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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 21:56:48 GMT
Who else said it? Not being snarky, just never heard of another president saying it. Obama called Libya a shitshow. Oh come on, you know full well that's not the same thing. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 22:04:33 GMT
Sometimes people read things differently from what is (possibly) meant, and sometimes the media turns things that were said into something that fits their own agenda. So, sometimes, there are two or three different ways something that is said can be interpreted. It's opinion either way. The only one that knows what a speaker actually meant is the speaker--and in hindsight, even that can change.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 22:21:49 GMT
Sometimes people read things differently from what is (possibly) meant, and sometimes the media turns things that were said into something that fits their own agenda. So, sometimes, there are two or three different ways something that is said can be interpreted. It's opinion either way. The only one that knows what a speaker actually meant is the speaker--and in hindsight, even that can change. Whilst what you say does happen but President Obama was referring to an escalating war in Libya and the aftermath of the conflict as a shit show. Whereas Trump called African countries and Haiti as shit holes in comparison to Norway. Different context entirely IMO. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 22:23:13 GMT
Sometimes people read things differently from what is (possibly) meant, and sometimes the media turns things that were said into something that fits their own agenda. So, sometimes, there are two or three different ways something that is said can be interpreted. It's opinion either way. The only one that knows what a speaker actually meant is the speaker--and in hindsight, even that can change. Whilst what you say does happen but President Obama was referring to an escalating war in Libya and the aftermath of the conflict as a shit show. Whereas Trump called African countries and Haiti as shit holes in comparison to Norway. Different context entirely IMO. You are definitely entitled to your opinion. I think what both of them said was crap! (my opinion). |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 22:24:44 GMT
How quickly we forget. Here are just a few: "Shithole countries". Throwing rolls of paper towels at Puerto Ricans who just endured a devastating hurricane, not to mention an abominable "relief effort" for these people who pay into our federal tax system. Don't get me started on DACA. I saw with my own eyes the rolls of paper towels flung, and heard "shithole countries" with my own ears so you can just cut the "blame the media" crap. "Shithole countries" is just another example of one president saying it and... nothing. Trump says it and certain people lose their mind. The other examples, I didn't say the media makes up what we all know happened. What I said was the outrage is manufactured. They figure out a way to be upset about whatever it is (like throwing paper towels) and then report it into the ground until certain people say oh, yeah I hadn't thought about it that way, but now that you've mentioned it 750,001 times, yeah I guess that is something to consider. Something had Obama done it, wouldn't be mentioned at all or it would have had a different spin "Obama raises spirits of those who need it most right now after the hurricane, by playfully tossing out paper towels." and it would have been a fleeting thought with everyone and then specifics lost forever to another input of wonderful feelings of Obama. And the hurricane relief had so much praise from those involved that contradicted those who had an agenda. Facts came out that contradicted so much of the complaints. Ah screw it .. 2 points. Yes President Obama used the term “shit-show” in describing the escalating violence after old Muammar was killed as Snopes pointed out below. This is little difference then when a president refers to specific countries as ”shithole” countries. Just thought you would like to have the rest of the story... From Snopes... “President Obama reportedly used the term "shit show" in private to refer to the escalating violence in Libya following the death of Muammar al-Qaddafi. WHAT'S FALSE President Obama's comment was about an escalating war, not the country itself; Obama's remarks were widely reported by the media at the time. ORIGIN During an Oval Office meeting on immigration on 11 January 2018, President Donald Trump reportedly used the term “shit hole” in reference to African countries and said that he’d rather take immigrants from places like Norway. The comment was widely condemned in the media (several news anchors bluntly called the president a racist) and countries such as Botswana and Haiti released statements calling for an apology from the President of the United States. As the fury grew over Trump’s comments, some conservative web sites published articles which attempted to defend Trump and paint the media as hypocritical by pointing to a seemingly similar comment President Barack Obama made in 2016. Truth Feed News, for instance, claimed that Obama used the term “shit show” in reference to Libya and that the remark was ignored by the media:” Second point. On the local news it was announced that “The health department of San Francisco is committed to helping a town in Puerto Rico still without power and still in crisis, by providing doctors and nurses for a week.” The hurricane was 6 months ago. This is something that should only have been needed done during the first several weeks, not 6 months after the hurricane. If the relief effort was so great why is a town still without electricity and why are 15 doctors and nurses heading down to PR to help? Six months after the hurricane? These folks are American Citizens and there is no excuse for the lack of help these folks received. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 23:37:17 GMT
The only difference between Obama’s shitshow and Trump’s shithole is justification for one.
The Puerto Rico recovery:
customers hit by the blackout had their power restored by Monday. But the incident underscores the challenges of recovering from a major storm on an island with aging infrastructure. It's a reminder that the U.S. territory will probably have a longer, tougher road to recovery than other states battered by recent storms.
That aging infastructure predates Trump by decades.
As for the article citing San Juan’s mayor as proof it’s all Trump’s fault, the PR AG says otherwise and along with citizens and other officials, claim she’s not being honest. And is using this tragedy to further her aims and ambitions. Even snopes is investigating.
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Post by Skellinton on Apr 4, 2018 23:56:39 GMT
I was just addressing the person who said that Oregon has higher property taxes but no sales tax. Portland is a freaking disaster for such a large city. I just don’t think Oregon should ever be held up as a paragon or example of money well spent. I have only spent a few days in Portland, so I only saw a very small portion of the city. I did mention earlier that OR seems to do ok with lower taxes and higher property taxes, but that was based on my time spent in Southern OR. The city and state parks we visited were so clean with nice facilities (especially in the Bend area) and all the roads we drove on seemed to be very well maintained, even with the winters they have. I know not 100% of any state is going to be great, but I only mentioned OR because the areas I have visited all seemed to be using their tax money more wisely compared to CA when it came to parks and roads. We did not see as many homeless as we do here (and I'm not in what I would call a big city), but I do understand they tend to gravitate towards the larger cities like Portland. The homeless have taken over all our local parks where they are completely unusable anymore. Who wants to enjoy a nice day at the park dodging human feces and smells of urine? That is the way Portland parks are as well. The freeways are lined with homeless encampments. The downtown streets are lined with homeless people. The suburbs are getting just as bad. Bend is lovely city and completey not indicative of the rest of the state. |
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Pearl Clutcher
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Post by Nink on Apr 5, 2018 0:20:26 GMT
That party at your house the other night turned into a shit show.
Your house is a shit hole.
There is a difference.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 2:05:01 GMT
That party at your house the other night turned into a shit show. Your house is a shit hole. There is a difference. They are both disparaging. |
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Post by jenis40 on Apr 5, 2018 2:12:18 GMT
Oregon roads suck. The freeways our woefully inadequate and dangerous. Potholes are a huge problem on surface streets and when citizens try to fix them themselves (because Portland) they are arrested. Portland Public schools are nothing to be proud of. I blame that on the district office though, they haven’t had a successful superintendent in eons. They actually paid one man 300,000 just to go away. Imagine what could have been done with that money in the classroom. Property taxes in Oregon are all over the place, Portland is the biggest city but neighboring cities (and I mean cities actually next to Portland) actually have higher property taxes then their neighbors in Portland. Schools buildings in Portland have lead in the drinking water and they are taking their own sweet time fixing it. In the meantime they are paying for bottled drinking water for each contaminated building. It is absurd. Give me Washington and their sales tax any day of the week. The problem isn’t funding it is how the funds are spent. And my word, don’t get me started on the homeless problem in Portland. I'm not trying to make this a "my state sucks more than your state", but in the last few years we've traveled to neighboring states quite a bit. Every single time as soon as we cross the border, both of us comment on how much better the roads are. You don't realize how bad they are here when driving on them everyday, until you drive on a decent road. Maybe we are just getting lucky on the highways we've traveled through OR, WA (Spokane side), NV, ID and AZ but it's a noticeable difference to us. I voted against raising the gas tax and vehicle registration costs because there is no way that money will be earmarked to where we were told it is going. If money was handled in this state correctly, then they wouldn't have to keep raise taxes. I will never vote for any new tax in this state. Sorry I have to laugh at your Washington State comment - Spokane and Spokane Valley are notorious for the gigantic potholes on the surface streets. The interstate has been rebuilt over the past twelve years we’ve lived here so it’s in slightly better condition. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 2:18:24 GMT
oregon parks are nice cause they have a dedicated vehicle tax that supports them (I believe). one problem with gas taxes/road repair is that with the increase in hybrid and electric vehicles, there are more cars driving miles and not paying any or little gas tax. hey, it only took WA state over a 100 yrs to build the north cascades highway.... our city has local commissions that monitor bond funds.. to be sure that the bond money is spent wisely and on what it was promised for.. maybe the state could add such. our schools have all been upgraded to be earthquake safe, our hospitals are being rebuilt or replaced.. and all our libraries have been remodeled to be safe.. good use of my tax money. Say, you all down there should try what we all up here are doing! We're piloting this nifty-swifty thing called Pay-Per-Mile. It's a fabulous program in which they slap a GPS on your car, and you pay the low, low price of 2.4 cents per mile. It's so cool! They can track everything this way -- where you go, when you went there, how fast you did it -- why, just about everything. If you don't like the GPS idea, you can pre-pay a certain amount for a set number of miles. Or you can take pictures of your odometer. There will be new jobs, new levels of bureaucracy, the whole enchilada! I mean, it's not like we already had a system in place to pay for roads and a way to collect more money when needed. (if my sarcasm isn't obvious in the above, please know that I really think this is a shitty, intrusive, freedom-suck) |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 2:25:40 GMT
oregon parks are nice cause they have a dedicated vehicle tax that supports them (I believe). one problem with gas taxes/road repair is that with the increase in hybrid and electric vehicles, there are more cars driving miles and not paying any or little gas tax. hey, it only took WA state over a 100 yrs to build the north cascades highway.... our city has local commissions that monitor bond funds.. to be sure that the bond money is spent wisely and on what it was promised for.. maybe the state could add such. our schools have all been upgraded to be earthquake safe, our hospitals are being rebuilt or replaced.. and all our libraries have been remodeled to be safe.. good use of my tax money. Say, you all down there should try what we all up here are doing! We're piloting this nifty-swifty thing called Pay-Per-Mile. It's a fabulous program in which they slap a GPS on your car, and you pay the low, low price of 2.4 cents per mile. It's so cool! They can track everything this way -- where you go, when you went there, how fast you did it -- why, just about everything. If you don't like the GPS idea, you can pre-pay a certain amount for a set number of miles. Or you can take pictures of your odometer. There will be new jobs, new levels of bureaucracy, the whole enchilada! I mean, it's not like we already had a system in place to pay for roads and a way to collect more money when needed. (if my sarcasm isn't obvious in the above, please know that I really think this is a shitty, intrusive, freedom-suck)They are trying to pass that here in California too--even after they've put an extra tax on the gasoline and the car registration-license fees!! The license fees have almost doubled for us. Nice huh? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 2:29:09 GMT
That party at your house the other night turned into a shit show. Your house is a shit hole. There is a difference. They are both disparaging. “disparaging” - expressing the opinion that something is of little worth, derogatory. Calling the rise of violence a shit show is showing the lack of respect to whom? Or is it who? |
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Post by megop on Apr 5, 2018 2:54:31 GMT
Liberal gently wading in here to comment - hope it’s okay. I think there here are many issues where the right and the left aren’t that far apart.
I feel that with Trump’s seemingly lack of compassion, wanting the wall and his prejudices towards non Caucasians are what make his comments on immigration so different. Im also a Californian so I’ll chime in about our taxes... The liberals I know are unhappy with the current financial situation in California. I’m happy to pay taxes, in fact I have no issue with high taxes. What I’d like to see is some thought put in to where the money is spent. High vehicle and gas taxes are fine with me - but how come our roads and bridges are falling apart - let us see the benefits of our taxes -where is the money going. Taxes for schools - great - but repair the schools. I hope I didn’t overstep here. I’ve been enjoying reading this thread. Just wanted to share my thoughts.
I think you are totally right about not being that far apart in some areas. Personally, I didn't vote for Trump, but those that did vote for him, knew his personality. He IS our president, and as such, he and his family should be treated with the respect of a president of the usa. I didn't care for Obama, but never ever called him the names our current president has been called, nor disrespected him in public forums the way this president and his family have been disrespected. I am not that happy to pay more taxes, as we're retired, and on a fixed income. So, when the taxes go up, we do without something else. And then when I see where the tax money is going (bullet train as was mentioned above) and see the condition of our schools and our roads, I don't like to pay taxes again!  You didn't overstep here at all. You gave your opinion respectfully, and didn't cause a ruckus!! You are very welcome to return!! as is anybody that shares their concerns. I too, think there are so many areas that could be agreed upon if people would just talk to each other and not follow the hype of congressional or party political spew. Weighing in here to disagree a bit regarding Trump and his family deserving respect. Here is my view. The person who holds the office of POTUS must earn respect. It is not a given simply by holding the office itself. The office (meaning position, not place) is what I respect most fully. It is to be treated with care. If the person who holds that institutional office, doesn't treat it with respect, then to me, they don't deserve mine and personally, Trump oftentimes is disrespecting the very office institution he currently holds. The Presidency will be there when he is long gone. |
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Post by jlynnbarth on Apr 5, 2018 3:05:17 GMT
rry I have to laugh at your Washington State comment - Spokane and Spokane Valley are notorious for the gigantic potholes on the surface streets. The interstate has been rebuilt over the past twelve years we’ve lived here so it’s in slightly better condition. Sorry I have to laugh at your Washington State comment - Spokane and Spokane Valley are notorious for the gigantic potholes on the surface streets. The interstate has been rebuilt over the past twelve years we’ve lived here so it’s in slightly better condition. SO MUCH TRUTH! LOL Spokane Memes has some great ones about the Pot Holes. I told my Dad the other night about the one the says "Why hasn't a Marijuana store in Spokane been named The Pot Hole?"  I also saw a video on fb from another country I can't remember where and people were planting flowers in the pot holes. Downtown and lower south hill would be a giant gardens!  |
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Pearl Clutcher
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Post by Nink on Apr 5, 2018 3:13:30 GMT
rry I have to laugh at your Washington State comment - Spokane and Spokane Valley are notorious for the gigantic potholes on the surface streets. The interstate has been rebuilt over the past twelve years we’ve lived here so it’s in slightly better condition. Sorry I have to laugh at your Washington State comment - Spokane and Spokane Valley are notorious for the gigantic potholes on the surface streets. The interstate has been rebuilt over the past twelve years we’ve lived here so it’s in slightly better condition. SO MUCH TRUTH! LOL Spokane Memes has some great ones about the Pot Holes. I told my Dad the other night about the one the says "Why hasn't a Marijuana store in Spokane been named The Pot Hole?" I also saw a video on fb from another country I can't remember where and people were planting flowers in the pot holes. Downtown and lower south hill would be a giant gardens! I drive in Spokane and Spokane Valley almost daily. I concur. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 3:49:41 GMT
They are both disparaging. “disparaging” - expressing the opinion that something is of little worth, derogatory. Calling the rise of violence a shit show is showing the lack of respect to whom? Or is it who? You keep on justifying it just goes to show the only difference between Obama’s shitshow and Trump’s shithole is justification for one. You can continue dissecting it without me, I'm done with this line of justification. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 6:03:23 GMT
David Hogg calls for advertisers to punish Laura Ingraham for tweeting what David Hogg, himself said about being rejected by colleges he applied to. She apologized, but he said not good enough, that he needs to take it further. She didn't say anything hateful, racist or even wrong. Was it necessary? No, but the only objectionable thing in her statement was stating what he himself said and calling it whining. Is a boycott of her really necessary under those circumstances? I don't think so, it's extremely, almost laughably mild. Especially when contrasted to the things he has said, but he insists on continuing shutting her down. Even those generally in agreement with him are saying he's taking it too far. What is the go to boycott response to opposing viewpoints in general going to do to political discourse in this country? I completely agree with this. I just do not get it. I was going to comment a few days ago, but as usual, the thread devolved and I lost interest. She apologized and instead of acting like an adult, Hogg kept at it and refused to accept the apology. He wants to be seen and treated as an adult until being an adult is too hard. I certainly don’t think Ingraham is being the bully in this situation. I’m not going to comment on the CNN video because I think people are arguing shades of grey, and regardless of what I think, someone is going to argue. I do have a question regarding the “caravan” of people that are planning to cross our border en masse from Mexico. I watched two different news stations this morning; one covered it almost exclusively and the other didn’t mention it at all. So, which is it? The sky is falling or nothing to see here? Now that Trump is securing the border with the National Guard, they've abandoned their quest to abolish our borders and also their demand for their "right to dignified work". |
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Post by Kymberlee on Apr 5, 2018 6:20:44 GMT
I saw that on the news this morning, @mytnice . Funny what happens when we flex our muscle a bit.
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Post by cade387 on Apr 5, 2018 9:32:23 GMT
The only difference between Obama’s shitshow and Trump’s shithole is justification for one. The Puerto Rico recovery: customers hit by the blackout had their power restored by Monday. But the incident underscores the challenges of recovering from a major storm on an island with aging infrastructure. It's a reminder that the U.S. territory will probably have a longer, tougher road to recovery than other states battered by recent storms. That aging infastructure predates Trump by decades. As for the article citing San Juan’s mayor as proof it’s all Trump’s fault, the PR AG says otherwise and along with citizens and other officials, claim she’s not being honest. And is using this tragedy to further her aims and ambitions. Even snopes is investigating. There are people who still don’t have power now - 6 months later. What are you talking about?  |
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Post by cade387 on Apr 5, 2018 9:42:03 GMT
I’m fiscally conservative and I don’t find this a place to discuss those topics. No one seems to want to discuss that stuff, even here.  ETA - when I say this place, I just wanted to clarify that I mean this thread. Folks on here don’t seem to want to talk about being fiscally conservative. What would you like to discuss about it? I am open. I’d love to discuss the spending bill passed. That was ridiculous. I’d also like to acknowledge that not one person in all of Congress is able to call themselves fiscally conservative anymore. When other spending or tax cuts have been brought up it is always deflected. We see that here in this thread already. I agree that folks aren’t that far off but some people just enjoy arguing for fun? Spite? I’m not sure anymore. The tax cuts passed do not help every (or even many) American(s). The spending bill compounds that. How are we going to come back from this? I understand state and local issues are also a problem, but when you have a group of folks just making bank from lobbyists and corporations paying them off - how does the regular citizen stand a chance? Why are the republicans in charge now so against campaign finance reform? Why was citizens united a good thing? Until we stop allowing our politicians to be bought and our interests to be told to us, the spending will never stop. There is no accountability on how that money is spent. I’m disgusted by the lot of them. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 12:41:23 GMT
I am a conservative who is not at all happy with the spending bill that was passed. One of the things that frustrates me to no end is that almost no one in our government seems to understand that tax cuts mean CUT, as in GONE, not money that needs to be made up somewhere else. There is no such thing as “funding tax cuts.” Otherwise, it’s just a shell game, in which the government continues to be bloated and wasteful. So, I am very disappointed in those who passed the tax cuts (good) then turned around and passed the spending bill (bad.)
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Post by mom on Apr 5, 2018 13:43:47 GMT
What would you like to discuss about it? I am open. I’d love to discuss the spending bill passed. That was ridiculous. I’d also like to acknowledge that not one person in all of Congress is able to call themselves fiscally conservative anymore. When other spending or tax cuts have been brought up it is always deflected. We see that here in this thread already. I agree that folks aren’t that far off but some people just enjoy arguing for fun? Spite? I’m not sure anymore. The tax cuts passed do not help every (or even many) American(s). The spending bill compounds that. How are we going to come back from this? I understand state and local issues are also a problem, but when you have a group of folks just making bank from lobbyists and corporations paying them off - how does the regular citizen stand a chance? Why are the republicans in charge now so against campaign finance reform? Why was citizens united a good thing? Until we stop allowing our politicians to be bought and our interests to be told to us, the spending will never stop. There is no accountability on how that money is spent. I’m disgusted by the lot of them. The reason they voted for it is because most people are 1 and 2 issue voters. Congress is not worried about this being an issue when Election comes around. Most voters think its great to have lower taxes and to create more jobs - but what most are not thinking of is that you can't lower the deficit doing either of those things. In fact, when you do those two things, the deficit is blown out of the water. I don't know how we come back from this. I do think cuts have to come from everywhere though, and just like when my family has blown our budget, the cuts have to be deep enough to hurt. Just skimming the top won't be enough. edited to add: and lets face it: most Americans themselves don't live on a budget. So why would they expect their government to? |
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Post by LuvAgoodPaddle on Apr 5, 2018 14:33:53 GMT
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Post by cadoodlebug on Apr 5, 2018 15:37:29 GMT
I heard on the radio this morning that 1,000,000 illegals now have driver's licenses in CA. Fifteen years ago most people would have said this will NEVER happen. How many years before illegals will get to vote in CA? That is goal of the democrats in this state, getting all those votes. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 15:41:49 GMT
I am a conservative who is not at all happy with the spending bill that was passed. One of the things that frustrates me to no end is that almost no one in our government seems to understand that tax cuts mean CUT, as in GONE, not money that needs to be made up somewhere else. There is no such thing as “funding tax cuts.” Otherwise, it’s just a shell game, in which the government continues to be bloated and wasteful. So, I am very disappointed in those who passed the tax cuts (good) then turned around and passed the spending bill (bad.) Totally agree with this! When the taxes go up, we (personally) have to cut OUR budget to be able to pay the higher taxes. It seems to go that way and not the other way. |
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Post by Kymberlee on Apr 5, 2018 16:17:24 GMT
I heard on the radio this morning that 1,000,000 illegals now have driver's licenses in CA. Fifteen years ago most people would have said this will NEVER happen. How many years before illegals will get to vote in CA? That is goal of the democrats in this state, getting all those votes. This infuriates me. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2018 16:24:28 GMT
I heard on the radio this morning that 1,000,000 illegals now have driver's licenses in CA. Fifteen years ago most people would have said this will NEVER happen. How many years before illegals will get to vote in CA? That is goal of the democrats in this state, getting all those votes. This infuriates me.  |
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Post by katieanna on Apr 5, 2018 16:36:24 GMT
I heard on the radio this morning that 1,000,000 illegals now have driver's licenses in CA. Fifteen years ago most people would have said this will NEVER happen. How many years before illegals will get to vote in CA? That is goal of the democrats in this state, getting all those votes. If the democrats want the illegals then by all means, let them have them...AND let them foot the bill for them. They should be willing to put their money where their votes are. |
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Post by cadoodlebug on Apr 5, 2018 16:41:38 GMT
I heard on the radio this morning that 1,000,000 illegals now have driver's licenses in CA. Fifteen years ago most people would have said this will NEVER happen. How many years before illegals will get to vote in CA? That is goal of the democrats in this state, getting all those votes. If the democrats want the illegals then by all means, let them have them...AND let them foot the bill for them. They should be willing to put their money where their votes are. Taxpayers are paying for them, not the democrats. |
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I also saw a video on fb from another country I can't remember where and people were planting flowers in the pot holes. Downtown and lower south hill would be a giant gardens! 
