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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Apr 3, 2016 11:25:38 GMT
I see some major red flags with how controlling she is. I agree. She sounds controlling to an abusive level. Men can be abused too. Any chance he would be willing to call a spousal abuse hotline? Or to read books about it? I'm sorry he's going through this. (and you).
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ddly
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,019
Jul 10, 2014 19:36:28 GMT
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Post by ddly on Apr 3, 2016 11:32:27 GMT
I don't think I could live with myself if I didn't talk to him. What a tough situation. She sounds like apiece of work and it doesn't seem like leaving the relationship is something he's interested in.
i would be gentle and be clear that you feel this and that. She sounds like a loaded canon and I would be afraid the damage she would do.
sorry you are in this situation.
Lisa D.
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Post by christine58 on Apr 3, 2016 12:04:57 GMT
This is the girl he chose, this is the life he chose, this is what he wants. Let him make his own decisions. Smile, hope for the best but stay out of it. Jen Would the peas be saying the same thing if it was a DD being controlled by a boyfriend? Nope. I've seen it here before. We tell that pea to get her DD OUT of that emotionally abusive relationship. Her son is being controlled and emotionally abused by his girlfriend. This young man has a long history of abuse and neglect before needmysanity fostered and then adopted him and his brother. I say...have a private conversation with him. Ask him if he is happy, etc. Be a safe place for him to go. I hope the wedding never takes place.
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Country Ham
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,314
Jun 25, 2014 19:32:08 GMT
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Post by Country Ham on Apr 3, 2016 12:42:41 GMT
This is the girl he chose, this is the life he chose, this is what he wants. Let him make his own decisions. Smile, hope for the best but stay out of it. Jen Would the peas be saying the same thing if it was a DD being controlled by a boyfriend? Nope. I've seen it here before. We tell that pea to get her DD OUT of that emotionally abusive relationship. Her son is being controlled and emotionally abused by his girlfriend. This young man has a long history of abuse and neglect before needmysanity fostered and then adopted him and his brother. I say...have a private conversation with him. Ask him if he is happy, etc. Be a safe place for him to go. I hope the wedding never takes place. Actually 99% of the time I recognize we are seeing one side of the story especially when it comes to appearances of emotional abuse. I woulds still say stay of their finances, jobs etc
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Post by gar on Apr 3, 2016 12:52:24 GMT
Would the peas be saying the same thing if it was a DD being controlled by a boyfriend? Good question. It's all very well saying they're adults, leave well alone but young adults don't suddenly know everything the day they turn into one.In my mind there's always a balance to be struck.
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AnotherPea
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,969
Jan 4, 2015 1:47:52 GMT
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Post by AnotherPea on Apr 3, 2016 13:07:32 GMT
This is the girl he chose, this is the life he chose, this is what he wants. Let him make his own decisions. Smile, hope for the best but stay out of it. Jen Would the peas be saying the same thing if it was a DD being controlled by a boyfriend? Nope. I've seen it here before. We tell that pea to get her DD OUT of that emotionally abusive relationship. Her son is being controlled and emotionally abused by his girlfriend. This young man has a long history of abuse and neglect before needmysanity fostered and then adopted him and his brother. I say...have a private conversation with him. Ask him if he is happy, etc. Be a safe place for him to go. I hope the wedding never takes place. I was thinking the same thing. This thread is bordering on a double standard. My BIL and his wife were living a total train wreck life. Her mother kept trying to control her daughter during this time. She allowed her daughter and SIL to live in a house of hers until things got too bad. Then she evicted them, telling her daughter that the daughter and children ONLY could live with her in the primary residence. She offered her daughter college tuition if she divorced my BIL. My in-laws had a fit. Their son/brother was kicked out of his home! Didn't the mother know she was butting into their business? How dare she interfere with grown adults. My SIL's mother was made out to be a controlling witch. Maybe she was. But her daughter ended up going to junior college and her grandsons grew up to be productive members of society. My BIL's life turned out very poorly. If he had remained in the picture those kids would have never had a chance.
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luckyexwife
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,069
Jun 25, 2014 21:21:08 GMT
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Post by luckyexwife on Apr 3, 2016 13:17:09 GMT
This is the girl he chose, this is the life he chose, this is what he wants. Let him make his own decisions. Smile, hope for the best but stay out of it. Jen Would the peas be saying the same thing if it was a DD being controlled by a boyfriend? Nope. I've seen it here before. We tell that pea to get her DD OUT of that emotionally abusive relationship. Her son is being controlled and emotionally abused by his girlfriend. This young man has a long history of abuse and neglect before needmysanity fostered and then adopted him and his brother. I say...have a private conversation with him. Ask him if he is happy, etc. Be a safe place for him to go. I hope the wedding never takes place. I agree. Try for a private conversation with him, and be his safe place. My DH'S brother has a controlling, abusive wife, and seeing what he has gone through is so sad.
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Post by jennrs on Apr 3, 2016 13:28:26 GMT
I have a DD the same age and have been following your story. I would step in if she were being controlled this way by a man. Especially after seeing her start to question her situation herself.
Why would she not want your son to have a better paying job, car and future that would benefit her, as well?
Good luck and big hugs!
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anniebygaslight
Drama Llama
I'd love a cup of tea. #1966
Posts: 7,402
Location: Third Rock from the sun.
Jun 28, 2014 14:08:19 GMT
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Post by anniebygaslight on Apr 3, 2016 13:33:39 GMT
We only have one side of this story.
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Post by mnmloveli on Apr 3, 2016 13:34:33 GMT
I would try a private talk without the gf there. I also would NOT be co-signing any car loan for him. With gf controlling the money, paying that loan will be last on her list. Keep in mind, late payments by them, reflect on your credit rating. My husband was a co-signer for his nieces college loans. She's always late even though she has a GREAT job. We tried to get a small loan for a bathroom re-do and were turned down due to late payments on HER loan. Be careful, sometimes by helping you can hurt yourself.
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Post by verdepea on Apr 3, 2016 13:38:13 GMT
I would not have a private conversation at this time. You have already offered help and stated your opinion of the girlfriend. It's not going to go well for you. Period.
He needs to come to you. Keep the door open...but keep your opinions to your self..This is a very pivotal time and I think you will push him away further. I would say the same thing if she was a girl.
Allow them time to let the relationship work out...fizzle out. Help him grow his independence by encouraging him to explore *his* interests.
It's tough being a parent. You have my sympathies. What about his brother? What is his take on all this? How old is he? Maybe you can promote them doing things together???
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 21:02:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2016 13:40:24 GMT
I have a DD the same age and have been following your story. I would step in if she were being controlled this way by a man. Especially after seeing her start to question her situation herself. Why would she not want your son to have a better paying job, car and future that would benefit her, as well? Good luck and big hugs! I think the big difference here is that there is a history of estrangement between the OP and her son. He chose the GF before and is likely to do that again. They are still rebuilding their relationship and it is still rocky. If the OP forces the issue, it could very easily end up in another estrangement, which will not give her son the "safe place to land" that he needs when he is ready to leave. I think being quietly supportive is a better idea. They have already told him what they think about his GF and her behavior. That's enough for now. I think this could be approached differently if the parent-child relationship were on more solid ground, but right now, I think the OP need to tread very carefully.
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Post by hop2 on Apr 3, 2016 13:43:36 GMT
I'm going to post here exactly what I said to the mom of a daughter a few weeks ago. OP where ever I said 'she' change to 'he' feel free to apply to your son. Don't tell her anything. Just don't go there it will backfire. Don't list his bad qualities either. Instead Ask questions. Ask her what she expects in a relationship. Ask her how she expects to be treated. Ask her if she feels she's worth what she expects and wants. Assure her she definitely is worth that and more!!! But ask so you know where her mind is. What are her definite deal breakers are. ( important for her to evaluate these things before there are issues) Ask her what her red flags are and how to recognize them. Ask her lots of questions. Ask her where she wants her life to go and how a relationship fits into that. Then in response to her answers to your questions make sure she knows she can trust you. Knows you'll love her. Knows what to do if she's pressured to do what she doesn't want to. And I don't even mean sex!! I mean if she's identified a for sure deal breaker what happens when that happens, prepare her to deal with it. Make sure she knows where to find support from someone just in case she's not going to come to you, a safe responsible person who will, with your permission, keep your DD's confidences. AND last but not least. Set aside 1:1 time to be with her at least every other week to go out and do something, grab dinner, have tea, whatever. Insist on it. Basically you or her father should set aside time to 'date' your DD. It sets precedence to how she ought to be treated. It helps build her self value in her own eyes. And when it's time to stand up for herself it will make it easier to do so. Be there for her.
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AmeliaBloomer
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,842
Location: USA
Jun 26, 2014 5:01:45 GMT
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Post by AmeliaBloomer on Apr 3, 2016 13:55:03 GMT
Ugh. They moved back in with her parents? Seems like last time that meant that her parents were heavily invested in supporting lifestyle choices that benefited the girlfriend, AND your son felt an obligation to her parents - in addition to being under GF's thrall. Bad combo. And the part about her never "letting" him see his family without her is worrying.
In that case, you are his only advocates. I'm not sure what you should do next when it comes to advice. Maybe just let him know that you are willing to listen if he feels the need. That could lead to you asking some open-ended questions about his future as suggested upthread, but pointedly not offering advice.
I think people here forget that your son moved out when still in high school. Many of us continue to support our kids through college - both financially and with guidance. Seems odd that culturally we have adopted this hands-off attitude for (only some) young adults based on this line in the sand. And I agree that there's an interesting gender wrinkle here. But there's also a tenuous relationship between you and him. More ugh.
(Oh, and my parents co-signed a car loan for me in my mid-20s. I think things like this are done more frequently than would be indicated on this thread.)
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J u l e e
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,531
Location: Cincinnati
Jun 28, 2014 2:50:47 GMT
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Post by J u l e e on Apr 3, 2016 14:00:48 GMT
So much has been said and I'm sure none of it is easy to read. I'm just here to give you a virtual hug and recognize how incredibly awful this is for you. As much as I agree with all the necessary "kick in the ass" advice given above, I know it's advice easier given than carried out. Wishing you strength and grace in spades. You can do this.
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julieb
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,845
Jul 3, 2014 16:02:54 GMT
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Post by julieb on Apr 3, 2016 14:18:11 GMT
It sounds to me like she doesn't want him to have a car because she can control him more by being his taxi driver and knowing where he is at all times.
While most peas say to stay out of it, my dh and I would certainly sit down and have a discussion with our kid. Not talking about it doesn't help in any way. I can't stand it when our families don't talk about things and think that way it's not happening and everything is great.
Good luck.
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Post by bostonmama on Apr 3, 2016 14:18:34 GMT
OP, I feel for you. Our kids don't magically become able to handle adult things AS adults the moment they turn 18, and some aren't even a year or two later. I don't think parenting stops at 18; they're always our children. My younger sister was in a similar relationship as your son right out of high school. She had a scholarship to a state university, but she decided to move in with her controlling boyfriend and work at a local grocery store instead. He wouldn't let her see her family alone, drove her to and from work so he knew she was there, etc. Our parents vocalized their concerns every chance they got. They let her know she could move back home at any time, that they'd help her go to college. She was resistant and angry for a long while, until one day she broke down to our mother and admitted she wanted out. She, too, was 20. Our parents took care of everything for her, paid for her to go to community college. She then transferred to a state university and met her now-husband there. She's currently working toward her PhD. There were a lot of people who advised our parents to stay out of it, that he wasn't physically abusive so it was none of their business. They told them she was an adult and to let her live her life. She wasn't in the mindset to make adult decisions, though; she was being controlled by someone else, her decisions were being controlled by someone else. Maybe it was 'controlling' of our parents to step in and put her on a different path, but that's what it took for her to become the successful, happy adult she is today! It's frightening to think where she might be had they not stayed supportive and 'in her business.' Do what feels right to you. You know him best. I wouldn't want to see you lose your relationship with him again, but maybe it won't this time. Hang in there
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uksue
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 2,527
Location: London
Jun 25, 2014 22:33:20 GMT
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Post by uksue on Apr 3, 2016 14:34:36 GMT
Sounds like he has pretty poor self esteem. I don't see any benefit in your interfering at this stage, beyond letting him know you are there for him . She is clearly treating him like a meal ticket and something within him makes him want to be treated like that right now.
I can see a point quite near where she will stop him having contact with you completely which I know would be heartbreaking. I'm relieved to hear that the wedding isn't going ahead right now because of the financial implications, but really she doesn't need a ring on her finger because he is completely under her thumb anyway!
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Post by ihaveonly1l on Apr 3, 2016 14:37:30 GMT
I'm not in this situation, but I have two sons (16 & 18) and sometimes my husband and I have to agree on who can deliver the message better. Sometimes it's me and sometimes it's him. If the two of you do decide that talking with your son is the best plan, I'd probably say that this would be one that your husband could probably handle better. He may even have to "throw you under the bus" a bit. Sometimes that helps if your son can see that your husband understands his frustration. "Son, I know you feel pulled between your girlfriend and mom. Mom wants the best for you. Girlfriend wants the best for you. What do you want?"
I think it's important for your son to know that you and your husband are united, but there is something about the message coming from mom that makes them feel immature and they hate that.
Good luck.
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Post by 2peafaithful on Apr 3, 2016 14:46:01 GMT
Oh dear Lord. She is a piece of work. He is your son. Love him well. Sometimes that means speaking and sometimes it means being quiet. You have done both and I know walked a long road with him and this young woman. She is controlling him and he is allowing it. This relationship is trouble and has shown that from the start. Who knows what he will do but if he throws away a great opportunity because of it it will be a lesson he has to learn and he appears to be unwilling to really weigh the wisdom that has been given to him. That is very hard to watch as a parent but he is an adult and can choose his way. That doesn't mean we don't ever speak up. He has given up his card so as a mom to 3 sons there is no way when I can see my son is on a bad path that isn't getting any better and perhaps worse that I am going to turn in my parent card. He needs to hear the truth in love. Regardless of what he does with it.
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Post by Belia on Apr 3, 2016 14:53:56 GMT
I think the big difference here is that there is a history of estrangement between the OP and her son. He chose the GF before and is likely to do that again. They are still rebuilding their relationship and it is still rocky. If the OP forces the issue, it could very easily end up in another estrangement, which will not give her son the "safe place to land" that he needs when he is ready to leave. I think being quietly supportive is a better idea. They have already told him what they think about his GF and her behavior. That's enough for now. I think this could be approached differently if the parent-child relationship were on more solid ground, but right now, I think the OP need to tread very carefully. This. To those to think this is a double standard, I might agree if it were ANY other pea than this. But knowing a bit of this backstory makes me stand by my advice. Stay out of it.
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Post by mom on Apr 3, 2016 15:32:54 GMT
This is the girl he chose, this is the life he chose, this is what he wants. Let him make his own decisions. Smile, hope for the best but stay out of it. Jen Would the peas be saying the same thing if it was a DD being controlled by a boyfriend? Nope. I've seen it here before. We tell that pea to get her DD OUT of that emotionally abusive relationship. Her son is being controlled and emotionally abused by his girlfriend. This young man has a long history of abuse and neglect before needmysanity fostered and then adopted him and his brother. I say...have a private conversation with him. Ask him if he is happy, etc. Be a safe place for him to go. I hope the wedding never takes place. I absolutely would be saying the same thing. I was in an emotionally (and eventually) physically abusive relationship. My parents tried to butt in - constantly. It only made me dig my heels in and try harder to prove them wrong. They were constantly trying to throw money at me, trying to lure me out of the relationship. Eventually I began to think my parents didnt think I could stand on my own two feet if I ever left. I finally got a gut full on my ex and got out. But I had to come to see the relationship for what it was - not just because mommy and daddy said so. The boy is an adult. There are no children to protect here (otherwise, I say protect the children all you can).
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Post by elaine on Apr 3, 2016 15:39:26 GMT
Ugh. They moved back in with her parents? Seems like last time that meant that her parents were heavily invested in supporting lifestyle choices that benefited the girlfriend, AND your son felt an obligation to her parents - in addition to being under GF's thrall. Bad combo. And the part about her never "letting" him see his family without her is worrying. In that case, you are his only advocates. I'm not sure what you should do next when it comes to advice. Maybe just let him know that you are willing to listen if he feels the need. That could lead to you asking some open-ended questions about his future as suggested upthread, but pointedly not offering advice. I think people here forget that your son moved out when still in high school. Many of us continue to support our kids through college - both financially and with guidance. Seems odd that culturally we have adopted this hands-off attitude for (only some) young adults based on this line in the sand. And I agree that there's an interesting gender wrinkle here. But there's also a tenuous relationship between you and him. More ugh. (Oh, and my parents co-signed a car loan for me in my mid-20s. I think things like this are done more frequently than would be indicated on this thread.) I remember the story well and did when I responded upthread. I have absolutely no problems with parents co-signing car loans, in most instances. I think it is done commonly. I think that in this case, with these kids, and with it being the OP's idea and not her son's, it is a bad idea. He has been with this girl for well over a year now. The relationship has some staying power. He ran away from home to be with her. The OP has been very good and consistent about staying in touch, being willing to be there for him, etc., and he continues to choose to stay in the relationship. These are some of the reasons I am suggesting a hands-off attitude. I also think that beyond a summer internship, or working in your family's own business, a young adult taking on a full-time job where one of your parents works is a bad idea. If the girlfriend already thinks the mom is controlling, she will do everything she can to sabotage his working there. And his behavior will impact how other employees view the mom. (((Hugs))) to the OP - such a long hard struggle!
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Post by brina on Apr 3, 2016 15:42:42 GMT
Please let me know if I am remembering your story correctly - you adopted your son our of foster care when he was older? Am I remembering correctly? If yes, I think you should speak with somebody who specializes in adoption/attachment issues, and then based on their advice address the issue with him. Although he is 20 his background does make this situation different than if he was your average 20-year-old and therefore the approach needs to be a bit different as well.
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Post by 2peafaithful on Apr 3, 2016 16:02:49 GMT
Please let me know if I am remembering your story correctly - you adopted your son our of foster care when he was older? Am I remembering correctly? If yes, I think you should speak with somebody who specializes in adoption/attachment issues, and then based on their advice address the issue with him. Although he is 20 his background does make this situation different than if he was your average 20-year-old and therefore the approach needs to be a bit different as well. That is good wisdom.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 21:02:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2016 21:56:04 GMT
Please let me know if I am remembering your story correctly - you adopted your son our of foster care when he was older? Am I remembering correctly? If yes, I think you should speak with somebody who specializes in adoption/attachment issues, and then based on their advice address the issue with him. Although he is 20 his background does make this situation different than if he was your average 20-year-old and therefore the approach needs to be a bit different as well. Yes - he is adopted from foster care, yes he does have attachment issues. We spent 2 years of intensive therapy when I first adopted him. At 7 he had PTSD from the abuse he suffered in his birth home. He went back into therapy when he was 14 for again 2 years, I agree. She sounds controlling to an abusive level. Men can be abused too. Any chance he would be willing to call a spousal abuse hotline? Or to read books about it? I'm sorry he's going through this. (and you). Thank you for pointing this out because that was what I vocalized to my husband last night. I work for a family crisis center. We have a DV shelter and we occasionally get men there. We have a DV support group for men and right now we have 15 to come on a regular basis. It is a real concern for us because of what we are seeing. I'm actually going to go by the shelter tomorrow and talk to the therapist that works there. At this point, having him for for our agency is off the table. We have bigger concerns and that is his well being. DH sent him a text last night asking him to come help him fix something on the truck today. DS said he would have to check with GF - I was ticked! In the end DS is coming over in about an hour. They are going to work on the truck but DH is going to try to talk to him. We will see how it goes.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 21:02:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2016 22:39:38 GMT
Hi This might not be popular but in the end YOU have to do what you can live with. Sometimes doing what you know you need to do and facing the outcome sucks. Being a parent sucks sometimes but in the end I'd rather know I spoke up, stood up and did everything I could to make sure my kid was ok. They might not like it at the the time but eventually(hopefully) they will grow up and appreciate that you cared enough to call them out on their crap. Speak to him, support him but be prepared that he might distance himself untill he's ready to listen. Stay strong and big mom hugs.
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Post by 950nancy on Apr 3, 2016 23:16:55 GMT
The simple fact is that they are shacked up, living together, whatever you want to call it. Therefor they 'should' be making major purchasing decisions together as a couple and not with mommy or daddy. Also mommy/daddy shouldn't be co signing loans for kids who think are mature enough to be living together as if they were a married couple. I agree about the purchases (his mom and dad not financing a vehicle), but living together with her parents supporting them and her making the spending decisions kind of makes the story a bit more not so black and white. I hope he gets out before her fairy tale ideas turn into a Grimm story.
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Post by 950nancy on Apr 3, 2016 23:26:35 GMT
Ugh. They moved back in with her parents? Seems like last time that meant that her parents were heavily invested in supporting lifestyle choices that benefited the girlfriend, AND your son felt an obligation to her parents - in addition to being under GF's thrall. Bad combo. And the part about her never "letting" him see his family without her is worrying. In that case, you are his only advocates. I'm not sure what you should do next when it comes to advice. Maybe just let him know that you are willing to listen if he feels the need. That could lead to you asking some open-ended questions about his future as suggested upthread, but pointedly not offering advice. I think people here forget that your son moved out when still in high school. Many of us continue to support our kids through college - both financially and with guidance. Seems odd that culturally we have adopted this hands-off attitude for (only some) young adults based on this line in the sand. And I agree that there's an interesting gender wrinkle here. But there's also a tenuous relationship between you and him. More ugh. (Oh, and my parents co-signed a car loan for me in my mid-20s. I think things like this are done more frequently than would be indicated on this thread.)When I was a senior in college and needed a car to get to student teaching (my mom drove me for the first few weeks), my dad bought a small, dependable vehicle and told me I could pay him back when I got my first job. I paid him seven payments and then he said that I was responsible and the car was mine. It was a great gift, and I never for one second didn't appreciate it.
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Post by leftturnonly on Apr 3, 2016 23:30:23 GMT
Well if he really is like my brother, she'll fake a pregnancy and at month 7, she will fly to Kentucky on a "business trip" and have a miscarriage and have the baby cremated and buried there because she can't afford to fly the remains home. And then a few weeks later, after his family hires a PI to investigate this girl, he'll find out that's she happily married with 4 kids and faked her whole life and name while with him. He only wasted 2 years on that one. I've wondered what happened with her. Too much of a train wreck to forget.
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