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Post by mollycoddle on Jan 29, 2022 0:01:34 GMT
So what…you are still vulnerable. Even if it is 25%. And how do you know that you aren’t being infected by someone who is vaxed and masked. It really makes no difference.
This is illogical. You could still die in a car accident while wearing a seat belt, so you shouldn't wear one, then? Sigh. I just can't even with this kind of nonsense anymore. Don’t bother trying. Why wear a seatbelt? Why wear a coat? Why buy insurance? Why wash your hands? Why lock your door? Why go to the doctor? Why use an umbrella? These are no doubt all burning questions in MAGA-land. |
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maryannscraps
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,803
Aug 28, 2017 12:51:28 GMT
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Post by maryannscraps on Jan 29, 2022 0:06:55 GMT
It’s a matter of risk assessment. By wearing a mask, getting vaccinated, washing your hands, social distancing, etc. you are mitigating the risk. Can you reduce the risk to zero? No. But you can do what works for protection. That’s how medicine works. Weighing risks. Everyone doing their part reduces the risk to all. I don’t think a lot of people really understand how risk mitigation works. Risk mitigation isn’t absolute. It’s not even close to absolute. Way too many factors to interfere with it. So you just discount it? The field of medicine is built on it. I’ll go with the numbers. You can ignore it all you want. Remember what I said about critical thinking? |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:11:00 GMT
So what…you are still vulnerable. Even if it is 25%. And how do you know that you aren’t being infected by someone who is vaxed and masked. It really makes no difference.
This is illogical. You could still die in a car accident while wearing a seat belt, so you shouldn't wear one, then? Sigh. I just can't even with this kind of nonsense anymore. Don’t bother trying. Why wear a seatbelt? Why wear a coat? Why buy insurance? Why wash your hands? Why lock your door? Why go to the doctor? Why use an umbrella? These are no doubt all burning questions in MAGA-land. My doing any of those things have absolutely no affect on you. NONE |
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Post by Merge on Jan 29, 2022 0:12:41 GMT
Risk mitigation isn’t absolute. It’s not even close to absolute. Way too many factors to interfere with it. So you just discount it? The field of medicine is built on it. I’ll go with the numbers. You can ignore it all you want. Remember what I said about critical thinking? She discounts it because that allows her to justify her decision to do whatever the hell she wants, whether it hurts other people or not. Don’t bother. People like this are a lost cause. |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:15:07 GMT
Risk mitigation isn’t absolute. It’s not even close to absolute. Way too many factors to interfere with it. So you just discount it? The field of medicine is built on it. I’ll go with the numbers. You can ignore it all you want. Remember what I said about critical thinking? I’m not discounting it. I’m being logical about it. One percent is enough for someone to get covid, masked, vaxed and boosted. From someone who is masked vaxed and boosted. Your numbers give you a 25% chance of getting covid and/or passing it on. |
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purplebee
Drama Llama
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Post by purplebee on Jan 29, 2022 0:19:23 GMT
But your wearing a mask DOES protect me from infection from COVID, which I have heard, in case you have not, can potentially cause death. No it doesn’t. Because if it did, nobody wearing a mask would ever get Covid. I hope you tell your surgeon and the medical personnel attending your next surgery that they are wrong about masks. |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:19:36 GMT
So you just discount it? The field of medicine is built on it. I’ll go with the numbers. You can ignore it all you want. Remember what I said about critical thinking? She discounts it because that allows her to justify her decision to do whatever the hell she wants, whether it hurts other people or not. Don’t bother. People like this are a lost cause. Aww, I’m sorry. Did I touch a nerve?? Now you are just frustrated because you can’t argue with my logic. Typical response to a logical point. |
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Post by lucyg on Jan 29, 2022 0:20:54 GMT
She discounts it because that allows her to justify her decision to do whatever the hell she wants, whether it hurts other people or not. Don’t bother. People like this are a lost cause. Aww, I’m sorry. Did I touch a nerve?? Now you are just frustrated because you can’t argue with my logic. Typical response to a logical point. Yep, that’s totally it. Nobody here can argue with your brilliant and amazing logic. Keep telling yourself that. |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:21:11 GMT
No it doesn’t. Because if it did, nobody wearing a mask would ever get Covid. I hope you tell your surgeon and the medical personnel attending your next surgery that they are wrong about masks. Not even near the point I was making. You’re veering off topic. |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:21:55 GMT
Aww, I’m sorry. Did I touch a nerve?? Now you are just frustrated because you can’t argue with my logic. Typical response to a logical point. Yep, that’s totally it. Nobody here can argue with your brilliant and amazing logic. Keep telling yourself that. There is nothing brilliant about it. It’s common logic. |
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Post by lucyg on Jan 29, 2022 0:22:54 GMT
Yep, that’s totally it. Nobody here can argue with your brilliant and amazing logic. Keep telling yourself that. There is nothing brilliant about it. It’s common logic. um, I think you’re misunderstanding that word “logic.” |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:24:11 GMT
There is nothing brilliant about it. It’s common logic. um, I think you’re misunderstanding that word “logic.” I’m, no I’m not. I know exactly what I meant. |
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Post by mollycoddle on Jan 29, 2022 0:24:34 GMT
Don’t bother trying. Why wear a seatbelt? Why wear a coat? Why buy insurance? Why wash your hands? Why lock your door? Why go to the doctor? Why use an umbrella? These are no doubt all burning questions in MAGA-land. My doing any of those things have absolutely no affect on you. NONE Aw, hey-It’s all about freedom. Freedom to drive unimpeded by a pesky seat belt. Freedom to keep your hands as clean as you want. Freedom to run around in the cold in the altogether if you want. It’s a heady feeling, I’m sure. No, of course it has nothing to do with anyone else. I was making the point that we do many things that we might not like to do. Some, like the above-are for ourselves. Not pleasant all of the time-no one enjoys paying for insurance, after all. But we do them. Similarly, we get vaccinations, background checks, etc, because they are smart to do for the community around us. The reason that people are angry with anti-maskers and anti-vaxers is because they are seen as not taking steps to control this pandemic. You might disagree, but that is how they are seen. |
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Post by SockMonkey on Jan 29, 2022 0:25:13 GMT
I don't know what they're thinking, but I'd be thinking I don't want to attend a church that doesn't enforce its own mask policy. That part. Jesus would never abide a community that doesn't care for each other. |
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maryannscraps
Pearl Clutcher
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Aug 28, 2017 12:51:28 GMT
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Post by maryannscraps on Jan 29, 2022 0:25:43 GMT
Yep, that’s totally it. Nobody here can argue with your brilliant and amazing logic. Keep telling yourself that. There is nothing brilliant about it. It’s common logic. No. It’s a lack of critical thinking. Seriously. And a lack of understanding of math and science. I’m out. Not worth trying to explain to someone who doesn’t care to learn. |
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purplebee
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Post by purplebee on Jan 29, 2022 0:26:58 GMT
I hope you tell your surgeon and the medical personnel attending your next surgery that they are wrong about masks. Not even near the point I was making. You’re veering off topic. But I thought masks don’t work? |
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Post by SockMonkey on Jan 29, 2022 0:28:03 GMT
If both of you wear the 50% effective masks, then the effectiveness = 1- (.5 x .5) = .75 = 75%. If only you wear the mask, you are protected 50% and the other person is protected 50% from you. So what…you are still vulnerable. Even if it is 25%. And how do you know that you aren’t being infected by someone who is vaxed and masked. It really makes no difference. The equivalent of "My seatbelt might only prevent death and not injury so fuck it, I won't wear it at all" is truly one of the dumbest takes I've seen in quite some time, and that's saying something in these 2022 streets. |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:29:54 GMT
My doing any of those things have absolutely no affect on you. NONE Aw, hey-It’s all about freedom. Freedom to drive unimpeded by a pesky seat belt. Freedom to keep your hands as clean as you want. Freedom to run around in the cold in the altogether if you want. It’s a heady feeling, I’m sure. No, of course it has nothing to do with anyone else. I was making the point that we do many things that we might not like to do. Some, like the above-are for ourselves. Not pleasant all of the time-no one enjoys paying for insurance, after all. But we do them. Similarly, we get vaccinations, background checks, etc, because they are smart to do for the community around us. The reason that people are angry with anti-maskers and anti-vaxersr is because they are seen as not taking steps to control this pandemic. You might disagree, but that is how they are seen. My point is that unfortunately, no matter what you or anyone around you does, it will not prevent you or anyone else from being infected with covid. |
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Post by aj2hall on Jan 29, 2022 0:33:32 GMT
Aw, hey-It’s all about freedom. Freedom to drive unimpeded by a pesky seat belt. Freedom to keep your hands as clean as you want. Freedom to run around in the cold in the altogether if you want. It’s a heady feeling, I’m sure. No, of course it has nothing to do with anyone else. I was making the point that we do many things that we might not like to do. Some, like the above-are for ourselves. Not pleasant all of the time-no one enjoys paying for insurance, after all. But we do them. Similarly, we get vaccinations, background checks, etc, because they are smart to do for the community around us. The reason that people are angry with anti-maskers and anti-vaxersr is because they are seen as not taking steps to control this pandemic. You might disagree, but that is how they are seen. My point is that unfortunately, no matter what you or anyone around you does, it will not prevent you or anyone else from being infected with covid. So we shouldn't even try to stop the spread? We should all have covid parties similar to the chicken pox ones in the 1970's? |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:33:59 GMT
Not even near the point I was making. You’re veering off topic. But I thought masks don’t work? I said that MY wearing a mask does not protect YOU from infection from covid. That has nothing to do with a surgeon wearing a mask during someone’s surgery. |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:35:47 GMT
My point is that unfortunately, no matter what you or anyone around you does, it will not prevent you or anyone else from being infected with covid. So we shouldn't even try to stop the spread? We should all have covid parties similar to the chicken pox ones in the 1970's? It’s already been proven that nothing we are doing is stopping the spread. New variants are popping up every few months and thankfully, are less deadly. |
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Post by mollycoddle on Jan 29, 2022 0:37:17 GMT
Aw, hey-It’s all about freedom. Freedom to drive unimpeded by a pesky seat belt. Freedom to keep your hands as clean as you want. Freedom to run around in the cold in the altogether if you want. It’s a heady feeling, I’m sure. No, of course it has nothing to do with anyone else. I was making the point that we do many things that we might not like to do. Some, like the above-are for ourselves. Not pleasant all of the time-no one enjoys paying for insurance, after all. But we do them. Similarly, we get vaccinations, background checks, etc, because they are smart to do for the community around us. The reason that people are angry with anti-maskers and anti-vaxersr is because they are seen as not taking steps to control this pandemic. You might disagree, but that is how they are seen. My point is that unfortunately, no matter what you or anyone around you does, it will not prevent you or anyone else from being infected with covid. That is very likely true. Here’s the thing, though. Lots of people who are immunocompromised will be in a lot of danger if they get sick. Same with the very elderly, or people with comorbidities. So they, and the people that they live with are trying very hard to keep them healthy. So I do what I can to keep myself and them healthy, for as long as possible. And research is ongoing. New treatments are being developed. So hopefully this really does become something like the common cold. 🤞🏻 |
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Post by lucyg on Jan 29, 2022 0:43:42 GMT
I don’t think she understands the word “prevent,” either. Not providing 100% protection isn’t the same thing at all as providing NO protection. The masks certainly do prevent a great deal of spread. So, cindosha, you are dead wrong when you say masks don’t offer protection. And the omicron variant may be less deadly overall, but it’s infecting so many more people that large numbers are still dying of it. This just seems to make you happy, as far as I can tell. |
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Post by aj2hall on Jan 29, 2022 0:45:52 GMT
So we shouldn't even try to stop the spread? We should all have covid parties similar to the chicken pox ones in the 1970's? It’s already been proven that nothing we are doing is stopping the spread. New variants are popping up every few months and thankfully, are less deadly. This is exactly why we shouldn't have covid parties and efforts to stop/slow/mitigate the spread are important. There is absolutely no guarantee future variants will be less deadly. www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/01/15/1073075753/get-omicron-symptoms-precautionsMillions of people are testing positive with COVID-19 in the U.S. each week and the FDA warns that most Americans will get the virus at some point. With growing evidence that the omicron variant likely causes milder disease, some people may be thinking: Why not encourage omicron to infect us so we can enjoy life again?
That's not a good idea for many reasons, say infectious disease experts and doctors. Don't throw your mask away and do not even think about hosting a 1970s-style chicken pox party, the omicron version. Here's why: |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:50:21 GMT
It’s already been proven that nothing we are doing is stopping the spread. New variants are popping up every few months and thankfully, are less deadly. This is exactly why we shouldn't have covid parties and efforts to stop/slow/mitigate the spread are important. There is absolutely no guarantee future variants will be less deadly. www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/01/15/1073075753/get-omicron-symptoms-precautionsMillions of people are testing positive with COVID-19 in the U.S. each week and the FDA warns that most Americans will get the virus at some point. With growing evidence that the omicron variant likely causes milder disease, some people may be thinking: Why not encourage omicron to infect us so we can enjoy life again?
That's not a good idea for many reasons, say infectious disease experts and doctors. Don't throw your mask away and do not even think about hosting a 1970s-style chicken pox party, the omicron version. Here's why:. You’re the one who mentioned the Covid parties. Not me. |
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PLurker
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,840
Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Jan 29, 2022 0:52:49 GMT
Speaks volumes (bolded): only thinking how it affects me and if I have to. To heck with anyone around who are high risk (or not) and could be endangering. Masks are a two way street, you know that right?! To keep things "in" as well as "out". So yes, we do still have worry about or rely on the actions of others. Seems like one-way selfish win to me. You are literally devaluing high risk lives and actually anyone else around you. Should I take your word for my safety or the medical team that literally removed and replaced my organs? They tell me being among the unvaxed and/or maskless isn't a safe place for me to be. But I certainly should take your word for it instead, right? That’s not what I have seen and read about n95s. Ok then. Screw my medical advise, I'm going with what you've read. You obviously must be more informed and not at all just trying to live your life in a selfish manner. Weird how this was pretty much your argument all along, about ALL masks before many could/can even get their hands on n95s. huh. Be free to be you and to hell with anyone else out of the orbit you care about. |
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Post by cindosha on Jan 29, 2022 0:57:54 GMT
I don’t think she understands the word “prevent,” either. Not providing 100% protection isn’t the same thing at all as providing NO protection. The masks certainly do prevent a great deal of spread. So, cindosha, you are dead wrong when you say masks don’t offer protection. And the omicron variant may be less deadly overall, but it’s infecting so many more people that large numbers are still dying of it. This just seems to make you happy, as far as I can tell. I said that my wearing a mask will not stop you from getting Covid. I also said that masked vaxed and boosted does not stop spreading it to or getting it from someone who is masked vaxed and boosted. It actually makes me sad. |
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PLurker
Prolific Pea
Posts: 9,840
Location: Behind the Cheddar Curtain
Jun 28, 2014 3:48:49 GMT
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Post by PLurker on Jan 29, 2022 1:08:51 GMT
I don’t think she understands the word “prevent,” either. Not providing 100% protection isn’t the same thing at all as providing NO protection. The masks certainly do prevent a great deal of spread. So, cindosha, you are dead wrong when you say masks don’t offer protection. And the omicron variant may be less deadly overall, but it’s infecting so many more people that large numbers are still dying of it. This just seems to make you happy, as far as I can tell. I said that my wearing a mask will not stop you from getting Covid. I also said that masked vaxed and boosted does not stop spreading it to or getting it from someone who is masked vaxed and boosted. It actually makes me sad. But it does. Maybe not 100% effective but it helps by *whatever* percent. That percent represents people Not getting sick and/or dying. I'll take the precautions and any help I can get. If only more people would be willing to be that help to others. |
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Post by aj2hall on Jan 29, 2022 1:14:30 GMT
This is exactly why we shouldn't have covid parties and efforts to stop/slow/mitigate the spread are important. There is absolutely no guarantee future variants will be less deadly. www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/01/15/1073075753/get-omicron-symptoms-precautionsMillions of people are testing positive with COVID-19 in the U.S. each week and the FDA warns that most Americans will get the virus at some point. With growing evidence that the omicron variant likely causes milder disease, some people may be thinking: Why not encourage omicron to infect us so we can enjoy life again?
That's not a good idea for many reasons, say infectious disease experts and doctors. Don't throw your mask away and do not even think about hosting a 1970s-style chicken pox party, the omicron version. Here's why:. You’re the one who mentioned the Covid parties. Not me. It's not about covid parties. It's about using every tool in the toolbox to slow/stop/mitigate the spread of covid. Masks, vaccinations, boosters, social distancing are all important. |
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Post by jennifercw on Jan 29, 2022 1:44:08 GMT
I've also been around here long enough to know that threads often/usually go off on tangents... but mask effectiveness isn't really the main point on this particular thread.
If you walked into a church, passing a sign on the door asking you to wear a mask and then noticing that pretty much everyone in the room was wearing a mask, would you put one on or not? And if not - what is going through your head when making the decision not to do so? That you are smarter than everyone else in the room? That you just don't care? That no one can make you do something you don't want to do? Is the social norm factor part of your thought process at all?
Would your decision making be different if it were a high school basketball game or a city council meeting or an educational program at the library - rather than a church? But specifically talking about situations in which you are sitting inside for some length of time with the same largish group of people and most of them are masked.
Or are you not making a conscious decision one way or the other because you simply don't notice what is happening around you?
I guess maybe it is a vent AND an actual question! It was just so strange to me and I am often curious about how people think...
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