I don't understand how (she) we are going to pay for it all

Best statement of the night!  

It's easy to overlook the fact that one of the main drivers behind the "college for everyone' movement was that schools were often guilty of funneling mostly minority students into vo-tech classes, or excluding them from college prep classes. It was also intended to combat generational poverty, where kids whose parents never finished high school often felt like college was an unattainable goal. We need to be careful not to fall back into earlier problems or undo the good we've done.

I agree that the trades need to be more highly regarded as honorable work. We're seeing some return to that here in Texas, with our diploma system changed to allow kids to choose an "endorsement" that best fits their plans and desires, rather than funneling everyone into the 4x4 college-prep plan. It's not perfect, but it's an improvement.

Are apprenticeships still a thing? I admit I have no idea. I do know I have concerns about the profusion of private, for-profit colleges that want to train kids to be plumbers and welders at tuition rates that rival the costs of four-year universities. There needs to be affordable, public institutions where people can learn those skills - and maybe there are, but I don't see them advertised like the expensive ones.

So many things to say about this thread this morning.

I'll start with this: I agree. Not everyone needs a college degree. There are a gazillion skilled labor jobs out there that pay well but they are simply not being filled because of the push to send every one to college. We, as a society, have made it seem as though not going to college is somehow wrong, less than. The fact of the matter is that while it is true that college does teach you a lot more than what you just learn in classes, you can learn a lot of those same lessons else where. A college education doesn't equal intelligence, but somehow we have made it seem that way and denigrated it to the point of derision. (Think about how we talk about the statistic of that, what 30% of Trump supporters are 'uneducated white men.') 

Not all college degrees are created equal. I am the first one to admit that I had a great time in college. I went to one of the top party schools in the nation at the time and believe me when I tell you that I fully participated in helping to keep up that title. I paid my own way though. My mom was a single mom, a dental hygienist, and she could not afford to pay for any part of my education. I had grants and loans. I graduated with what is probably the most useless degree known to humanity-a history degree. 

I am looking for work. I am having a really hard time finding anything-part of that is because I stayed home with the kids and my work history is spotty at best. But what is so odd to me is that jobs that years ago didn't require any kind of degree, require one now. I applied for what essentially amounts to a receptionist position that requires a college degree. Now, I understand that this is unusual for that type of job, and that because of the employer, but still. A college degree for a $13/hr position.

Anyway, all that to say that as I get older, I am agreeing with Mike Rowe more and more about how not everyone is made for college. And that not everyone who doesn't go to college is destined to live in poverty. College isn't a right, it is a choice, and that we as a society need to stop categorizing those that go as elite and those that don't 'the uneducated.'

You think about this from the point of view of someone running a small budget. The problem is that they aren't thinking about these things in terms of cash flow.

They think about the budget in terms of who they owe, who donated the most, and who will get them re elected.

If you actually think programs are funded by purely looking at cash flow in and out, I have some lovely ocean front property in Arizona I'd like to sell you.

I agree. My sisters district does not allow kids to be retained. So they show up or dont, do work or dont...Still move along.

This is one of my biggest, stand up on a soap box and scream to the heavens issues. You should be concerned-those for profit schools are a big problem. The latest statistic that I read is that is that 30% (give or take) of all student loans are given to students at those type schools and that those 30% are responsible for almost 60% of student loan defaults.

The majority of those school are subpar, prey on the weak, and in some cases charge for a two year "degree" what a state college charges for a four year degree including costs associated with housing. A second insult occurs when some of those students decide they want to further their education and they learn that not only do their credits not transfer to an accredited college degree program, but in many cases have capped out their grant dollar amounts and are only eligible for more loans.

It is HUGELY concerning. 

Yes, it's paid. When they're working, they're paid. A pre-apprentice starts at $14/hour with no skills. They show they can grow, apply for the program, and can easily get in. Pay raises are every 6 months! The only time they aren't paid, is when they're at "school" for a week or two taking classes. But, if they've been working for our company and in good standing, they can draw unemployment for that time uncontested. Without the classes, they won't advance.

Oh, absolutely.  I know for a fact that my auto mechanic lives in a much nicer house than I do, and drives a nicer car.  DH and I both have masters degrees.  Our auto mechanic friend has no degree.  One of our neighbors is a plumber and is doing very well for himself. He works his butt off.

We recently bought a new dishwasher, and the man who came out to install it was very nice and knowledgeable about all things house-related.  It was a tricky installation because of the way the builder did our house, and required some skills other than just knowing how to hook up a dishwasher.  But what I really liked was the fact that he had a younger worker with him, and was teaching this young man as he went - not only about the appliance installation, but about dealing with problems as they come up, working with customers, etc.  I don't know if he was an apprentice or just a younger employee this guy had taken under his wing, but the young man was getting an education far beyond a simple training class.

This...because I could not put it into words the way you did!

Don't be upset if there's a job you want that takes more education than you have. But if you can't afford the education, don't expect to get the education - that is for people who can afford it. But we should look to ourselves for solutions. I get it.

I just disagree. When there was a job i wanted, but I wasn't qualified for, I went to school and got the education I needed . I didn't expect someone to give me a job I wasn't qualified for. But I needed - fought for and received - loans and grants and institutional aid, and being as it was a public school that was state money and I don't apologize for that. Financial aid for higher education meant that I had the option of becoming a reasonably well paid professional when the alternative at home was working at Walmart. Or Food City or maybe Roses even.

I don't think it helps us as a country to not promote success among the upcoming generation. Since I got my undergrad degree, the cost at the same school has quadrupled. What am I supposed to say to my kid's generation? Sorry you can't afford it - I got mine, so you figure it out for yourself? No thanks.

So I do expect that we as a country should find ways to make higher education accessible, affordable, and effective. Not because I think people should just have jobs they aren't qualified for - but because I think people should have access to the tools that qualify them for the jobs they want and the financial future they are looking for. And that is what I mean by success being open to us.

There are trade school and apprenticeship's here.

I don't think in our area that there is less of a push into trades vs more if a push to attend a 2-4 year college (if there is, we're not aware).

I think what stops many from entering the trades is that the see those years before them struggling with massive layoff's (construction). There are more and more rules being placed on these trades in which they have to assume the costs. More and more insurance, bonding, higher fees for licenses and permits. The overhead and supply costs can be overwhelming.

And, when these trades tell customers their fee for a service call upfront, they get accused of trying to rip them off!! (Reasonable fee too)--and those doing that don't even consider that they wouldn't work for free either!

I'm afraid that it will get worse with a Trump win; with all his contract breaching and renegotiating after the work was done at an agreed on price, where he brags about it being great business--screwing the contractors--that it will become mainstream and others will start following that to make it the norm.