Deleted
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Sept 28, 2024 8:11:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 21:10:17 GMT
C'mon you guys. Poor little United Continental. I don't think they could have afforded to up the ante to get a few more people to agree to fly the next day. I mean, they only made a few billion in profits last year. The ragged little dumplings: "United Airlines parent United Continental Holdings reported a full-year 2016 net profit of $2.3 billion, down 69.2% from net income of $7.3 billion in 2015. However, Chicago-based United’s 2015 earnings included a one-time $3.1 billion non-cash tax valuation benefit that skews year-over-year comparisons, especially since 2016’s earnings include a one-time tax expense of $1.5 billion. On a pre-tax basis, United’s 2016 net profit was $3.8 billion, down 9.5% from $4.2 billion ..." atwonline.com/airline-financials/united-earns-23-billion-2016-net-profit
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PrettyInPeank
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,691
Jun 25, 2014 21:31:58 GMT
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Post by PrettyInPeank on Apr 10, 2017 21:14:30 GMT
related to the original response by united "refused to volunteer" They are kidding, right? Since when does anyone HAVE to volunteer? In the military, my husband calls it "voluntold." Lol
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Post by 2peafaithful on Apr 10, 2017 21:18:20 GMT
This is absolutely ridiculous. If you run a business by overbooking, then you need to have a plan in place to address issues when they arise. They should've offered significantly more money in vouchers or other incentives to get volunteers before doing what they did. I find it crazy you could book a ticket and pay for a service then get dragged off a plane (I know, I know - fine print and all - but I still find it ridiculous). Whatever they would've had to pay to get volunteers would've been a bargain versus the bad press. I imagine they are now wishing they had increased those vouchers. Lets see.....a few grand or the entire world staring at you during one of your worst decisions....big mistake, huge.
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PrettyInPeank
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,691
Jun 25, 2014 21:31:58 GMT
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Post by PrettyInPeank on Apr 10, 2017 21:23:21 GMT
I already disliked United. But now I will never fly them again. This wasn't one employeee making a mistake--it was several, and in whole makes up the company of United.
The system that permitted crew on a full flight is insane (mistake 1), allowing all the passengers on the full flight knowing they needed seats (mistake 2), not being permitted to offer higher compensation (mistake 3), using a random system to select "volunteers" based on arbitrary reasons (mistake 4), the pilot allowing the police to be called (mistake 5), allowing the police to forcibly remove him (mistake 6), the CEO making an insulting excuse of an apology (mistake 7).
Yeah, never flying United again.
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MizIndependent
Drama Llama
Quit your bullpoop.
Posts: 5,836
Jun 25, 2014 19:43:16 GMT
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Post by MizIndependent on Apr 10, 2017 21:37:00 GMT
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PrettyInPeank
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,691
Jun 25, 2014 21:31:58 GMT
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Post by PrettyInPeank on Apr 10, 2017 21:41:06 GMT
Communicator of the year? That's rich.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 8:11:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 21:59:45 GMT
This twitter might be nearer the truth as to what their statement should be like
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Post by pastlifepea on Apr 10, 2017 22:01:13 GMT
Holy crap...all that and to think that if they'd upped the ante on the vouchers it's highly likely none of this would have happened. So instead of an additional few thousand dollars for more voucher money, they are likely facing an expensive lawsuit and have generated all of this free publicity. Everyone else on the plane was delayed a couple of hours as well, so there's also that. And then the "sorry not sorry" apology from the boss man. Unbelievable.
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Post by Lindarina on Apr 10, 2017 22:07:55 GMT
Well, that must be one of the best executed anti-commercials I've ever seen. Great way to tell every potential customer world wide to chose a different airline whenever possible. Who cares if the guy could have handled it in a different way. What on earth made them think that dragging him off screaming was the best solution?
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Post by hop2 on Apr 10, 2017 22:12:51 GMT
Um holy Crap!
Wish me luck I fly united today!!! Although I do have a hard time envisioning them removing me from a plane here.
I guess I should keep that in mind if they 'offer'
They, the airline should be penalized in some way for a bait & switch or false sale it something. AND loosein court
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Post by artgirl1 on Apr 10, 2017 22:20:53 GMT
I haven't read all these pages, but have read several news accounts. Did he get to fly? I hope he saw his attorney first thing today.
I was scheduled to fly Delta out of NYC at 8am once. The flight was cancelled, and I was rebooked for 10am, then again for 12, 2, 4, 6, 8, and finally left at 10 pm.(all on standby, and having to call customer service each time to rebook. When I finally got on the 10 pm plane, was seated at the emergency exit. The flight crew member (not assigned to that flight) being transported said to me "you're too old to sit in that seat".(I am 63, look about 50 and probably fitter than most 20 year olds) I asked her to repeat herself, and recorded that. I was moved again. I had to rent a car to get home (75 miles) because my transportation could not wait all day, and the shuttles to my city did not fly that late. Delta ended up paying for my next 5 round trips to NYC.
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Post by Merge on Apr 10, 2017 22:21:37 GMT
I say good for this guy, doctor or not, for standing up for his right to be seated on the flight for which he'd bought a ticket. The airlines are like big bullies and assume they can overbook and treat passengers like crap and it will never hurt their bottom line. This man, in refusing to be removed, forced the airline to make public asses of themselves and show how little they actually value paying customers. I hope it bites them in the butt.
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Montannie
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,486
Location: Big Sky Country
Jun 25, 2014 20:32:35 GMT
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Post by Montannie on Apr 10, 2017 22:26:47 GMT
I say good for this guy, doctor or not, for standing up for his right to be seated on the flight for which he'd bought a ticket. The airlines are like big bullies and assume they can overbook and treat passengers like crap and it will never hurt their bottom line. This man, in refusing to be removed, forced the airline to make public asses of themselves and show how little they actually value paying customers. I hope it bites them in the butt. Yes, customers should insure that no United flight is ever over-booked again by declining to book with them at all.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 8:11:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 22:43:03 GMT
When my dd was little, that United Smashes Guitars song came out on the web. She would ask us to play it over and over and over. My DH even wrote other little verses for her. I'd forgotten about that. Thanks for the reminder!!!
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grammanisi
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,741
Jun 26, 2014 1:37:37 GMT
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Post by grammanisi on Apr 10, 2017 22:48:34 GMT
What if you are traveling with your family and only 1 person was selected? This was the first thing that came to my mind.
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Post by annabella on Apr 10, 2017 22:56:21 GMT
What if you are traveling with your family and only 1 person was selected? This was the first thing that came to my mind. I'm sure they'd make an exception for you and go back to the lottery and randomly pick another person, which they could have done when this man said no.
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Post by flanz on Apr 10, 2017 23:04:37 GMT
WOW! They should take back the award, eh?
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Post by flanz on Apr 10, 2017 23:07:08 GMT
I haven't read all these pages, but have read several news accounts. Did he get to fly? I hope he saw his attorney first thing today. I was scheduled to fly Delta out of NYC at 8am once. The flight was cancelled, and I was rebooked for 10am, then again for 12, 2, 4, 6, 8, and finally left at 10 pm.(all on standby, and having to call customer service each time to rebook. When I finally got on the 10 pm plane, was seated at the emergency exit. The flight crew member (not assigned to that flight) being transported said to me "you're too old to sit in that seat".(I am 63, look about 50 and probably fitter than most 20 year olds) I asked her to repeat herself, and recorded that. I was moved again. I had to rent a car to get home (75 miles) because my transportation could not wait all day, and the shuttles to my city did not fly that late. Delta ended up paying for my next 5 round trips to NYC. good for you! I'm guessing that was a while ago... I don't think you'd get that in today's wretched air travel climate...
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Post by elaine on Apr 10, 2017 23:10:45 GMT
I just watched a story on NBC and the man was also 69 years old.
How would you feel about seeing your 69 year old parent dragged forcibly down an aisle? For a seat he had paid for and had confirmed, including officially boarding the plane?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 8:11:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 23:10:59 GMT
The mother of all marketing publications, Ad Age, has a nice summary. "Check below for some thoughts from brand, reputation and communications experts on what UA should be focusing on right now as it wades through the crisis. Howard Fencl, VP, Hennes Communications: "United CEO Oscar Munoz needed to immediately apologize. He did not. Instead, he offered a non-apology, 'for having to re-accommodate these customers.' Basically, he is apologizing for their overbooking policy, and not the violence and humiliation their passenger suffered, or the emotional distress it caused all the other passengers witnessing this unnecessary event. Ultimately, the bigger picture here is that United needs to overhaul its overbooking policy. If it is known that a flight crew needs to take seats with passengers on a flight, that must be known well enough in advance that employees staffing the gate make room for them before passengers are boarded."" adage.com/article/cmo-strategy/united-airlines-passenger-ejection-permanent-brand-damage-experts/308612/?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=Social
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quiltz
Drama Llama
Posts: 6,840
Location: CANADA
Jun 29, 2014 16:13:28 GMT
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Post by quiltz on Apr 10, 2017 23:23:50 GMT
They should pull back people based on how they paid. Usually people whouuse points are the first to go and/or company personal (they are usually on stand by).
Next go the people who didn't confirm their reservation the 24 hours in advance, meaning the later they confirmed prior to the flight are the first to be bumped.
There are several codes on your boarding pass.
The best is to confirm at the first opportunity as possible & if you are able, pre book your seat. If you have someone who has a disability or exceptionality, let the airline know as soon as you purchase your tickets. Let them know if you will be using a wheelchair & give the dimensions. Sometimes a smaller plane may be used & the cargo hold doors may not be able to fit your equipment. Stuff happens. Book early, reconfirm early, keep records of dates & time & the type of communication (text, eemail, phone ).
I got bumped once, I volunteerd, on a trip home from Bermuda to Toronto. I received a $700. voucher, overnight accommodation at the Fairmount Hamilton, all meals & transfers. Better than facing the snow storm at home. This was awhile ago.
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Post by hollymolly on Apr 10, 2017 23:33:16 GMT
What United did was unquestionably wrong. I would be furious and United would be paying for my ticket on the next flight to my destination, regardless of airline, and giving me a huge voucher, and I'd still call my attorney as soon as I landed.
What the security guys did was criminal assault, plain and simple. I hope charges are filed against them.
But...why in the world did the passenger not leave the plane and deal with it on the ground? Why didn't he get up on his own when security came to forcibly remove him? What did he hope to accomplish? That they would choose someone else? What if that person refused, and the next person refused and the next and the next? I hate to blame the victim, because what happened to him really was horrific, but he could have avoided it by just getting off the damn plane when he was told to. When you are on a plane, you have an obligation to obey all crew member instructions, whether you agree with them or not, whether they are fair or not. It is truly for the safety of all the passengers that you do what they tell you to do. I don't want to be in a metal tube 35,000 feet in the air with someone who isn't going to do what the crew members tell him to do.
I just really cannot understand why he resisted to that extent.
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Post by *KAS* on Apr 10, 2017 23:34:49 GMT
They should pull back people based on how they paid. Usually people whouuse points are the first to go and/or company personal (they are usually on stand by). Next go the people who didn't confirm their reservation the 24 hours in advance, meaning the later they confirmed prior to the flight are the first to be bumped. There are several codes on your boarding pass. The best is to confirm at the first opportunity as possible & if you are able, pre book your seat. If you have someone who has a disability or exceptionality, let the airline know as soon as you purchase your tickets. Let them know if you will be using a wheelchair & give the dimensions. Sometimes a smaller plane may be used & the cargo hold doors may not be able to fit your equipment. Stuff happens. Book early, reconfirm early, keep records of dates & time & the type of communication (text, eemail, phone ). I got bumped once, I volunteerd, on a trip home from Bermuda to Toronto. I received a $700. voucher, overnight accommodation at the Fairmount Hamilton, all meals & transfers. Better than facing the snow storm at home. This was awhile ago. Airlines most profitable customers are business flyers. And we often can't book early as they are often last-minute trips that pop up. We pay more for tickets because of that. But I also don't have to reconfirm and select my seats - I do all that when I buy my ticket. maybe you're speaking about Southwest?
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Post by *KAS* on Apr 10, 2017 23:41:27 GMT
The story I read a little while ago said that they originally offered $400 vouchers and then changed it to $800. In my experience, $1000 is the sweet spot when there is not another flight the same day. Even people who would be inconvenienced will do so for a thousand bucks.
So for an extra $800 ($200x4 passengers), this story doesn't happen.
They did suspend the police officer.
They medically treated the passenger, took everyone off the plane to clean it, delayed the flight by over two hours, and then finally left. I think he was on the plane when it finally left but I'm not 100% sure. They said that about half the plane walked off after it happened but then they ended up unloading the whole thing anyway.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 8:11:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 23:48:33 GMT
I have a hard time believing it to. As a stand-by passenger who was already buckled in to my seat, my name has been called and I've been told to deplane. Sucked, but I got off. Eta... I also know not to wear leggings. But he wasn't standby. He was just randomly chosen... Why is the airlines need to move employees around more important than a customer who bought a ticket? We know that now. I was agreeing with seasidemermaid when she said maybe he was a stand-by passenger since I've had that happen to me before.
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blue tulip
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,004
Jun 25, 2014 20:53:57 GMT
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Post by blue tulip on Apr 10, 2017 23:52:17 GMT
this was almost our situation 2 weeks ago. flying united, out of O'Hare, to new Orleans. I booked this flight over a year ago, and when I chose seats they were in the middle of the plane. then 2 mos ago they change the departure time, and must've changed planes too, cuz we were in the very last row. there were notices on the departure board that the plane was overbooked, they needed 2-3 people to volunteer to get bumped. this was an 11am flight. they could get one person out at 8pm, 1 out at 1am, and they didn't know when for the third.
so we all board the plane and figure it's fine. then they say they had to add more fuel and we are overweight, we need 2-3 people to get off. no one volunteers. they are offering $800 credit. they announce again in 10 minutes, no one gets up. finally a different, very blunt woman comes on and tells us 2 people need to get off or they will start bumping random people or cancel the flight. I bet it was the same woman who announced on this flight, the reported words were almost verbatim what she said. time goes by and thankfully 2 passengers volunteered. :/
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 8:11:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 23:55:48 GMT
I wonder if the four crew members arrived at the gate after it was already boarded, so United had to result in randomly picking four passengers. Were no jumpseats available... maybe not for all four crew members, but one or two?
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Sept 28, 2024 8:11:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 23:58:59 GMT
this was almost our situation 2 weeks ago. flying united, out of O'Hare, to new Orleans. I booked this flight over a year ago, and when I chose seats they were in the middle of the plane. then 2 mos ago they change the departure time, and must've changed planes too, cuz we were in the very last row. there were notices on the departure board that the plane was overbooked, they needed 2-3 people to volunteer to get bumped. this was an 11am flight. they could get one person out at 8pm, 1 out at 1am, and they didn't know when for the third. so we all board the plane and figure it's fine. then they say they had to add more fuel and we are overweight, we need 2-3 people to get off. no one volunteers. they are offering $800 credit. they announce again in 10 minutes, no one gets up. finally a different, very blunt woman comes on and tells us 2 people need to get off or they will start bumping random people or cancel the flight. I bet it was the same woman who announced on this flight, the reported words were almost verbatim what she said. time goes by and thankfully 2 passengers volunteered. :/ That's what happens when no one pushes the issue. The airlines just keep doing it over and over because it's more profitable to them than up'ing the ante to get people to voluntarily come off the plane. So, I'm grateful this guy exposed this disgusting practice. I read somewhere in one of the many articles on this that's come out today that some flights are overbooked by as much as 40%. That should be ILLEGAL. I know they might want to overbook by a certain percentage to not have empty seats when people are buying refundable - on the other hand, those refundable tickets are WAY more expensive, partly to cover the potential empty seats when people change their minds. But the airlines want to make money hand over fist on the no shows - make more on their refundable tickets AND oversell seats. So, now, they've been caught w/the pants down and I'm glad it's making the news so people can push back and get them back into some reasonable zone on how much they overbook and what they feel is reasonable as a response.
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Post by elaine on Apr 11, 2017 0:07:16 GMT
this was almost our situation 2 weeks ago. flying united, out of O'Hare, to new Orleans. I booked this flight over a year ago, and when I chose seats they were in the middle of the plane. then 2 mos ago they change the departure time, and must've changed planes too, cuz we were in the very last row. there were notices on the departure board that the plane was overbooked, they needed 2-3 people to volunteer to get bumped. this was an 11am flight. they could get one person out at 8pm, 1 out at 1am, and they didn't know when for the third. so we all board the plane and figure it's fine. then they say they had to add more fuel and we are overweight, we need 2-3 people to get off. no one volunteers. they are offering $800 credit. they announce again in 10 minutes, no one gets up. finally a different, very blunt woman comes on and tells us 2 people need to get off or they will start bumping random people or cancel the flight. I bet it was the same woman who announced on this flight, the reported words were almost verbatim what she said. time goes by and thankfully 2 passengers volunteered. :/ That's what happens when no one pushes the issue. The airlines just keep doing it over and over because it's more profitable to them than up'ing the ante to get people to voluntarily come off the plane. So, I'm grateful this guy exposed this disgusting practice. I read somewhere in one of the many articles on this that's come out today that some flights are overbooked by as much as 40%. That should be ILLEGAL. I know they might want to overbook by a certain percentage to not have empty seats when people are buying refundable - on the other hand, those refundable tickets are WAY more expensive, partly to cover the potential empty seats when people change their minds. But the airlines want to make money hand over fist on the no shows - make more on their refundable tickets AND oversell seats. So, now, they've been caught w/the pants down and I'm glad it's making the news so people can push back and get them back into some reasonable zone on how much they overbook and what they feel is reasonable as a response. I used to live in Eugene, OR and I can't tell you how many times flights were cancelled to either Portland or Eugene because it was more profitable to United to cancel a flight than to put the airplane in the air with less than 80% of the seats taken.
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Post by kellybelly77 on Apr 11, 2017 0:07:57 GMT
I just read that Congress is now involved. The senior member of the Transportation committee has called for a congressional hearing into this and the practice of overbooking. United's bad day just got demonstrably worse.
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