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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Aug 28, 2014 16:05:14 GMT
Do you think poor people are entitled to spend money on frivolous wants? Like going to the spa. Or on a cruise. Or a vacation. What if they saved for a long time to make that goal come to fruition? What if they have outstanding debts, like credit card bills that they are only making the minimum payment on, or even missing payments? What if they are on food stamps? Should poor people only be entitled to small frivolous purchases, like a bottle of nail polish as opposed to a vacation? Reason why I ask listed in spoiler below: I overheard a conversation between two women yesterday (they are my neighbors, I could hear them clearly over the fence).
One was telling the other that our other neighbors (a man who works as a dishwasher in a nicer restaurant and his wife) are going on a cruise, and that she could not believe that "people like that" would think they should be there with everyone else who "earned it."
I am friendly with the neighbor couple (not the gossiping women) and I do know for a fact that they have a food stamps card, because it came up in conversation before.
I'm pretty sure the gossiping women called them "people like that" because he works as a dishwasher and they are on food stamps. They are lower income, but he does earn the money he makes.
So, should qualifying for and using state benefits, along with being lower income preclude you from saving your money to use for higher end frivolous things?
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scrapaddie
Drama Llama
Posts: 5,090
Jul 8, 2014 20:17:31 GMT
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Post by scrapaddie on Aug 28, 2014 16:12:14 GMT
Sure, everyone is entitled to frivolous wants, but indulging In them comes after taking care of necessities. Why should I pay for groceries for someone who can afford a cruise?
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basketdiva
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 3,649
Jun 26, 2014 11:45:09 GMT
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Post by basketdiva on Aug 28, 2014 16:15:06 GMT
Sweetshabbyroses said exactly the way I feel. I see nothing wrong with maybe splurging on nail polish or a item of clothing now and then but a cruise- no way should I help pay for it.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 11, 2024 4:25:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 16:15:28 GMT
Sure, everyone is entitled to frivolous wants, but indulging In them comes after taking care of necessities. Why should I pay for groceries for someone who can afford a cruise? I agree with you. Just because someone is low income doesn't mean their desire for things goes away. I would hope they would make wise decisions with their money, espeically if they are being government funded, but I'm sure many people don't. I try not to judge people - I definatly don't want them judging my purchases.
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Aug 28, 2014 16:15:58 GMT
If they are on any kind of government assistance I don't think they should be going on cruises or expensive vacations. That's my "dime" they are traveling on. I do see the need for relaxation time for everyone but it should be a day at the local swimming pool or free concerts, etc. Now, if they are "poor" or in a lot of debt but NOT on any government assistance, that is their business IMHO. So, if they receive food stamps (no cash assistance), they should only enjoy free things? What if the local swimming pool has an ice cream stand, and they buy a cone for a dollar. Should they not spend that money on something they don't need? But if it is okay to spend that one dollar on ice cream, is it okay for them to save that one dollar every single time they go to the free pool? Can they save that dollar each time for ten years in a row until they have enough for a vacation?
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back to *pea*ality
Pearl Clutcher
Not my circus, not my monkeys ~refugee pea #59
Posts: 3,149
Jun 25, 2014 19:51:11 GMT
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Post by back to *pea*ality on Aug 28, 2014 16:17:23 GMT
Perhaps someone gifted them the cruise you never know.
But if they are skimming the system and taking benefits they are not entitled to they should go to jail, not on a cruise.
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Aug 28, 2014 16:18:54 GMT
Sweetshabbyroses said exactly the way I feel. I see nothing wrong with maybe splurging on nail polish or a item of clothing now and then but a cruise- no way should I help pay for it. So what if they take the money that they could have spent on nail polish, and save it instead? What if they always save those little bits of fun money, until they have enough for one big frivolous expense?
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Post by bianca42 on Aug 28, 2014 16:19:22 GMT
What you don't know is who is paying for the cruise. Did he win it because he's the best dishwasher in the world? Did his or her parents pay for the entire extended family to go on a cruise? Are they sitting through some time-share/cookware/etc sales pitch to earn the free cruise? Are they charging it on a credit card with a 25% interest rate and going to be paying for that cruise for the rest of their lives?
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Aug 28, 2014 16:20:57 GMT
If they are on any kind of government assistance I don't think they should be going on cruises or expensive vacations. That's my "dime" they are traveling on. I do see the need for relaxation time for everyone but it should be a day at the local swimming pool or free concerts, etc. Now, if they are "poor" or in a lot of debt but NOT on any government assistance, that is their business IMHO. Bold mine. So, if they are on medical assistance, too? Also, does anyone know how many people qualify for food stamps? Many. Many more than you would think. So, all the military families on food stamps should NEVER spend they money on frivolous things because it's you "dime" right?
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Post by stampbooker on Aug 28, 2014 16:21:05 GMT
I don't think we can make a judgment because we don't know the situation. They may have saved for years, putting away a couple dollars here and $5 there until they finally had enough. Little bits that wouldn't make a dent in their every day situation and grocery bill. Maybe it was a gift from relatives or someone chipped in to help them. Maybe they got a little windfall from something.
Julie
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Post by magentapea on Aug 28, 2014 16:21:12 GMT
If their day to day needs are being subsidized by anyone, then I think small indulgences are ok, but expensive vacations are a no-no. However, I would rethink my situation if cruising was, for example, the last wish of a dying person. If they are barely scraping by but have found a way to pay for the vacation themselves (and living without handouts), I have no problem with it.
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Post by anonrefugee on Aug 28, 2014 16:22:01 GMT
Maybe someone have them the special luxury? Trying not to be spoiler here...
Everyone needs relaxation, and is entitled to dream.
But as said above, I cannot support giving public funds to someone so they have discretionary income for a very expensive luxury.
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Post by scrapsotime on Aug 28, 2014 16:22:47 GMT
I'm typing this before reading the spoiler.
As someone who has been poor, no amount of saving was ever going add up to a cruise or an expensive vacation. How someone poor, by my standards, can save that much is beyond me. It took me many months of saving nickles, dimes and quarters from tips (plus some help from my parents) to buy a $75 swing set for my kids. It was there only Christmas present that year.
ETA: with this post I became a throbbing member. Whoohoo!
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Aug 28, 2014 16:23:35 GMT
I don't think we can make a judgment because we don't know the situation. They may have saved for years, putting away a couple dollars here and $5 there until they finally had enough. Little bits that wouldn't make a dent in there every day situation and grocery bill. Maybe it was a gift from relatives or someone chipped in to help them. Maybe they got a little windfall from something. Julie Exactly!
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PrettyInPeank
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,691
Jun 25, 2014 21:31:58 GMT
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Post by PrettyInPeank on Aug 28, 2014 16:24:43 GMT
I'm torn on this I guess. On the surface, I think you should take care of your needs before you can have extravagant "wants." I feel like it's taking advantage to have the government pay for your food and bills, but you still afford yourself extras. But ice cream on Fridays, or Redbox rentals, dinners out once a month wouldn't bother me for some reason. Everyone needs to live.
Where I'm torn is, what if you added up every dinner out and ice cream for a year, and it equaled to a cheap cruise? My husband and I took a 7-day cruise for just under $800 last year (inside room) after taxes and fees. So it can be done cheap if you search.
Is that fair? If they save all year and clip coupons, skip dinners out and extras, I guess I don't have a leg to stand on opinion-wise. If you are okay with them having dinner out, you should be okay with them saving for a cheap vacation.
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PrettyInPeank
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,691
Jun 25, 2014 21:31:58 GMT
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Post by PrettyInPeank on Aug 28, 2014 16:29:05 GMT
Sweetshabbyroses said exactly the way I feel. I see nothing wrong with maybe splurging on nail polish or a item of clothing now and then but a cruise- no way should I help pay for it. So what if they take the money that they could have spent on nail polish, and save it instead? What if they always save those little bits of fun money, until they have enough for one big frivolous expense? Exactly what I was thinking.
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Deleted
Posts: 0
Oct 11, 2024 4:25:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 16:29:22 GMT
I was on Medicaid due to health issues. So I guess for some I shouldn't be able to go on vacation.
Do people feel that way about those on Medicare too?
Any type of assistance at all.
I just think others need to stop worrying about everyone else and focus on themselves.
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Post by sisterbdsq on Aug 28, 2014 16:29:55 GMT
If they are on any kind of government assistance I don't think they should be going on cruises or expensive vacations. That's my "dime" they are traveling on. I do see the need for relaxation time for everyone but it should be a day at the local swimming pool or free concerts, etc. Now, if they are "poor" or in a lot of debt but NOT on any government assistance, that is their business IMHO. So, if they receive food stamps (no cash assistance), they should only enjoy free things? What if the local swimming pool has an ice cream stand, and they buy a cone for a dollar. Should they not spend that money on something they don't need? But if it is okay to spend that one dollar on ice cream, is it okay for them to save that one dollar every single time they go to the free pool? Can they save that dollar each time for ten years in a row until they have enough for a vacation? You took the words out of my mouth. Here's a scenario - - Man leaves abusive (physical and emotional) marriage (mentally ill wife) with his daughter and some clothes. He was in business with his mother and step-dad. They embezzled a boatload of money from the business. He was able to take the business over and has been rebuilding. It's going to be a long process. He had been living with the "parents", but had to move due to the money stealing and subsequent poor situation at the house. As he has a daughter, he applied for, and they receive, food benefits and medical assistance. He works VERY hard and pays for her to do all the things a normal child does. He also does all kinds of side work to make more money. Can he not go on a vacation? Should he and his child suffer and she not be able to be in the band, play softball, have nice things? can he not have a girlfriend and take her places and buy her things? Nothing for himself?
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Aug 28, 2014 16:32:52 GMT
I'm torn on this I guess. On the surface, I think you should take care of your needs before you can have extravagant "wants." I feel like it's taking advantage to have the government pay for your food and bills, but you still afford yourself extras. But ice cream on Fridays, or Redbox rentals, dinners out once a month wouldn't bother me for some reason. Everyone needs to live. Where I'm torn is, what if you added up every dinner out and ice cream for a year, and it equaled to a cheap cruise? My husband and I took a 7-day cruise for just under $800 last year (inside room) after taxes and fees. So it can be done cheap if you search. Is that fair? If they save all year and clip coupons, skip dinners out and extras, I guess I don't have a leg to stand on opinion-wise. If you are okay with them having dinner out, you should be okay with them saving for a cheap vacation.
Bold mine. And this is where I stand. If this couple has saved for years and years (which they have), and really really scrimped the very best they could, they should be able to spend their fun money on whatever they want. And I really want opinions about how people feel toward military families who qualify and receive food stamps. Should we tell those families who risk having mom or dad never come home again when going to war, "Too bad. No reunion vacation for you! You are eating on OUR DIME!" I'm sorry if I am ranting, but my breath was taken away by how cold and mean the gossiping neighbor women were. I always have to remember, "There but for the grace of God, go I."
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tiffanytwisted
Pearl Clutcher
you can check out any time you like, but you can never leave
Posts: 4,538
Jun 26, 2014 15:57:39 GMT
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Post by tiffanytwisted on Aug 28, 2014 16:33:02 GMT
Sweetshabbyroses said exactly the way I feel. I see nothing wrong with maybe splurging on nail polish or a item of clothing now and then but a cruise- no way should I help pay for it. So what if they take the money that they could have spent on nail polish, and save it instead? What if they always save those little bits of fun money, until they have enough for one big frivolous expense? I see what you're saying, but I don't think it's that simple. First of all, the likelihood that that's what they're doing is quite slim. It would take someone who is on assistance a REALLY long time to save up the little splurges long enough to afford a cruise. Possible, sure. But it doesn't seem plausible to me. And if they're getting government assistance, then in my opinion they should be saving their money so they can get off it. There a lots of things in life that I am blessed to be able to have or do. But there are plenty more that I can't have or do because we can't afford it. While the things that are out of my reach may be more expensive than the things that are out of this person's reach, the point is still the same. We can't all have everything we want. FWIW, the definition of 'poor people' needs to be clarified. Like a pp said, if we're just talking about people who can't make ends meet, are in debt, etc. then how they spend their money is their business. If it's someone receiving government aid, then I agree - why should I pay for their groceries so they can spend their money on a spa day? If the cruise/vacation/spa day was a gift, then of course none of this matters.
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Deleted
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Oct 11, 2024 4:25:50 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 16:33:15 GMT
I think your neighbour is a giant bitch, she has no idea how they paid for the cruise or how long they've gone without other things to afford it. Her use of the term 'people like that' just makes me so angry. NO ONE is beneath anyone else.
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Post by LavenderLayoutLady on Aug 28, 2014 16:35:29 GMT
So, if they receive food stamps (no cash assistance), they should only enjoy free things? What if the local swimming pool has an ice cream stand, and they buy a cone for a dollar. Should they not spend that money on something they don't need? But if it is okay to spend that one dollar on ice cream, is it okay for them to save that one dollar every single time they go to the free pool? Can they save that dollar each time for ten years in a row until they have enough for a vacation? You took the words out of my mouth. Here's a scenario - - Man leaves abusive (physical and emotional) marriage (mentally ill wife) with his daughter and some clothes. He was in business with his mother and step-dad. They embezzled a boatload of money from the business. He was able to take the business over and has been rebuilding. It's going to be a long process. He had been living with the "parents", but had to move due to the money stealing and subsequent poor situation at the house. As he has a daughter, he applied for, and they receive, food benefits and medical assistance. He works VERY hard and pays for her to do all the things a normal child does. He also does all kinds of side work to make more money. Can he not go on a vacation? Should he and his child suffer and she not be able to be in the band, play softball, have nice things? can he not have a girlfriend and take her places and buy her things? Nothing for himself? See! Exactly this! Not all those on assistance are low life lazy slugs just hoping to mooch off "your dime."
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PrettyInPeank
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,691
Jun 25, 2014 21:31:58 GMT
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Post by PrettyInPeank on Aug 28, 2014 16:35:34 GMT
So, if they receive food stamps (no cash assistance), they should only enjoy free things? What if the local swimming pool has an ice cream stand, and they buy a cone for a dollar. Should they not spend that money on something they don't need? But if it is okay to spend that one dollar on ice cream, is it okay for them to save that one dollar every single time they go to the free pool? Can they save that dollar each time for ten years in a row until they have enough for a vacation? You took the words out of my mouth. Here's a scenario - - Man leaves abusive (physical and emotional) marriage (mentally ill wife) with his daughter and some clothes. He was in business with his mother and step-dad. They embezzled a boatload of money from the business. He was able to take the business over and has been rebuilding. It's going to be a long process. He had been living with the "parents", but had to move due to the money stealing and subsequent poor situation at the house. As he has a daughter, he applied for, and they receive, food benefits and medical assistance. He works VERY hard and pays for her to do all the things a normal child does. He also does all kinds of side work to make more money. Can he not go on a vacation? Should he and his child suffer and she not be able to be in the band, play softball, have nice things? can he not have a girlfriend and take her places and buy her things? Nothing for himself? When you say "they," is that just the parents, or the man himself?
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Post by Darcy Collins on Aug 28, 2014 16:53:57 GMT
I think it's hard for people who are struggling to pay their bills and pay taxes to not resent someone on public assistance talking about "fun" money. If you feel like it's hard to make ends meet, and you hear about someone who is receiving help with food, but is then able to save enough for a cruise, it's hard to not feel like perhaps they should put that towards their food purchase and not rely so heavily on others.
We're pretty comfortable, so I can't say that I resent them stocking away their dollars for years for a trip. I wonder though that perhaps if they used those funds in a different way, they might benefit their family's financial well being as a whole and actually pull them out of needing assistance.
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Post by stampbooker on Aug 28, 2014 16:53:59 GMT
So what if they take the money that they could have spent on nail polish, and save it instead? What if they always save those little bits of fun money, until they have enough for one big frivolous expense? I see what you're saying, but I don't think it's that simple. First of all, the likelihood that that's what they're doing is quite slim. It would take someone who is on assistance a REALLY long time to save up the little splurges long enough to afford a cruise. Possible, sure. But it doesn't seem plausible to me. And if they're getting government assistance, then in my opinion they should be saving their money so they can get off it. I think you would be surprised. People can be on foodstamps without being dirt poor. However, I guess most peas would say that they should only use the EBT that need to survive and not what they qualify for. Most people are going to use all the EBT they are qualified to have. Julie
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tiffanytwisted
Pearl Clutcher
you can check out any time you like, but you can never leave
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Jun 26, 2014 15:57:39 GMT
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Post by tiffanytwisted on Aug 28, 2014 17:04:19 GMT
I'm sorry for what he's going through, but in my opinion no, he should not go on a vacation he cannot afford. There have been plenty of years my husband & I have had to choose between a home repair and a vacation and guess what? We didn't go on vacation. Can he have a girlfriend? Sure. Take her places and buy her things? Again, in my opinion, no. If you can't afford it, then you can't have it or do it.
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Post by sisterbdsq on Aug 28, 2014 17:08:32 GMT
When you say "they," is that just the parents, or the man himself? The parents. Boatloads of money. He took over the business completely (assets and liabilities) and has been paying back the business debts and trying to get things back on track.
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Post by anxiousmom on Aug 28, 2014 17:11:31 GMT
. I'm pretty sure the gossiping women called them "people like that" because he works as a dishwasher and they are on food stamps. They are lower income, but he does earn the money he makes. "People like that." So much ugliness, judgement and bigotry in that.
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Post by sisterbdsq on Aug 28, 2014 17:14:42 GMT
I'm sorry for what he's going through, but in my opinion no, he should not go on a vacation he cannot afford. There have been plenty of years my husband & I have had to choose between a home repair and a vacation and guess what? We didn't go on vacation. Can he have a girlfriend? Sure. Take her places and buy her things? Again, in my opinion, no. If you can't afford it, then you can't have it or do it. He can afford it, because he's able to save money, because he qualifies for assistance. He pays for his apartment without assistance, (which he would qualify for) and does his best to provide for his daughter. And really, do you think a good woman is going to date a guy with a daughter and no money? Not that we're all money grubbing bitches, but c'mon. Do you think he'd even WANT to date if he couldn't afford to buy her a meal or a card for her birthday?
He doesn't have a home to repair, because the exwife let it go into foreclosure. I'm sure he'd LOVE to be able to make that decision...home repair versus vacation.
I'm guessing the peas who have such a hardline have never been in a situation that warranted help.
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Post by Meri-Lyn on Aug 28, 2014 17:15:02 GMT
I'm torn on this I guess. On the surface, I think you should take care of your needs before you can have extravagant "wants." I feel like it's taking advantage to have the government pay for your food and bills, but you still afford yourself extras. But ice cream on Fridays, or Redbox rentals, dinners out once a month wouldn't bother me for some reason. Everyone needs to live. Where I'm torn is, what if you added up every dinner out and ice cream for a year, and it equaled to a cheap cruise? My husband and I took a 7-day cruise for just under $800 last year (inside room) after taxes and fees. So it can be done cheap if you search. Is that fair? If they save all year and clip coupons, skip dinners out and extras, I guess I don't have a leg to stand on opinion-wise. If you are okay with them having dinner out, you should be okay with them saving for a cheap vacation. This is where I am as well. You can get a cheap 4-day cruise, for just around a few hundred bucks. It would be about the same as taking your kids to Disney or something. If they saved up for a once in a lifetime thing, sure, what the heck! If this was something they were doing continuously, putting wants in front of needs and making other bad choices (coughcoughMyCousincoughcough), yeah, I might raise some eyebrows.
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