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Post by melanell on Aug 28, 2014 22:59:47 GMT
I asked DH about his opinion and he wondered what people would want this person to do with the saved money. He brought up how it's popular these days for the advice to be given to folks to save money rather painlessly by eliminating minor "treats" from their spending, such as the "$5.00 latte".
So say Lana Walker typically meets her friend for a fancy coffee and a baked good once a week, spending $10.00 each time. And say she gets a basic manicure once a month for $20.00. And she has her hair cut every other month for $25.00.
Many peas felt small treats were fine, and most would agree that a haircut is worth spending money on.
So say she stops the manicures and meets up with her friend elsewhere, each bringing a coffee from home. She also takes up a relative on their offer to cut her hair. After a full year she has saved just over $900.00.
What should she do with that money that would appease those who do not feel she should have a vacation?
She cannot ask the state to let her skip her food stamps for a few months. It doesn't work like that. And she isn't making any more money, so her circumstances for food, rent, medical care won't be any different. Saving $900 over the course of a full year is very nice. But it doesn't mean you can now do without any of that assistance. It just means you did without things most people take for granted for a year.
If she buys food with it, the foodstamps will still be loaded on her card each month. If she buys clothing with, the cash assistance check will still arrive each month. It won't change that she is receiving tax dollars.
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Post by moretimeplease on Aug 28, 2014 23:01:50 GMT
Lots of posters above have hit this point already, but "government assistance" comes into play at every level of income along the spectrum. From tax loopholes to welfare. You really can't be outraged about one and give a pass to the others. Society/government/whoever does their best to put rules, regulations, and laws into place to determine eligibility. Do these rules etc catch every cheat? Heck no! But their purpose is to make the decisions objective rather than subjective. I tell clients at work that there is no way possible for me to determine whose "emergency" is more important, and that's why we have to follow the guidelines. Trying to determine who is "deserving" and who isn't is not up to me as a fellow human being. If someone meets the eligibility guidelines, I harbor no resentment.
That's not to say I'm never judgmental though...I DO have a problem with people (& corporations) attaining eligibility thru dishonest means. Kinda makes my blood boil. I send my share of fraud referrals to the county attorney's office, that's for sure!
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compeateropeator
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Post by compeateropeator on Aug 28, 2014 23:21:28 GMT
How about if the scenario is that you are a middle income family that has a child that has medical problems and you are getting government assistance - be it cash, counseling, aids at school, special equipment to help, or whatever, should you be allowed to take a vacation?
You could really put that vacation money towards those other expenses.
The only difference is what people consider "government assistance".
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Post by anxiousmom on Aug 28, 2014 23:30:58 GMT
Having worked in a social service office, I think that the number of people who think that there are those who cheat the system FAR outnumber the people who are actually cheating the system.
It is entirely possible to own nice things and still receive some type of assistance, people fall on hard times. Outward appearances do not always tell the whole story. The myth of the welfare cheat is fairly prevalent and everyone seems to know someone, but the fact is that is not easy to do so. There are those who cheat at all levels of the socio-ecnomic spectrum (commodities fraud anyone?) There are checks and balances, and while it is possible to milk the system, it just isn't that easy. In Florida, cash assistance is limited in time (60 months) and regardless of family size is capped at something less than $400/month for the largest families. The cash assistance program is intended to pay for what food stamps do not cover (e.g. paper and hygiene products etc.) Once the time limit has been reached, you are done for life. Additionally, while receiving cash assistance, participants have to either be working, participating in job readiness activities or in short term training FULL TIME and there are offices full of people who monitor, follow and double check to make sure that this is happening.
Now, I get that we are talking about food stamps, but the principal of cheating the system still applies. It just isn't happening as much as people think it is. It just doesn't.
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Post by Scrapper100 on Aug 28, 2014 23:32:58 GMT
I am bugged by the " people like them" comment that is just really insulting. The man is working hard and trying to earn a living and should be respected for that. But that aside no I don't think someone on public assistance should go on a cruise. If it was a prize or a gift ok but if they have enough left over to save hundreds it should go for something else they need something that will help get them off of assistance. Shouldn't that be the goal to get off of assistance ASAP. I know very judgrmental but well it doesn't make sense for someone to basically use food stamps to supplement their income so they can do fun things.
I have know people that were on assistance and bettered themselves and it was temporary and used the way it was supposed to And then seen those that abuse have system and made monthly or more trips to Disneyland they had annual passes but it was still over 100 a month even if they took all their own food just for gas and parking plus extras as I know they went to trade pins and bought the special one every month plus the cost of passes. This was many years ago so passes were maybe half what they are today but seriously. If they had over 100 each month for this plus passes they shouldn't be getting food stamps. I understand wanting a few extras but when you see people on assistance going to Disney monthly and out to lunch and Starbucks multiple times a week there is something wrong with the system.
I would rather see those that truly need help get more per month vs seeing abusers get anything.
Work more jobs and pay off debt and try and better yourself. There are places you can take classes to help get a better job. No one is meant to work minimum wage forever. Is it easy no but that is just the way it is. Most young people have to work more than one job. I know I did, was it fun, no but it was the only way I knew to pay the bills and better myself. If you use assistance fine but do everything you can to improve your life while on it so that you can get off of it. Everyone should want to do better than living on assistance or living on minimum wage but it is hard and I respect those that work hard to better themselves. I don't look down on people that do these jobs don't get me wrong. If I see someone working hard I always think they are trying and that us what counts.
The people I know that worked their butts off while on assistance are some if the best people I know. They now have good jobs and have degrees. They aren't rich but they have jobs and are happy. It took them longer to graduate but they did it and appreciate the degree a lot more than those whose mommy or daddy paid their way. Those are the ones that never appreciate anything they have and constantly think someone should give them something.
If someone goes to Starbucks once s month that is one thing but going on a cruise even if it took a year to save up is wrong.
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Post by mdoc on Aug 28, 2014 23:33:53 GMT
I don't care what anyone spends his or her own money on. I do care, to some extent, what they spend government assistance money on. I long ago resigned myself to the fact that I have zero control over where my substantial tax dollars go, so I don't worry about it.
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Post by Scrapper100 on Aug 28, 2014 23:36:02 GMT
How about if the scenario is that you are a middle income family that has a child that has medical problems and you are getting government assistance - be it cash, counseling, aids at school, special equipment to help, or whatever, should you be allowed to take a vacation? You could really put that vacation money towards those other expenses. The only difference is what people consider "government assistance". To me that is a bit different than someone on welfare or food stamps. Totally different. Kids are supposed to get what they need for an education that is just part of what the state is supposed to do. Everyone is entitled to an education. On the other hand you are expected to feed yourself.
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Post by Scrapper100 on Aug 28, 2014 23:54:34 GMT
I asked DH about his opinion and he wondered what people would want this person to do with the saved money. He brought up how it's popular these days for the advice to be given to folks to save money rather painlessly by eliminating minor "treats" from their spending, such as the "$5.00 latte". So say Lana Walker typically meets her friend for a fancy coffee and a baked good once a week, spending $10.00 each time. And say she gets a basic manicure once a month for $20.00. And she has her hair cut every other month for $25.00. Many peas felt small treats were fine, and most would agree that a haircut is worth spending money on. So say she stops the manicures and meets up with her friend elsewhere, each bringing a coffee from home. She also takes up a relative on their offer to cut her hair. After a full year she has saved just over $900.00. What should she do with that money that would appease those who do not feel she should have a vacation? She cannot ask the state to let her skip her food stamps for a few months. It doesn't work like that. And she isn't making any more money, so her circumstances for food, rent, medical care won't be any different. Saving $900 over the course of a full year is very nice. But it doesn't mean you can now do without any of that assistance. It just means you did without things most people take for granted for a year. If she buys food with it, the foodstamps will still be loaded on her card each month. If she buys clothing with, the cash assistance check will still arrive each month. It won't change that she is receiving tax dollars. Can she save it for an emergency or put if toward something like a class that will enable her to get a better job. I understand not bring able to go on and off food stamps. Also I doubt someone on assistance would really have that much extra money a month. I would assume most if on assistance would love to be able to just cut out those treats and actually have that kind of extra money. I know I didn't while I was on college. I didn't know anyone that was getting a manicure that's for sure.
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azredhead
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Post by azredhead on Aug 29, 2014 0:08:29 GMT
I think that it depends on the assistance and how they use or abuse it.Everyone should be allowed to enjoy good things even when going through different struggles financially. But it is hard when their is a constant need for dependency on others. I try very hard to do as much as we can on our own. It's hard to explain unless you're in that position so I don't judge. It also helps to enjoy good things when struggling to make things bearable. But I also know that even the disability system is very abused. It was a long hard legal battle. I have worried about this very thing from time to time with my heart condition that has put me on disability. Most days are good, other days, I can't get off the couch. If i do a lot it takes me several days to get strength back. I still enjoy time with my family ,short trips etc to see family , (most of the time my mom has paid for our trip- it's only been in the last year or so that we've been able to start doing our own trips and enjoy breathing room and a few extra and upgrades. DH still works, so my disability is not my sole income. . We have been at rock bottom. It is better now as we have been able to save and pay off much debt, for now both my health and finances. Or I guess i should say stable. There have been many times where I worry I have to explain myself .
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Post by melanell on Aug 29, 2014 0:14:15 GMT
I asked DH about his opinion and he wondered what people would want this person to do with the saved money. He brought up how it's popular these days for the advice to be given to folks to save money rather painlessly by eliminating minor "treats" from their spending, such as the "$5.00 latte". So say Lana Walker typically meets her friend for a fancy coffee and a baked good once a week, spending $10.00 each time. And say she gets a basic manicure once a month for $20.00. And she has her hair cut every other month for $25.00. Many peas felt small treats were fine, and most would agree that a haircut is worth spending money on. So say she stops the manicures and meets up with her friend elsewhere, each bringing a coffee from home. She also takes up a relative on their offer to cut her hair. After a full year she has saved just over $900.00. What should she do with that money that would appease those who do not feel she should have a vacation? She cannot ask the state to let her skip her food stamps for a few months. It doesn't work like that. And she isn't making any more money, so her circumstances for food, rent, medical care won't be any different. Saving $900 over the course of a full year is very nice. But it doesn't mean you can now do without any of that assistance. It just means you did without things most people take for granted for a year. If she buys food with it, the foodstamps will still be loaded on her card each month. If she buys clothing with, the cash assistance check will still arrive each month. It won't change that she is receiving tax dollars. Can she save it for an emergency or put if toward something like a class that will enable her to get a better job. I understand not bring able to go on and off food stamps. Also I doubt someone on assistance would really have that much extra money a month. I would assume most if on assistance would love to be able to just cut out those treats and actually have that kind of extra money. I know I didn't while I was on college. I didn't know anyone that was getting a manicure that's for sure. I hear you. But since various peas said they would be okay with things like that I included those items.
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Post by redayh on Aug 29, 2014 0:26:10 GMT
Everyone deserves to have a good time once in a while. Even the dirt poor. I don't even mind chipping in a dollar or two of my tax money.
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NYCPea
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Post by NYCPea on Aug 29, 2014 0:52:39 GMT
I don't think it's any of my business.
I've found it more beneficial to focus on making my own life better rather than worry about who may or may not be cheating the system. I haven't walked in their shoes and chance are I don't know their entire story.
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compeateropeator
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Post by compeateropeator on Aug 29, 2014 1:03:09 GMT
I agree to a certain extent - but then change that to one of the adults having medical problems (or whatever) and receiving assistant of sorts. Those children also grow up and become adults - does the assistance stop because they are no longer children? Probably not. I guess what I am trying to say is that the perception of what is considered government assistance seems to be determined by what your assistance is called and what your income level is. And those in the lower income levels sometimes seemed to be held to different standards than others. For someone working a low paying job and receiving some assistance, that may be all that they are able to achieve in life. Everyone does not have the opportunity or ability to better themselves in life. You always hear the stories where people say "my relative had nothing, and with nothing but hard work they are now living the high life". Well for every one of those stories I bet there are many that worked just as hard, scrimped just as much, and tried just as hard - but it did not make a difference. I would not have any ill will for someone who was working a low paying job and receiving some assistance who saved and went on a trip of a lifetime. And I certainly would not be saying that since they are receiving assistance they are taking that trip on "my dime". My dime pays for a lot of things for a lot of people, and I guarantee that it is not only the low income people who I am helping. I want to emphasize that I have no problem with my tax dollars funding programs (I would probably be considered one of those liberals ) for those who need it whether they earn 1000.00 a year or 100,000.00 a year - we all need help sometimes. I do however have a problem with those who think that only those on foodstamps or welfare are the only people receiving assistance and especially when they hold them to a higher expectation than others.
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Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 29, 2014 1:03:27 GMT
It's sort of mind boggling to me that there are many posters who are saying they have no problem with someone on assistance treating themselves every so often to an occasional splurge, but somehow it's NOT okay to skip all of those splurges, save that $5-$10 over time, and use those saved monies on what is most likely a once-in-a-lifetime experience. I really don't see the difference there. There were also a few comments that those funds should be used to better their circumstances and get off assistance. Can some of these posters share how this could be achieve with, let's just say, a modest budget of $1,200. In the grand scheme of one's life, what is $1,200 going to do to pull them out of poverty? It's a drop in the bucket for things like further education. I'm not trying to be snarky, but I'm not connecting the dots here. If it (I'm assuming here) took them several years to amass that small fund, how does that $25/month make a life-changing difference for someone on public assistance? $1,200 isn't really a drop in the bucket to pull someone up from being a dishwasher. There are many vocational programs offered at community colleges which would be quite a bit less than $1,200. A dishwasher is truly one of the lowest paid jobs - making around $18,000 a year working FULL TIME. It's a tough, tough job. One isn't going to obtain a 4 year degree with $1,200, but that might be able to obtain some vocational training and obtain a job above minimum wage.
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Post by straggler on Aug 29, 2014 1:11:10 GMT
melanell...can I please be Lana Walker? I have never been on public assistance, but neither have I lived a lifestyle where I felt I could spend $10 every week on a fancy coffee and a baked good, have a basic manicure every month for $20 and a haircut every other month costing $25! All that and food stamps too, sounds like she's got a great thing going! I think I want some of that!
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mallie
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Post by mallie on Aug 29, 2014 2:18:09 GMT
How about if the scenario is that you are a middle income family that has a child that has medical problems and you are getting government assistance - be it cash, counseling, aids at school, special equipment to help, or whatever, should you be allowed to take a vacation? You could really put that vacation money towards those other expenses. The only difference is what people consider "government assistance". Right. I know a woman here in town who has two profoundly disabled daughters. They both got full-time aides five days a week up until the age of 21 through the school district. I know that she took at least one vacation a year. Should she instead have used that vacation money to pay back the city for the cost of those aides? Should I resent her for taking that vacation when it's my taxes that help pay for her daughters' aides? Or when my father sold a home after the age of 55, he was exempt from paying capital gains tax on it. Should he have insisted on paying the tax anyway? Should I not take a tax deduction for my charitable contributions or for my dependent children? Those deductions are essentially government subsidies to give me more money in pocket. We ALL get government subsidies in one form or another. And the biggest recipients are corporations. It's always been a curiosity to me that the government subsidies that make people angriest are giving poor people food and welfare.
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jayfab
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Post by jayfab on Aug 29, 2014 2:23:28 GMT
I haven't read all the replies, but I'm going to stick my opinion in on this:
I don't think its anyone's business what someone does with their money. Bottom line, people who are receiving assistance are doing so because the law states that they are eligible.
It perplexes me that some people take issue with someone getting a pittance of government assistance and having the nerve to want to enjoy a few nice things in life (cell phone, internet, etc.) but yet they have no problem subsidizing huge corporations that use loopholes to get out of paying ANY taxes and yet they rake in billions in profits.
My other issue is with people who rail against the so-called welfare queens and vote against social safety nets, all while taking advantage of those same programs themselves.
(I can already feel the flames touching my butt...lol)
No flames here. I just read an interesting article about how much anticipation of "something" benefits our health. Can you "general you" imagine never having anything to look forward to. What a dismal exsistance. I am realizing how judgmental and jealous people have become. Everyone should walk in someone else's shoes for a while. And nowadays I honestly don't think internet or cell phones are just "nice" things. They are pretty much a necessity.
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jayfab
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Post by jayfab on Aug 29, 2014 2:24:35 GMT
It's sort of mind boggling to me that there are many posters who are saying they have no problem with someone on assistance treating themselves every so often to an occasional splurge, but somehow it's NOT okay to skip all of those splurges, save that $5-$10 over time, and use those saved monies on what is most likely a once-in-a-lifetime experience. I really don't see the difference there. There were also a few comments that those funds should be used to better their circumstances and get off assistance. Can some of these posters share how this could be achieve with, let's just say, a modest budget of $1,200. In the grand scheme of one's life, what is $1,200 going to do to pull them out of poverty? It's a drop in the bucket for things like further education. I'm not trying to be snarky, but I'm not connecting the dots here. If it (I'm assuming here) took them several years to amass that small fund, how does that $25/month make a life-changing difference for someone on public assistance? Well said!
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Post by stampbooker on Aug 29, 2014 2:33:23 GMT
It's sort of mind boggling to me that there are many posters who are saying they have no problem with someone on assistance treating themselves every so often to an occasional splurge, but somehow it's NOT okay to skip all of those splurges, save that $5-$10 over time, and use those saved monies on what is most likely a once-in-a-lifetime experience. I really don't see the difference there. There were also a few comments that those funds should be used to better their circumstances and get off assistance. Can some of these posters share how this could be achieve with, let's just say, a modest budget of $1,200. In the grand scheme of one's life, what is $1,200 going to do to pull them out of poverty? It's a drop in the bucket for things like further education. I'm not trying to be snarky, but I'm not connecting the dots here. If it (I'm assuming here) took them several years to amass that small fund, how does that $25/month make a life-changing difference for someone on public assistance? $1,200 isn't really a drop in the bucket to pull someone up from being a dishwasher. There are many vocational programs offered at community colleges which would be quite a bit less than $1,200. A dishwasher is truly one of the lowest paid jobs - making around $18,000 a year working FULL TIME. It's a tough, tough job. One isn't going to obtain a 4 year degree with $1,200, but that might be able to obtain some vocational training and obtain a job above minimum wage. Not everyone has the mental or intellectual capacity to move beyond a dishwasher. Julie
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Post by Karenina on Aug 29, 2014 3:02:35 GMT
Everyone deserves to have a good time once in a while. Even the dirt poor. I don't even mind chipping in a dollar or two of my tax money. I agree. I grew up middle class. Then my father had a serious accident and we were dirt poor, almost lost the house. My mom went back to work and we had nothing special for a few years. My parents did not spend a dime on anything fun, even at Christmas. We were broke broke broke. But we were close and I was loved, very much loved. The best present I have ever received is a toy I got one of those Christmases. A blue matchbox car with Minnie Mouse fixed inside, I didn't think I would get anything that year except for maybe some clothes or a backpack. I was so happy with that car. I keep looking for it on Ebay but no luck. Should my parents have not gotten me that because we also stood in line for a turkey dinner? Should they have saved the .99 cents? People from church gave me cool hand-me-downs - like Jordache jeans and a rainbow shirt My mom and dad worked hard through those times and are very well off today, they live in that same house and my dad remodeled it to be awesome. Maybe I am a softy, but I don't care if a poor person spends some money on something fun. The memory could be their Minnie Mouse Matchbox car. ETA: OM! I found the car! Minnie Mouse Matchbox car
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Post by originalvanillabean on Aug 29, 2014 3:05:42 GMT
As my neighbor says, "not for me to judge". Too many details are unknown.
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Post by Linda on Aug 29, 2014 3:29:25 GMT
If they are working poor (and if he's employed as a dishwasher...) they may be eligible for the EIC. It's been many years (Praise be to God) since I've been eligible but if I'm remembering correctly, you have the option of receiving a little extra in the paycheque each week or claiming it as a refund at tax time. Depending on their income, deductions, circumstances, they may well get enough refunded at tax time to pay for a cruise (depending on cost - I live in Florida and while I wouldn't call a cruise cheap, it can be a relatively inexpensive vacation when you don't have to factor in airfare or food and sundries and you get the cheap off-season rate on an interior room).
I was on food stamps and my son was on SSI (income based assistance for those with disabilities) and Medicaid yet I sent him to a private (Catholic)) school for Kindergarten. I'm sure there are those who would judge me for that. My mum bought his uniforms; I volunteered at the school (ran the before school program) in exchange for a half-tuition scholarship and I scrimped and saved every penny to make it happen (and my share of tuition was about $700 for the year - roughly two months rent for me at that time). It was worth it to me to have him in a classroom with 13 students/3 adults not 25+ students/1 adult plus I worked across the street from the school and his teacher was willing to walk him across the street to me after school if I couldn't take my break at dismissal time.
We all make choices and as long as those choices are legal, then who are we to judge other people's choices.
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Post by lucyg on Aug 29, 2014 3:39:24 GMT
What we as a nation spend on food stamps is such a pittance that I'm not going to worry about a few people who might be abusing the system. We spend much, much more taking care of rich, powerful people than we do poor people.
I also want to repeat what some others have said ... that not everyone is capable of "bettering" themselves and getting off of minimum wage. A few hundred dollars in food assistance makes their lives so much better and isn't going to break the Romneys of the world or even the lucyg's.
And telling people to get a second job isn't always practical. If you're a single parent, you probably have to pay for child care when you're at work. It ain't cheap and it's probably eating up most of a small paycheck. After-hours child care is astronomical. What's more, your children need some attention from you, not a sitter, from time to time.
I will say that if I were getting public assistance, I would not want to go on a cruise or make any big, showy purchases ... even if I had painstakingly saved the money, or someone else was paying for it. It would feel inappropriate. But since I don't know everyone else's backstory, I'm not going to worry about how others spend their money.
BUT I do want to respond to the question several others have asked here ... what can a poor person do with that $1000ish they may have saved up by never spending a frivolous penny that would help propel them out of poverty? In addition to the suggestion above about taking a class, I do think $1000 can go a long way toward changing someone's life.
This person could start a micro business with $1000 and slowly grow it into something bigger.
She could use the money to launch herself into an actual job. When you are dirt poor, if you do find a good job, you need appropriate clothing, day care, transportation ... weeks before you ever see a paycheck. $1000 would give you that opportunity you might otherwise have to pass by because it just isn't practical for you.
$1000 might make a down payment on a used car that you can use to get to work.
$1000 would make a good cushion, literally money in the bank, against the time your beater car breaks down, you lose your minimum wage job, you have to move unexpectedly, you have any emergency that can throw you right back into grinding poverty when you were just starting to pull yourself out.
I don't think it would be such a bad idea to hold onto $1000 rather than spend it on a cruise.
But bottom line, it's not my money and they get to decide. Not me.
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Post by smokey2471 on Aug 29, 2014 4:04:43 GMT
I think you should be saving all your extra money to be able to get off assistance not go on a cruise. At some times in my life I struggled to make it paycheck to paycheck. I saved money but I saved it to better my situation not go on expensive vacations.
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MaryMary
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Post by MaryMary on Aug 29, 2014 4:13:42 GMT
My sister lives in our basement with her 4 kids. She receives food stamps and several other forms of assistance. There have been times over the years that I have been frustrated by how she spends her money when she purchases things that I feel are luxury items, rather than needs.
But, now I ask myself, "Would I want to trade lives with her?". And the answer is always no, and so my annoyance is quickly forgotten.
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jenkate77
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Jun 26, 2014 1:33:16 GMT
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Post by jenkate77 on Aug 29, 2014 4:48:21 GMT
I think it's hard for people who are struggling to pay their bills and pay taxes to not resent someone on public assistance talking about "fun" money. If you feel like it's hard to make ends meet, and you hear about someone who is receiving help with food, but is then able to save enough for a cruise, it's hard to not feel like perhaps they should put that towards their food purchase and not rely so heavily on others. I think that's it. We are not on public assistance, and we're not "poor" but money is tighter right now after 15 years of marriage than it has been in a long time. We've had some surprise expenses and less income than we expected. (One of those surprise expenses was a baby, who we all agree is the best thing to ever happen to our family, but the $6000 expense wasn't something we planned for!) We paid a large amount in taxes, and then paid almost $4000 more in state and federal taxes in April. We didn't get a summer vacation this year, our vacation fund went to taxes. So of course I think people are entitled to spend money how they best see fit, but I think Darcy has it exactly right.
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Post by rebelyelle on Aug 29, 2014 5:01:10 GMT
What we as a nation spend on food stamps is such a pittance that I'm not going to worry about a few people who might be abusing the system. We spend much, much more taking care of rich, powerful people than we do poor people. I also want to repeat what some others have said ... that not everyone is capable of "bettering" themselves and getting off of minimum wage. A few hundred dollars in food assistance makes their lives so much better and isn't going to break the Romneys of the world or even the lucyg's. And telling people to get a second job isn't always practical. If you're a single parent, you probably have to pay for child care when you're at work. It ain't cheap and it's probably eating up most of a small paycheck. After-hours child care is astronomical. What's more, your children need some attention from you, not a sitter, from time to time. I will say that if I were getting public assistance, I would not want to go on a cruise or make any big, showy purchases ... even if I had painstakingly saved the money, or someone else was paying for it. It would feel inappropriate. But since I don't know everyone else's backstory, I'm not going to worry about how others spend their money. BUT I do want to respond to the question several others have asked here ... what can a poor person do with that $1000ish they may have saved up by never spending a frivolous penny that would help propel them out of poverty? In addition to the suggestion above about taking a class, I do think $1000 can go a long way toward changing someone's life. This person could start a micro business with $1000 and slowly grow it into something bigger. She could use the money to launch herself into an actual job. When you are dirt poor, if you do find a good job, you need appropriate clothing, day care, transportation ... weeks before you ever see a paycheck. $1000 would give you that opportunity you might otherwise have to pass by because it just isn't practical for you. $1000 might make a down payment on a used car that you can use to get to work. $1000 would make a good cushion, literally money in the bank, against the time your beater car breaks down, you lose your minimum wage job, you have to move unexpectedly, you have any emergency that can throw you right back into grinding poverty when you were just starting to pull yourself out. I don't think it would be such a bad idea to hold onto $1000 rather than spend it on a cruise. But bottom line, it's not my money and they get to decide. Not me. People make choices in life that determine their own happiness and success. The choices listed above are what someone who wants MORE could do - someone who isn't happy where they are and wants more, wants change. I also think there are valid choices (like using the money for a vacation) that other people make that align with their definition of enough, of happiness. I'm not sure I'm explaining that well, so I'll use an example - years ago when I was managing a restaurant, we had a busboy who had been working at the restaurant for years - at least a decade. When I started working there, he was in his mid-sixties. He made minimum wage plus a small tip-out from the servers and bartenders each night. His wife was a house cleaner. We live in one of the most expensive cities in the country, so I can imagine that the two of them had some sort of assistance. Anyway - he and his wife had moved to the states in their early 40's, having fled a terrible situation in their home country. They had also left their one son in their home country, as he'd just been married and didn't want to leave his wife's family to fend for themselves. Anyway - they lived a very, very simple life - he walked to work, didn't have a cell phone, wore the same old clothes that his wife patched for him, ate simple shift meals to save money on groceries, etc. etc. They both worked hard, saved what little they could, sent money home when they were able. I got to know him really well over the years. Once a year, he and his wife would go on one long weekend to the beach - it reminded him of home. For this couple, that one weekend away was a year's worth of luxuries. They spent money on NOTHING else. Should he not have taken little trip that because he had government assistance? Should he, a man in his mid-60's who did literally back-breaking work 6 days a week, not have that ONE small luxury? Furthermore, at that stage in his life, starting a business, going back to school, developing a career - none of those things mattered to him - as he would say, he was just a "tired old man" who wanted to do a good job, and go home knowing that he worked hard that day. What mattered was his simple life, free from life-threatening conflict, here in the States with his wife that he loved, in a job that he worked hard at, and in a place they felt safe. He didn't want MORE - he had enough to live a happy life. Eventually the conflicts at home died down, and his son was able to pay for his parents to go home. I remember him talking about "retiring" - how he was happy to be going home to his child and grandchildren, but that he would miss working an honest job each day. I guess what I'm saying is, you never know someone's full situation. It's not my place to say how he should "better" his life - one person's choice for a "better" life can be vastly different than the next person's. Not my place to decide what a "good" life is all about
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Post by lucyg on Aug 29, 2014 5:21:36 GMT
rebelyelle, I don't disagree with you at all. My point was only that several people scoffed at the idea that $1000 could ever be enough to be useful in escaping poverty. I think it can be very useful to someone who wants to make changes and handles the money with mindfulness and care. For someone who isn't interested in making life changes, it wouldn't be necessary.
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anniebygaslight
Drama Llama
I'd love a cup of tea. #1966
Posts: 7,402
Location: Third Rock from the sun.
Jun 28, 2014 14:08:19 GMT
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Post by anniebygaslight on Aug 29, 2014 6:30:17 GMT
I don't think we can make a judgment because we don't know the situation. ...
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Post by papercrafteradvocate on Aug 29, 2014 10:52:09 GMT
Count me as another who thinks people need to MYOB and stop judging when they really don't have all the details of a persons personal and financial life.
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