Do you think poor people are entitled to frivoulous wants?

I come at this from a different perspective. A relative, who has psychiatric problems as well as medical problems, cannot work or live alone and has been declared disabled so that he qualifies for Supplemental Security Income, Medicaid, and food stamps. (He had to be declared disabled by Social Security before he could qualify for Medicaid.) He lives with us, and, 5 years ago, his pharmacy costs alone ran to over $700 a month; I'm not sure what they would be now. Without any income, he was unable to afford the life-saving medications, so enrolling in Medicaid was a big blessing. The SSI income (predetermined according to a fixed schedule for a single male) and the food stamps were a bonus. There has been a cost of living increase each year.

But, here's the thing: because of his psychiatric problems and personality, he won't spend any money on himself! He has just enough clothes to get by from one laundry day to another (we insist that he wear fresh clothing every day), and he refuses to buy anything new unless the old piece is in tatters (and, even then, it's a battle). He certainly won't buy any luxury items, not even a more comfortable chair, not to mention a magazine or a movie ticket. He does pay for his food (I shop and cook, he reimburses), but he doesn't pay us for living in our home or for utilities or transportation to doctor appointments, so he has very few expenses beyond his medical needs.

We can't ask Social Security and the Dept of Social Services to adjust (downward) his monthly benefits; they can't do that. It's not individualized according to exact need and circumstances. If his bank balance is over $2000, they will stop the benefits, so the surplus cash piles up at home. (I know, I know, you wish you had this problem!)

My husband and I want to take a trip to visit our adult kids, who live in another state. It would be a week's vacation, and we'd need to stay in a hotel. Since my relative is now "part of the family" (and we encouraged him to think that), we'd like him to come with us; otherwise, arrangements for his care that week would be complicated. We would use the cash that he has accumulated at home for his airfare, hotel, restaurants, etc. From the discussion above, I get it that many people would think he's not entitled to use his money for such a "luxury." But according to the rules and regs, he's allowed to use the money for travel, food, and recreation, among other things. So ... is it wrong to take him with us on the trip?

Conversations like this remind me reasons I hate to make/write policies and changed careers.

I worked in a non-government funded local food pantry for three years. We subscribed to the shopping method of food selection meaning each person we served got the opportunity to "shop" our shelves just like people going to the grocery store.

It appalled me to hear donors suggest that we should pack boxes for our clients instead of giving them choices about the foods they could receive.

The lack of money already limits a persons choices in so many ways. If we could let them be in control of a simple thing like what foods they wanted to receive, why wouldn't we want to give them?

I think if you are so "poor" that you require assistance, you should make choices that do not include "over the top" types of wants.  I do not mean that you are not entitled - just that you should make different choices.  In fact, I think most people do.  When I was on food stamps as a newly divorced mom going to school, I did not even have money to save for anything big.  Splurges were shoes for the kids.

I do think that it is much more egregious to gossip about your neighbor and/or to have hardline, judgmental attitude towards "people like this" than for poor people to have "frivolous wants."

I also want to point out that many times people who are obviously "poor" or obviously in need receive much more shows of generosity than you might imagine.

I know a few people living in public housing and using other forms of public assistance and it both amazes me and warms my heart to see how much people will try to give to them and do for them, particularly the kids.

I know one little girl has been taken on several trips that my own kids have never experienced yet, because someone did that for them.



Now a trip is a big expense and probably happens a lot less often, but gifts of cash, electronics, etc. do happen all of the time, so people with little to no income can have nice things without spending "our hard-earned tax dollars" on them and without coming to own them by illegal means.


I know it's easy to vilify people on assistance, but some people out there actually like or even love those people and want to do nice things for them.

I am a frugal Betty. When my dh and I started our family, I stayed home and we had next to no money. My dh was just starting his career, and we lived in a small house with 11% interest rates. We never did anything fun, nor bought anything frivolous. We were not on any assistance, but we bought what we needed second hand or not at all. If I would have come in to some money, I would have saved it vs spending it on a vacation, etc. That's just me. I desire financial freedom over stuff. Today, I have way more money than I need, but I still don't spend it willy nilly. I second guess almost every large purchase.

I realize that I am unique, and most people do not think as I do. I say if you can afford it, do it...but I also think that vacations are not a right, so if you are taking government money and you have enough left over to go on a vacation, you are getting too much assistance. Welfare is designed to keep you whole (fed/sheltered/clothed) and not to make you a profit.

If you are 100% self supporting and not behind on bills then why not enjoy a vacation that you've worked hard to earn? However, if you're on any type of government assistance and/or behind on bills then it's not right. I don't pay taxes so that I can help fund your cruise. Also, when you don't pay your bills the the rest of us get punished w/higher rates. So, if you are a dishwasher and work hard, but are self sufficient then go and enjoy and know you've earned it. Otherwise, NO!

Those who are saying it's your dime that is paying for their cruise or vacation, just how is it your dime? Not everyone who gets food stamps get cash assistance. Not everyone who qualifies for low income housing is getting cash assistance. And if they are getting food stamps, it doesn't mean they're getting thousands of dollars a month for food. I was on food stamps for a couple years before I met DH and working very part time and going to school. I did not get a dime in any other assistance. Food stamps was around $300 a month. If I ran out, I ran out. It's not easy. Does that mean it was your dime that paid for my little trip to Mackinac Island one summer? No. Actually, it was my parents who paid for that.

People shouldn't assume that just because someone is going on a trip, that they're paying for it. Maybe they got a really good deal. Maybe it was a gift. Maybe, maybe, maybe.

And yes, even "people like that" can have frivoulous wants. Everyone can have all the selfish, silly, frivoulous wants they want to have. Everyone will find a way to get what they want, even if it means saving all of their change for a few years and going into (or further into) debt for it. DH and I are comfortable. We have wants. We want a baby but we just cannot justify going into debt for one right now. We want to take the kids to Universal Studios but again, cannot justify the cost when we have more important wants and needs. I really hate it when people assume that just because you are on assistance, you do not deserve to live in a safe, clean house, cannot have nice clothes or look good or even drive a decent car. You do not know how someone got that new car. My cousin is on assistance thanks to her son's deadbeat Dad. She got my grandmother's car when she was no long allowed to drive. It wasn't a beater but it wasn't a brand new one either. She was getting highlights on a regular basis because she was trading babysitting for them from a mom in her neighborhood who was working as a hairdresser. Same with her fancy nails. In no way was your "dime" paying for that. She went to CO and AZ many times to visit her brothers. Her parents and my grandmother paid for those plane tickets. Not you.

I pay taxes too. Even when I was on Medicaid. You were not paying for my $300 cruise. I qualified for benefits based on medical needs. I wasn't punishing you or taking advantage of anything.

Agree with this.  It's how I feel in the carpool line full of families getting free and reduced lunch but driving new huge pickups and SUVs, talking on their iPhones while I sit in my 2000 Accord, get no assistance from anywhere, and have my kids pack their lunch daily because we can't afford $3-4/day. And the moms are SAHMs while I work my butt off.  I'm not gonna' lie, it's very aggravating.

I wouldn't judge the cruise couple just because we don't know how the cruise was paid for and it's none of our business.  But if I knew for a fact they had their own money to cover it, even if it took them years to save for it, while accepting government assistance, I would be ticked.  

I agree with Darcy that, if they're capable of saving that much money, it should be used for something to improve their overall situation and get them off of assistance, not for a frivolous vacation.  

If someone is on food stamps and is saving money over the years because they do not have to pay for their own groceries, then no, I don't think they should be on a cruise.

Jennifer

If they're receiving food stamps, a portion of their income is NOT spent on food.  While it is not direct cash assistance, food stamps allow someone to redirect part of their income from food to another source.  In this case, a cruise.  While tax dollars aren't paying for the cruise directly, the money that is being spent on the cruise would have presumably went to food if they weren't receiving food stamps.  In the OPs scenario, the couple saved for the trip, it wasn't a gift as in your scenarios.

For what it's worth, Dh and I have been on 7 all expenses paid cruises. He earned our travel as a reward offered by his company for being one of the top producer salesperson in the country.

So ya never know how they came by the option to travel.