tracylynn
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Jun 26, 2014 22:49:09 GMT
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Post by tracylynn on Nov 21, 2014 3:48:32 GMT
Before I get flamed for somewhat agreeing, I have absolutely nothing against anyone being gay! Whatever turns you on! But here is my personal experience. I grew up with a neighbor girl in the 1960's that we all called a Tom boy. Not girly at all, but we had never even heard the term gay or homosexual, we just knew she was different and it didn't matter, we all played together and were friends. Even in high school when we knew about people being gay, we didn't care, we knew then she was gay, and she said she was and again, we didn't care, still hung out, still friends. Fast forward 40 years... She is a facebook friend. Every other post is about being gay and she posts about it 10 times a day. I have finally stopped all notifications from her. It's almost like she is looking for an argument. She sent me a go fund me request to help her friend pay for his surgery to become female. Sorry, that is cosmetic surgery and I'm not helping pay for that, he isn't going to die if he doesn't have it. That is the in the face thing that turns me and others off. Just my two cents. For the record I also stopped notifications from a cousin shilling Avon and a best friend shilling Lia Sophia and Plexus. Your friends friend is FEMALE. She deserves the respect to be treated and referred to as such. And just because YOU think it's cosmetic surgery doesn't mean a hill of beans. To her it's EVERYTHING. To her she is in the wrong body. Period. You don't know if she'll die or not. Maybe she'll end her life because she can't bear to live in the wrong body any longer. Can you imagine living your life that way?
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Country Ham
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Posts: 3,316
Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Nov 21, 2014 4:16:47 GMT
Love to you, Mama! All of this Hate and ignorance boggles my mind. I'm a long-married staunch ally and supporter of LGBTQIA people and my heart hurts for all of the teens, men and women who are subjected to abominable treatment because of their sexual orientation... What do the extra initials stand for? LGBT was the old stanard. What are the new labels that QIA stand for?
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Post by flanz on Nov 21, 2014 4:23:51 GMT
Yep, still waiting for it to become "trendy" in our part of central Texas. My son would be thrilled to know he's finally part of the "popular" group. Right now it's just suspicion and scorn every day. We're moving to Washington state next year, outside of Seattle. We're hoping he'll at least find more acceptance and fellowship there. I hope so!!! I think there is a lot of ignorance throughout the country, but some areas are far more liberal than others, adn I think Seattle and Portland definitely fall into that category. Hugs to you and to your son, and kudos to you for being a supportive parent who clearly loves her child!!
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stittsygirl
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Posts: 3,664
Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Nov 21, 2014 4:24:31 GMT
Love to you, Mama! All of this Hate and ignorance boggles my mind. I'm a long-married staunch ally and supporter of LGBTQIA people and my heart hurts for all of the teens, men and women who are subjected to abominable treatment because of their sexual orientation... What do the extra initials stand for? LGBT was the old stanard. What are the new labels that QIA stand for? Questioning (or sometimes queer), intersex, asexual, and some use the "a" for ally as well. I've been learning a lot about sexual and gender identification the past few years. It is a huge spectrum.
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Post by flanz on Nov 21, 2014 4:25:40 GMT
Love to you, Mama! All of this Hate and ignorance boggles my mind. I'm a long-married staunch ally and supporter of LGBTQIA people and my heart hurts for all of the teens, men and women who are subjected to abominable treatment because of their sexual orientation... What do the extra initials stand for? LGBT was the old stanard. What are the new labels that QIA stand for? I'm having a senior moment. Q is queer and a is Asexual. I, is it intersex? Does anyone know?
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Post by flanz on Nov 21, 2014 4:26:19 GMT
What do the extra initials stand for? LGBT was the old stanard. What are the new labels that QIA stand for? Questioning (or sometimes queer), intersex, asexual, and some use the "a" for ally as well. I've been learning a lot about sexual and gender identification the past few years. It is a huge spectrum. Ha, we posted at the same time!
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stittsygirl
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Posts: 3,664
Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Nov 21, 2014 4:29:00 GMT
Yep, still waiting for it to become "trendy" in our part of central Texas. My son would be thrilled to know he's finally part of the "popular" group. Right now it's just suspicion and scorn every day. We're moving to Washington state next year, outside of Seattle. We're hoping he'll at least find more acceptance and fellowship there. I hope so!!! I think there is a lot of ignorance throughout the country, but some areas are far more liberal than others, adn I think Seattle and Portland definitely fall into that category. Hugs to you and to your son, and kudos to you for being a supportive parent who clearly loves her child!! Thank you  . It's already been quite a journey, but a really good one in many ways too.
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stittsygirl
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Posts: 3,664
Location: In the leaves and rain.
Jun 25, 2014 19:57:33 GMT
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Post by stittsygirl on Nov 21, 2014 4:32:08 GMT
Questioning (or sometimes queer), intersex, asexual, and some use the "a" for ally as well. I've been learning a lot about sexual and gender identification the past few years. It is a huge spectrum. Ha, we posted at the same time! Yeah, I've found different people use different terms for the acronym sometimes. I know there is a small movement out there to come up with something easier and more inclusive or all-encompassing, so we'll see if any different terms take hold in the future.
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Olan
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Jul 13, 2014 21:23:27 GMT
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Post by Olan on Nov 21, 2014 4:34:22 GMT
Sorry Olan, I respect your opinion, however it doesn't change mine. If she is feeling suicidal, and there is nothing that even remotely suggests that she is, then she needs to be in counseling and perhaps she is. I have contributed to several "Go Fund" me accounts for people who will definitely die if they don't have a medical procedure, like chemotherapy or heart transplants, etc. Who said she couldn't have gender reassignment surgery?? No one. I just am not contributing to that when I feel there are more urgent requests. It's alright. You don't get it. Maybe you have a great pie recipe? 
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Post by M~ on Nov 21, 2014 4:37:52 GMT
You know, oh, about 7 months, give or take a few, I had to sit through a Team lunch where some other people from the office were invited. Anyway, during this lunch, the topic of gay marriage came up, and one of my colleagues--who is a black Dominican who married a Jewish man, and who has shared her story with me of how his family treated her badly because she's black--said, "I think homosexuals are disgusting." Now, two people (besides myself, obviously) knew about my sexuality because I had told them. I just didn't say anything and I was just silently pleading for those other two people to not say anything in response, even though I knew they wanted to. Now, I've only come out to a handful of people. Every time I think I can go to the "Coral Gaybles" gay professional group near my house, I remember that I have family members and/or colleagues in that area. So I don't go--because I don't want anyone else in my family to find out before my grandmother passes away. I recall that there's a particular attorney who lives in that area who tried to get me to admit I was gay for 3 years--just because that's what she does. According to her, "she wants to ferret out every gay person," and because I don't date, she assumed I was a lesbian. Every time people at work talk about an actor, I have to pretend I think he's handsome or hot. Because again, social and professional circles are tiny, even though we think they're not. Every time I fill out a medical form or insurance form, I don't check off "lesbian or homosexual" because I don't want "it" to be out there until I'm ready for it to be out there. Every time someone makes fun of the interpreter or tells me she's disgusting because "she's a dirty lesbian" and "looks and acts like a man," I'm horrified, and appalled, and saddened that these people with whom I have worked for 7 years are going to talk about me the same way. Sooner rather than later. And yeah, my family's the "burn the gays and lesbians," type. Yeah, it's great, isn't it?  ?
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Post by freecharlie on Nov 21, 2014 4:43:39 GMT
You know, oh, about 7 months, give or take a few, I had to sit through a Team lunch where some other people from the office were invited. Anyway, during this lunch, the topic of gay marriage came up, and one of my colleagues--who is a black Dominican who married a Jewish man, and who has shared her story with me of how his family treated her badly because she's black--said, "I think homosexuals are disgusting." Now, two people (besides myself, obviously) knew about my sexuality because I had told them. I just didn't say anything and I was just silently pleading for those other two people to not say anything in response, even though I knew they wanted to. Now, I've only come out to a handful of people. Every time I think I can go to the "Coral Gaybles" gay professional group near my house, I remember that I have family members and/or colleagues in that area. So I don't go--because I don't want anyone else in my family to find out before my grandmother passes away. I recall that there's a particular attorney who lives in that area who tried to get me to admit I was gay for 3 years--just because that's what she does. According to her, "she wants to ferret out every gay person," and because I don't date, she assumed I was a lesbian. Every time people at work talk about an actor, I have to pretend I think he's handsome or hot. Because again, social and professional circles are tiny, even though we think they're not. Every time I fill out a medical form or insurance form, I don't check off "lesbian or homosexual" because I don't want "it" to be out there until I'm ready for it to be out there. Every time someone makes fun of the interpreter or tells me she's disgusting because "she's a dirty lesbian" and "looks and acts like a man," I'm horrified, and appalled, and saddened that these people with whom I have worked for 7 years are going to talk about me the same way. Sooner rather than later. And yeah, my family's the "burn the gays and lesbians," type. Yeah, it's great, isn't it?  ? I am so sorry you feel that way. I do want to say that sometimes it takes personally knowing a gay person to open someone's eyes. I hope that you find more allies.
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Olan
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Jul 13, 2014 21:23:27 GMT
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Post by Olan on Nov 21, 2014 4:47:54 GMT
You know, oh, about 7 months, give or take a few, I had to sit through a Team lunch where some other people from the office were invited. Anyway, during this lunch, the topic of gay marriage came up, and one of my colleagues--who is a black Dominican who married a Jewish man, and who has shared her story with me of how his family treated her badly because she's black--said, "I think homosexuals are disgusting." Now, two people (besides myself, obviously) knew about my sexuality because I had told them. I just didn't say anything and I was just silently pleading for those other two people to not say anything in response, even though I knew they wanted to. Now, I've only come out to a handful of people. Every time I think I can go to the "Coral Gaybles" gay professional group near my house, I remember that I have family members and/or colleagues in that area. So I don't go--because I don't want anyone else in my family to find out before my grandmother passes away. I recall that there's a particular attorney who lives in that area who tried to get me to admit I was gay for 3 years--just because that's what she does. According to her, "she wants to ferret out every gay person," and because I don't date, she assumed I was a lesbian. Every time people at work talk about an actor, I have to pretend I think he's handsome or hot. Because again, social and professional circles are tiny, even though we think they're not. Every time I fill out a medical form or insurance form, I don't check off "lesbian or homosexual" because I don't want "it" to be out there until I'm ready for it to be out there. Every time someone makes fun of the interpreter or tells me she's disgusting because "she's a dirty lesbian" and "looks and acts like a man," I'm horrified, and appalled, and saddened that these people with whom I have worked for 7 years are going to talk about me the same way. Sooner rather than later. And yeah, my family's the "burn the gays and lesbians," type. Yeah, it's great, isn't it?  ? Living authentically is going to trump that b.s.! Everyone deserves happiness and the delay you are experiencing should mean you are rewarded with all the peace and love your heart can hold.
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AmeliaBloomer
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Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Nov 21, 2014 6:30:09 GMT
Now, I've only come out to a handful of people. [snip] I'm horrified, and appalled, and saddened that these people with whom I have worked for 7 years are going to talk about me the same way. Sooner rather than later. M~, I'm truly sorry you have to suffer such fools. I have a story that might give you hope. Or at least give you a laugh. Background: I live in a very gay-friendly, granola-ie town. Gay elected officials, ministers, school principals, teachers, merchants, neighbors, many parents of my kids' classmates...and as my kids grew up, their own classmates and friends. So... When my now-20-year-old-and-apparently-straight son was five, we had an unplanned discussion one day about baby-making. Questions were asked; details emerged. He was seriously grossed out, and expressed alarm that he might someday have to interact with girl...erm... bits. Me: "Don't worry about it now. Maybe when you grow up and love somebody, you might change your mind...blah, blah." Him: <thinking furiously> "Well, Richard and Doug [next door] love each other. Can I just do whatever they do?" Me: <beat> "Uh...yeah, that works." I swear on a towering stack of holy-books-of-world-religions that this is a true story. And one of several reasons I'm grateful my kids grew up among the people they did. I hope, when you decide to come out, that you can affect children in your own world. (Maybe not necessarily this exact example.  )
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craftykitten
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Posts: 4,304
Jun 26, 2014 7:39:32 GMT
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Post by craftykitten on Nov 21, 2014 8:23:10 GMT
When my now-20-year-old-and-apparently-straight son was five, we had an unplanned discussion one day about baby-making. Questions were asked; details emerged. He was seriously grossed out, and expressed alarm that he might someday have to interact with girl...erm... bits. Me: "Don't worry about it now. Maybe when you grow up and love somebody, you might change your mind...blah, blah." Him: <thinking furiously> "Well, Richard and Doug [next door] love each other. Can I just do whatever they do?" Me: <beat> "Uh...yeah, that works." I swear on a towering stack of holy-books-of-world-religions that this is a true story. And one of several reasons I'm grateful my kids grew up among the people they did. I hope, when you decide to come out, that you can affect children in your own world. (Maybe not necessarily this exact example.  ) Aw, that's sweet. I wish everyone lived in a world where this kind of acceptance was normal. I think it will take a long, long time before everyone is able to live as they want to. My heart is hurting for some of the stories on this thread.
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Post by lindywholoveskids on Nov 21, 2014 13:44:31 GMT
I agree that its really very hurtful to be homophobic. it's hurtful for everyone. we are also lucky that we live in an extremely accepting city. Our daughter who is now grown has learned from the way we live. our grandson will be ok no matter how he is.
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ReneeH20
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Posts: 452
Jun 28, 2014 16:00:48 GMT
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Post by ReneeH20 on Nov 21, 2014 17:43:57 GMT
I haven't seen too many people comment on this and to me, it's the saddest comment in your whole post. It's easy for you to say that. It's easy for people who haven't struggled with gender identity to sit in judgment, feel smug or annoyed or skeptical. I have a friend whose child recently went through the public transition from being female to being male and I'm certain that the last thing any of them felt was that he was doing it to be "in" or that he wanted to be glorified. Living in tea party country where the KKK is making a last great stand, well, let's just say that open minded acceptance of openly living as who you are is not a sure thing. As to some of the responses, I'm beyond sick of hearing things that suggest we live in a post racial society or that we should celebrate heterosexuality because homosexuality has become so normal. It's bullshit; smelly, goopy, nasty bullshit. Spend 2 minutes reading the comments on any article or op ed discussing issues of race or sexuality. Spend 5 minutes asking people (here, on FB, in real life) their experiences dealing with these issues. There are a lot of ugly, hateful, stupid people in this world and they spend a lot of their energy spreading their ugly, hateful stupidity around. As a mother of a gay transgender young adult this part of the OP bothered me the most and the response of Sarah H said most of what I would want to say about it. I'm going to add a little more to it. Not to berate the OP for her beliefs, but to add something for her to possibly think about. I know that my thinking on gender has expanded greatly. My child was born a girl and was a "tom boy." I have another daughter who is a non-girly girl (but identifies female) so thought nothing of it. Some questions growing up about why girls had to wear dress, but nothing like the transgender stories you see in the news about the kids declare they are the other gender at tender ages of 2,3,4,5,etc. Things started coming to a head in puberty. Disliking of the female body parts. Dating a couple boys, dating a girl, dating another transgender person for a year. Counseling for the past 3 years. Wearing male clothes. The change in the kid from very unhappy, didn't care about hygiene or appearances is amazing. A more confident happy person has emerged as they are accepting themselves. So now they are to the point where they want to take hormones to have a more masculine voice and stop periods, have a more muscular and less curvy body. I asked (as have a couple of family members) if they want to have surgery. You know what? They said no. I am frankly shocked. I thought that that is what every transgender person wants. Not the case. This how the kid explained it to me. "My sex is female, but my gender is male." My kid is kind of an androgynous person. Several of their friends are the same way. You don't quite know if they are male or female. That makes people really uncomfortable...not knowing. My point I guess is: gender is not black and white for everyone. It can be hard to understand if you have always felt you are male or female. *** They, their, them, etc - I sometimes use this pronoun as my transgender child told me this is an acceptable way to use pronouns for a transgender person.
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Post by flanz on Nov 21, 2014 21:26:28 GMT
I am here, and he will be welcome. My kids always have friends in their classes with same-sex married-couple parents, and we have both a huge LGBT community and a very inclusive area for LGBT folks broadly. I can't promise every day will be puppies and rainbow -- I do not know personally know what it is like to be a gay teenager here -- but I think he is going to find this is a great place for him. Thank you! My husband took this new job primarily move our son out of Texas. There are so many good things and good people in Texas, but it's still not a place we feel comfortable as an atheist family with a LGBTQ child. From everything I've researched, that part of Washington seems like a near perfect fit for us. I'm grateful we have this opportunity to move there, but I still hurt for the kids and adults who have no choice but to stay in situations that are damaging or even dangerous. I strongly urge you to seek out a liberal Unitarian Universalist Congregation near your new home. We are very welcoming and inclusive of LGBT folks. my MINISTER is an atheist!!! I have heard that some UU congregations or fellowships (if they are lay led) are very Christian in certain parts of the NorthEast... I had no idea that was even possible! Please do research the UU congregations in your soon to be new home, and go check them out. I think you will be very warmly received and hopefully very pleasantly surprised that "church" can look like this. No credo, no "if you don't believe what we believe you are wrong and going to hell!" It's a faith based in social justice and caring for the earth and the belief that every single person is worthy of being treated with dignity and respect. xo
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Post by bc2ca on Nov 21, 2014 21:49:46 GMT
I'm horrified, and appalled, and saddened that these people with whom I have worked for 7 years are going to talk about me the same way. Sooner rather than later. And yeah, my family's the "burn the gays and lesbians," type. Yeah, it's great, isn't it?  ? {{hugs}} I'm hopeful that your coworkers are going to be horrified, appalled and saddened by the things that they have said in the past and realize how wrong they were.
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sharlag
Drama Llama

I like my artsy with a little bit of fartsy.
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Location: Kansas
Jun 26, 2014 12:57:48 GMT
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Post by sharlag on Nov 21, 2014 22:17:29 GMT
ReneeH20 , I'm going through this with my oldest child. Only he wants to be called SHE, and is too polite to insist that people do so. It's helpful to hear other parents talk about similar experiences. 
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Post by Skypea on Nov 21, 2014 22:25:56 GMT
people also get bullied, beaten and die who are straight, bi, Christian, black, white, poor, Jewish.... Right, but I'm going to guess that other than the bi, the black and the Jewish, that they aren't getting that treatment just because they are those things.
you think that doesn't happen to the white, poor and Christian? What bubble world are you living in?
straight might even be included... we just don't know it yet. Time will tell on that one. Many DO get bullied by the gays.
so much for the 'just stay out of our bedrooms' banner. We now know THAT wasn't true.
I don't want to know about the sex life of anyone - even that of straight people. Keep it to yourself.
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Olan
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Jul 13, 2014 21:23:27 GMT
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Post by Olan on Nov 21, 2014 22:31:24 GMT
Right, but I'm going to guess that other than the bi, the black and the Jewish, that they aren't getting that treatment just because they are those things.
you think that doesn't happen to the white, poor and Christian? What bubble world are you living in?
straight might even be included... we just don't know it yet. Time will tell on that one. Many DO get bullied by the gays.
so much for the 'just stay out of our bedrooms' banner. We now know THAT wasn't true.
I don't want to know about the sex life of anyone - even that of straight people. Keep it to yourself.
What type of bullying do you speak of?
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 21, 2014 22:31:36 GMT
Really. That's a great statement. Great way to shut down discussion. I'm glad you don't know where I live either. I find it amazing you find an appropriate response to be a physical threat. Nice. Which is exactly what the LGBT community lives with everyday! Your point that people with non-traditional gender roles face hostile aggression every day was made in a hostile & aggressive manner. Interesting choice. It made me stop and do a double-take and that's the kind of reaction you hoped for I'm guessing? OP, George Takei is popular right now because people want to hear his clever take on things. Other than fans of the original Star Trek, nobody cared two hoots about him or what he had to say before. I only occasionally see a shared post of his on FB, so I'm just a little confused how you consider him in your face. That's just a little aside wondering, though. It's not really important to the thread. 
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ReneeH20
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Jun 28, 2014 16:00:48 GMT
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Post by ReneeH20 on Nov 22, 2014 0:20:36 GMT
ReneeH20 , I'm going through this with my oldest child. Only he wants to be called SHE, and is too polite to insist that people do so. It's helpful to hear other parents talk about similar experiences.  My kid would like to be called he - and the masculine form of the given name. I try but sometimes I mess up. Like I told my kid, I've called you "X" for 19 years. I like hearing other parents experiences too, but haven't heard too many.
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Country Ham
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Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Nov 22, 2014 0:33:15 GMT
OP, George Takei is popular right now because people want to hear his clever take on things. Other than fans of the original Star Trek, nobody cared two hoots about him or what he had to say before. From the beginning of this thread I wondered if the OP was talking about the actor from Star Trek. Is a big media presence for gay people?
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Post by leftturnonly on Nov 22, 2014 0:46:42 GMT
OP, George Takei is popular right now because people want to hear his clever take on things. Other than fans of the original Star Trek, nobody cared two hoots about him or what he had to say before. From the beginning of this thread I wondered if the OP was talking about the actor from Star Trek. Is a big media presence for gay people? He is. On Facebook, he posts clever things he finds in the media. I just looked at his recent posts, and had to go quite a few posts back before I found anything gay-related. Though he's openly gay, I don't consider him in-your-face at all. ETA - This is from his most recent post.... 
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