celebration". And it was...oh man, was it ever! |
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Post by pierogi on Nov 20, 2014 19:51:09 GMT
Daaaayum. That. Is. Hilarious. (My own rehearsal dinner seems so...blah in comparison, now.  ) |
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Post by OntarioScrapper on Nov 20, 2014 20:34:04 GMT
homosexuality and alternative lifestyles. I stopped following George Takei. . That's your loss then. George Takei posts all sorts of things. Most of the time he makes me laugh. That's why I follow him. Being a homosexual is a PART of him, so of course he will post some posts in relation to that. I'm married. I have have kids. I sometimes post about my kids and married life. I'm female. I will sometimes post stuff about being female. There are many different things I post about just like George Takei. I don't read all of his posts, just what interests me. I would think anyone on my FaceBook feed would do the same with me. I'm sure there are some who really don't want to know about the new adventures of my daughter's pet rats and skip those posts. |
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Post by epeanymous on Nov 20, 2014 20:39:03 GMT
Yep, still waiting for it to become "trendy" in our part of central Texas. My son would be thrilled to know he's finally part of the "popular" group. Right now it's just suspicion and scorn every day. We're moving to Washington state next year, outside of Seattle. We're hoping he'll at least find more acceptance and fellowship there. I am here, and he will be welcome. My kids always have friends in their classes with same-sex married-couple parents, and we have both a huge LGBT community and a very inclusive area for LGBT folks broadly. I can't promise every day will be puppies and rainbow -- I do not know personally know what it is like to be a gay teenager here -- but I think he is going to find this is a great place for him. |
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stittsygirl
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,664
Location: In the leaves and rain.
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Post by stittsygirl on Nov 20, 2014 20:48:53 GMT
Yep, still waiting for it to become "trendy" in our part of central Texas. My son would be thrilled to know he's finally part of the "popular" group. Right now it's just suspicion and scorn every day. We're moving to Washington state next year, outside of Seattle. We're hoping he'll at least find more acceptance and fellowship there. I am here, and he will be welcome. My kids always have friends in their classes with same-sex married-couple parents, and we have both a huge LGBT community and a very inclusive area for LGBT folks broadly. I can't promise every day will be puppies and rainbow -- I do not know personally know what it is like to be a gay teenager here -- but I think he is going to find this is a great place for him. Thank you! My husband took this new job primarily move our son out of Texas. There are so many good things and good people in Texas, but it's still not a place we feel comfortable as an atheist family with a LGBTQ child. From everything I've researched, that part of Washington seems like a near perfect fit for us. I'm grateful we have this opportunity to move there, but I still hurt for the kids and adults who have no choice but to stay in situations that are damaging or even dangerous. |
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Deleted
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Aug 18, 2025 21:35:31 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2014 20:56:07 GMT
We're all on different schedules. Just cause you, OP, think being gay is a non-issue, doesn't mean others are on the same schedule - either from the sending or receiving end.  I think that is the best way to put it. I also think it's the best thing to have in mind when responding to someone here -on any topic. The OP started a topic that she thinks one way about and has been very good about hearing another point of view than her own. I think so many have been kind in sharing their point of view. The ones that go right to shock or anger instead of educating, seem to have a ways to go on their schedule.  |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2014 21:16:51 GMT
I'm going to guess that you don't have kids yet. When you have kids, anything about them that will cause them pain and hardship in terms of social reaction, causes you to worry and hurt for them. Even something like an obvious birthmark, or a limp, or a lisp, or a stutter, will cause you to worry and ache for them when they are at what a shark tank school can be. When/if your child comes out to you, you will rejoice in the fact that they trust you enough to open up to you, and fear and ache for them and the slights and worse that they will suffer from others. You will celebrate those that do accept them and rejoice in them, as opposed to the social voices who still decry homosexuality as a sin, etc. In theory, saying "no big deall" to whatever your child reveals to you about their sexual identity is nice, in our current society where heterosexism is so prevalent that people still won't recognize and acknowledge it (even on this thread), it WILL be a big deal if your child comes out to you. Because you will love your child and want to spare him or her any pain possible, and you will suddenly become aware of how many others still don't accept homo and bi-sexuality, and your child will probably suffer for it. This - I have been this mom when my son came out. I hurt for him because I knew he would have issues because of being gay. His dad (my ex), for example, uses the "love the sinner, hate the sin" tactic on him all of the time i.e. I love you but I don't accept your "lifestyle." It is so hurtful to him and will probably end their relationship. On the other hand, we live in Seattle and he really has had a fairly easy time in general. A few weeks ago DS posted something to the effect on Facebook that his being gay was no different than being blue eyed or color-blind. Just a part of who he is. The funny thing is that most people posted that they didn't know he was color blind. That is exactly how it should be ... in a perfect world. |
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Post by jeremysgirl on Nov 20, 2014 21:18:00 GMT
I think until we live in a world where rights are the same for everyone and everyone is accepted for who they are, they need to be out there making headlines. It is so depressing right now to live in Michigan. The appeals court just ruled in favor of our marriage ban so no gay marriage here and some are trying to get protections added to our civil rights act, but that debate is raging. And I am just so sick of the ignorance on this issue. I think articles being supportive and bringing this fight to the forefront is just what we need.
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Post by Spongemom Scrappants on Nov 20, 2014 21:19:21 GMT
I'm also in South Carolina and I have experienced exactly what you describe. It saddens me how much of the hatred toward gays is cloaked in "faith."
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Deleted
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Aug 18, 2025 21:35:31 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2014 21:22:33 GMT
I am here, and he will be welcome. My kids always have friends in their classes with same-sex married-couple parents, and we have both a huge LGBT community and a very inclusive area for LGBT folks broadly. I can't promise every day will be puppies and rainbow -- I do not know personally know what it is like to be a gay teenager here -- but I think he is going to find this is a great place for him. Thank you! My husband took this new job primarily move our son out of Texas. There are so many good things and good people in Texas, but it's still not a place we feel comfortable as an atheist family with a LGBTQ child. From everything I've researched, that part of Washington seems like a near perfect fit for us. I'm grateful we have this opportunity to move there, but I still hurt for the kids and adults who have no choice but to stay in situations that are damaging or even dangerous. My son is a gay kid in Seattle and has had a fairly easy time with it for the most part. I think it would be much tougher for him in other areas of the country, but luckily it's pretty much a non-issue here. |
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Post by flanz on Nov 21, 2014 2:29:33 GMT
Because people get bullied, beaten and die for being homosexual...... THIS!!! |
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Post by flanz on Nov 21, 2014 2:32:49 GMT
actually I am serious. I get that people get bullied and beaten and are killed and I think that is horrendous and can't even understand why some hate homosexuality that much or at all. It's a complete non-issue to me. To me being gay is about the same as having blue eyes, a part of your make up that you can't change. And deserves just as much celebration and conversely condemnation as having blue eyes, it's no big deal. I believe that nobody should be discriminated against due to their sexuality, I am thrilled that gay marriage is legal where I live, (why gay people don't deserve the same rights as straight people is beyond me). And really, I am well aware that people are bullied and beaten for being homosexual which is heinous but being homosexual doesn't need all of this celebration. It just is. I know I'm not saying it very well. My point is that it shouldn't be such a big deal if someone is gay. It should be a non-issue. Much like making a comment that the sky is blue. You look up, say oh yeah it is and then you move on. YES! It should be a non-issue! But until it IS a non-issue, those of us who find homophobia despicable, those of us who have friends who are nop-notch amazing people who were thrown out like trash when they came out to their parents in high school, we MUST advocate and loudly proclaim our status as ALLIES! Something like 40% of the appalling number of homeless youth are LGBT and were tossed out of their homes by the people who gave birth to them, just for being who God (if you believe in God, I don't) made them to be!!! |
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Post by flanz on Nov 21, 2014 2:34:29 GMT
My cousin just got a bag of human feces on his doorstep with a note that said "faggot." Yeah, what a thing to celebrate.  How obscene!! I'm so sorry that happened. Please tell him this REfupea is on his side, and hurts that he has to put up with such CRAP!!! |
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Post by flanz on Nov 21, 2014 2:36:59 GMT
Because representation is important, especially for kids who only see cis/heterosexual representation around them 24/7, who feel like freaks amongst their peers becaus they don't fit what's considered "normal" in our society, who often end up killing themselves because they feel they'll never be loved or accepted for who they are. I'm sickened by the OP, but grateful and in tears because of the responses. Thank you. Love to you, Mama! All of this Hate and ignorance boggles my mind. I'm a long-married staunch ally and supporter of LGBTQIA people and my heart hurts for all of the teens, men and women who are subjected to abominable treatment because of their sexual orientation... |
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Post by scrappinmom3 on Nov 21, 2014 2:52:49 GMT
I think until we live in a world where rights are the same for everyone and everyone is accepted for who they are, they need to be out there making headlines. It is so depressing right now to live in Michigan. The appeals court just ruled in favor of our marriage ban so no gay marriage here and some are trying to get protections added to our civil rights act, but that debate is raging. And I am just so sick of the ignorance on this issue. I think articles being supportive and bringing this fight to the forefront is just what we need. I too live in Michigan and am also sick of the ignorance of so many people. Equal rights for everyone, I say. |
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Now that is an image that is difficult to get out of your brain, lol!
)
I think that is the best way to put it.
