grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 13:21:17 GMT
Yes, this is my first and possibly only wedding related post. I just figure there might be someone who knows since we have such a cross section.
So (and I heavily roll my eyes here) my FH's mother wants us to "at least" be married by a priest. His family is Catholic, my family is as well but I am an atheist. He is apparently "friends" with a retired priest that he might want to do the ceremony (I'm not sure how they are friends considering the priest was never mentioned until we planned to marry). I'm pretty open to this, as long as most of the churchy stuff is taken out. We have a meeting with this priest coming up and I'm wondering if the church is even open to altering the ceremony as they have it laid out (the short version, not the long boring mass version). I'm also not interested in Catholic marriage prep, which I assume would be part of having a priest marry us.
My mom (who doesn't care who marries us as long as it makes us happy) doesn't even think that they will entertain marrying us, seeing as we won't marry in a church (we're at one location for everything) and I'm so lapsed in my Catholicness, but I am willing to go to this meeting to entertain what FH wants. I just don't want a churchy ceremony, especially not the gospel and the homily. The gospel reading is fine (or something in it's place), it's the boring homily that I can't stand particularly at a wedding where the people he's marrying are strangers. If he knew us all our lives and actually told stories, totally different. A reading from the bible (countered by a secular reading)? Sure. A prayer? Sure.
I think we're the first in his family to not marry in a church (I think this same priest has married all the couples in the family), so there's some consternation about that. I don't care, church is not a part of my life, it's rarely a part of his (he goes when family things happen and goes through the motions but that's it), so having a church wedding would in no way reflect who we are or add any kind of meaning to our wedding day.
I guess I'm wondering if we're wasting our time with this meeting and if we're better off just getting a secular officiant and calling it a day. I've been googling but I'm not coming up with the answers I need.
UPDATE (ALSO POSTED AT END OF THREAD): Well here's an update.
The Monsignor is a pompous, long winded man. I wanted to say ass, but he wasn't... just full of himself. I'm surprised that he didn't pat us on the head and give a candy for all that he sort of treated us like we were either errant little children or that we'd cutely misbehaved.
He took a long flippin' time to say no to whether or not he could come out to our ceremony... actually now that I think of it, he used every word in the dictionary other than "no". And that's fine, it's his prerogative. But trying to guilt me into becoming Catholic again by saying that the roots were there and my tree is just dormant and that the only "right" place to marry is in the church really irritated me. I think had he been less pompous, I would have found the conversation enjoyable. As it was, I found it a little offputting to be told that I'm nothing more than an errant child who knows no better and who must come back to to the church to find my "home" and "community" (or what? I will wander aimlessly for ever? Not all who wander are lost).
The conversation also caused a fight between us and a long (and unwanted) discussion about why I don't want a church wedding with his aunt. Fact is, I just don't. It doesn't mean anything to me. I feel the peace everyone wants me to feel in church when I am overlooking the water, which the location we selected does.
I had a great conversation with my mom about this whole thing yesterday, she gave me some background about our family's involvement and walking away from a parish due to the "home" and "community" not being what it should be. So I have some insight to help me explain things to his mother (who has asked to sit down to discuss/hear my point of view. Because that's not a terrifying thought).
So that's the update. I promised I would update. Thank you so much to everyone who chimed in. It gave me a lot of food for thought. Thanks.
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Post by bearmom on Feb 20, 2015 13:31:18 GMT
We got married in a Catholic Church, dh is Catholic (practicing) and I'm not. We caused quite the stir in Dh's little home town as we were the first couple married in the church without celebrating the Eucharist. The priest and Dh's mom were kinda put out, but I was adamant.
There the readings and homily, but it was short and was related to marriage, so I didn't mind that part.
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cakediva
Drama Llama
Making the world a sweeter place one cake at a time!
Posts: 7,429
Location: Fergus, Ontario
Jun 26, 2014 11:53:40 GMT
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Post by cakediva on Feb 20, 2015 13:33:35 GMT
Well, DH is not Catholic, and we married in the church. We did not have a full Mass, but there were readings and a homily (brief).
And I'm not 100% sure, but if the ceremony is not in a church, I'm thinking a priest won't do it.
One option that might be agreeable - DH's brother & his wife were not married in the church. They married in another denomination (SIL is Catholic) but when they went to have their third baby christened, they decided to do it in the Catholic church. In order to do so, they had to have their vows blessed by the Catholic church. It was super simple, DH and I went with them - the priest simply did the marriage ceremony with the two of them, in the church, with DH and I witnessing. No hoopla, just the vows.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 13:37:47 GMT
We got married in a Catholic Church, dh is Catholic (practicing) and I'm not. We caused quite the stir in Dh's little home town as we were the first couple married in the church without celebrating the Eucharist. The priest and Dh's mom were kinda put out, but I was adamant. There the readings and homily, but it was short and was related to marriage, so I didn't mind that part. There will definitely be no eucharist because we will under no circumstances do the long, drawn out version of the wedding mass. But I can see how that would be an uproar, since just saying that we're not doing the church wedding has been enough of an uproar. This family does not like challenges to their traditions, even when doing the traditions would be empty and meaningless. Well, DH is not Catholic, and we married in the church. We did not have a full Mass, but there were readings and a homily (brief). And I'm not 100% sure, but if the ceremony is not in a church, I'm thinking a priest won't do it. One option that might be agreeable - DH's brother & his wife were not married in the church. They married in another denomination (SIL is Catholic) but when they went to have their third baby christened, they decided to do it in the Catholic church. In order to do so, they had to have their vows blessed by the Catholic church. It was super simple, DH and I went with them - the priest simply did the marriage ceremony with the two of them, in the church, with DH and I witnessing. No hoopla, just the vows. I did find something that said that a priest can marry outside of the church if they get the permission of the bishop, so I can hope that this bishop is a hardass and won't go for it. The blessing thing might work, even if it would all be for show and be meaningless. I guess I'm just not happy about this interference, even though this is nothing compared to what it could be. In that sense, I am very lucky. I need to remember that.
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Post by alissa103 on Feb 20, 2015 13:41:42 GMT
If the priest is truly a friend, he might do it. You do not have to have a full mass with communion.
But most priests will want you do do the marriage prep with them before they marry you. If this priest is really a family friend, he may be fine with foregoing it, but it would be pretty rare as marriage is one of the sacraments. All of the sacraments have some sort of prep that goes before them that's sanctioned by the church. So that's going to be your biggest issue, I think.
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luckyexwife
Pearl Clutcher
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Jun 25, 2014 21:21:08 GMT
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Post by luckyexwife on Feb 20, 2015 13:42:29 GMT
It can vary heavily in different areas.
Both of my sisters were Lutheran and married Catholics. They were both married in our church, but a Catholic priest was also there, and did part of the ceremony, including some blessing. The priest wad a family friend of ours, and he agreed to do it. I have other friends that were told no to the same request when they asked (different priest and different churches ).
Good luck with your meeting!
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wellway
Prolific Pea
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Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
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Post by wellway on Feb 20, 2015 13:45:48 GMT
I'd go to the meeting and get answers direct from the source. I always get the impression that some priests are more flexible than others and until you speak directly to him you won't know how flexible he is.
At least, after the meeting you can make an informed decision. Perhaps the family and priest would be happy with a blessing?
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 13:51:04 GMT
If the priest is truly a friend, he might do it. You do not have to have a full mass with communion. But most priests will want you do do the marriage prep with them before they marry you. If this priest is really a family friend, he may be fine with foregoing it, but it would be pretty rare as marriage is one of the sacraments. All of the sacraments have some sort of prep that goes before them that's sanctioned by the church. So that's going to be your biggest issue, I think. I agree. I think some kind of marriage prep is a good idea, I just don't want the Catholic (aka religious version) because it covers a lot of stuff I just don't care about or agree with. I really have no idea how much of a friend this guy is. As I said, he was never mentioned in conversation until the wedding came up. I would have thought at his cousin's confirmation last year that this guy would have been mentioned but I have no idea. I'd go to the meeting and get answers direct from the source. I always get the impression that some priests are more flexible than others and until you speak directly to him you won't know how flexible he is. At least, after the meeting you can make an informed decision. Perhaps the family and priest would be happy with a blessing? That's ultimately what I plan on doing, I'm just trying to get a feeling for what's to come. A little bit of preparation, so to speak. That and if I get it out here, I won't have a fight with family or FH. I had no idea how much I would have to bite my tongue around his family over things that seem completely normal to me when it comes to the wedding... things like it's about us and not them (but that's a vent about traditionalists for another day and another thread. I do appreciate the perspective though. It's helpful to hear anecdotal evidence from similar situations.
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wellway
Prolific Pea
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Jun 25, 2014 20:50:09 GMT
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Post by wellway on Feb 20, 2015 13:51:26 GMT
Bear in mind if you plan to have children and not raise them as Catholics I would start dropping BIG hints now (or just straight tell her) so future MIL is well warned ahead of time of your intentions.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 13:53:06 GMT
Bear in mind if you plan to have children and not raise them as Catholics I would start dropping BIG hints now (or just straight tell her) so future MIL is well warned ahead of time of your intentions. So very true. To be honest, I would leave that up to FH. If he wants to raise them as such, it will be his responsibility. I will expose them to a variety of religions and beliefs but if he wants them Catholic, that's all on him. That is, if we have kids.
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back to *pea*ality
Pearl Clutcher
Not my circus, not my monkeys ~refugee pea #59
Posts: 3,149
Jun 25, 2014 19:51:11 GMT
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Post by back to *pea*ality on Feb 20, 2015 13:57:23 GMT
When I read your post, the first impression I got was your ambivalence towards the Catholic church. You have no desire to be married in the Church and you will only agree to do it on your terms. It doesn't work that way, a priest will only marry you in the Church with a full mass.
What happens if you have children? The same family who is pressuring you to marry in the Church is going to rally to have you baptize your children.
If you are an atheist, I personally don't think you should marry in the Church. If you shared what you posted here with a priest, even a close family friend, I doubt he would perform the ceremony.
You have strong feeling against religion, you need to work this out with FH now. If this is what he wants, to practice his faith and baptize his children better to resolve these issues before you marry.
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back to *pea*ality
Pearl Clutcher
Not my circus, not my monkeys ~refugee pea #59
Posts: 3,149
Jun 25, 2014 19:51:11 GMT
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Post by back to *pea*ality on Feb 20, 2015 14:03:16 GMT
Bear in mind if you plan to have children and not raise them as Catholics I would start dropping BIG hints now (or just straight tell her) so future MIL is well warned ahead of time of your intentions. So very true. To be honest, I would leave that up to FH. If he wants to raise them as such, it will be his responsibility. I will expose them to a variety of religions and beliefs but if he wants them Catholic, that's all on him. That is, if we have kids. So, if your husband wants to raise your children in the Catholic faith you won't object. Will you chose godparent's for your baby, will you buy a Christening gown and the usual celebratory party after? This is all a part of the whole Catholic thing. Saying it will be "on him" is unrealistic. Discuss now, decide now and agree now what is going to happen in the future. Perhaps you should go through the Catholic pre-cana and talk about this aspect of your marriage. Your in-laws and his family are not going to stop being Catholic.
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Post by pierkiss on Feb 20, 2015 14:05:40 GMT
We are both catholic and we did the whole big church with the long mass to appease our mothers, who are super catholic. We wanted to get married on the beach, but the church (at least here) wouldn't do it. . The ceremony was pretty long, and you have to kneel for a good chunk of it, which was bad for my husbands knee. It sort of sucked. But our reception totally made up for it and it was awesome!!!! We have said repeatedly if we could do it again we would go to some island and get married on the beach. (My dad was down with that idea at the time).
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 14:15:27 GMT
When I read your post, the first impression I got was your ambivalence towards the Catholic church. You have no desire to be married in the Church and you will only agree to do it on your terms. It doesn't work that way, a priest will only marry you in the Church with a full mass. What happens if you have children? The same family who is pressuring you to marry in the Church is going to rally to have you baptize your children. If you are an atheist, I personally don't think you should marry in the Church. If you shared what you posted here with a priest, even a close family friend, I doubt he would perform the ceremony. You have strong feeling against religion, you need to work this out with FH now. If this is what he wants, to practice his faith and baptize his children better to resolve these issues before you marry. You're absolutely right. I'm just not interested in marrying in the Catholic church because it has no meaning to me. It has little meaning to him. I swear, the only time this "friend" came up was after his mother said "I don't care what you do, but I'd like to see you married by a priest, so I am really not sure how close or how "friendly" this guy is to my FH. I'm big on the day being all about things that are meaningful to us, personal touches if you like. And this just seems like it's not. If this priest had been a big part of FH's life, that he was a part of the family, that he in some way was a meaningful addition, I'd be all over it and I'd figure out a way to deal with it. I'd still want the churchiness toned down, but I would accept that this priest would be a meaningful touch to the day for FH. But that's not the impression I'm getting. Not even close. I don't think he wants to practice his faith, I've never gotten that impression. Last time we talked about it as a group, he said that he'll go to church "when they pay me" (as in give him work as they have in the past for events), and the only time we've been to church in our relationship was for his cousin's confirmation. If he wanted to go to church, I wouldn't stop him. I would encourage him. And if we have children (big if), and he wanted them to practice as well, I would support him but he would have to be responsible for carrying it out. I want the day (including the ceremony) to be incredibly meaningful to both of us. If having the priest will accomplish that for FH, then I will suck it up and do it, even if it will leave me cold. I just don't see it as being a meaningful thing for him, but more of shutting up his mom. That and I think I needed to talk this out and get some outside perspective from people who have BTDT.
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Post by jeremysgirl on Feb 20, 2015 14:16:00 GMT
I was a Catholic when I got married the first time. My exDH was not. He was not baptized either. What we were told is that we were not eligible (much to my mother's dismay) for a full mass at our wedding because he was unbaptized. So we had the short ceremony. We did have to go through the premarital counseling through the church. And the priest was very upfront with us that he would not perform any marriage ceremony at a location other than the church. Even in the short ceremony, you have the gospel reading and the homily. You get to pick your readings for your wedding, though.
It just sounds to me, though, like you aren't interested in getting married in a Catholic ceremony and I would just be upfront about it. Maybe you can have some other kind of religious person perform your ceremony, off-site, that is more like religion-lite. My sister had a female reverend do her marriage ceremony and it was not nearly as heavy with religious overtones as my wedding in the Catholic church. This might be able to satisfy everyone.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 14:18:03 GMT
We are both catholic and we did the whole big church with the long mass to appease our mothers, who are super catholic. We wanted to get married on the beach, but the church (at least here) wouldn't do it. . The ceremony was pretty long, and you have to kneel for a good chunk of it, which was bad for my husbands knee. It sort of sucked. But our reception totally made up for it and it was awesome!!!! We have said repeatedly if we could do it again we would go to some island and get married on the beach. (My dad was down with that idea at the time). My parents want us to do whatever we want, it's the traditionalists on his side that have balked at a lot of things that we're doing that do not fit into their vision of what's "appropriate" for a wedding (ie: not having a church wedding, not inviting 300 people, etc). The beach sounds awesome, my cousin is doing that in May... but even she had to buckle under to demanding parents and do a church service as well. And she's pissed as hell that they are trying to take over that as well.
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Post by anxiousmom on Feb 20, 2015 14:20:50 GMT
Can you compromise with them in some way and maybe find an Episcopal priest? They tend to be a whole lot more...liberal for wont of a better word when it comes to the dogma of wedding services.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 14:22:18 GMT
I was a Catholic when I got married the first time. My exDH was not. He was not baptized either. What we were told is that we were not eligible (much to my mother's dismay) for a full mass at our wedding because he was unbaptized. So we had the short ceremony. We did have to go through the premarital counseling through the church. And the priest was very upfront with us that he would not perform any marriage ceremony at a location other than the church. Even in the short ceremony, you have the gospel reading and the homily. You get to pick your readings for your wedding, though. It just sounds to me, though, like you aren't interested in getting married in a Catholic ceremony and I would just be upfront about it. Maybe you can have some other kind of religious person perform your ceremony, off-site, that is more like religion-lite. My sister had a female reverend do her marriage ceremony and it was not nearly as heavy with religious overtones as my wedding in the Catholic church. This might be able to satisfy everyone. That's exactly it. I wouldn't balk at a religious reading at all. I've always loved the "love is patient" reading and would be more than happy to have that read at our ceremony. Even a prayer of some ilk would be fine (as long as it doesn't drone on and on). I just don't want a ceremony that would be a farce, and a Catholic ceremony would be just that to me. I have told my FH that I don't want a religious wedding. He just wants me to go to this meeting to "find out" what we can do. He's buckling under his parent's demand for this. So I'm going, even though I have secular officiants all ready to go. I really do appreciate everyone's perspective. It's helping me to figure out my own feelings about this and to get an idea of what to expect.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 14:24:32 GMT
Can you compromise with them in some way and maybe find an Episcopal priest? They tend to be a whole lot more...liberal for wont of a better word when it comes to the dogma of wedding services. We probably could, though I have no idea where to look (yes, find out local churches) but then if we did that, would it be any different than a secular officiant? It still wouldn't be Catholic so would the sacrement "matter"? I don't know if I am phrasing that right. Unfortunately, all the priests who were friends of my family have now passed away, or else we could have gone that route. Or at least explored it.
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Post by Meri-Lyn on Feb 20, 2015 14:25:23 GMT
I thought about the Episcopal priest as well. When one of my good friends was getting married, they wanted an outside ceremony in a garden, and the Catholic priest told them no. So they went this route.
Both DH and I are non-believers, and we got married in a hotel ballroom by a notary. I'm sure his grandmother would have preferred the church, but she was cool with it.
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Post by jeremysgirl on Feb 20, 2015 14:27:30 GMT
grinningcat...you are not a Catholic so no matter if you get married in the Catholic church or not, your marriage will not be a sacrament. As it was explained to me, had my DH chosen to convert to Catholicism, then at that time, my marriage would have become a sacrament, but if both parties are not Catholic, there's no sacrament. This might help you in deciding, as well. If they are hoping for that, it can't happen.
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Post by pelirroja on Feb 20, 2015 14:31:13 GMT
Years ago my girlfriend got married in the middle of August in a non-airconditioned church and we bridesmaids were fainting left and right as the two hour ceremony dragged on to what seemed like five hours at least. I feel faint and dizzy just at the thought of that. That's enough to object to Mass for me, religion has nothing to do with it!
I think the most important part of your question is not about the ceremony but the fact that you and yours will need to decide in advance how you will handle religious issues for the wedding and future lifetime events. The most important thing is: how will the two of you handle the in-laws who will most likely have an opinion and some influence (like it or not) on the two of you to conform to certain traditions within their family, even if you do not follow their beliefs or have any belief(s) whatsoever.
Will you attend or participate in certain ceremonies to appease the inlaws or will you draw a line? Will someone ask your husband to pick between you and your MIL (I know this seems an unlikely scenario right now but you need to think ahead. You might not even think that could happen, but she might be adamant: what will you do? And will your husband be strong enough to follow thru?). As you are married, there will be events and issues: wedding ceremony, baptisms, christenings, funerals, do not rescucitate, birth control, saying grace at the dinner table, public school or private religious education, etc. It could become so much more than just your particular day and your particular event.
Make sure you map out a plan with your FH and you are clearly in agreement on how you will handle numerous scenarios. And then make a Plan B in case he caves in to his Mom and can't withstand the pressure or threats or drama. And be prepared you might have to step up and fight the battle for him and be willing to become persona non grata if you truly choose to take a stand contrary to his family's practices and traditions.
Is it possible to have the wedding itself officiated at the reception site, perhaps perform a brief ceremony and ask numerous people of different walks and faiths to say a blessing/prayer sort of thing over your partnership?
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Post by anxiousmom on Feb 20, 2015 14:37:14 GMT
Can you compromise with them in some way and maybe find an Episcopal priest? They tend to be a whole lot more...liberal for wont of a better word when it comes to the dogma of wedding services. We probably could, though I have no idea where to look (yes, find out local churches) but then if we did that, would it be any different than a secular officiant? It still wouldn't be Catholic so would the sacrement "matter"? I don't know if I am phrasing that right. Unfortunately, all the priests who were friends of my family have now passed away, or else we could have gone that route. Or at least explored it. I don't know the details on how it would be accepted (is that the right word?) by the Catholic church, but it would not be secular. The thing about the Episcopal church is that they are less...rigid (and that sounds negative, but it isn't what I mean...maybe I should say less bound by rules?) in how they go about the services.
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Post by christine58 on Feb 20, 2015 14:44:31 GMT
I do not think the priest will do it if you're not getting married in a church. Ask if he can be "present" when you get married (I am assuming a Justice of the Peace would be your choice?). I believe he might also bless your marriage. Ask all those questions upfront.
I am Catholic and have been to weddings in the church where there is no communion. Not a big deal to me. BUT I really don't think he will marry you outside the church.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 14:46:08 GMT
grinningcat...you are not a Catholic so no matter if you get married in the Catholic church or not, your marriage will not be a sacrament. As it was explained to me, had my DH chosen to convert to Catholicism, then at that time, my marriage would have become a sacrament, but if both parties are not Catholic, there's no sacrament. This might help you in deciding, as well. If they are hoping for that, it can't happen. True. I don't know, to be honest, if they want the sacrement or if they just want a religious ceremony. I'm going to go to this meeting, find out what's what, see what this guy is like. Who knows? Maybe we'll hit it off and all my worries will go away. I think that might be it. I've had some not so nice encounters with "mean" priests. I've also had some lovely ones as well, and he could be one of those. I just need to find out and I'd like to start planning this part of the day sooner versus later.
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Post by Basket1lady on Feb 20, 2015 14:53:11 GMT
You are getting a lot of misinformation here, so be careful. You may want to do a little research prior to your meeting so you have an idea of the facts.
If your marriage is performed by a priest or deacon, it is indeed a valid marriage in the Catholic church and is a sacrament. The issue is that as Catholics (if you were baptized Catholic, even you are considered a cradle Catholic), marriage is considered a sacrament. In order for it to be a sacrament, you must be in a state of grace and enter into the marriage with the proper intent and the full blessings of the Church. That includes raising any children Catholic. If one partner is not Catholic, the marriage is still considered a sacrament, as long as it has been agreed to by the bishop and is performed under the Catholic rites. A marriage performed or blessed by an Episcopal, Methodist, Christian minister is not considered a valid marriage because it has not been blessed by the Church.
A Catholic marriage must take place on consecrated ground. I'm not sure if outdoor spaces exist--that will be a question to ask at the meeting. You can have a ceremony; you do not need to have a mass. It can be as short as 10 minutes. You can also have your marriage convalidated after the fact (what many consider to "have your marriage blessed.") You still need to go through the same steps as a marriage. It is just done separately, usually well after the actual marriage.
Good luck. I will add on a personal note, that I would encourage you to be honest in your meeting. Whether or not the priest is a family friend is neither here nor there. As far as any short cuts, some parishes may be more lenient than others, but pretty much all need to follow the basic doctrinal laws in a marriage.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
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Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 14:56:52 GMT
Years ago my girlfriend got married in the middle of August in a non-airconditioned church and we bridesmaids were fainting left and right as the two hour ceremony dragged on to what seemed like five hours at least. I feel faint and dizzy just at the thought of that. That's enough to object to Mass for me, religion has nothing to do with it! I think the most important part of your question is not about the ceremony but the fact that you and yours will need to decide in advance how you will handle religious issues for the wedding and future lifetime events. The most important thing is: how will the two of you handle the in-laws who will most likely have an opinion and some influence (like it or not) on the two of you to conform to certain traditions within their family, even if you do not follow their beliefs or have any belief(s) whatsoever. Will you attend or participate in certain ceremonies to appease the inlaws or will you draw a line? Will someone ask your husband to pick between you and your MIL (I know this seems an unlikely scenario right now but you need to think ahead. You might not even think that could happen, but she might be adamant: what will you do? And will your husband be strong enough to follow thru?). As you are married, there will be events and issues: wedding ceremony, baptisms, christenings, funerals, do not rescucitate, birth control, saying grace at the dinner table, public school or private religious education, etc. It could become so much more than just your particular day and your particular event. Make sure you map out a plan with your FH and you are clearly in agreement on how you will handle numerous scenarios. And then make a Plan B in case he caves in to his Mom and can't withstand the pressure or threats or drama. And be prepared you might have to step up and fight the battle for him and be willing to become persona non grata if you truly choose to take a stand contrary to his family's practices and traditions. Is it possible to have the wedding itself officiated at the reception site, perhaps perform a brief ceremony and ask numerous people of different walks and faiths to say a blessing/prayer sort of thing over your partnership? I did my time at a couple full marriage masses... I think that plays a lot into my lack of desire for this kind of ceremony and why I've put my foot down for a church wedding (well, one reason). I will definitely attend services and events with the family. I have gone to religious events and just quietly sit or stand during the ceremony and participate in whatever happens after (though sometimes those ceremonies are hard when they are not in English or French... I experienced that for the first time last year. Thankfully I know the ceremonies well enough that I could follow along even if I couldn't understand a word! So I think we have that taken care of for now. As for children, if he wants to raise them as Catholics, I won't stop him but he will have to take the lead on it. I will support him and attend events/ ceremonies as they come around but Iit will be his responsibility if he wants that to be a part of their lives. I would educate them about other religions as well, I guess that's my contribution. As for things like birth control, that's none of their business (and would make that clear if it was ever brought up in conversation) and I have made my feelings clearly known about DNR, organ donation and cremation to my parents, my siblings and my FH. As far as I am concerned, they have no say in what happens to me. I will make sure I know his wishes are made clear as well. I'm pretty hard headed so in the event that something happens, I assume I'd be pretty good at telling them to shove it if their wishes do not match his. He's pretty tired of their interference in the wedding, to be honest. And I know it hurts him that there's nothing but criticism. I haven't had to step in yet, but I will and I don't really care if that makes me persona non-grata. As far as I am concerned, their behaviour towards him at times should make them persona non-grata, so at this point not dealing with them might be a good thing. Thankfully, my family has welcomed him with open arms and he feels a part of the family... something I am still trying to feel with his. We are having an open dialogue about many of these things, and have to this point agreed that a united front is the way to deal with the stuff coming down so far. I would hope that continues. I like the idea of different blessings... it would be lovely. Except almost everyone invited is agnostic/atheist.. but something to consider. Thanks.
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Post by peasapie on Feb 20, 2015 14:56:58 GMT
It's not easy to find a priest who will perform the ceremony outside the church. We did,mfgr my daughter who wanted a beach ceremony, but it took a lot of searching.
Honestly, if you are atheist, I think it might be better to start wedded life on an honest footing and tell your mother in law that you aren't going to do this. She will want you to have your future children receive the sacraments, and that will be further conflict for you.
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grinningcat
Pearl Clutcher
Posts: 4,663
Jun 26, 2014 13:06:35 GMT
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Post by grinningcat on Feb 20, 2015 14:59:04 GMT
I do not think the priest will do it if you're not getting married in a church. Ask if he can be "present" when you get married (I am assuming a Justice of the Peace would be your choice?). I believe he might also bless your marriage. Ask all those questions upfront. I am Catholic and have been to weddings in the church where there is no communion. Not a big deal to me. BUT I really don't think he will marry you outside the church. That's an idea. We do have a couple officiants in mind, but he could definitely come and say a prayer/blessing. That would definitely work. Most of the weddings I've been to lately have been the short version. I can only think of two that were the full mass with communion. I think most people don't like the idea of sitting there for over an hour. Thanks for the idea though. I will pass that on.
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Post by jeremysgirl on Feb 20, 2015 14:59:38 GMT
You are getting a lot of misinformation here, so be careful. You may want to do a little research prior to your meeting so you have an idea of the facts. If your marriage is performed by a priest or deacon, it is indeed a valid marriage in the Catholic church and is a sacrament. The issue is that as Catholics (if you were baptized Catholic, even you are considered a cradle Catholic), marriage is considered a sacrament. In order for it to be a sacrament, you must be in a state of grace and enter into the marriage with the proper intent and the full blessings of the Church. That includes raising any children Catholic. If one partner is not Catholic, the marriage is still considered a sacrament, as long as it has been agreed to by the bishop and is performed under the Catholic rites. A marriage performed or blessed by an Episcopal, Methodist, Christian minister is not considered a valid marriage because it has not been blessed by the Church. A Catholic marriage must take place on consecrated ground. I'm not sure if outdoor spaces exist--that will be a question to ask at the meeting. You can have a ceremony; you do not need to have a mass. It can be as short as 10 minutes. You can also have your marriage convalidated after the fact (what many consider to "have your marriage blessed.") You still need to go through the same steps as a marriage. It is just done separately, usually well after the actual marriage. Good luck. I will add on a personal note, that I would encourage you to be honest in your meeting. Whether or not the priest is a family friend is neither here nor there. As far as any short cuts, some parishes may be more lenient than others, but pretty much all need to follow the basic doctrinal laws in a marriage. It is not a sacrament unless you are baptized in a religion the Catholic Church recognizes. So if you are a Lutheran and a Catholic, it is a sacrament. If you are unbaptized and a Catholic, it is not a sacrament.
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